What is "Mind?"

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MikeL

Social climber
Southern Arizona
Feb 20, 2017 - 10:13am PT
http://www.azquotes.com/author/12768-Rumi/tag/vision
paul roehl

Boulder climber
california
Feb 20, 2017 - 10:43am PT
"He was alone. He was unheeded, happy and near to the wild heart of life. He was alone and young and wilful and wildhearted, alone amid a waste of wild air and brackish waters and the sea-harvest of shells and tangle and veiled grey sunlight and gayclad lightclad figures of children and girls and voices childish and girlish in the air." JJ

A snippet of a quote from the middle of "Portrait." Read this when I was 17 and thought it was the most beautiful piece of writing I'd ever come across... still do.

What "stream of conscious" writing requires is a superior consciousness!

What happens in the "wake" and "Ulysses" is not simply arbitrary gibberish but remarkably complex exposition of remarkably complex ideas..." The ineluctable modality of the visible..."

Breton called it "pure psychic automatism" and it ain't easy.
WBraun

climber
Feb 20, 2017 - 10:48am PT
Superior consciousness is the supersoul.

That is God localized within every living entity alongside the individual soul.

Wthout the supersoul, there would never ever be any doer.

This is why modern science is ultimately so clueless and is Swan consciousness (free from all material contamination) & (not duck consciousness) ......

This message is NOT approved by the gross materialists
eeyonkee

Trad climber
Golden, CO
Feb 20, 2017 - 10:54am PT
A few light taps upon the pane made him turn to the window. It had begun to snow again. He watched sleepily the flakes, silver and dark, falling obliquely against the lamplight. The time had come for him to set out on his journey westward. Yes, the newspapers were right: snow was general all over Ireland. It was falling on every part of the dark central plain, on the treeless hills, on the Bog of Allen and, farther westward, softly falling into the dark mutinous Shannon waves. It was falling, too, upon every part of the lonely churchyard on the hill where Michael Furey lay buried. It lay thickly drifted on the crooked crosses and headstones, on the spears of the little gate, on the barren thorns. His soul swooned slowly as he heard the snow falling faintly through the universe and faintly falling, like the descent of their last end, upon all the living and the dead.

Maybe my favorite passage in a book (the last paragraph in James Joyce's The Dead).
paul roehl

Boulder climber
california
Feb 20, 2017 - 11:46am PT
“INELUCTABLE MODALITY OF THE VISIBLE: AT LEAST THAT IF NO MORE, thought through my eyes. Signatures of all things I am here to read, seaspawn and seawrack, the nearing tide, that rusty boot. Snotgreen, bluesilver, rust: coloured signs. Limits of the diaphane. But he adds: in bodies. Then he was aware of them bodies before of them coloured. How? By knocking his sconce against them, sure. Go easy. Bald he was and a millionaire, maestro di color che sanno. Limit of the diaphane in. Why in? Diaphane, adiaphane. If you can put your five fingers through it, it is a gate, if not a door. Shut your eyes and see.

Stephen closed his eyes to hear his boots crush crackling wrack and shells. You are walking through it howsomever. I am, a stride at a time. A very short space of time through very short times of space. Five, six: the nacheinander. Exactly: and that is the ineluctable modality of the audible. Open your eyes. No. Jesus! If I fell over a cliff that beetles o'er his base, fell through the nebeneinander ineluctably. I am getting on nicely in the dark. My ash sword hangs at my side. Tap with it: they do. My two feet in his boots are at the end of his legs, nebeneinander. Sounds solid: made by the mallet of Los Demiurgos. Am I walking into eternity along Sandymount strand? Crush, crack, crick, crick. Wild sea money. Dominie Deasy kens them a'.

Won't you come to Sandymount,
Madeline the mare?

Rhythm begins, you see. I hear. A catalectic tetrameter of iambs marching. No, agallop: deline the mare.

Open your eyes now. I will. One moment. Has all vanished since? If I open and am for ever in the black adiaphane. Basta! I will see if I can see.

See now. There all the time without you: and ever shall be, world without end.”

From "Ulysses"





Here's something to parse out. Fascinating stuff: "Bald he was and a millionaire..."
BASE104

Social climber
An Oil Field
Feb 20, 2017 - 04:56pm PT
Have any of you guys read the Chinese sci-fi book, The Three Body Problem?

It touches on many topics. Great book. Extremely inventive. There is even a part of it where the Buddhist notion of Emptiness proves key to one of the character's happiness.

Gill would like it. Math is a big part of it. I don't recommend too many books, but this one is a great read. I heard of it in a round about way. Many people like it, including Obama according to Wiki.

In real life, the n-body problem is a very interesting physical topic. To determinists, who say that everything is predictable, it is an example of a simple physics problem that hasn't been solved, except in special circumstances.

More ammo for free will.
MikeL

Social climber
Southern Arizona
Feb 20, 2017 - 07:02pm PT
Cool. Thx, Base!

P.S. Music for Chameleons has the most mesmerizing prose I think I've read. It was good for me taking the bus into campus in grad school
WBraun

climber
Feb 20, 2017 - 07:08pm PT
A man is what he thinks about all day long.

Don't be thinking about yer dog at the time death or you'll turn into a dog in your next life ......
MH2

Boulder climber
Andy Cairns
Feb 20, 2017 - 07:21pm PT
Thanks for the tip, BASE.

I will take a look, and try to find, Of Ants and Dinosaurs as well.

I have read Ninefox Gambit by Yoon Ha Lee (Korean American and student of mathematics.) Number theory is used in combat in the future. The book warps your brain and is, "like Chinese arithmetic."

It is difficult to understand yet seems to make sense:

http://www.usingenglish.com/reference/idioms/like+chinese+arithmetic.html

(I intend Chinese arithmetic as a reference to Liu Cixin and The Three Body Problem, but I remember the phrase from a co-worker in Seattle who I am pretty sure said, "harder than Chinese arithmetic." It seemed apt at the time (1988} but I took it more or less literally and when I look it up now I see it has an x-rated meaning, too.)

Largo

Sport climber
The Big Wide Open Face
Topic Author's Reply - Feb 20, 2017 - 07:37pm PT
I've always favored stream of consciousness writing in the present tense because one, it's slippery to do, and two, it has the immediacy of the internal monologues that rattle on in our heads all day. The trick with writing that way or at any rate trying to flow it all onto a page is that in our minds we change tenses all the time and there's no way to get that effect as fluidly as it occurs half consciously in our awareness. People are pretty skilled at doing this without really trying, however, like here:

Several weeks later I got a text from Kathy D., former cover girl for Climbing magazine who after her marriage went bust, moved back to her hometown near the Florida Keys and started cave diving, one the most frightening, and dangerous, adventure sports going. She texted:

Out here in the woods, sitting here — cave divers are overdue. But don't say a word to anyone. They tried a long push, are 10 hours into the dive. No sign of them. Fingers crossed it's just a delay...


Ed Hartouni

Trad climber
Livermore, CA
Feb 20, 2017 - 07:48pm PT
Number theory is used in combat in the future.

it's used now...
MH2

Boulder climber
Andy Cairns
Feb 20, 2017 - 07:50pm PT
Don't be thinking about yer dog at the time death


The day before yesterday I had a premonition of having a heart attack or stroke or other final crisis. As the world went black I knew what I had to do. I had to locate the button.


MH2

Boulder climber
Andy Cairns
Feb 20, 2017 - 07:52pm PT
it's used now...


True, but some science fiction takes the present and leaps ahead with it into strange possibilities.
Ed Hartouni

Trad climber
Livermore, CA
Feb 20, 2017 - 07:54pm PT
we live in a pretty strange world, just that we don't experience it like many of the people in the world do...
High Fructose Corn Spirit

Gym climber
Feb 21, 2017 - 10:22am PT
"We don't have the mechanism but we have it cornered." -Rodolfo Llinas

[Click to View YouTube Video]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYQqr2BxMEI
survival

Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
Feb 21, 2017 - 11:04am PT
"So did that fraculator thing work or what? What's the deal there?"
Professor Heller
jogill

climber
Colorado
Feb 21, 2017 - 11:38am PT
Fraculator = fractal calculator?
Marlow

Sport climber
OSLO
Feb 21, 2017 - 12:31pm PT

One of the many many many expressions of mind...


... one more...


... and still another...

Marlow

Sport climber
OSLO
Feb 21, 2017 - 12:39pm PT

One of the human mind's artifacts:

paul roehl

Boulder climber
california
Feb 21, 2017 - 02:24pm PT
"We don't have the mechanism but we have it cornered." -Rodolfo Llinas

The problem with Rodolfo's idea that "knowing" is a goal because when that goal is achieved we feel pleasure and knowing is a positive evolutionary device and that that pleasure is an evolutionary carrot of sorts, ignores the obvious and difficult problem of what pleasure actually is. What the experience of pleasure is and what/who is doing the experiencing of that pleasure.

To use a metaphor: he doesn't see the forest for the trees.
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