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JuanDeFuca
Big Wall climber
Stoney Point
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Topic Author's Original Post - Apr 8, 2006 - 11:02pm PT
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Who first used copperheads in the Valley. Was it Bridwell on PO?
Juan
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Roger Breedlove
Trad climber
Cleveland Heights, Ohio
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Earlier. I think PO was 1975. I am pretty sure that Bircheff and I ran into fixed heads on the Prow of Washington's Column a few years before. Ratty wires and scary as I rembember.
Jim may have been one of the first copper heads on some other route. Werner may know more.
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yo
climber
I'm so over it
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Breedlove sighting in the Taco!
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Gene
climber
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I don't have it in front of me, but I think the Roper green book makes reference to "bashies" on the FA of the NA wall and maybe the Prow. They probably were around earlier than that.
I'll check the little green book when I find it.
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WBraun
climber
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I believe copperheads were first used as a pasted aid placement after Bill Forest invented them as a nut.
Someone bashed one in the rock one day and eureka what have we here!
When did Forrest first come out with those coppernuts?
And Breedloves statement: "Jim may have been one of the first copper heads...."
Hahahaha
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WBraun
climber
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Hahaha
Yikes, not that kind Ouch!
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Light&Fast!!!
climber
calgary
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Maybe first ascent of Cosmos... for some strange reason I have that in my head. Could be totally wrong about it though?
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Ed Hartouni
Trad climber
Livermore, CA
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I thought I remember seeing this somewhere... Big Walls by John Long & John Middendorf, page 98:
"Copperheads (or "mashheads") are cylinders of copper or aluminum swaged onto a cable; they are mashed into shallow grooves or pockets as aid placements. First created (in the early '70s) by Bill Forrest as a nut, climbers later discovered that they could be hammered into seams and made to stick. Jimmy Dunn, on his remarkable first solo ascent of a new El Cap route (Cosmos), was the first to use copperheads for extended lengths of aid. Although the generic name is copperhead (a trademark of Bill Forrest), "heads" are made of both copper and aluminum."
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JuanDeFuca
Big Wall climber
Stoney Point
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 9, 2006 - 01:08am PT
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Cosmos, Never heard of it?
Where is it?
Juan
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Ed Hartouni
Trad climber
Livermore, CA
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click on the "Climbing Routes" button above and search for "Cosmos"
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Gene
climber
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Meanwhile other new tools developed to make climbing more efficient: Ed Leeper perfected hook design with the invention of the arched base, and Bill (Dolt) Feuerer produced new piton designs. Clyde Deal, a machinist working in the Yosemite Machine Shop, customized gear for the Camp 4 climbers, including the first "Bashies", small rectangles of aluminum with a hole for a sling, used to paste into small pockets in the rock. Chouinard and Frost designed and produced RURPs and Crack-n-ups, and a few inventive climbers began tinkering with adjustable crack jamming devices. Aid-specific software began appearing too. With state of the art harnesses, haulbags and hammocks of his own design, Bill Forrest pioneered technical ascents in the Black Canyon and the Southwest. Forrest also evolved bashies to specifically sized "Copperheads", which enabled thinner and thinner seams to be aid climbed without bolts .
Footnote: But not necessarily without damage. A bashie or a copperhead is often not removable, and once the sling or wire rots or breaks the piece is useless. In fact the problem is serious enough that as early as 1970 Steve Roper coined the term trashie to describe the unusable remains of a bashie.
From: http://www.bigwalls.net/climb/mechadv/index.html
Looks like they dated from the 60s.
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Tom
Big Wall climber
San Luis Obispo CA
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"I don't have it in front of me, but I think the Roper green book makes reference to "bashies" on the FA of the NA wall and maybe the Prow. They probably were around earlier than that."
That sounds about right.
RR was a closet bolter/chipper/basher/gluer, according to a rumor.
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WBraun
climber
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Bashies are not copperheads.
The thread had this question: "Who first used copperheads in Yosemite?"
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Chiloe
Trad climber
Lee, NH
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Forest copperheads first appeared around 1971, I think. They were originally intended (and widely used) as nuts. It was a pretty quick discovery that they could be welded into cracks with the pick end of your hammer; and also that anybody could make them, so this was a cost-effective concept. (A nasty fall and rescue of a climber attempting the second ascent of Rainbow Wall occurred when a homemade copperhead failed.)
Bashies -- soft aluminum rectangles made by Dolt and others were already in use for hard aid. The ones I had (Dolt) were not a good design, but we quickly figured out that small Clog wedge nuts could be bashed in as well. I imagine this was the sort of thing many climbers discovered independently, looking at a bad crack and what they had on their rack. It's just a short step from tapping the nut lightly with your hammer.
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Ed Hartouni
Trad climber
Livermore, CA
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from Steve Roper's 1971 guide (the "Green" guide) in the Introduction under the section heading "Impedimenta" on page 19:
"For those who venture onto A4 and A5 climbs, there is a collection of tools which one must have. Skyhooks are quite useful, especially on aid climbs which have been established since 1963. Soft aluminum blocks called mashies are needed on very few climbs at present, but they can sometimes change the rating of a fearsome aid pitch. Artificial chockstones, or nuts, are becoming exceedingly popular, and all climbers should own at least ten. Nuts save not only wear and tear on the cracks, but great amounts of energy and time."
Then later in the section "Glossary", on page 37:
"TRASHIES are mashies that are left in place with nylon webbing. The webbing soon rots and a hard-to-remove blob of metal blights the rock."
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Jaybro
Social climber
The West
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I saw something reffered to as a 'beat-on,' in a mtn store in Boulder, circa '70 (holubar?) From what I vaguely remember, and what I can infer from subsequent experience, It was some kind of circlehead pasted onto a bowling ball size rock. What I remember was that you could pick it up by the sling/wire and lift the rock off the ground, which at the time blew my tiny little mind.
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WBraun
climber
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Anybody remember the "solderhead"
Where's piton ron, he knows a lot about this stuff.
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Chiloe
Trad climber
Lee, NH
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I know I was using Forrest copperheads as bashies on aid routes in Colorado by 1971, and I'm sure others had thought of it already. They actually were also usable as sraight nuts for free-climbing protection, which was probably Bill Forrest's original intention.
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