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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Jan 17, 2008 - 03:15pm PT
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Here! Here!
uh,.. er
There! There!
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dipper
climber
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Jan 17, 2008 - 04:11pm PT
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Steve, Mimi (Stimi),
What sort of acknowledgement of your past climbs are you in need of?
Please let us know how we may give you strokes in hopes that this incessant goading of yours will stop.
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Wade Icey
Trad climber
www.alohashirtrescue.com
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Jan 17, 2008 - 04:19pm PT
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aren't all hippie lettuce smoking, beer drinking, partying dirtbags, targets?
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Mimi
climber
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Jan 17, 2008 - 04:41pm PT
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Hey Jody, sorry I missed responding to your question last time you asked it. The answer's yes, of course.
The Kid: I hope you're right on that!
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deuce4
Big Wall climber
the Southwest
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Jan 17, 2008 - 04:56pm PT
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Yeah, I used pitons.
I don't use them anymore.
It took years of 10-step programs at the local Pitons Anonymous.
If I ever got back into Big Wall Climbing, I wouldn't use them anymore...
but I wouldn't use them any less, either!
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'Pass the Pitons' Pete
Big Wall climber
like Oakville, Ontario, Canada, eh?
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Jan 17, 2008 - 05:30pm PT
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Bwah-ha-ha-ha-ha!! Laughing out loud at Deucey's comment above. Spoken by the man who somewhere wrote [if I remember correctly] about taking along a 2" bong for "good luck"!
"My name is Pete ..... [HI PETE!] ... and I am a Pitonaholic."
"Mark and Richard are concerned about their legacy. They want to be seen as heroes, not zeros."
Emphatically disagree.
My experience with Richard and Mark is that they want the truth revealed about what happened on WoS, and about who they are. The legacy they leave behind in education and family and church is far huger and more significant than some stupid climb up the side of a wall, and they are content and secure in this. They just wanted to set the record straight, and address the lies that have been perpetuated about them for a quarter-century. I think they have succeeded very well at this.
I think they are smart enough to recognize that they will never be perceived as heroes, and merely seek some middle ground. Somewhere between a missionary and a mercenary are a couple of guys like Mark Smith and Richard Jensen, and that's OK. And reaching a middle ground is a far cry and huge improvement from my original thought when I heard their names.
Prior to all this stuff being written on McTopo, what did you-all think about Richard Jensen and Mark Smith, and how do you feel now? For me, it's like night and day. They have told me they feel vindicated, and I am very happy for them.
Neal - I don't get the context of what you mean above. Can you please clarify and add specifics? Cheers.
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Da_Dweeb
climber
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Jan 17, 2008 - 06:04pm PT
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LoveGas and others,
Clint doesn't have to read the 15 hours or so of these threads to comment as he has. He's commenting about THIS thread (Part XXVII) which was created BY Grossman for the purpose of smearing Smith and Jensen. If he's "fixated" on anything, he is fixated on the fact that this whole thread is a hack job on people, not on a climb. To try to make it out as if this thread is a slander against Grossman is a joke.
Hell, the OP couldn't be more ironic with the naming of this thread if he tried. Smith and Jensen moved on for good to worry about more important things about 150 posts before you resurrected this latest incarnation of the thread. So tell me, now that we're 212 posts further down the downward spiral, are the rest of you four and twenty bozos any closer to being done with this yourselves? Have you honestly said even a single damn thing that justifies continuing this debate, let alone a whole new thread?
This thread isn't about WoS. It's about trashing the climbers, not the climb. So I'd like to recommend to you all a favorite book of mine by Doctor Dennis Leary about a revolutionary new kind of therapy called, "SHUT the F*#K UP!!"
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Nefarius
Big Wall climber
Fresno, CA
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Jan 17, 2008 - 06:06pm PT
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Man, if that airplane would have crashed into the Great Slab in, say, 2005-ish, we'd all be sitting around the base of that thing smokin' some ganja instead! Chillin' like villains! hahaha
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Jan 17, 2008 - 06:18pm PT
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Wow!
Ten step etriers?
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Mimi
climber
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Jan 17, 2008 - 06:20pm PT
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Da-Dweebus, you're the one that helped start this mess up again, fool. And since when is Richard done with this debate? He's got you and other anonymous trolls chirping their song regularly.
The climb was messed up by these two guys so why wouldn't they and their tactics be discussed? And they've done their best to stir this pot since they got on the ST back in 2005. They're as big a part of the mudslinging as anyone else.
Are you a climber who's really interested in this controversy or one of his brown nosing students hoping to win points?
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Da_Dweeb
climber
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Jan 17, 2008 - 06:46pm PT
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Mimi –
I’d rather be an “anonymous troll” than a cliquish, territorial, elitist, self-righteous bitch like yourself. You’re damn right I started this mess up again – with a post to attest from first-person experience about Mark’s good character as a _former_ student who considered him one of the most important people in my life – as a teacher, and not as a climber. I did so to try to give a little positive light on his character after all the mudslinging YOU and others brought against him. I have since regretted doing so because sure enough, out of the woodwork it brought back out all of you little petty people with your little petty grudges about imagined slights against “your” rock, “your” valley, “your” proper order of things from 25 frakking years ago to keep this carnival of crap going. I say what I say with no approval nor endorsement nor even encouragement from Mark or Richard. You need to grow up and shut up, Mimi. Same with you, Grossman.
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Mighty Hiker
Social climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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Jan 17, 2008 - 06:53pm PT
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Ron, how about 12 step etriers? Would they aid? (So to speak.) I mean, a higher power would be involved and all that stuff.
"Hi, my name is Pete (either), and I'm a peteonaholic."
"Hi, my name is X, and I'm a WingsofSteelaholic."
"Hi, my name is Z, and I'm a SuperTopoaholic."
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scuffy b
climber
Stump with a backrest
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Jan 17, 2008 - 07:10pm PT
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I don't understand the "drive" to halt this nonsense.
Is there anything bad to say that has not already been said?
If you're tired of it, ignore it.
If you're a participant, glory in it.
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Wade Icey
Trad climber
www.alohashirtrescue.com
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Jan 17, 2008 - 07:19pm PT
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stupid doo doo heads! I'm telling Mom!
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WBraun
climber
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Jan 17, 2008 - 07:19pm PT
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Ah yes ..... Commercial break.
Time for a message from our sponsor.
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Off White
climber
Tenino, WA
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Jan 17, 2008 - 07:31pm PT
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If they're not concerned about a legacy, why do they care about "the truth coming out"? If Truth is all they're worried about, hey, they lived it, what more do they need? The Truth, capital T, doesn't really involve what people think, it's a dry as dust objective actuality that cannot involve opinion. It can encompass how much force was applied to a piece of bent angled steel, but it cannot address whether that force was appropriate. Truth, small t, is subjective, based upon an individual's perspective. Mark and Richard want their small t truth accepted by others, but it's all fuzzy jive subject to interpretation. Werner may believe that after we die we come around again, and I may believe that once you're dead its all maggots and weevils ever after, but that doesn't give either of us a lock on the capital T Truth. We can lobby others to accept the view from our perspective, but it cannot affect the Truth.
Mark and Richard want everyone to enshrine their truth as Truth, replacing the currently enthroned interpretation. Whatever, ya'll are gonna vote one way or another based on a raft of your own experiences, perceptions, bias, and friendships. Myself, I think the ladies doth protest too much, but that and a dollar and a quarter will get me a ride on the bus. Pete, I think your opinion weighs about the same, but given the photographic evidence compared to your 20 and 40 foot declaration, I think you're overdue for a visit with the ophthalmologist.
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Off White
climber
Tenino, WA
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Jan 17, 2008 - 07:32pm PT
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Oh, and I do have to say that I appreciate Jody's diversions, eye candy in an ugly place is always welcome.
edit: Scuffyb, I've only spent one day in your presence, but I treasure you nonetheless.
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Gene
climber
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Jan 17, 2008 - 07:43pm PT
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Only 16 more days until Groundhog Day.
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survival
Big Wall climber
arlington, va
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Jan 17, 2008 - 07:45pm PT
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Hey Dweeb,
You said Mark and Richard had moved on long ago, but that sure didn't keep Richard from jumping in with both feet on a Bill Russell thread that had nary a word about those guys until he came in with some really strong words.
That's not moving on.........
Bruce
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Wade Icey
Trad climber
www.alohashirtrescue.com
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Jan 17, 2008 - 07:52pm PT
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hey jody is that last photo enhanced? and what makes you think you have the credentials to take photos of MY ocean? Have you taken previous photos of any ocean? did you get permission from the big guys upstairs (that would be Ansel and Galen) to take these photos? Can you prove you have permission? digital or velvia? Prove it! and what gives you the right to post these photos on MY internet? I know Eppie and he knows how those dials are supposed to work. Did you get his permission to use those dials? Does your faith make it any easier to use those dials? Can you prove your faith makes it easier? It's a simple question. why are you being so evasive? I lived in the valley for ten years. long enough to know that anyone who's lived in the valley is right about everything, all the time. How long did you live in the valley? I would display my wit and flaunt my large vocabulary and call you a bunch of names so you could post an indignant defense, but hey, i'm better than that and I have a lettuce garden to tend and it's nap time so quit persecuting me because i'm pretty.
happy bday to your dad. i think we can put aside our differences long enough to agree that dads are cool. eh?
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