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Messages 3741 - 3760 of total 7868 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
Bruce Kay

Gym climber
BC
Sep 11, 2012 - 07:40pm PT
yes. Damn slippery.

Perhaps a bolt would help.
Mighty Hiker

climber
Vancouver, B.C.
Sep 11, 2012 - 09:06pm PT
Yeah, I found it so hard that I put a pin in, and thought it was 5.10a. So sue me already.
Credit: Mighty Hiker

Those who want fixed anchors at the top of PL wilfully overlook the nature of the route - diagonal, crux at bottom. Fixed anchors would quickly lead to worse polishing, and a bunch of people with broken ankles from rope stretch and swinging - the simple physics are against toproping there. And it's hard to imagine how someone could do the route without being able to construct a simple belay at the top, if necessary continuing to the 'true' top and tying onto a tree.
Jim Brennan

Trad climber
Vancouver Canada
Sep 11, 2012 - 10:07pm PT
Hey Bruce,

How would that rig be for a day trip from the cable crossing with just draws on yer harness and a shell in a hydration pack ?

Do you have to have all the glacier crossing crap ?
Hoser

climber
vancouver
Sep 11, 2012 - 10:08pm PT
Now they just shuffle over to the anchors a top power windows whilst dragging their rope through the gravel and spray everyone below with rocks.

Regarding the grade, I would be surprised if Bourdon didnt upgrade it in the new guide...

gf

climber
Sep 11, 2012 - 10:09pm PT
What say you greg, having made your trad dad mark up there?

To each his own bruce-I've only done 2 trips to the tantalus-one was the first winter traverse of the range done with Don Serl and Chief in feb of 89 and the second was the FA of the West Face of Dionne in 96 with my old friend Don and a Mr Peder Ourom. Sticking to the later; we had a great day that deployed euro tactics with the chopper dropping us off in the am down near the base of the couloir leading to the face. My thick cranium survived a football sized block detached by the climber above me when we were simul-ing; that aside we enjoyed a magnificent excursion up an unclimbed face marred only by yours truly blowing an all free ascent due to poor fitness caused by too much of something else earlier that year. I've always enjoyed the jigsaw puzzle aspects of putting together a route and leaving as little trace of passage as possible, but that said, I also have feasted on many a sport course over the years -so I'm not getting dragged into passing judgment apart from urging folks to try both the surf and the turf.
gf
Hoser

climber
vancouver
Sep 11, 2012 - 10:18pm PT
Old School BK has been replaced with a new Euro version, he does have flash backs of his old ways but I believe they are more like nightmares for him now.

I am hoping he is just experimenting but when he asked me if his shoes matched his harness I started to get worried...

I guess the old school retirement party/intervention did nothing for him
Bruce Kay

Gym climber
BC
Sep 11, 2012 - 10:43pm PT
Greg - On that subject, how is the quality of the climbing over on that west face?

Jim, rack of draws or otherwise, that would be one hell of a day trip from sea level. It took us 12 full hours return from the haberl hut and that was with a light day pack!

MH2

climber
Sep 11, 2012 - 11:01pm PT
It took us 12 full hours return from the haberl hut and that was with a light day pack!


Was it the photographer that slowed you down?
gf

climber
Sep 11, 2012 - 11:03pm PT
I thought that apart from that one block that had my name on it the climbing was really good -there is a pillar of pocketed rock out on the right side that i think connie and jamie climbed in a seperate outing -really nice IIRC

gf
Bruce Kay

Gym climber
BC
Sep 12, 2012 - 12:05am PT
To each his own bruce


Fair comment, which in fact pretty much mirrors my own. By the way i'm not so much fishing for judgement as commentary, if that makes any sense. I think I can guess as to what Connie and Jaimie were trying to accomplish in establishing that route and i think they were largely successful, to their credit. One thing I've noticed around here is that the quality of climbing is often superior out on the clean faces as opposed to the typically chossy crack systems. These guys totally saw that potential on this route - which sure makes you wonder whats around the corner to the west!. All the same a fair number of bolts (maybe 30% ) are within a meter or two of good useable cracks, which does seem to dumb it down a bit. Maybe its just me but I've noticed the same sort of contrived feeling to a route on things like True Grit / Parallel dreams on east end of Rundle. I guess they were just trying to make it draws only.

Anyway I recommend the route and give it 3 full stars, but in my humble opinion it would blossom to 4 stars if a few select bolts got the chop in favor of carrying a light rack. I offer this comment with no disrespect to connie and jamie as I totally dig their effort and whatever I think they're the ones who made it happen, much to our benefit.

I'm just really curious about what the real old timers think. Somehow I bet if it happened a couple of decades ago there'd be a bit more expressed interest!
hamish f

Social climber
squamish
Sep 12, 2012 - 12:19am PT
I'm not sure if I'm a real old timer or just posing as one. The color of my hair suggests I'm in that league so I'm happy to go with it. That route sounds great and all the rest of it, but my thinking, without ever having actually been there, would tend to be in the direction of Special Kay.
Bolting three feet from a crack? I thought Robbins dealt with that decades ago.

Not that my opinion should count for much as I'm too busy riding my bike to personally check it out.
gf

climber
Sep 12, 2012 - 12:19am PT
-Is that new route called nickleback by any chance bruce :/ -kidding aside bruce i would be a total hypocrite if i even thought of slagging their efforts -hell i've used all manner of technology in the tantalus-huts, choppers, cable crossings -where to start and where to stop? /EDIT -but yes, you and hamish have a point -bolt right beside cracks seems bloddy odd but also -no rack at all in the mtns? just some draws?
-heres' a cautionary note -on the descent from the aforementioned W face, we were well and truly at a place called hopelessly lost. Mr Ourom who has lousy night vision and a lot of common sense wanted to "sit the f*#k down and wait it out till dawn". Don chuckled and "f*#k that shit" was my unspoken thought; what i said was "gee fellows, how about we rap this gully -we can see the snowfield by moonlight not too far below." Things did not go as planned. At one point I tensioned way off to the side and jabbed a camalot off my RACK into a crack, then did the proverbial flying walenda to clear a large shrund-i then headed down the slope a ways, stomped in my uber-light alum axe and tensioned up the rope for the boys to quasi-tyrolean to snacks and safety. Gear can be helpful in the mountains.
Bruce Kay

Gym climber
BC
Sep 12, 2012 - 12:27am PT
ah... the eternal question

where to start and where to stop

like fixing floor joists
Jim Brennan

Trad climber
Vancouver Canada
Sep 12, 2012 - 12:38am PT
Good insights Hamish.

I posted for info because of exactly the reason of having a simple desire for fun in a day. I thought of having all the suffering and fun but none of the camping or crampons, ice axe, tents and any other equipment necessities.

This seems to be a function of having tried as hard at being what an ideal calls for and wanting a tour without a big pack now.

The modifier is how great the Jim Haberl hut looks. Scott Flavelle deserves top marks for doing his best at helping that shelter come to completion.

Jim Haberl was a super guy and always humble and gracious.

Oplopanax

Mountain climber
The Deep Woods
Sep 12, 2012 - 12:40am PT
there is a pillar of pocketed rock out on the right* side that i think connie and jamie climbed in a seperate outing -really nice IIRC

gf

*left

I suppose using the Culbert guidebook conventions that it is "true right" (climber's left) though.

How many times over the years have climbers gone the wrong way because the guidebook (any guidebook) says left when it means right or vice vrersa
Bruce Kay

Gym climber
BC
Sep 12, 2012 - 12:42am PT
Good one! Reminds me descending off the A strain with my good bud Grant Stathem. At some point in the twilight grant rapped down into the shrund..... yet didn't come out. I waited for ages then finally saw a vague image wallowing out like a beached whale down below. When i went down I had the benefit of him pulling me into port, something he didn't have, with the ensuing epic of overhanging pick placements while somewhat self belayed with a descender over the black hoary maw - all without crampons which is another story all together!

could sure have used a nice bolted rap route on that one
Ghost

climber
A long way from where I started
Sep 12, 2012 - 12:46am PT
The route sounds great, and, at least from my perspective, plugging a cam is not somehow holier than clipping a bolt. But I'm 100% with Greg on the other thing: going into the mountains without a light rack is crazy.

Oh sure, if you're never more than shouting distance from ten other parties, then no worries. But anybody who never got off route in the mountains, or hit by a storm in the mountains, or overtaken by darkness in the mountains hasn't really done much climbing in the mountains.

You could argue forever about what constitutes the proper "light rack" but one thing I'm pretty keen on is sneaking a hammer and a couple of blades into my partner's pack.
Bruce Kay

Gym climber
BC
Sep 12, 2012 - 12:48am PT
Jim - I'd say this clip up is right up your alley then, but as is you do need poons, axe and boots hauled up the thing as rapping the route is not advised. The hut is first rate. I'd go up there just to hang out.

also the grade of the route is more like mid 5.10 at most, not 11b as advertized. the alleged 11b is exactly one move off a ledge, bolt above you.
Jim Brennan

Trad climber
Vancouver Canada
Sep 12, 2012 - 12:51am PT
Time to get some aluminum crampons, a LIGHT axe and move with the times.

The hut does look fantastic !
hamie

Social climber
Thekoots
Sep 12, 2012 - 01:12am PT
Bolted rap routes. Now that's another biggie.
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