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adventurous one
Trad climber
Truckee Ca.
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Topic Author's Original Post - Aug 16, 2009 - 10:31pm PT
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The, long anticipated, new climbing guide for North Tahoe / Donner / Reno-Carson City region is getting close to being completed. After 15 years of research, the new guide will be coming out by spring. (Thanks to all of you that have contributed for being so incredibly patient with me all these years) Though I have interviewed (during the past fifteen years) many dozens of those responsible for the first ascents in this area going back 40+ years, there are still some routes with unknown first ascent information. (First ascent information prior to 1969 is very lacking) If you have fa information that has not been shared with me about this region, and want to set the record straight, please contact me. As I only visit this forum briefly a couple of times a week, contact me via my e-mail at oneadventurousone@yahoo.com for a quicker response.
This has been a very ambitious, fifteen year long, comprehensive effort to document as many known routes as possible in an area that is roughly 1,800 square miles. (When this project was first started I intended to cover the South Shore-Lovers Leap Areas as well, which would have even increased the size of the region, but after the first couple of years working on this guidebook I wisely decided to put that on hold and focus on my own backyard which is the greater North Tahoe – Reno region)
Information has been collected on all established routes within a one-hour approach of parking and I plan to publish most routes that are no more than a 30-minute approach from parking. The region covered in the new guide will be North Tahoe from Highway 50 / Spooner Summit, east clear out to Dayton area, north to the Pyramid Lake region, and West down Interstate 80, including all the Donner Crags and beyond. Currently the guide is at 680 pages (and adding) with 20 new, never before published crags and over 400+ “new” routes dating back 40 years, in addition to all the previously documented crags/routes.
A BIT OF HISTORY ABOUT THIS GUIDEBOOK: (if you care)
Fifteen years ago, having already been an active local climber since 1982, I took on the daunting task of compiling first ascent information for every route ever done in the North-East Tahoe / Donner-I-80 / Truckee River Canyon / Reno-Carson region that is within a one hour approach from vehicle access. Though it would be impossible to track down everyone that has ever done a first ascent, I have been making an attempt to track down the likely suspects. This even includes guys that have not climbed in 20-30 years and are no longer in the area. There are a few places I have not got around to yet, after 15 years of effort, but I have documented a majority of the climable pieces of rock in the region more than 40 feet tall.
Part of the motivation for this project is for the first truly historically accurate and comprehensive guidebook for this region. (including correcting many fa errors in previous guidebooks) The other is to provide a database for what has been climbed so as to prevent bolting over of existing trad routes. Only crags within a 30 minute approach are going to be covered in this guide, and not even all of those are going to be able to be included, so as to keep the guide to fewer than 780 pages. (And I have down sized the font so many times that I may need reading glasses to read my own guide, ha)
Again, if you would consider adding your knowledge of undocumented routes to this great, historical climbing region for the database, and possibly added to the new guidebook, I would be grateful.
John Jackson
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seakri
Trad climber
Sierra Crest
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Aug 17, 2009 - 12:12am PT
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Thanks for all your effort John. Can't wait to see it. Nice meeting you the other day at stealth wall.
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mtnyoung
Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
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Aug 17, 2009 - 12:18am PT
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Sounds like an excellent effort. I'm looking forward to buying it and then to using it. Thanks for the long dedication and work.
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drunkenmaster
Social climber
santa rosa
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Aug 17, 2009 - 12:43am PT
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i look forward to its release.
it sounds very good - new areas and new/old historical info - that's always all good.
best of luck!
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Salamanizer
Trad climber
Vacaville Ca,
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Aug 17, 2009 - 01:37am PT
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What an incomprehensibly massive project.
Kudos!
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Clint Cummins
Trad climber
SF Bay area, CA
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Aug 17, 2009 - 02:27am PT
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Interesting. What size are the 680 pages, and how many routes total at present?
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adventurous one
Trad climber
Truckee Ca.
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Topic Author's Reply - Aug 17, 2009 - 03:02am PT
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Clint-
Page size is 5.5 x 8.5
Number of routes in the new guide?
Still juggling whether some crags are going to make it into the guide due to size constraints and a couple that I am deciding on due to access and enviromental concerns. RIGHT NOW number of routes in the guide is around 1,200, plus or minus. (all cliffs/routes with photos and route overlays) Additionally, I also have information on a bunch of crags/routes (several hundreds of routes) that are outside my self-imposed limit for the guidebook of being within a 30 minute approach of parking. (though I may break down and include a couple of choice crags beyond this limit if I decide there is room)
Edit- If I count all the routes I currently have info on in the region included in this guidebook, including routes up to an hour approach, I would guestimate it would be around 1,700 routes.
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NoRushNoMore
climber
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Aug 17, 2009 - 05:53am PT
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Put them all in. What's up with the 30 min limit? Or one hour for that matter.
Some of the best Red Rock routes are 2 hours away, they are all in the guide books.
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adventurous one
Trad climber
Truckee Ca.
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Topic Author's Reply - Aug 17, 2009 - 09:53am PT
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No Rush-
It would have to be a two book set to fit them all in. A thought for the future perhaps. But 1,200 routes is more than most would climb in a lifetime, and here we are lucky that most of the largest cliffs/best routes have quick access unlike other regions.(and I may include a few exceptional exceptions to the 30 minute approach cutoff) Currently all of the published routes at Donner / North Tahoe are within a 15 minute approach of the highway, and almost all are within a 10 minute approach. Of all the published crags in the region, only Big Chief, at about 20-25 minutes, has a longer approach than 15 minutes. (And you used to be able to drive to Big Chief till they permantly closed the access on an old logging "road")
I might add that there are still hundreds of undeveloped routes within a 30 minute stroll from parking in this region. There will be lots of new route potential on the new crags listed in this upcoming guide! Hard to believe, but true.
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mark miller
Social climber
Reno
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Aug 17, 2009 - 11:18am PT
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Excellent and thanks for your efforts.
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John Jameson
Mountain climber
Reno, NV
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Aug 17, 2009 - 12:22pm PT
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Awesome! Thanks alot buddy, we've been waiting for this one for awhile.
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james Colborn
Trad climber
Truckee, Ca
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Aug 17, 2009 - 09:31pm PT
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John, awesome undertaking. Congrats! Let me know if you are in need of a climbing partner. Hope all is well. James.
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adventurous one
Trad climber
Truckee Ca.
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Topic Author's Reply - Aug 17, 2009 - 10:50pm PT
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Hi James,
Haven't seen you this year. Hope Sarah and your little one are doing well and that you have adjusted to life as a dad. I will get your number from Nancy or Scott and maybe we can do some climbing. Nancy is getting real tired of being my belay slave, as she calls it, since my regular partner is taking some time off from climbing. Scott has been saying he wants to get back into climbing as well, so we should both start dragging him out and get him hooked again. (He even drug out his 1970s rack and led something last week I hear) Last time I saw you my back was still badly messed up and I was getting fat, well heavier than I care to be anyhow. Doing a bit better now and getting fit again. We should go climb before I head out for 10 days of Burning Man.
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Willoughby
Social climber
Truckee, CA
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Aug 30, 2009 - 01:55am PT
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Can't wait to see it!! Maybe you can straighten out all the confusion between Bourbon Street and Touch and Go, at Black Wall.
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james Colborn
Trad climber
Truckee, Ca
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Aug 30, 2009 - 10:53am PT
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Ha Willoughby, yeah the topo for black wall is sad in the existing guide. The wall is drawn {a poor rendering at that} flat. The wall is hardly one dimensional. Did you and I talk about a boulder in Euer Valley a while back? I think I found it. Its amazing and 5 min. from my door. Contact me.
John, I remember you talking about this project when I first met you. Psyched for you. Yeah, lets get out there. I just finished a project and unfortunately have no work lined up, so lets go climb. Scott and I got out a few time in the last couple of years, his rack is probably a museum piece. The guy ties in with a bowline for christs sake.
Fatherhood rules, as I type this I'm feeding the little guy breako, while mom runs the PCT and then it's off to the beach before daddy goes to the HULK, super psyched! Have fun at The Man. I probably won't be going out there for a few years! Tell Nancy hello. How can town be so small yet I never see you guys? I have to admit I'm not haning downtown as often as I did before the bambino.
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adventurous one
Trad climber
Truckee Ca.
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Topic Author's Reply - Sep 8, 2009 - 07:43pm PT
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Just back from the playa. Another great "Burn" full of experiences and memories.
Regarding Black Wall- The new guide clearly shows where both Bourbon Street and Touch And Go are. Seems many newer climbers believe that "Touch And Go" is "Bourbon Street". Spent a lot of effort trying to show where the routes go on Blackwall, as it is a bit more complicated than the typical Tahoe crag.
Ron- Thanks for the offer. I will contact you, and yes I remember the guidebook you authored. I enjoyed exploring all the (then) obscure crags in it shortly after it came out, early 90s, and have continued to enjoy some of those places even now. Many of those crags, Iron Buttes, Prison Hill, Contra Canyon, etc., are in the new guide and I look forward to discussing the history of those places with you.
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BurnRockBurn
climber
South of Black Rock City
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Thanks for all the hard work. Look forward to the read. Welome back home from home...(burningman thing) Was a great year on the playa as usual.
Shawn
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adventurous one
Trad climber
Truckee Ca.
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 12, 2009 - 10:13pm PT
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Bump-
Because some of you old time Donner/ North Shore climbers may have missed this the first time around.
I still have some obscure routes in the new guide without first ascent info. Makes doing an index awkward when there are fantastic routes without any, given by the fa party, route names attached to them. (knowing who did the fa, and when, adds to the interest of the route also)
I have invested a tremendous amount of time trying to get all the historical info sraight.
If you were active in doing first ascents n this area, and we have not already been in contact, please contact me so that this information is passed onto the next generation.
Thanks to all those that have already contacted me, and I look forward to more stories that I can pass on to the new generation of local climbers.
John Jackson
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howdy
Social climber
Donner Lake
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Oct 13, 2009 - 04:18pm PT
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I am really going to miss using my Falcon Guide. Perhaps my favorite part of using the guide is spending nearly as much time deciphering what route is what. I can still remember my first dozen times going to Big Chief and trying to figure out what controlled substances the authors and editors were on when they put that section together in the book!!
Cheers,
Howdy
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aldude
climber
Monument Manor
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Oct 13, 2009 - 04:33pm PT
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Haven't seen the book yet....where can I purchase it?
Quiz time :
Is this route in there??
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adventurous one
Trad climber
Truckee Ca.
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 14, 2009 - 02:04am PT
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Aldude- See op. New guidebook is coming out in the spring. Guide will be available everywhere that fine guidebooks are sold.
Regarding the route in the photo- Need to see more of the route, or more of the background, or different perspective to be sure. However, it does not look immediately familiar. Since I have been on, or inspected from close by, virtually all of the 1200 routes in the guide, I suspect this is not a route currently included in the new guidebook. But I could be wrong without a wider angle photo.
Is it within the boundaries laid out in the op? Either way I would like to hear the details.
To figure out the area covered:
Start at the intersection of Highway 50 and Highway 28 at Spooner Summit, draw a line across Lake Tahoe to Homewood. Most everything north of there to Interstate 80 is included. West, down I-80 to Highway 20 is the northwest boundary.(still undecided whether there is going to be room to include The Emeralds/Bowman, which is further down Highway 20. Started working on those areas, but they are mostly incomplete and probably won't make the cut) Crags heading east past Carson City all the way out to Dayton are included. North, past Reno all the way out to the Pyramid Lake region is the northeast boundary.
Howdy-Thanks for the support. The errors regarding Big Chief/Sawtooth Ridge/Light Deprivation Buttress etc. are going to get cleared up.
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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Oct 14, 2009 - 10:06am PT
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Will it have the areas off the Mt Rose highway?
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adventurous one
Trad climber
Truckee Ca.
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 14, 2009 - 12:39pm PT
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Thomas Creek and Trippy Rock (volcanic crags off of Mt. Rose Highway) are included. Currenty none of the granite off of Mt. Rose Highway is included because I have yet to find anyone with route info for the rock there. I have not been up there in a long time. Would love to add anything there if you have beta on established routes. The little granite outcrop on the north side, just before the meadow, always has looked interesting.
Have you climbed anything on the back (north) side of the ridge? Would like to have an excuse to head back up there, even if it means snowshoeing or skiing in with climbing gear. Anything between Mt. Rose Highway and Spooner Summit would be of interest to hear about as well, as I have not spent enough time exploring that area.
Edit- Speaking of Thomas Creek, anyone have fa/route names on the three, super short, sport routes at Thomas Creek on the wall to the left of the main routes?
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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Oct 14, 2009 - 01:09pm PT
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Steve Glotfelty (sp) is the one to talk to about Thomas Creek. I;ve explored a bunch of those outcrops you mention with little success. I was hoping, you had something more.
edit, I thought it might be grouse slab as well
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howdy
Social climber
Donner Lake
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Oct 14, 2009 - 01:10pm PT
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aldude-
That looks like it is over on Grouse Slab. Or is it on the Green Phantom?? I think the perspective is a little off for the Phantom though??
Cheers,
Howdy
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Brian Biega
climber
Truckee, CA
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Oct 14, 2009 - 01:30pm PT
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Hi Al... Greese
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adventurous one
Trad climber
Truckee Ca.
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 14, 2009 - 01:56pm PT
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Is the route in the photo the .10cish route just to the right of "Europa" and "The Slash" at Grouse Slabs? Don't remember it being quite that steep, but the rock looks similar. If so it is in the new guide with unknown name/fa info. Is that one of your routes?
I was just there climbing some routes on a little wall 100' below there a week and a half ago and still didn't recognize the photo. Some other (old) "new" stuff on that side of Grouse Slabs is included as well.
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DHike
climber
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Oct 14, 2009 - 02:01pm PT
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John,
Nice work, contact me by email if you want a couple of more obscure routes to add.
Dan
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aldude
climber
Monument Manor
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Oct 14, 2009 - 04:05pm PT
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AO - you are right sir (w/help from howdy&Brian). 10c sounds right but if Europa is 10d then this route is 9c!! Seriously - Europa feels 5.11 to me*
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adventurous one
Trad climber
Truckee Ca.
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 14, 2009 - 05:04pm PT
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Aldude- If that is your route, did you put a name to it? Year?
Were you involved in the route on a small wall directly below this route? Guessing they went in at about the same time. A couple of bolts on a similar slab, but a bit easier, just to the right of a .10- flared crack? Route name?
edit- Yeah, Europa is a bit of a sandbag, especially if you don't do a lot of super thin, steep slab.
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adventurous one
Trad climber
Truckee Ca.
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Topic Author's Reply - Dec 16, 2009 - 07:54pm PT
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A timely bump.
If you still have any obscure route info to get to me, please do it now as I am wrapping up this project and hope to have it ready for editing by Jan 1rst.
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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Dec 16, 2009 - 07:58pm PT
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Need a reviewer? Fire one this way...
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FINCH
Trad climber
Reno, NV
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Is there an update on when this will hit the stores?
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Slater
Trad climber
Central Coast
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John, congrats. That's a lot of work. Can't wait to see it.
Tom
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adventurous one
Trad climber
Truckee Ca.
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Topic Author's Reply - Feb 6, 2010 - 10:43pm PT
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Hoping to send it off to the printers in about a month. Probably in stores late May or early June. Still have a couple of key people from bitd that I am trying to interview to finish the historical narrative and review the book for first ascent accuracy. The guide is otherwise just about complete and making the rounds for feedback. Over 1300 routes now (650 never before published) Still not to late to add some last minute fa info if anyone has not contacted me yet.
I will update when I know a definite availability date.
John jackson
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FINCH
Trad climber
Reno, NV
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Awesome! Thanks. I'm moving to Reno in 11 days and am not very familiar with the local crags. This book is coming at the perfect time. Great work.
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tomas.bosque
Sport climber
Reno, NV
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Hey OP-
Now that it's May, just curious when you think this will hit the shelves?
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Mtbphoto
Trad climber
Truckee, Ca
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Can't wait for this guide, hope it comes out before I leave Tahoe!
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tomas.bosque
Sport climber
Reno, NV
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Jul 14, 2010 - 04:51pm PT
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Bump.
Is there any news on a release date for this book?
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nano
Trad climber
truckee
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Apr 21, 2011 - 02:01am PT
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bump
You know I love you, John Jackson!
The book is coming out soon....June of 2011...I have so much respect for you in the way that you dedicated your time and passion. over a span of 20+ years, to this amazing project....thank you!
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seth kovar
climber
Reno, NV
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Apr 22, 2011 - 09:45pm PT
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^^^^^^^^^^^^
Yeah, the binder was thick and rad!!!! Can't wait...
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adikted
Trad climber
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Apr 22, 2011 - 10:04pm PT
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Psyched for a NorTahoe Guide.....Thanks for all the hard work and hope to see ya at the crags this summer :)
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adventurous one
Trad climber
Truckee Ca.
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 23, 2011 - 01:17am PT
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In stores by early June. Visit the Camp 4 Press website at camp4press.com for a preview of the book.
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seth kovar
climber
Reno, NV
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Apr 23, 2011 - 04:04pm PT
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Awesome!!! Can't wait.
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seth kovar
climber
Reno, NV
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Apr 28, 2011 - 04:22pm PT
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Just tried to order one and it won't accept my card. No issues with my cards as I just ordered some other things from a different site. Don't know why it won't go through?
Anyone else have troubles?
Also, I want to send mine to a different address than the billing address, how can I do this?
Adventurous one?
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adventurous one
Trad climber
Truckee Ca.
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 28, 2011 - 04:57pm PT
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Seth,
Are you using the Pay Pal button on the website? No one else has mentioned a problem. I will pm you later about reserving a copy. Don't worry, I'll make sure you get one reserved so you are one of the first to receive a copy when they come in.
John
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seth kovar
climber
Reno, NV
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Apr 28, 2011 - 05:14pm PT
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Thanks John, I appreciate it. I will give the paypal a shot when I get home. I was just trying to use my card.
Good looking out. Stoked for the guide man, thanks again.
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the Fet
climber
Tu-Tok-A-Nu-La
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Apr 28, 2011 - 05:24pm PT
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Awesome project.
It may not be an issue for "locals" but you could really use north indicators on your maps.
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adventurous one
Trad climber
Truckee Ca.
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 28, 2011 - 08:35pm PT
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Thanks for the suggestion. Actually the pages on that pdf were scanned prior to the final edit. North arrows were added at the last minute and were included in the final "print ready" version, as were a few other minor additions/edits.
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Impaler
Gym climber
Vancouver
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Apr 28, 2011 - 09:20pm PT
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Thanks John! The guide looks Rad! I noticed that you spelled OS as "onsite" instead of "onsight" in the pdf preview.
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adventurous one
Trad climber
Truckee Ca.
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 29, 2011 - 12:03am PT
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Thanks, glad you approve! The "onsite" is an oversight, it would seem.
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adikted
Trad climber
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May 10, 2011 - 09:11pm PT
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Psyched about the guide......Anticipation has gotten the best of me....out sooner than later?
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nutjob
Gym climber
Berkeley, CA
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May 10, 2011 - 09:39pm PT
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Holy wonderful, I never heard about this project before. I'm definitely buying one. Lots of good stuff in good weekend warrior range!
Make sure the Berkeley Ironworks store has copies.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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May 10, 2011 - 10:10pm PT
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I'll be buying one.
Cool stuff!
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Rick Sylvester
Trad climber
Squaw Valley, California
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May 11, 2011 - 05:36am PT
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Way to go, John. It's just like what I experience every time I begin something -- it almost invariably ends up being a much larger job that I figured or intended.
As far as the route quiz, the key that it's a Grouse Rock route is the sunlit boulder down and to the left, at least for me. That's a pretty definite feature along the slab's base
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adventurous one
Trad climber
Truckee Ca.
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Topic Author's Reply - Jun 10, 2011 - 02:56pm PT
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The new Tahoe/Reno guidebook!!
Orders placed previously from the website will ship out shortly. Future orders will start shipping in about three weeks. In shops in about three weeks. Order from the website at camp4press.com for earliest shipment.
Hope you all enjoy it.!!!
John Jackson
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Sonic
Trad climber
Central Coast, California
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Jun 10, 2011 - 03:12pm PT
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Awesome!! Ordered mine 3 weeks ago!
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seth kovar
climber
Reno, NV
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Jun 10, 2011 - 05:20pm PT
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Yeah, finally got the card to work. Ordered and super stoked, thanks for all the hard work!!!!
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labrat
Trad climber
Nevada City, CA
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Jun 10, 2011 - 05:30pm PT
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I bought one! The weather is here. Need book asap! :-)
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Heyzeus
climber
Hollywood,Ca
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Jun 10, 2011 - 05:50pm PT
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John,
If I order today from the website will it ship "shortly" or will that qualify as a future order and ship in 3 weeks?
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adventurous one
Trad climber
Truckee Ca.
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Topic Author's Reply - Jun 10, 2011 - 06:44pm PT
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Books ordered now will be sent out in about three weeks. Only had enough advance copies to fill the current orders (Only a couple dozen). The majority of the copies will be landed in about three weeks. Maybe by then the snow will be melted at some of the crags.
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Lithuanian
Trad climber
Reno
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Jun 10, 2011 - 07:06pm PT
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Ordered. Can't wait to get hands on it.
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Tim Camuti
Trad climber
CA
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Jun 11, 2011 - 03:14am PT
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I have been anticipating this for Years and now it is ordered. Thanks for your due diligence dear sir!
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james Colborn
Trad climber
Truckee, Ca
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Jun 11, 2011 - 10:33am PT
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Awesome job John!
What a huge accomplishment. Impressive.
James
Ps. Just ordered a copy
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atchafalaya
Boulder climber
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Jun 21, 2011 - 02:22pm PT
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John, got my guide in the mail today and wanted to say thanks. Rock Climbs of North Tahoe is a great guide, with attention to detail that was sorely missing in the old Falcon guide. I have climbed mainly at Donner and the surrounding crags between old 40 and 80 for the last 20-some years, and this is the first guide that accurately identifies those crags and climbs. Thanks again John, the new guide is greatly appreciated. Robert
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adikted
Trad climber
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Jun 21, 2011 - 05:20pm PT
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Got my copy yesterday....AWESOME GUIDE....thanks for all your hard work..im gonna put this to some good use...off to Donner for the afternoon....THANKS AGAIN JOHN...
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Tim Camuti
Trad climber
CA
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Jun 27, 2011 - 12:02am PT
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Ordered mine through the website 2 weeks ago and really looking forward to getting it when the order comes through! Thanks for updating it all!
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caughtinside
Social climber
Davis, CA
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Jun 27, 2011 - 01:35am PT
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The guide is great! Can't wait to check out some of these new (to me!) crags. Thanks!
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seth kovar
climber
Reno, NV
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Jun 29, 2011 - 03:51pm PT
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Ordered mine June 10th, I think? When should I expect it? Too excited to check it out...
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adikted
Trad climber
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Jun 29, 2011 - 05:14pm PT
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I bet that copy u looked at at black wall was mine....my buddy took it out there......sweet book..gonna put some use to it for sure
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Zander
Trad climber
Berkeley
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Jun 29, 2011 - 08:28pm PT
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Hey John,
What way of buying the book makes you the most money?
Zander
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phylp
Trad climber
Millbrae, CA
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Jun 29, 2011 - 08:31pm PT
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That's a good question Zander. Inquiring minds want to know!
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adventurous one
Trad climber
Truckee Ca.
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Topic Author's Reply - Jun 29, 2011 - 09:01pm PT
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They FINALLY arrived in port, from China, yesterday. Waiting for the cargo ship to clear customs and unload. So......very soon we will have them and start delivering them to the shops and sending out the copies ordered off the camp4press.com website.
I make the most from the book off the camp4press.com website. (A company I started to help out aspiring guidebook authors get a fair deal btw) Order yours now and be one of the first to get it sent out.
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seth kovar
climber
Reno, NV
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Jun 29, 2011 - 09:40pm PT
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Sweet!!!! Very excited
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lasher
Trad climber
CA
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Jun 30, 2011 - 12:28am PT
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Will you be selling the books at The Backcountry or Granite Chief? Will they be available this weekend?
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Zander
Trad climber
Berkeley
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Jun 30, 2011 - 11:31am PT
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I just ordered it on the website. Looking forward to this!
Z
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tomas.bosque
Sport climber
Reno, NV
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Jun 30, 2011 - 07:04pm PT
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Order mine as well. Stoked to get it soon!
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phylp
Trad climber
Millbrae, CA
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Jun 30, 2011 - 07:52pm PT
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The paypal link at camp4press made it super-easy!
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Danholio
Trad climber
San Francisco, CA
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Going to Donner this weekend. Any chance I can pick up a copy at a store yet?
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adventurous one
Trad climber
Truckee Ca.
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Topic Author's Reply - Jul 1, 2011 - 05:55pm PT
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Won't be in stores for this weekend. Maybe? Next weekend. Last word was the books were on a cargo ship, from China, waiting to be unloaded in port in Los Angeles. As soon as they get to us, in Reno, they will be shipped out to the shops as well as the pre-ordered copies off the camp4press.com website.
Maybe find someone this weekend with one of the pre-ordered advance copies, (that were sent out a couple of weeks ago) at the crags to check out. They have store display copies at Alpenglow in Tahoe City, The Backcountry, The Sports Exchange, and Granite Chief in Truckee. If you already have a copy, hope you take it out this weekend and go explore some new stuff!
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Zoo
climber
Fremont, CA
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I'm in North Tahoe area for a 5 day weekend. I have the new book from my pre-order. It has a bunch of new areas for me to check out. So far I have been to ...
the swimming pool twice, class 1 trails walking my dog, class 1 trails with my kids, at the equestrian center leading around a pony carrying a 5 year old (yep, class 1), on a short bike ride with lots of climbing. I am looking at all the pretty pictures in the book, making plans, etc. Maybe tomorrow, or Tuesday, Wednesday possibly.
Its all good though.
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pbernard02
Trad climber
Chester, CA
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Hey John! Got the guide... been checking it out, but I haven't yet to get out and check out the routes. Arghhh... can't wait!
Paul
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jstamps
Sport climber
reno, nv
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Jul 13, 2011 - 02:15pm PT
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Has the new guide made it to any of the shops yet? I'd love to take it up to the crags with me this afternoon.
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adventurous one
Trad climber
Truckee Ca.
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Topic Author's Reply - Jul 13, 2011 - 04:57pm PT
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Try The Back Country, Sports Exchange or Granite Chief in Truckee or Alpenglow in Tahoe City. They should have copies in stock.
And...if you ordered from the website, any orders that have not already been shipped should all be in the mail by tomorrow.
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213
climber
Where the Froude number often >> 1
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Jul 13, 2011 - 06:39pm PT
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looks great John! Got mine at the Backcountry and some others picked one up at Alpenglow.
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bergbryce
Mountain climber
South Lake Tahoe, CA
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Jul 13, 2011 - 06:44pm PT
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Will get my hands on mine tonight.... It's in at Alpenglow!
Stoked.
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adventurous one
Trad climber
Truckee Ca.
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Topic Author's Reply - Jul 20, 2011 - 03:24am PT
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Pop- Sorry to hear you think there are any inconsistencies. I am sure no guide book is absolutely perfect, but....16 years of very intense effort went into trying to make this guidebook the most accurate guidebook possible, with many dozens of the most historically influential climbers of the North Tahoe region reviewing it for accuracy.
A couple of words spelled wrong and a numbering inconsistency for the River Rock and Big Chief Crags (which were discovered by the author, and painstakingly hand edited, before any went out)are so far the only "inconsistencies" known/reported on this 476 page, full color guidebook.
(errors/additions/feedback on the guide can be sent from the feedback form at the camp4press.com website, where the book can be bought as well)
Minor errors would not be completely unheard of for a guidebook covering about 1,300 routes (Most all of which I personally climbed, or inspected for the ones beyond my ability to free climb, during the past 29 years of climbing and living in the area) and put together over a 16 year period (many, many errors were corrected from the previous guidebook by interviewing so many of the original fa teams)
Be sure to read the "HOW TO USE THIS GUIDEBOOK" section to get the most out of the guide, even if you have owned a hundred other guidebooks.
I sure would be interested how everyone else who has bought a copy feels about the effort and quality of this new guidebook (especially those that are known/respected in the local climbing community). If you have used or read it and thought it was well done, and believe the previous post does not do it justice, please post up.
Edit- Maybe the previous poster thought that some of the hand editing for the numbering inconsistency on the River Rock and Big Chief crags were done by the guy he borrowed the book from, which might make sense. Anyway, hope that is what he is talking about.
Thanks
John Jackson
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thetennisguy
Mountain climber
Yuba City, CA
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Jul 20, 2011 - 11:16am PT
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I've been waiting for this book for over a year, since I first heard that it was in the works (on Supertopo). Nice job, John. Got a peek at it a week ago up at Donner at the AAC climb. Ordered one the minute I got home. Received it this week and, well, all I can say is ... awesome job, it's completely worth it! And thank you for putting this out there! One other thing ... can't wait for the next one to come out that Paul Bernard is working on!
Best regards to you guys!
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adventurous one
Trad climber
Truckee Ca.
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Topic Author's Reply - Aug 15, 2011 - 09:41pm PT
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Now that the new North Tahoe-Donner-Reno guidebook has been out for over a month; how bout some reports of getting out to some of the "new" spots and what you thought? Would luv to hear some stories and what you saw and think.
Cheers.
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adventurous one
Trad climber
Truckee Ca.
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 8, 2011 - 10:14pm PT
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Bump....
Out of curiosty to hear that someone made it out (and had some new adventures) to some of the previously long "under the radar" crags in the new guidebook. Any of the "new" areas see much traffic this season, or maybe some new routes? Spent most of my time this season taking a much needed break staying away from the crags in the North Tahoe guidebook (and had fun climbing new places for a change) so didn't get out to see if the formerly obscure crags around here saw noticeably increased exploration. Any photos?
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Brian Biega
climber
Truckee, CA
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Hey John-
The book is great as are the new areas it guides us to.
Thanks again for all the beta...
Cheers, Brian
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Rocman
Trad climber
Reno,NV
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Dec 23, 2011 - 08:09pm PT
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China 40 bucks
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Rocman
Trad climber
Reno,NV
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Feb 16, 2012 - 10:55am PT
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65 mistakes and counting,plus the ink you used is rubbing off.?I want my money back
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seth kovar
climber
Reno, NV
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Feb 16, 2012 - 12:05pm PT
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65 mistakes and counting,plus the ink you used is rubbing off.?I want my money back
Better user it fast!!!!!
I love the new areas, but I agree, for 40 bucks it could have been a bit more quality.
Bought the Southern Nevada bouldering guide for the same price and it's amazing. Full color, hi rez.
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Outside
Trad climber
Truckee
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Feb 16, 2012 - 12:38pm PT
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Mogul should be deleted from the guide. It has serious access issues and is on private property.
Plus its a piece of chit.
AND bolts are showing up all over the place right next to perfect cracks ect...
Lame!
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adventurous one
Trad climber
Truckee Ca.
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Topic Author's Reply - Feb 16, 2012 - 01:27pm PT
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Rocman:
Regarding mistakes: There was a numbering mistake, (off by one number) at River Rock and Big Chief. These were discovered and hand corrected BEFORE A SINGLE COPY was distributed. Only a single first ascent listing has been reported to me as being wrong. (Eric Pearlman reported on a route he claims to not have done, even though someone claimed to have done the first ascent with him)
I take mistakes very, VERY SERIOUSLY. The guidebook was a huge, 16 year long community effort to document 1,300 routes, and was reviewed by many, many prominent long time local climbers for accuracy. ROCMAN....Were you one of the many that I interviewed for this book? If not, maybe I should have since you seem to have so much exclusive information....I say that seriously and with respect.
I seriously doubt the printing ink is rubbing off. IF any ink is rubbing off it would only be these two hand corrected numberings (all in a continous series due to being off by a single number)
The printer used is probably the largest printer of color climbing guidebooks in the US, used exclusively by a number of the biggest climbing guidebook publishers out there. (Yes they are printed in China (Hong Kong), by a US company) Probably 99% of, large run, color books are printed offshore, by US companies, because they cost 2-3 times as much here. (Which is really unfortunate) Also, the paper stock is of the highest quaility available.
On the website (camp4press.com) is a page for reporting additions/mistakes with the guidebook. All, verified, mistakes are reported on the website there. Other than some obvious grammer mistakes NOT A SINGLE mistake has been noted on a SINGLE ROUTE (seven months after distribution) by anyone. (LOTS of positive feedback however)
I am sure that there are probably mistakes, as every guidebook is bound to have, and I would encourage you to use the feedback page on the website so that we can continue to update the information in the database for climbing in the region, and include it in future editions.
Thanks
John Jackson
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adventurous one
Trad climber
Truckee Ca.
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Topic Author's Reply - Feb 16, 2012 - 01:42pm PT
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Very lame to hear of additional bolts at Mogul. Mogul is mostly a, short, top-route crag that has been used for decades by Reno climbers.
As far as removing areas from the guidebook: The LARGEST SINGLE PURPOSE of doing this (LOCALS GUIDE) guidebook was for documenting EVERY SINGLE ROUTE EVER done (that we could discover) in the region for the express purpose of preserving the climbing history and preventing bolting over of existing routes. (Retro bolting should be chopped) They were all included, the good, the bad, and the ugly. The idea for the book started as an effort to create a permanent data base for preserving the history of climbing in the area, then evolved into a comprehensive guidebook. ( I have files, files and more files of information provided to me, in adition to having climbed a majority of the routes in the guidebook within my ability, over the past 29 years of climbing/living in the area)
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adventurous one
Trad climber
Truckee Ca.
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Topic Author's Reply - Feb 16, 2012 - 01:46pm PT
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Thanks Ron!
I have tough skin fortunately, though it is still good to hear confirmation from the long timers (notice I did not say oldtimers, lol) such as yourself.
The most important thing is to continue to document the routes, and history, accurately. If it takes having some mud slung at me, thats ok.
Cheers. :)
John
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Outside
Trad climber
Truckee
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Feb 16, 2012 - 01:57pm PT
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Cool
Then go down to Mogul and crawl through the chain link fence with NO Trespassing signs and chop the bolts that some kid put in at his newly discovered crag.
Oh might as well go over to Mountain Project too and tell those teenagers all there 5' FA's aren't FA's.
Thanks
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adventurous one
Trad climber
Truckee Ca.
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Topic Author's Reply - Feb 16, 2012 - 02:09pm PT
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All bolts near cracks need to be removed.
In the (even recent) past there were never any no trespassing signs, (or any chainlink fences bitd for that matter) I started going out there about 25 years ago, and a number of times since to show others when it was to cold to climb elsewhere and we only had an afternoon to kill in Reno. Never had anyone mention access issues with the (now defunct developers?) owners.
BTW, Blackwall (the best crag in the region) is on private property also. How do you decide what to leave out? I believe all crags should be included unless there are environmental or obvious access concerns, that is why it is called "LOCALS GUIDE" to................
Edit: Mogul area is not on Mountain Project......which is always full of inaccuracys anyway. Anyone can claim, and name, a fa on that site without doing any research. Thats what we have researched guidebooks for........
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seth kovar
climber
Reno, NV
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Feb 16, 2012 - 03:24pm PT
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Adventurous one,
I wasn't trying to ruffle any feathers, like I said, I am totally stoked on the guide and the new areas!!!!
Wasn't trying to be a jerk, just comparing this to another guide of the same price. You were asking for feedback, right?
That said, I carry this mother around with me wherever I go, it stays in the truck and I am constantly pulling it out (that's what she said) to scope lines.
I am very happy with the content, just being a s bit of book snob, I found the quality to be poor. Can't really argue there, can we?
It is still the best reference for the area and I would still recommend to all.
I guess you can read all of this as "Think before you type Kovar!!!!" a problem that I have with this site.
Respectfully,
Seth
edit: For you jack off complainers feel free to do your own guide and show John how its done. Good luck and I look forward to seeing your perfect guide book.
I don' think it's unreasonable to get a finished product that is free of hand made corrections SIlver. :)
God this site makes me feel like and ass sometimes or maybe I am just an ass sometimes.
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seth kovar
climber
Reno, NV
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Feb 16, 2012 - 03:39pm PT
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I feel you Silver, but I also didn't just come out to blast the book. John asked for feedback, right?
Was just my two cents...
My book doesn't look like the corrections were hand made in each book. It looked like they were made and then sent off to print, I guess that was my point.
You're right though, I'd rather have corrections than waste all that paper, good call.
:) I just need to shut up now!!!
edit:
edit x2; Seth your not an ass you are still wet behind the ears and have not much foundation to compare what we once had to what we now have to use for guide books. You're all good young buck.
True, in a way, I loathe the books. Everyone knows what they want to climb and sometimes I feel like "just taking a look"
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adventurous one
Trad climber
Truckee Ca.
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Topic Author's Reply - Feb 16, 2012 - 03:58pm PT
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No worries Seth,
It seems as if the "quality" issues you speak of are all related to the hand editing I did for the numbering issues on parts of River Rock and Big Chief. (Let me asure you that there are no guidebooks with 1300 routes without multiple errors). Maybe I just was the first author/publisher ever to make the "mistake" of personally spending the time (for two thousand copies) to hand edit the mistakes, out of a sense of responsibility.
Remember, this project was put togehter over a 16 year period and I was adding routes to the database all along. Now that I have all this into a single book format, it will be much easier to update/add to for future editions (Probably not for a few years though, as we are busy with a couple of other guidebook projects right now)
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seth kovar
climber
Reno, NV
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Feb 16, 2012 - 04:04pm PT
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Cool AO no worries!!!! Like I said I love it and use it more than most books I own...
Once again, "Quiet down Kovar" :)
edit: I love to edit too, so feel free to send me anything
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Clint Cummins
Trad climber
SF Bay area, CA
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> "wantever puts more money in your pocket"
It puts more money in your pocket, too, since you paid less than it would cost to print it somewhere more expensive.
The critique that guidebook authors have "sold out", "cashed in", etc. is opposite of the facts - it's not a way to make money (you will make way under minimum wage, even less than they pay in China :-) ).
It's a way to share what you have learned with others.
Every big project will have some error rate. I hope you share your corrections with the author.
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adventurous one
Trad climber
Truckee Ca.
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 8, 2012 - 03:16am PT
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^^^^^^^
"Every big project will have some error rate. I hope you share your corrections with the author."
+1
Rocman,
I did not, and would not, bash anyone. I apologize if you somehow feel slighted by anything that was written, there was nothing written in my book but praise for those that have helped establish climbing in the Tahoe Region. If you are who I suspect, there was nothing but acknowledgements for your contributions, certainly nothing negative.
If you are who I am suspecting, and I do not name you if you do not wish to reveal yourself here, it would appear you are concerned that some of the routes you claimed as first ascents were later found to possibly have been climbed previously many years earlier. No bashing there, it is very difficult sometimes to ascertain if something has been climbed before if there was no known previous documentation. No need to feel slighted or diminished if information about ealier ascents comes out, especially if those previous ascents were not done in as "pure" a style as the later ascents. In all the "mistakes" that were corrected regarding previously reported 'first ascents" for this project I never once felt that anyone had intentionally falsley claimed a first ascent. Many of the earliest historically documented "first ascents" in North Tahoe were actually only originally done as top rope routes, which further complicates the task of documenting first ascents, but effort was made to differentiate between top rope "first ascents" and lead "first ascents" of these early Tahoe / Donner routes when known.
Again, after 8 months of mass distribution, there has only been one single reported instance of a piece of incorrect information (Typo / spelling errors aside) which was a miss reported first ascentionist on a single route. I would not claim you wrong without hearing your evidence (which I have asked you for without a reply) however, it seems somewhat unlikey that you would have more knowledge of "mistakes" than the entire collective knowledge of all the rest of the climbers in the region combined, that have commented on this book, and yet not be willing to provide a single example. Again, there is a page on the website to report a mistake or provide an update to the guide. http://camp4press.com/feedbackandcorrections.html
I assure you that the collection of this archive of local climbing history and new routes, by many that continue to assist, is an ongoing endeavor and has not ended with the publication of the first comprehensive guidebook for the North Tahoe region. If you have something to add, please share it as this project was/is a collaberative effort of the local climbing community that many others have contributed historical information for.
John Jackson
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Route Loser
Trad climber
Lake Almanor/Chico, CA
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Would you like me to count and post the mistakes in the THIRD edition of the Yos Big Walls Book? Or better yet the second? Get over it.
Your hard work is appreciated, mistakes and all.
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BuddhaStalin
climber
Truckee, CA
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Rocman, you need to chill....and learn to type, spell, and use both grammar and syntax. Your posts are unreadable. My bowels ache when I see your license plate somewhere I am going to climb.
JJ, your book is good, mistakes and all. Best book for the area to date. People will never stop bitching, no good deed goes unpunished. The ink on mine is fine, the advantages of having usable photos/topos far outweigh having some marker on the pages.
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Stewart Johnson
climber
lake forest
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i dont really like guidebooks,never have.
jj's book though is pretty nice and i did contribute to it.
important history.good stuff.
more importantly i would like to thank the new local guidebook authors
for exluding the emerald bay area from there modern books.
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Slinky00
Trad climber
Carson City, NV
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I have been very happy with this guide book. I love all the lesser know areas closer to Reno/ Carson like Dinosaur Rock, Prison Hill, Spooner Crags, Ballbuster Rock, Thomas Creek. Sure it has some corrections, but that never really bothered me. Thanks for all the hard work you put into this guide. It's been a lot of fun exploring areas I haven't been before.
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Rocman
Trad climber
Reno,NV
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Apr 11, 2012 - 10:47am PT
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Thats OK the less they know about E.B. the less crowds,Im now glad I didnot give all my intel of areas in my backyard.Rocco Spina,yes jon you know who,above pull your head out,maybe that will help?
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