Discussion Topic |
|
This thread has been locked |
Greg Barnes
climber
|
|
|
May 25, 2007 - 01:49pm PT
|
The bolt on South Crack was off-route, about 15-20' above the logical weakness. It was a 1/4" thread-head split-shaft with a stainless SMC hanger. People would sometimes retreat off that single 1/4" bolt, but more often they would clip it, traverse left to the corner, place pro, and the follower would be faced with a nasty pendulum potential. In any case, I removed it years ago & patched the hole.
Interestingly enough, TM Herbert once asked me to add a bolt on-route about 20' below where that bolt used to be.
|
|
G_Gnome
Trad climber
Knob Central
|
|
|
May 25, 2007 - 01:54pm PT
|
Greg, your proposal for replacing the belay anchors for Dixie Peach sounds good. I know of a couple climbers that end up sort of stuck in the middle of nowhere without them last summer.
|
|
Nick
climber
portland, Oregon
|
|
|
May 25, 2007 - 04:57pm PT
|
I put in most of the bolts on the third pitch of Sunnyside Down. As I recall, the last bolt placed on the route was used to protect the step over onto the razor thin flake that leads to West Crack. A standard nut anchor was then used. Sunnyside is not that great a route.
I did Dixie Peach to the top with my daughter last summer and was surprised to find the anchor on the outside edge of the Great White hike gone. Not that big a deal, but it was there in the 70's and is really convenient.
|
|
bachar
Trad climber
Mammoth Lakes, CA
|
|
|
Topic Author's Reply - May 26, 2007 - 01:52pm PT
|
South Crack was put up as a clean first ascent by Robbins - no bolts, no pins - if I remember correctly???
|
|
Greg Barnes
climber
|
|
|
May 26, 2007 - 02:15pm PT
|
I think South Crack was done to the end of the crack, then rappelled off of pitons, for many years, then TM Herbert did the FA of the slabs. Eventually the pins fell out or were pulled and everyone continued up.
Tom Higgins let me know that the bolt on p2 of West Crack just appeared one day in the '70s, and was not original. I'd prefer to remove it, but it's been indicated as a belay bolt for decades of climbing guidebooks. Anyone have opinions on removing it or replacing it?
|
|
Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
|
|
|
May 26, 2007 - 02:41pm PT
|
Royal wrote an article called "Save South Crack" way back when that used the route as a call to arms to cease using hammered protection on this and other routes that had been reasonably done without force. I don't have a TM guide to check the FA party. If RR did it clean on the FA, as with The Nutcracker, his point would have been that much stronger.
|
|
Clint Cummins
Trad climber
SF Bay area, CA
|
|
|
May 26, 2007 - 03:31pm PT
|
FA of South Crack: Gordon Webster and Frank de Sausurre, 1965.
I remember the Robbins article, "Help Save South Crack", in Summit magazine, as described by Steve.
|
|
Greg Barnes
climber
|
|
|
May 27, 2007 - 08:22pm PT
|
Roger tells me that there might be an even more confusing situation with that first anchor/3rd pro bolt. He's pretty sure he replaced a 4 quarter-inch-bolt anchor with two good bolts, and patched the other two holes (this would be easy to check by searching for the patched holes).
Assuming that the bolt count on the first pitch is correct at 3 pro bolts and a 2-bolt anchor, then there'd be several possibilities:
1) JB just missed one of the bolts (pretty darn easy to do with stainless steel bolts & hangers in Tuolumne) - and Roger says that the 2nd bolt on the first pitch is up and right, not up and left as the Reid guide says, so that would be even more likely.
2) the 3rd pro bolt was doubled by someone, and then later others added even more anchor bolts (bolt kits were somewhat common even on established routes at one point)
3) a pro bolt is missing (even modern bolts can be sheared clean off by rockfall/avalanches)
However, I think we might need Tom Higgins to sort this out, especially with the old Roper guide not even mentioning a bolted belay at all on the first pitch. However, he also doesn't mention bolts at several upper belays which are bolted. Here's what Roper's '76 guide says:
"Sweet Jesus. 5.9. This excellent route goes up the right side of the golden wall mentioned in the preceding description. Begin climbing on rippled rock which rises steeply from comfortable ledges. Several bolts protect the first long lead, which ends at a small ledge with a crack. Next, climb easier rock (using a vertical crack for protection) to a two-bolt belay. Traverse down and left about 40 feet; then climb up a bit to a belay ledge. On the next pitch climb past a bolt to a belay ledge only 50 feet above the belayer. Next, climb past two bolts and then head up and right over easier rock to the base of a long, left-leaning arch. A short traverse right allows access to the right-facing dihedral visible from the road. Follow this to the top."
|
|
Brutus of Wyde
climber
Old Climbers' Home, Oakland CA
|
|
|
May 27, 2007 - 09:07pm PT
|
LongAgo --
Green Dot soles. Haven't thought of those things for decades. Thanks for stirring the memories.
Brutus
|
|
nboles
Trad climber
fremont. ca
|
|
|
May 27, 2007 - 10:38pm PT
|
More food for thought
From Alan Nelsons Guide 2nd edition 1982
Sweet Jesus 5.9+
Begin Cimbing on rippled rock rising steeply from comfortable ledges. End on a small ledge with two bolts. Climb easier rock to a bolt belay. Traverse down and left 40', then up to a belay ledge. Climb a 50' pitch past a bolt to a ledge. Climb past two bolts until possible to traverse down and right to a left leaning arch. Pray the second doesn't fall, unless the like 80' pendulums. Traverse tight into a right-facing dihedral and follow it to the top.
|
|
bobh
climber
Bishop, California
|
|
|
May 30, 2007 - 08:20pm PT
|
Regarding the bolt above the overhang on West Crack, Greg asked:
*
And while we're talking about original bolts - does anyone know the heritage of the 1/4" bolt at the 2nd belay on West Crack (by the tree about 40' above the roof)? I keep forgetting that it's even there (I never belay there), but noticed it yesterday and it really ought to be either removed or replaced - there's an outward pull on a old thin SMC hanger. It looks a lot like the old bolts on Sunnyside Down.
*
Based on Nick's description, I'd guess it's on Sunnyside Down. I belay there when I'm doing West Crack and I expect that the follower is going to struggle on the overhang, so the bolt (backed up by a cam or two) serves an additional purpose beyond being a protection bolt on Sunnyside Down. Anyway, it's about as far from West Crack as the Blown Away bolts. My vote would be to replace it.
|
|
scuffy b
climber
The town that Nature forgot to hate
|
|
|
May 31, 2007 - 10:50am PT
|
I got to do Sweet Jesus on the 77 solstice with Big Al Bartlett
and Big Robb Dellinger. I was more scared than I expected to be.
The boys were razzing me pretty hard, but we all did just fine.
I was climbing in Directissimas with EB soles taken from a pair
of bobh's worn out shoes.
|
|
bachar
Trad climber
Mammoth Lakes, CA
|
|
|
Topic Author's Reply - May 31, 2007 - 11:08am PT
|
nboles - hmmm....from Alan Nelson's guidebook it sounds like maybe the third bolt on the first pitch was originally a belay? Maybe that's why there are two bolts there now?
It is a good ledge after all even though it is a short pitch. If I was doing the first ascent I may have stopped there as well. There's a tricky section going straight up (5.8) or a possible traverse left to a corner (corner looks tough however). Much further up is another belay where the unprotected 5.8 traverse goes left and "One Toke" continues straight up.
|
|
Dick_Lugar
Trad climber
Indiana (the other Mideast)
|
|
|
Jul 10, 2009 - 08:43am PT
|
Sounds like the perfect name for this climb...I can hear the leader's saying this over and over as they climbed it. Gotta love Bachar's youthful enthusiasm in this thread, and all his threads for that matter. And a Brutus of Whyde post on here to boot...what a great climbing archive!
Frank
|
|
Ghoulwe
Trad climber
Spokane, WA
|
|
|
Jul 10, 2009 - 09:02am PT
|
Greg:
I believe the big Leeper-style hangers that you're referring to were made by Mark Houston (sp?) in San Diego in the late '80's or early 90's. I'm sure Juan Maderita can confirm or correct me if you were interesed in being certain. He only made a few batches that I'm aware of.
I bought quite a few of these hangers from Mark and placed many of them on routes in Northern Baja. They were a bit beefier stock and had a much more generous biner hole size which helped being able to clip 'em if you happened on one with a sling threaded through it.
Eric Barrett
|
|
AP
Trad climber
Calgary
|
|
|
Jul 10, 2009 - 10:14am PT
|
I have always been suspicious of climbs rated 5.9+
Lots of sandbag potential
|
|
Greg Barnes
climber
|
|
|
Jul 10, 2009 - 11:00am PT
|
Thanks Eric. I had heard of those "big Leepers" years ago as DMM, but then someone corrected that and called them HME, but maybe that was supposed to be MHE (Mark Houston Enterprises maybe??).
Regardless, despite the rust, they are thicker than the thick Leepers (there are 3 generations of Leepers, 0.062" thick, 0.080", and 0.090" if I remember correctly), and I don't know of any cases of the Houston hangers breaking. Actually I think that there were nearly no cases of the last generation Leepers breaking (other than due to rusting away in wet climates), but it's super hard to tell them apart without a caliper.
|
|
426
Sport climber
Buzzard Point, TN
|
|
|
Jul 10, 2009 - 12:08pm PT
|
Even 20 years or so later i remember this route with a certain clarity that comes from being underpowered and so much a noviciate on a route above my head. To stupid to know better. 5.9+ means 5.10~ Jeebus, i'm sweating even realling the episode. Double pits to chesty!
Footgear: Kamet
Partner: Paul Crafton
Temp: just that cool, crisp morning Medlicott feel that makes you nauseous but not quite pukey. 5 degrees warmer and you would hurl
Relative humidity: .0007%
The bolts are widely spaced iirc. Each clip seemed to have a very hard move "just before" which I must have squandered minutes, felt like hours up there. Yates screamers. Only needed 3. Crafty was silent as I whined, whimpered, doubted, cursed, prayed and cajoled myself. On these leads some partners will give no encouragement which was perhaps appropriate.
After doing 2 pitches Crafty did throw up. I felt on the verge for the entire climb, each belay calming enough to quell the rising bile. Even though he was following, it was "too hard and scary" to continue. I can't recall various shenanigans to rappel off but do remember swinging on the last rappel and simultaneously jumping, rapping off the end of the rope, holding one end and Crafty catching or preventing a serious crater onto ledges below. We walked away and I'll never be back...there are bold climbers, there are old climbers........
Gene Drake always claimed that old rubber was superior to new fangled crap because it didn't roll. I remember that Kamet rubber being rather bricklike in chemical composition and not sticking like glue but definitely providing a platform for the edges and knobs.
|
|
Ed Bannister
Mountain climber
Riverside, CA
|
|
|
Jul 10, 2009 - 12:56pm PT
|
426
I was reading this thread because it may have been Bachars last comments on the forum, or anywhere. I designed some of the Kamet shoes in cooperation with the staff at the factory, and introduced the brand to the us market. You are excactly right about the intent of the rubber compound, the goal was to be as sticky as Fire, but better at edgeing. At that time Charles was still using the softer gummier stealth rubber, which you had to keep out of the sun at stances. Lated C4 came along which was stickier, and still held an edge, get Charles to tell you how he discovered that rubber, it's a fun story.
Ed Bannister
|
|
|
SuperTopo on the Web
|
Let us know!