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east side underground
climber
Hilton crk,ca
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Dihedral Wall June '85 - Nope - you think it was a little hot ?
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le_bruce
climber
Oakland, CA
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1st go: Sent with a strong partner who'd been up LF. We did WFLT together. Triple Direct, mid-August '06, full moon, no one else on all of SW face except for Yo and partner, who were completing their Albatross send (later to become one of this site's best TR's). Before fatherhood - big factor for me I think. All kinds of fun, great memories.
2nd go: Failed miserably on the Tangerine Trip, June (?) '07. Strong partner but I let myself get into the wrong head space. Scheduling an int'l flight five days out from your day 1 is a terrible idea, too easy to take hold of that excuse when you get scared (as I did). Shitty feeling to let down a solid partner.
3rd go: Bailed from the Alcove, super strong partner, this summer. Just hit a mental redline. Reversing the Hollow Flake pendulum with the pigs took some doing. Once again, feels bad to let down a good partner.
El Cap can get you when you least expect it. Looks like all systems go on the Salathe here in this pic, staying loose and having fun past the Ear, but waking up 12 hours later I was done.
Hopefully get it this next June.
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bigwall shitter
Social climber
the wild west
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Mark, just wondering why you don't consider this a "failure?" Not an attempt at flaming just wondering. Or have you done 8 El Cap routes since?
Disclaimer: I've never done a big wall and I suck. Just curious as to what defines success and failure on a big wall.
http://www.supertopo.com/tr/Iron-Hawk-Solo/t11586n.html
EDIT: BTW, this is one of my favorite TR's ever and have shared it with many people. Very inspiring.
He climbed and hauled everything but the last two pitches by himself, that is a hell of a lot more work than climbing the whole thing to the very tippy top with a partner. I'd count that as an ascent of el cap, not perfect, but a hell of a lot better than I could do.
carry on
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Vitaliy M.
Mountain climber
San Francisco
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I got up East Buttress on my first attempt less than a month ago....but that doesn't count as a true El Cap experience. Hope to get on it sometime in the next year. From the look of things, there will be lot's of TRs! Micronut is already running stairs and hauling in the gym!!
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Adamame
climber
Santa Cruz
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Climbed New Dawn with Hoipoiloi for my first El Cap Route. We were on Wino by night two. It was pretty mind blowing to go from, can I do this at all to 1800 ft up on the 2nd night. That broadened my horizons a good deal
5 for 5 now.
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Andrew Barnes
Ice climber
Albany, NY
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SteveA and Gunkie,
The thing about the second pitch of the Mordor wall is that in its current state it's impossible not to aid on the bolts - because the bolts are filling up the bathook holes. Now one could choose not to clip the bolts for protection after using the bolt for aid, but this is now taking the game of artificial climbing to the extreme of artificiality. Basically, adding the bolts has irrevocably changed the nature of the route.
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cmclean
Trad climber
San Francisco, CA
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Bailed on our first attempt--Salathe in 2007. We had done multiple grade Vs and RNWF, but never hauled before on a route, which ended up being pretty mentally daunting when planning on a multi-day ascent. Bailed due to time and just being psyched out. Went back the next year and climbed the route in 2 bivies, starting a current 5/5 El Cap ascent streak. I think the first send is both the hardest and most rewarding.
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Michael Hjorth
Trad climber
Copenhagen, Denmark
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First try: Mescalito 1994; OK!
Second try: Muir 2005; bailed!
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Andy2
climber
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Climbed the Nose on my first try in 1992, leading and hauling every pitch. I must have been in good shape then! No previous wall experience, but I'd done several trips to the Valley, including Steck Salathe etc.
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Gunkie
Trad climber
East Coast US
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The thing about the second pitch of the Mordor wall is that in its current state it's impossible not to aid on the bolts
Very good point, Andrew.
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RP3
Big Wall climber
El Portal/Chapel Hill
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Mark, just wondering why you don't consider this a "failure?" Not an attempt at flaming just wondering. Or have you done 8 El Cap routes since?
Cole,
What if you just cleaned a route? My girlfriend recently followed me up Zodiac, where I led and hauled every pitch. Do you think she climbed El Cap? I certainly think so...
Therefore, it is not flawed logic to say that if you jugged out two pitches from the top after a solo of a damn hard route, you get credit!
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martygarrison
Trad climber
Washington DC
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NA Wall 77 with Bill Denz, first try. Nose with Lars Holbeck 78, first try. Salathe with Stu Polack 78, bailed after free blast. Heat. Never went up again. Decided long free climbs were more fun.
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mcreel
climber
Barcelona
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I have very fond memories of the Nose. It was my first and only real wall. Before that my longest route was East Butt Middle, I guess. Started climbing regularly Fall '85. First 10a lead May '86. First 11b lead Taurus at Sugarloaf Mar. '87. Nose July '87. I did it between 2 of my Ph.D. prelim exams, one of which I failed, hah, hah.
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Spanky
Social climber
boulder co
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It's hilarious to me that a couple of posters on the last page consider Mark's ascent of iron hawk a success. You either top the route out or you don't. it's black and white and from the look of those pitches on the topo they aren't trivial, otherwise he would have sent them. Mark's obviously a great climber but he got rescued and jugged the last two pitches. And if he didn't have the advantage of having buddies to come get him it would have been yosar or a hellish descent on a traversing route.
Roger; to answer your point I don't really think you can claim you climbed the zodiac if you jugged the whole thing, yeah its hard work but in my opinion if you didn't lead anything then there's an asterisk next to the ascent. Just my opinion but when I was learning I was told you aren't really climbing until you're on the sharp end.
2 cents
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Don Paul
Big Wall climber
Colombia, South America
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ie, a telephone repairman can climb el cap. I wouldn't mind jugging a route, maybe if I was the video camera guy or something, just to be up there. A fun thing to do but it's not even comparable to following a normal trad route, where you at least do the moves. Jumaring is more like rapelling than like climbing, even if you do take out gear. Hey if someone wants to hire a guide to get this great experience, go for it. I'm impressed with the guy above who climbed his first wall at age 46, I plan to make my own return as well!
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Melissa
Gym climber
berkeley, ca
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Nobody is BSing anyone about what they did or didn't do. If they were, you wouldn't know the details.
It used to hurt me if I had a great experience on some route and I had to listen to someone else's need to reduce it to nothing at all. It seemed like if I even breathed a word of the climb without redisclosing my every style sin, there were some people who would call me a liar...even if they were with me and therefore obviously fully aware of exactly what I climbed (or did not) and how I climbed it.
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RP3
Big Wall climber
El Portal/Chapel Hill
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Spanky,
For sure, there is an asterisk next to an ascent of that nature. But someone who juggs all of El Cap still did climb up El Cap...performing a vital role in the act of a team ascending a cliff.
If someone climbs a single pitch on toprope, did they still climb the pitch even though they were not on the sharp end? Sure...but they don't get the same credit as if they had led it.
I guess that is just how I feel...everyone is entitled to believe whatever they want.
Cheers,
Roger
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Spanky
Social climber
boulder co
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Melissa,
I hear what your saying but lets call a spade a spade. It's no shame to fail on a route and I take as much pride in some of my failures as my successes. In fact I would argue that I have learned more from getting my ass kicked than on routes that we cruised. I fully believe that Mark's trip up Iron Hawk was an amazing experience that included lots of learning and soul searching. He put forth an amazing effort and climbed well but we can't change reality and calling it a success is wrong because that isn't what happened. In fact I probably have more respect for the fact that he pushed himself right to the edge to see what his limits really are. But the fact remains, he didn't climb the last 2 pitches.
Roger,
I do believe that it's an enormous effort to jug el cap, but from my personal ethics I have always tried to hold myself to high standards. If someones asks me if I did a route and I have I will say yes but if I fell or hung I add that to. In addition if I tr a climb and get it clean great, but we all know leading a pitch is much different than toproping. I got a pitch from thanksgiving on lurking fear but I don't claim to have finished the route because we got stormed off. I guess everyone has their own personal ethics but I don't think jugging a route is the same as swinging leads. It'c hard work and cool but it's not the same
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Melissa
Gym climber
berkeley, ca
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Spanky,
Why do you need to make calls about whether or not someone else's route should count as a success to them? Are you deciding where limited sponsorship dollars should go?
Mark told you what he did quite specifically and what it meant to him. Those are the facts.
The rest is your judgement.
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