Healthcare Debate in USA

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dirtbag

climber
Mar 8, 2018 - 03:42pm PT
Luxury. Pie in the sky. Won’t happen until our government rights itself, at least 3 years from now.

Edit: and I say that wishing we could have policy discussions about healthcare and other important issues. But right now, we simply need to exercise damage control and keep the ship from sinking.
Yury

Mountain climber
T.O.
Mar 9, 2018 - 07:35pm PT
Thank you guys/girls for an enlightening and (mostly) civil discussion. Quite a few interesting facts were discussed and quite a few good ideas were proposed.

Unfortunately many of you have distorted perception of Canadian Health Care system.
So I take liberty to clarify some misconception.

Jody:
Canadian teaching institutions do not produce enough physicians to meet demands …
At least in Ontario College of Surgeons and Physicians (it’s a doctors’ trade union) has a major say in how many new doctors are required. They do not want to overproduce doctors to have a guaranteed pay. As soon as a certain percent of freshly minted doctors “unexpectedly” emigrates to greener pastures down there we have doctors’ shortage.

OK, this case need some details.
This did happen in Quebec.
In this particular case overworked doctors asked to hire more doctors by their hospital (to decrease their workload) instead of a nominal pay increase.

Norton:
single payer Medicare has overhead costs of about 2%,
private plans keep as much as 50% to pay out in profits
Actually in Canada “Administrative cost” is 6% while in the US it’s 19%.
Recently I read an article on health care and these numbers are still fresh in my memory (I apologize I do not remember the source).
It means that US health care system can’t be fixed by only eliminating private insurance companies.
A problem of obscene hospital prices should be also addressed.
I still remember from my BCBS training, that doctors’ offices are responsible for largest portion of fraud (the same as in Canada).

Ken M:
most Canadians who are immensely proud of their health care system.
Yes, propaganda departments are very good up here.
As a result many young Canadians believe that we have a superior Health Care system.
At the same time people of my age (who acquired some real life experience with this system) are envious of what you have down there.

~kief~:
>>>>health care in the US has become a world wide laughing stock.
remember michael moores sicko?
Sicko is just propaganda by clueless (?) Michael Moore.
More than 50% of US population have access to Health Care that is envy to an average Canadian with real health issues.

Reilly:
Plus, pardon the thread drift, we both know the absurdity of the coding system.
Such coding system is used in all single payer countries, including Canada.
I am not familiar with another effective way to fight price gauging.

Reilly:
Somebody said something in praise of the VA. I thank my stars I've not seen
the inside of one since the 70's, period. Not a pretty sight. They've got
to be better these days as they couldn't be worse.
You need to pay more attention to VA.
Among all US healthcare programs, VA probably is the most similar to what we have in Canada.
Yes, similar to VA, healthcare in Canada is not getting better.
You can extrapolate current VA state to 10 to 20 years into the future to understand what you should expect from coming US single payer system.
moosedrool

climber
Andrzej Citkowicz far away from Poland
Mar 9, 2018 - 08:04pm PT
You can extrapolate current VA state to 10 to 20 years into the future to understand what you should expect from coming US single payer system

Yury, we have a pretty good idea how it works. Medicare is not that bad, I’ve heard.

But, I agree that the high cost of medical insurance is mostly caused by overpriced health services and medications.

Moose
Yury

Mountain climber
T.O.
Mar 9, 2018 - 08:20pm PT
Moosedrool:
But, I agree that the high cost of medical insurance is mostly caused by overpriced health services and medications.
One more cause is unnecessary tests and procedures.
On a healthcare forum I started reading a few years ago:
- typical American concern is about unneeded tests and procedures,
- typical Canadian concern is about waiting time and ability to get access to some new expensive procedures, that were not either approved or fully rolled out in Canada.

You can't have all three:
- good
- fast
- cheap
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