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sgarlick
climber
North Conway, NH
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Topic Author's Original Post - Jun 19, 2009 - 11:30am PT
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Hi climbers!
I've read a few posts on this forum about the geology of different climbing areas. Perhaps some of you might be interested in my book that just came out this spring: "Flakes, Jugs & Splitters: A Rock Climber's Guide to Geology" published by Falcon. (Here's the link to the book on Amazon.com: http://tinyurl.com/qq34nm )
Promotions aside, any other rock nerds out there? Discovered anything cool about your local crag?
Sarah
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couchmaster
climber
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Jun 19, 2009 - 11:36am PT
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Good stuff Sarah! Igneous ROCKS!
Gothic rock pinnacle. Some sort of Basalt based welded tuft.
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pyro
Big Wall climber
Calabasas
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Jun 19, 2009 - 11:39am PT
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Geology is the only reason why I went to school.
The geology around So Cal is absolutely the best. I'm all about looking (I've got quite a good selection at home)for the rare earth's out in the desert. The local area that I climb at is (ancient Volcanic with lots of crystals here and there) pretty good too.
nice thread!
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sgarlick
climber
North Conway, NH
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Topic Author's Reply - Jun 19, 2009 - 11:52am PT
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Cool photo. That rock looks wild!
I remember hearing about a pitch at a cragging area somewhere out west (Colorado maybe?) where the key foothold is a trilobite fossil. I'd like to see that...
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Melissa
Gym climber
berkeley, ca
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Jun 19, 2009 - 11:56am PT
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Hi, Sarah.
I bought your your book off the shelf in Lone Pine a couple of weeks ago and was going to write a little "check this out" post here about it.
I'm really enjoying it.
I've tried to learn about the geology of the places where I climb in the past and have found it a struggle. Most geology books are for afficianados and so full of jargon that I spend so much time in the glossary that I forget what was being said about this peice of vocab or that.
Your book gives relatively brief answers to climbing-relavent questions with plenty of eye candy for the wandering mind of a dilatante like me!
In addition to my curiousity about how the features that we use to climb formed, I bought your book as a little word tour of climbing rock. The pictures and rock descriptions are better than many topo books for getting a sense of what it might be like to climb some of these places.
Best of luck with book sales!
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Peter Haan
Trad climber
San Francisco, CA
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Jun 19, 2009 - 12:02pm PT
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thanks for the thread, Sarah. I just ordered your book from Amazon, can't wait to read it! A stimulating way of discussing geology!
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Eric McAuliffe
Trad climber
Alpine County, CA
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Jun 19, 2009 - 12:07pm PT
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couchmaster-where is that tower located? The formation looks alot like the Meherten formation here in the sierra, and in Bear Valley we have a TON of that CRAP all over. Really pretty, but just garbage. Our stuff is volcanic lahar. A really hot mudslide that came from NV and picked up all kinds of andesite and other volcanic rocks which make up the conglomeration.
E
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Brian in SLC
Social climber
Salt Lake City, UT
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Jun 19, 2009 - 12:08pm PT
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Really enjoy your book as well! Fun chatting with you at OR in SLC too.
Just picked up, "Etched in Stone: The Geology of City of Rocks National Reserve and Castle Rocks State Park, Idaho." By long time climber Kevin Pogue.
There's a climbing area in Montana that is, we think, andesite. Kind of a cool color rock. Have always wanted to do a new route there and call it, "andesite for sore eyes"...yuck yuck...
Fun stuff...
-Brian in SLC
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Jan
Mountain climber
Okinawa, Japan
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Jun 19, 2009 - 12:09pm PT
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Yes, thanks for the thread! I too ordered your book and it looks like a great gift item for several friends as well.Congratulations on such a creative idea for a book!
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Jun 19, 2009 - 12:25pm PT
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I'm reading Walter Alvarez's The Mountains of Saint Francis. Very readable mix of geology and history. He's best known for his mass extirpation theory, popularly explained in T-Rex and the Crater of Doom.
I gather that Walter has also been an enthusiastic peak bagger.
We still need a good intellectual history of geology and alpinism in the late 18th and early 19th centuries: de Saussure, Agassiz, Forbes, Tyndall, etc.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
Monrovia, CA
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Jun 19, 2009 - 12:28pm PT
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"I date rocks for a living"
Geez, I thought I've had some rough dates!
OK, I'll go to the car, but with my copy of your book Sarah.
It looks very good!
Having embarassed myself on a number of continents my shame
has often been ameliorated by the interesting rock which precipitated the horror. "Mousetrap" in Wales stands out after 30 years as the most interesting; still not sure what holds it all together.
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Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
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Jun 19, 2009 - 12:45pm PT
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As far geology is concerned, I'm the igneous one (my Old Man was a biology major, so I know all about the bugs that live under the rocks, but not so much about how the rocks came to be)
Your book should be fascinating!
Common tourist knowledge says these are igneous intrusions:
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sgarlick
climber
North Conway, NH
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Topic Author's Reply - Jun 19, 2009 - 01:09pm PT
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Some of you might be interested in one of the references I used when researching the book: "Landforms and Geology of Granite Terrains" by Romani and Twidale (http://tinyurl.com/mpqldv ). It's pretty technical, but explains a lot of the features you see in places like Joshua Tree and Vedauwoo.
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TwistedCrank
climber
Ideeho-dee-do-dah-day
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Jun 19, 2009 - 01:10pm PT
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Thank you Sarah Garlick!
Your book is a welcome contribution to the genre. I picked it up when I first saw it at B&N.
I used climbing as an excuse to get a geology degree. Three of them in fact. I don't do geology anymore which is nice because I can ponder the origin of a specific crag, flake or hold without having to get uptight about writing a paper.
Me thinks western Colorado wins hands down for variety of geology to climb on. Proterozoic weirdness in the Black Canyon, welded tuff and conglomerate sport routes, glaciated peaks with grand vistas, 1000's of feet of red conglomerate, Wingate and Entrada towers and splitters, and virtually every local crag is unique.
Almost the same thing could be said about southwest Montana.
Or western Washington.
Or northern New Mexico.
Yosemite and the Sierra? Pff... Just boring old glaciated granitoids. 1000's of feet of it. Yawn.
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Dick_Lugar
Trad climber
Indiana (the other Mideast)
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Jun 19, 2009 - 01:13pm PT
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Wait...let me get this straight. I went to school, took on gobs of student loan debt to get a degree in geology so I could have a deeper understanding and appreciation of the rocks I climbed on, and instead, I could have just spent $25 on this book?!!!
I feel stoooopid now!
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Melissa
Gym climber
berkeley, ca
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Jun 19, 2009 - 01:15pm PT
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I only paid $17.
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Eric McAuliffe
Trad climber
Alpine County, CA
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Jun 19, 2009 - 01:33pm PT
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California is SUPER complex! I took a Cali geology course at Sierra Collage from Dick Hilton. HE made some very interesting breakthroughs in the understanding of the Great Valley, which is very interesting, but thos Sutter buttes, thats the REAL unsolved mystery of California.
E
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Ghost
climber
A long way from where I started
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Jun 19, 2009 - 01:48pm PT
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Thanks for posting this. I've just ordered it (Amazon)
Got an off-topic question for you though: One day back in the stone age I ran into a couple of guys in the Bugaboos, and wound up doing a climb with them there, and exchanged a couple of postcards afterwards. Both really nice guys and one of them was named Jim Garlick. Any relation?
btw this was around twenty-five years ago and he was not a young man then. If he's still alive, he'd likely be pushing 80 now. I think he was from Oregon.
D
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Reilly
Mountain climber
Monrovia, CA
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Jun 19, 2009 - 02:06pm PT
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Dingus,
From the Lassen park brochure:
yur gonna...
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sgarlick
climber
North Conway, NH
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Topic Author's Reply - Jun 19, 2009 - 02:42pm PT
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Ahh... the joys of California geology. I did my Master's research in the Klamaths--not great climbing (at least in my field area), but fascinating rocks and gorgeous, gorgeous country.
Ghost: Nope, not related to Jim Garlick, at least as far as I know. It's not that common a name here in the US, but is surprisingly so in Australia and New Zealand.
Cheers!
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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Jun 19, 2009 - 05:18pm PT
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What I love about geology / paleontology, is that it's so fourth dimensional.
You heading to 'that pass' this weekend, Dingus?
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scuffy b
climber
Sinatra to Singapore
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Jun 19, 2009 - 05:24pm PT
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What's your schedule, Jaybro?
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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Jun 19, 2009 - 05:29pm PT
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it's 2:25, now, I might not be able to get it together to go, until after 2:30.
got some ultra mafics to decipher, first...
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
Arid-zona
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Jun 19, 2009 - 05:33pm PT
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If you hadn't figured it out yet, Sarah is plugging her own book. For those who don't know her she is cool as hell, smart as a whip and a badass climber. Buy this book! I have no doubt that it is extremely well written.
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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Jun 19, 2009 - 06:17pm PT
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I caught the spam angle, checked it out on Amazon, and ordered one. Good luck, Sarah, fellow small volume book author!
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Oplopanax
Mountain climber
The Deep Woods
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Jun 19, 2009 - 06:21pm PT
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That R&I climbing article from the 90s on "THE GEOLOGY OF HOLDS" was one of the worst issues ever. And I say that as a geoscientist.
I'm guessing Sarah's book is better if only because it would be hard to be worse than that.
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scuffy b
climber
Sinatra to Singapore
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Jun 19, 2009 - 06:23pm PT
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I ordered one as well.
Better safe than sorry...
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Peter Haan
Trad climber
San Francisco, CA
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Jun 19, 2009 - 06:32pm PT
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I agree, Scuff, ALWAYS better safe than sorry. What would happen if we were on a tough route and came to a hold we had never seen before, you see?
I think as soon as a bunch of us here get our orders in and have read her cool book, we will be digging the thread up again and making more encouraging remarks. I am hoping that my order comes in just about when I finish David Sedaris' latest and that they dovetail together without an air bubble.
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Mighty Hiker
Social climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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Jun 19, 2009 - 07:14pm PT
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Perhaps the "Flakes" referred to in the title are dense, but not lithic. I've met a few flaky climbers.
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scuffy b
climber
Sinatra to Singapore
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Jun 19, 2009 - 07:16pm PT
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dense not lithic
light not solid
rock hard, fire hot
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Fletcher
Trad climber
the end of the world as we know it, & I feel fine.
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Jun 19, 2009 - 07:43pm PT
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This is wicked cool.... I'm ordering on too.
Eric
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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Jun 19, 2009 - 08:13pm PT
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Crimp the syncline, dyno to the allochthonous intruston.
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Nibs
Trad climber
Humboldt, CA
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Jun 19, 2009 - 09:54pm PT
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Sarah, any relation to Don, HSU geo prof?
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tinker b
climber
the commonwealth
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Jun 19, 2009 - 10:02pm PT
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well done sarah, way to get it done. i am in mass again, all i want is for the rocks to dry.
be well,
jo-lynne
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cleo
Social climber
Berkeley, CA
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Jun 19, 2009 - 11:34pm PT
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how many climbers studied geology in school anyway? seems like 10% here on the taco - go figure!
so cool - a climber book on geology, will have to check it out, get a copy for the gearshed here are berkeley (outdoor club). i too love the big picture plates crushing into mountains stuff - i suck at petrology and mineralogy. i also love the human-time dynamic part of geology - guess thats why i do rock fall and seismology!
what kind of geologist are you sarah?
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Tork
climber
Yosemite
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Jun 20, 2009 - 12:24am PT
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jbar
Social climber
urasymptote
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Jun 20, 2009 - 04:33am PT
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Jbro- Oh great. Just what we need. Route beta for geologist. :o)
Sarah - As a cave diver I felt obligated to learn the little I know about karst geomorphology. Now that I'm climbing I'm more than a little embarassed when the people I take climbing as me what type of rock we're on and I can't answer. Way to see a niche.
Another book sold.
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Prod
Trad climber
A place w/o Avitars apparently
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Jun 20, 2009 - 08:43am PT
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My birthday present to me. Just ordered it this morning.
I started my affair with geology in the Grand Canyon as a river guide.
Cool pics tork.
Prod.
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sgarlick
climber
North Conway, NH
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Topic Author's Reply - Jun 20, 2009 - 09:48am PT
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Tork--those photos are so great! I want to do that route... it looks crazy.
Jo-Lynne--Hi, Hi, Hi! Please come up and visit us! Emilie arrives tomorrow and we can launch the Challenger II in the river again. Yes, the rain has been a bit much lately, but there's always speed-aid-climbing Cathedral in a downpour for an adventure or the steep stuff at Sundown. :)
And thanks everyone for the comments. I'm not related to the geologist Don Garlick, but I've always wanted to meet him. My research has been in the structural geology/tectonics/metamorphic petrology fields. But these days I'm more interested in geoscience education and outreach.
Happy climbing! I hope the rest of you have a great weekend. The cliffs are pretty soaked here in New England.
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JohnRoe
Trad climber
State College, PA
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Jun 20, 2009 - 11:14am PT
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just ordered the book, thanks for the posting.
Lots of rain here in PA also.
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Dr.Sprock
Boulder climber
Sprocketville
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Jun 21, 2009 - 03:45am PT
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That is a wonderful cave, but how was it formed?
I think we ought to ask the lisping geologist about this one:
"Sonny Jim, it's like this. Schissssst, schlate, and shherpintine shale-like sands were in syncline solution with shhanidine sscarp stacks.
the shhhurficial deposhists of scoria ssheastacke get convoluted in a shubmarine fan which caused shhhhseismic shubduction.
many sheetwash stringers can be found in the shrink-well stream capture.
every ssshhillimantle ssstratovolcano gets shhilicated out into a shtope block.
furthermore, sheetwash stitching plutons combine with silica salts to form soils. sshhhhiltstone slumps cause schtalagmites to require sshpelogy tests in order to determine the sstalactites schlongation.
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homemade salsa
Trad climber
west tetons
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Jun 21, 2009 - 12:00pm PT
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Sounds like a great book- I just ordered one. Wish they'd had this as a course when I was in college...
Prescott College does do a course called "Rock and Geo" where they cruise around the west, climbing and learning the local geology. I'll turn them onto this- maybe they will buy a stack of them to use as their textbook.
Thanks!
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Klimmer
Mountain climber
San Diego
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Jun 21, 2009 - 02:08pm PT
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My kinda of post. Geology, terrestrial or extra-terrestrial. I love it. I would prefer to read a treaty on non-fiction solid science than any fictional story or book anyday. I will have to check out your book.
My latest area of interest is learning the science and getting very good at optical mineralogy. It is absolutely amazing what we can learn at the microscopic scale. It is an old tool but a very important and powerful one. I love the photography aspect also.
Here is something else. In all the geology/geomorphology courses I have had, there is nothing natural or by natural processes that explains this on the surface of Mars (or Earth for that matter) . . .
Ok, everyone (NASA included) what the heck is it? And if you think it is natural feature of Mars, then please explain the geomorphology involved in creating it. I know what it is, but then you probably don't want to hear it (but you knew I would say anyhow right?)
Mars Global Surveyor MOC Image m1501228
Plain in Acidalia, 37.22 Lat., 27.80 Long. Not sure if it is North Hemisphere or South, they don't say.
Official USGS/NASA Mars Global Surveyor image Website: http://ida.wr.usgs.gov/html/m15012/m1501228.html
Scale: 1 pixel= 4.47m. From my calculations: Giant 3D geodetic dome is approx. 38 pixels in diameter; approx. 169.86m = 554.00ft in diameter and about 84.83m = 278.31ft high; the crater diameter is approx. 96 pixels; 429.12m = 1407.51ft in diameter and a depth of approx. 143.04m = 469.29ft. Typically craters have a diameter to depth ratio of 3:1 to 5:1.
What it isn’t: The 3D geodetic dome did not make this crater. The physics and energy involved with crater formation and morphology do not work this way. There is nothing in geomorphology to explain this phenomenon as natural. It is artificial. It seems to be designed to blend in with a few craters just to the south of this crater that have a similar “look” but clearly have Mars sand blowing into the crater structures naturally. This artificial structure is absolutely and clearly different. Seems to be a nice attempt at hiding and blending with similar features surrounding in the region. Also a crater would be an excellent shelter from the Mars winds and weather.
So NASA what the heck is it? Some possibilities are:
God hit a divot and errant golf ball and it got stuck in the giant red sand trap of Mars?
An Alien outpost on the Red Planet?
NASA’s Secret Astronaut Corp Mars Base #1 (NASA SACMB1) ?
SO NASA WHAT IS IT? Things that make you go . . . Hhhhhhhhmmmmmmmm!!??????
Ok, people nothing to see here move along. Just some art commissioned by NASA/Boeing to celebrate Bush 1 talking about going to Mars. Those are the strangest Mars rocks I have ever seen though. What petrologic process is at work here to produce these stones on Mars? Yes, I know it is just art, but still. What is NASA and space industry partner trying to say?
I wonder if they have a Cosmic Secret First Ascent Book for Mars, for those NASA astronauts in the Secret Corp? Hey, if you were the first, wouldn't you still want credit even if it was a secret corp?
Hey, inquiring minds want to know. Does someone know? Just wondering . . .
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Redwreck
Social climber
Echo Parque, Los Angeles, CA
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Jun 22, 2009 - 09:59pm PT
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My copy arrived from Amazon today, really looking forward to diving into it.
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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Jun 22, 2009 - 10:04pm PT
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Klimmer, you got your nichols crossed, or what?
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Elcap76
Trad climber
Long Beach, CA
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Jun 22, 2009 - 10:33pm PT
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OK, albite.....
What kind of rock is in the thin section?
danabgeologist
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Klimmer
Mountain climber
San Diego
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Jun 22, 2009 - 11:05pm PT
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I get it, albite (he-he good one).
Yes, I got my Nichols crossed.
About the thin-section, you probably all know the minerals (Pyroxene, Plagioclase, Olivine, Amphibole (Hornblende)+ opaque minerals), but this is of extra-terrestrial origin. Impact Shock Metamorphism effects galore --- they are all here. Classic image. I will not discuss the parent body.
I could say, but then you know what I would have to do. Let's not go there. Staying alive is good.
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anointed one
Gym climber
my mamma
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Jun 23, 2009 - 11:07am PT
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"Being able to recognize the difference between Calavaras Complex and Shoo Fly complex and understand what those differences are thought to represent.... I find that very gratifying."
gag! limestone and blueschist melange blocks are the only cool choss to have come from the subduction.
$135 for Romani and Twidale? Zoiks! Does it have a good discussion on glaciated granitic terrain?
Klimmer, I don't see your pyroxene. Obvious 60-120 on the amph though. Alteration to sericite to form the whispies?
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ydpl8s
Trad climber
Santa Monica, California
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Jun 23, 2009 - 11:47am PT
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And of course, let's not forget
Pegmatite
And Marble
Or Volcanoclastics
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sgarlick
climber
North Conway, NH
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Topic Author's Reply - Jun 23, 2009 - 12:10pm PT
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Great photos! I love the Black Canyon.
Anointed One: Yes, the Romani and Twidale book is one of those crazy expensive academic volumes. A good one to borrow from the library--not necessarily to own.
Stich: Great question about crumbly granite. Kitty-litter granite, sometimes known by geologists as grus, forms from a type of weathering called granular disintegration. In a nutshell, it's when the rock falls apart along along the boundaries between its individual crystals, usually because water has been able to penetrate these tiny "microcracks". This can happen when a surface is exposed to a wet soil for a long period of time, or if groundwater is able to penetrate part of the granite through crack systems.
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PhotogEC
climber
Pasadena, CA
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Jun 26, 2009 - 05:51pm PT
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Sarah - your book just arrived from Amazon yesterday. I've only had a chance to thumb through it, but it looks like a great read!
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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Jun 26, 2009 - 05:52pm PT
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Still waiting on mine....
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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Jun 29, 2009 - 05:01pm PT
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Was she riding BART into the city yesterday?
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cowpoke
climber
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Sarah,
Congratulations on the book!!! Just ordered a copy!
I remember your beautiful Patagonia slide show to the geo dept at UW (you were there getting your PhD?), while I was in the psych dept...we met via Bayard. You did a fabulous job speaking to the two audiences: your profs and the climbers. I've run into Bayard a couple times since we moved back east. Hopefully run into you one of these days too, although tough to recognize everyone in their rain hoods.
In the meantime, I'm now looking forward to summer reading!
Cheers,
Eric
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Jan
Mountain climber
Okinawa, Japan
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Sarah-
I just received your book and leafed through it. It looks like the geology book I've waited for my whole life. And that's saying something since my father was a geologist!
Again, congratulations on your creativity as well as your expertise.
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Peter Haan
Trad climber
San Francisco, CA
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Susan,
Great book. As technical as it has to be, very well written, clear as hell, fun references all the time to actual climbing areas, professional and scholastic while still being friendly. Thanks for all the work and your unique approach!
ph
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Studly
Trad climber
WA
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Just ordered this book off Amazon. Looking forward to a good read!
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gstock
climber
Yosemite Valley
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Allen Glazner and I are writing a book on the geology of Yosemite, part of the "Geology Underfoot" series. About six months ago I wrote a chapter on the geology of climbing in Yosemite that I was pretty proud of, but it looks like Sarah was way ahead of me on that one. Great job! I've just ordered the book and look forward to reading it.
Sarah, perhaps you'd be willing to review the chapter I wrote? In addition to jugs, flakes, and splitters, Yosemite does have a few unique features that you might not have tackled, e.g., the feldspar knobs of Tuolumne.
It's great to see climbers as geologists and vice versa. I don't really know which one I was first, but I sure am glad I have a life that blends the two.
Greg Stock
Yosemite Park Geologist
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Klimmer
Mountain climber
San Diego
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Remember, the original climber/tramp John Muir also was into Geology. How can you not ask and wonder about the very rock we love to climb on? I would say all climbers to some degree are amateur geologists, some at a higher level, some at a lower level of understanding, then of course some at the professional degree level.
And didn't John Muir who dropped out of college scoop the great learned geologist Clarence King, on the origins of the Sierra Valleys, Yosemite Valley in particular, from Glaciation and not faulting? Ouch, that had to hurt. Sometimes you have to become one with the rock to really know, and John certainly did.
By the way, to make my point from another thread even more convincing, did you know that John Muir had at one time memorized the entire Bible? Now I don't know how anyone does that, sometimes I forget my very name, but he says so in many of his writings. The bible had an incredible influence on his writing, and maybe that is why I enjoy reading Muir so much.
Wow, just think a man of faith and look at all he was able to accomplish: climber/mountaineer, first ascents galore, naturalist/scientist, prolific writer on nature and conservation, the father of the National Parks, founder of the Sierra Club which is still a World preeminent and very important Environmental Conservation group. And dang it all if he didn't contribute to science regarding the geomorphology and the glaciation of the Sierra Nevada Mountains of California. A man of faith did all of that.
Muir had the proper understanding of Dominion over Creation, we are supposed to care for, conserve, and protect the Earth we live on.
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sgarlick
climber
North Conway, NH
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Topic Author's Reply - Jul 5, 2009 - 09:57am PT
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It's great to hear that folks are interested! Thanks for all the kind words.
Klimmer: I completely agree with you that most climbers are amateur geologists, at least to some degree. That was a huge part of my motivation for this project. It can be hard sometimes to get your average person on the street to care about rocks (even though I've somehow made this a personal mission in my life...), but climbers already care about rocks, quite deeply, actually. It's pretty cool.
Greg: Congratulations on your book! I've really enjoyed the Geology Underfoot series and I'd be delighted to check out your chapter. There are so many neat geologic features and stories on El Cap alone, not to mention the whole park. Send an email--sarahgarlick@gmail.com
I hope everyone's enjoying their weekends. It has been so wet here in New England that I've resorted to aid climbing on Cathedral just to get out. We bailed off the cliff yesterday when the thunderheads rolled in. Hmmm... maybe a new book will have to be the Climate Change of Rock Climbing... :)
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sgarlick
climber
North Conway, NH
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Topic Author's Reply - Aug 3, 2009 - 01:19pm PT
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For all you east coast SuperTacoians... I'm giving a slide show about the Geology of Rock Climbing on this Wednesday night at the EMS in North Conway, New Hampshire. Show starts at 7:00 PM and is free. (Yea for all things free!)
Hope to see some of you there--
Sarah
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