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Anastasia

Trad climber
California
Topic Author's Original Post - Oct 4, 2007 - 04:16pm PT
I have been thinking about what it means to be part of the climbing community...

I think this community is real and if we develop it a little bit more. If we all participate in helping each other, have more get togethers the possibilities are endless. (SushiFest is brilliant)

Just look at the Jewish community where they help each other in jobs, medical care, emotional needs etc. Over the years their whole community that use to be one of the poorest has risen up to be one of the wealthiest and most influential groups in America.
Why not climbers? If we can put our differences aside and always support each other especially with dealings of the non-climbing world, what can be possible?

On another note:
I have heard sad things about climbers that work in the rigging/stunt business; they are famous for trying to undermine each other and thus dropping the value of their worth. I wonder if can we change this trend?

Everyone knows cooperation means higher standards of living. Is it possible for us to do it among our group? Can we, will we truly be a community?
AF
nature

climber
Flagstaff, AZ
Oct 4, 2007 - 04:23pm PT
We can thank Jeff Lowe for the brilliance of SushiFest. He inspired the idea. Now it's up to the rest of us to keep the magic alive!

This is a quote from someone on RC.com

Nature is spreading the joy from what started over on Supertopo.com. I have yet to attend one of the events, but I really can't think of a larger, more well-received gathering of climbers that didn't involve a "competition" or paid sponsoship of some sort. The "who's who" list of attendees has been rather impressive -- not that we care much about that kind of crap, but if you'd like to rub elbows with some legends and those who have been legends in their own minds this is the party to attend.

I never thought of it in these terms until that post. But the bigger question is, as Anastasia sorta asks, how can we have events like the sushifest (doesn't have to involve sushi) that fosters a climbing community feel?

Anastasia - per your request I sent you an email regarding the next sushifest but I didn't hear back. Are you and JB in?

bluering

Trad climber
Santa Clara, Ca.
Oct 4, 2007 - 04:31pm PT
I think we are a pretty darn good community as it is. Helping uninsured injured climbers, picking up sh#t, supporting others with emotional/physical ailments (juan, bvb, Donny), Fatty helping with investment tips and jobs.

I kinda know what ya mean, but anything in particular you had in mind?
jstan

climber
Oct 4, 2007 - 04:49pm PT
The biggest step in this direction, not surprisingly, will be the hardest. Find a Ken Yager in each climbing area.
crusher

climber
Santa Monica, CA
Oct 4, 2007 - 04:51pm PT
Hey not to mention events like the Stonemasters' Reunion and the Woodson Shindig!!!

I'm not a Stonemaster or a Woodson local but the feeling of kinship, community and welcome at those events was wonderful and something that one doesn't feel so often living in a big city and being consumed by work, etc.

I was never into "blogging" or visiting forums until I starting "hangin' out" with you guys.
Anastasia

Trad climber
California
Topic Author's Reply - Oct 4, 2007 - 05:07pm PT
Nature,
I am trying to be in but John has a slideshow on that date. (He likes having me come along since I am good with crowd control.)
Yet since I really want to go to Sushifest, I might ignore my slideshow duties (john can survive without me) and just go to the fest by myself.
Right now I am on the fence, trying to figure out what I should do...
AF
---------------------------------------


As for helping people, I am not talking about helping just "a climber" but organizing something more extravagant to help "all" who qualify as being in need. Including helping with job searches, emotional needs, etc.
I am talking about creating a much stronger network with specific purposes in mind, Something that will involve all of us to participate for our cause. The goal simply being to increase our communities economic/social quality of life.
pud

climber
Sportbikeville
Oct 4, 2007 - 05:33pm PT
The community is here Anastasia. It really is.
A few months ago I didn't believe this but because of some unexpected events I have seen it with my own two eyes.
Last June after climbing at Stoney I was talking to Micheal Reardon about the lack of support and real community here in SoCal.
He told me he didn't feel a sense of community here other than his friends and that recently he had discovered that the real community was in Boulder, Co.
He said the people there cared about eachother.
He also shared with me that it bothered him that so many people couldn't put petty issues aside and climb and live well together.
I could see in his face that he was truly concerned with this issue.

A couple of month's later and I'm putting together a benefit on behalf of my fallen friend.
The Micheal Reardon/HERA benefit was a great success on Sept. 8th 2007 in Westlake, Ca.
Not so much because of the money raised for HERA but because of the community support I witnessed.
I approached a small Printing shop here in Simi Valley and asked if they could print up raffle tickets for free for the event. They were not very busy and had only been in business a short time and with good reason could have said no. Instead the husband and wife team had the 5000 tickets printed that afternoon.
I walked into a Home Depot in Thousand Oaks and walked out with thirty trashcans, pop up tents and other items donated by a kind and caring non-climber sales manager.
John Bachar donated shoes
Locker offered resoles
REI, A-16, Sports Chalet, Tiffany Campbel/Levine, Lowes and many climbing and non climbing individuals and bussinesses offered goods and services for free. Simply to help.
The list goes on and on.
All of these people including non climbers wanted to help.
I finally realized the people here just needed a place to go to express thier caring and kindness. It's here. People care.
We do need to cultivate this behaviour the best way we can.
More Sushifest's, more Crag clean up days, more support to fallen/injured climbers and the ones they leave behind.
As strong, caring, individuals it is our responsiblity to be the ones to initiate.
Crimpergirl

Social climber
St. Looney
Oct 4, 2007 - 05:53pm PT
The community is *here* at ST.com too.

I mean, where else can we post threads about leaking showers, our art, relationships, loss of pets or humans we loved, get beta, share our successes and failures, taunt, laugh and cry together? I have learned about plants, physics, real estate, wine, birds and even climbing here. I have met the most amazing people, and been exposed to some *haut* climber photos here (oh yeah!). And the excellent climbing - much of it stemmed from events learned about here.

Can it get better than this?
Mungeclimber

Trad climber
sorry, just posting out loud.
Oct 4, 2007 - 06:26pm PT
if i may offer this:

sushifest is something unique. can the original sushifest be recaptured? I would say 'no'. But what do i know.

Instead, keeping shindigs, hoo hahs, clean ups and ballywhose or is it whoms, should be kept organic to retain that sense of community.

The forum allows the common communication and language, but the real community comes from climbing with people and outreach to each other.

large scale events can be fun, but will invariably not be inclusive enough, or be too exclusive.

i say, overlap the communities (no sexual innuendo, you dirty pervs). Woodson Shindig over here, then Veedawooo hoo over there, and some, but not all folks attend the Joshua Tree gigs, and so on, overlapping til everyone knows everyone via no more than 6 degrees of separation.

That or we all start stalking Kevin Bacon.

food for thought. not really an action plan. but a concerted overlapping effort i think would make a network more effective without becoming too massive a thing.

meh, disregard this post. I'm rambling again.
nature

climber
Flagstaff, AZ
Oct 4, 2007 - 06:45pm PT
No offense intended:

The difference between the sushifest(s) and the Stonemasters' Reunion and the Woodson Shindig is that sushifest brought a bunch of people together that didn't have a historic interest. Yeah, sure many were supertopians but many were not. That's neither a good thing nor a bad thing - it's just different. Certianly all three of the above events were a hell of a lot of fun and probably all three for different reasons.



sushifest is something unique. can the original sushifest be recaptured? I would say 'no'. But what do i know.

I think this statement is true. Or, well, I did up until the Facelift. Though it wasn't exactly a SushiFest (much overshadowed) by the Facelift itself) that little spot in Yellow Pines turned into a magical place for close to a week. I had people coming up to me saying "hey, you're the sushi guy, right? How do I get in?". Many people told me that by doing the sushi we/I added to the whole event greatly.

So no, the spirit of first sushifest will never recaptured. But that isn't to say that each and every one won't have it's own special and unique magic. Hell... we're just now figuring out how to throw an even bigger party! Ain't that right Pancake man?!?!
Ricky D

Trad climber
Sierra Westside
Oct 4, 2007 - 06:50pm PT
I agree that a community already exists on this site.

We have the creepy Uncle Al types, the crazy Aunt from your Dad's side, a humongous number of supposed "cousins" and that lady down the block with the birds.

We also have 50 or 60 people willing to give up a week of their lives to come to Yosemite to meet, feed and party with people they have never seen and to pick up the trash left by strangers who will never know we were there.

Along the way, we managed to become friends and faces. I know that if my Jeep ever breaks down in SLC or Flagstaff or Michigan or wherever - I can probably find a Supertopian nearby to offer a crash couch for the night.

That is a community on a national level.

What I really notice is that very little barrier exists among climbers. Think about it - some old fart 1980's climber like me can stand next to a Royal or a JStan or a Timmy O'Neill and actually talk without feeling that I look like a narc. Heck - I even got an autograph from Royal Robbins and shook hands with BOTH Huber Brothers and Ron Kauk.

I say this because I have also belonged to the communities of skiers and skydivers. Let me assure you that neither of those groups so readily tolerate some "nobody" hanging with the gods.

But climbers do.

Community at it's best.



Mtnmun

Trad climber
Top of the Mountain Mun
Oct 4, 2007 - 09:28pm PT
Bwaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhh sniff sniff Bwaaahhhhhhhhhhhh
I love you Guys!
Ricky D

Trad climber
Sierra Westside
Oct 4, 2007 - 09:33pm PT

Yeah - is getting kinda cheesy like some Oprah show isn't it?

But in our defense - NO ONE ever sang the entire lyrics to "Kumbhaya" or "Michael Row Your Boat Ashore" during any of the bonfire parties.

So we got that going for us okay.

Mighty Hiker

Social climber
Vancouver, B.C.
Oct 4, 2007 - 10:36pm PT
I helped with and attended the FaceLift, and did what I could to recruit SuperTopians to help, because I believe that for all our minor differences, climbers do form a community. I'm not exactly sure what sort of community it is, but there are many shared values and experiences. I wouldn't stretch it too far - there's a lot of geography. And a certain demographic is perhaps over-represented on SuperTopo, although I believe there are many younger, perhaps shyer, lurkers. But there are lots of commonalities.

The FaceLift went well, especially when you consider that it, and the museum, are essentially Ken's full time unpaid job. (Time to contribute - http://www.yosemiteclimbing.org/membership.html); It showed what we can do when we work together, both in terms of our own community, and how we inter-relate with the larger communities we share our spaces with. Plus it was a lot of fun, and a chance to meet many old and new friends. Even if I didn't stay at Yellow Pines. (Whimper.)
happiegrrrl

Trad climber
New York, NY
Oct 4, 2007 - 10:56pm PT
The whole key to experiencing the climbing community is - to get out there, away from you local crag, once in a while. And - when you are at your local crag - be welcoming to those visiting from other areas.

I have met so many people in real life that I first met online here in the forums. Maybe it's that I have the Gunks(the 42nd Street of climbing), but I can't walk down the carriage road without getting stopped by at least one person who recognizes me (usually because of Teddy).

That said - This weekend, I need climbing partners!!! I haven't got anyone either Saturday OR Sunday. This sucks!

If anyone is looking to climb at the Gunks or willing to let me tag as a 3rd in the party - please send me an email or look for me in the AM(I camp at Slime, will be at the bagel breakfast in the uberfall on Saturday, and on Sunday I guess I'll just head to the uberfall too, if I haven't hooked up by then.

jstan

climber
Oct 4, 2007 - 11:49pm PT
On several occasions I have said on ST I was basically a miserable SOB at heart. I will now prove it.

A person asked to climb with me at Facelift. I said I had thought of climbing but had shelved the idea so as to do things and concentrate on Facelift. I also said I was not convinced I could teach the person very much. Just watching how a person moves and how they use their hands gives one insight. Frankly I thought the person was very soon headed for harder climbs than I can do now, if not already there. If the person had given any indication that a lack of knowledge might put them in danger, I would have changed my plan. I did not see such a sign. Once I have a plan that is reasonable and remains the best course of action I tend to proceed.

I still feel terrible. Should there ever be a next time I have to try and do better.

I can't remember a single instance in which I felt poorly treated.

Jody may have just run into me at some point.

Euroford

Trad climber
chicago
Oct 4, 2007 - 11:59pm PT
i do for one believe in the broader community of climbing. I've been helped out so much, i have friends in so many places, its a wonderful thing.

awww, i really do love you guys!

Alex Perry

Trad climber
California
Oct 5, 2007 - 02:06am PT
Many have been driven away from supertopo by mean people. In a healthy community people don't have to be so evil to each other. Climbers can be some of the smallest, back-biting, jealous people on the planet. I mean, the way Krakauer trashed Boukreev unrightly. On the other hand, there are virtual saints here.
M3(mad moderate mtnr)

Mountain climber
Sac'to, CA
Oct 5, 2007 - 02:10am PT
The Pancake Man recovers -- kinda!

Migthy Hiker: "I helped with and attended the FaceLift, and did what I could to recruit SuperTopians to help, because I believe that for all our minor differences, climbers do form a community. I'm not exactly sure what sort of community it is, but there are many shared values and experiences. I wouldn't stretch it too far - there's a lot of geography. And a certain demographic is perhaps over-represented on SuperTopo, although I believe there are many younger, perhaps shyer, lurkers. But there are lots of commonalities.
The FaceLift went well, especially when you consider that it, and the museum, are essentially Ken's full time unpaid job. (Time to contribute - http://www.yosemiteclimbing.org/membership.html); It showed what we can do when we work together, both in terms of our own community, and how we inter-relate with the larger communities we share our spaces with."

Sargeant MH (not to offend, because while long not part of the Military-Industial complex, I think it takes a good sargent, over an officer, to accomplish what MH can/does do): you & many at this (my first) Facelift demonstrated the "many shared values and experiences." of our come-unity. You also nailed it when you (in a different string) suggest that someone like Ken provides a wonderful nexus around which the larger climbing community of an area can coalesce(noting that Yosemite -- Like JTree _ is geographically international when the climbing facet is examined). I personally was gratified also to see his/YCA's vision of focusing on commonalities both within the CLIMBING community, and the larger (maybe?) community which has interests in Yosemite.
And although Timmie O'Neil thought he MISTAKENLY wandered into a Rainbow Gathering, only to "realize" he was at the YFL, he actually WAS at the Rainbow Gathering in reality -- as the many different hues of humanity's affection for Yosemite played out their role in the grand Merced River Valley.

SMH: "Plus it was a lot of fun, and a chance to meet many old and new friends. Even if I didn't stay at Yellow Pines. (Whimper.)"

(see below, on "magic") Well, you damn sure did miss out on staying at the Yellow Pines, and what a magical place it was, with or without externally stimulated perceptions! (Thanks, Doc ;-). And I think that you're going to have to make up for it in 2008, by recruiting even more to YP Cmpgrd, and if not stay there yourself, at least be sure to show up at more of the Sushi & breakfast gigs next year (don't know if your Irish, but you seem to have the touch for o' pot o' gold!)


Nature: "No offense intended:

The difference between the sushifest(s) and the Stonemasters' Reunion and the Woodson Shindig is that sushifest brought a bunch of people together that didn't have a historic interest."

M3: Gotta both agree & disagree here, Nature (but don't let me lead you astray ;-). I think ALL of us have some sort of "historic interest -- perhaps not on an immediate personal level, but through some historic connection to Yosemite, whether through direct experience, stories of those who've gone before, or in previous existences. But you are dead on about the idea that this past week saw the coming together -- in an unique, meaningful & productive way -- of many people who had little or no previous know contact (Although I'm now certain that the Poop Queen & I knew each other from Gabe's, Ia City, IA!).

Nature: "Yeah, sure many were supertopians but many were not. That's neither a good thing nor a bad thing - it's just different."

Absolutely! That's why Kenny-boy has nurtured this creature into doubling in size each of the past four year!



Nature: "Though it wasn't exactly a SushiFest (much overshadowed) by the Facelift itself) that little spot in Yellow Pines turned into a magical place for close to a week. I had people coming up to me saying "hey, you're the sushi guy, right? How do I get in?". Many people told me that by doing the sushi we/I added to the whole event greatly."

M3: Sushi in the woods is -- especially for this ol' Iowa Mountaineer -- a mind-bender (even sans assist from the Doc!). And having people like Ken's niece & grand niece & nephew, who guided my kids around YP, and around the dance floor!) Meeting both historic and modern heroes of mine from the world of vertical was grand! Hearing your cheers when I won a raffle at the final dance just almost made me piss my pants!!! ;-)

Nature: "So no, the spirit of first sushifest will never recaptured. But that isn't to say that each and every one won't have it's own special and unique magic. Hell... we're just now figuring out how to throw an even bigger party! Ain't that right Pancake man?!?!"

M3: I'm in. Just gotta get'em thin! (AC, is thin & GREEN still OK?). Nita says she can't coordinate, but I think we can all put the heat on Andy to let her bring along the pot (coffee thermos!). Dawn is promising a wine-opener & glasses! Ricky D. is even suggesting a warm-up at their mountain cabin.
Can we get Chris Mac to show?

Cheers!

M3

PS: Nature, you bring the cranberry-almond bread, and I promise to bring along the sandbag! ;-)

PSS: Watch out next year, Crimpergirl, 'cause I'm looking for a good wench for the front of my truck, & I know in Missouri they make 'em tough as mules!
nature

climber
Flagstaff, AZ
Oct 5, 2007 - 02:17am PT
I love you man.
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