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p.bix29
Sport climber
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Topic Author's Original Post - Jul 19, 2018 - 07:42am PT
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Hi all,
I'm a grad student conducting a research project about some problems that arise in the trad climbing world. I have compiled a survey of 6 questions with regard to trad climbing, gear placement, and overall safety. If you could spare 5 minutes of time to help me out and complete the survey, that would be awesome. I need some hard stats to back up my assumptions for the project.
Here is the google forms link:
https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLScZGRZqtSm7sh5O8KyN9P1tgg1zDV6zjYM7oUd-nkTLtPk5MA/viewform?usp=sf_link
If you have friends who might be interested in taking the survey as well, send them this link. I appreciate all the help I can get!
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Jon Beck
Trad climber
Oceanside
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Jul 19, 2018 - 08:56am PT
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seems like a seriously flawed survey, did you have climbers help with this?
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Russ Walling
Social climber
from Poofters Froth, Wyoming
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Jul 19, 2018 - 08:57am PT
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Don't take this the wrong way... but you egghead dudes with these surveys ask the dumbest questions ever. Your survey makes no sense, and don't try the line that "the questions may seem idiotic but they are designed to blah blah blah..."
Try harder... be familiar with the subject... ask intelligent questions.
Edit: Jon beat me to it.... but again, G'damn that was a sh#t survey
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Jul 19, 2018 - 09:12am PT
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What are you trying to accomplish? Sounds like maybe something in the direction of the last question...
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rgold
Trad climber
Poughkeepsie, NY
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Jul 19, 2018 - 09:20am PT
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Russ, the NSOED (National Society of Egghead Dudes) hereby formally protests using this survey, seemingly whipped up over lunch with little thought and less understanding, as an example of the generally fine work done by Egghead Dudes.
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Phil_B
Social climber
CHC, en zed
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Jul 19, 2018 - 09:21am PT
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Gotta say I agree with the other climbers. Looks like someone in a sociology class got an assignment, but doesn't know anything about climbing.
Radio buttons were not a good choice. I climb trad, sport, whatever. It depends on who I'm with and how I feel. Use check boxes.
What's a pain point? I've had difficulties placing pro, especially when I'm near my limit or if I'm tired or if I screwed up and placed that 0.75 30 ft. lower and I *REALLY* need it here.
edit: looked up pain point and it sounds like a way to make your perceived issues seem reasonable.
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Russ Walling
Social climber
from Poofters Froth, Wyoming
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Jul 19, 2018 - 09:39am PT
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I stand corrected RGold... lumping all EggHead Dudes in there was a knee jerk reaction to TWSE (The Worst Survey Evahhh)
Apologies to all the good Eggheads
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NutAgain!
Trad climber
South Pasadena, CA
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Jul 19, 2018 - 10:12am PT
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Sounds to me like someone is making a business plan for a product that protects flaring cracks, and is trying to collect original research to justify the demand/problem in the marketplace. Maybe for a business class? Doesn't seem sophisticated enough to be useful as part of attracting VC funding, and in any case, no VCs would fund a climbing gear product company. At least as of a decade ago, those folks are looking for a strong likelihood of 40x returns on their investment, and they don't want to bother for less than $5-10M investment, and this is not a $200M+ market. Even if it were, a startup could not expect to own most of it unless they had a patented solution and there were no other alternative solutions. But getting the patent can take years and if the product is not completely novel, competitors can offer prior art to invalidate the patent before it is accepted.
Then again, I gotta agree with others re: a person not so familiar with climbing... but I can't wrap my head around what a sociology student would be doing making a survey like this. I can't see the actual utility or even the intended utility.
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jogill
climber
Colorado
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Jul 19, 2018 - 10:18am PT
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Have academic standards at Notre Dame fallen so low?
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hooblie
climber
from out where the anecdotes roam
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Jul 19, 2018 - 10:21am PT
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adjust your focus to advanced studies in sociopathy and you've met your huckleberry
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ontheedgeandscaredtodeath
Social climber
Wilds of New Mexico
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Jul 19, 2018 - 10:34am PT
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For flares you just stuff that sh#t in deeper and hope for the best.
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Batrock
Trad climber
Burbank
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Jul 19, 2018 - 10:39am PT
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We have gear for flared cracks, they are called Totem Cams.
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briham89
Big Wall climber
santa cruz, ca
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Jul 19, 2018 - 12:43pm PT
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We have gear for flared cracks, they are called Totem Cams.
You spelled *OFFSET cams* wrong ;)
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Gnome Ofthe Diabase
climber
Out Of Bed
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Jul 19, 2018 - 02:26pm PT
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And No I have no shame, I could give a flyin'eF, as to what anyone thinks
I'm a thinker, having wasted way to much enjoying myself! So sadly this is enjoying myself. . . .
Etu` JGill? Here is a quote from a solid 5.12+ leading, gear using on-time east coast climber, saying nothing about the academics, but the piss-poor quality survey? seems to me I'd be embarrassed,I doubt the fine institution of higher learning has any thing to do with thisJohn Clark · 5 hours ago · San Francisco, CA · 2
s.price wrote:
Notre Dame approved this survey?
I would expect a higher standard.
Silly me. Oh, don't even get me started on the crap that the Notre Dame administration pulled with the climbing club after I graduated. They gutted the best climbing training facility (dirty 45 deg woody, hangboards, and a treadwall in a basement), made a new facility that the current climbing club is not allowed to fully utilize to lead, train, or practice skills in, trashed all the old holds and bought cheapo garbage to "maintain a uniform appearance for visitors", and banned loose chalk. They also banned trips further than an 8 hour drive from campus, meaning that students can't organize official trips to classic climbing areas in larger mountains. That's just the tip of the iceberg too.
This survey?, it is Complete lizard shjt:
please look at this link, the biotch(spelled"fancy) has posted the answer to this fake survey:
post #9
http://www.supertopo.com/climbing/thread.phptopic_id=3100043&msg=3100043#msg3100043
What is wrong with all you climbers Readers failure is rampant here, you display a serious lack of ability to think critically: The OP Just joined up? Clearly has little to no grasp of the subject, other than the title & a few lines?
Why do you ALL believe this crap? What is it ?
look to help with a question,
like: Hey, all my name is Ashley.... I'm looking for . . . . a device to follow folks in a down hill race..... & got 10 responses.
A real warm intro, nice (rolls left eyeball right & right eyeball left)
as opposed to this how y'all have sympathy for this crap?
Needs More Cow Bell, Less Gnome
[Click to View YouTube Video]I cut this video down from 5 minutes.
I climb back down, traversing high across the trough, obscured by the branch,toward the camera. Theres another where I head more left, along a line passing the shrubbery, into the sun.
**//0/0/0/0/0/0/000/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/
0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/000/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/0/**//
cSPIDER, I luvya'mhan but seriously? I'm not sure if these are generated by the insurance industry or what
but;
IT IS NOT REAL,
GO LOOK AT THE mNT rEJECT THREAD (I don't have those groovy symbols but copy rite, trade mark, TradeMark) !
the party that posted, wont respond,? what is that about?
just joined
not cred at all
no understanding of terms used to describe concepts used in climbing.
A clear disinterest in the subject, shown by the fact that , beyond the click bate title, there is zero indication of any climbing comprehension. They didn't try, but try it your self;
google works....
https://www.mountainproject.com/forum/topic/112482423/cam-placements-in-outward-flaring-cracks
Just clicking on the thread ?, each use of the click bait words or word,
PICTURES THAT WHILE CLEAR TO A CLIMBER SHOW CLEAR AMBIGUITY,NEED FOR CLARIFICATION, SUBJECT TO OPINION OF EXPERTS? CLASSIFIDE ON A SCALE?
thnx for sure' Xcon,hope its the last click, there needs to be a reason, the click bait, key words, seen as "value words" when evaluating claims, as a significant number of people request Rock Climbing Insurance, ??
thats a guess, benign, not worth worrying about,? why help 'em out?
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Jon Beck
Trad climber
Oceanside
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Jul 19, 2018 - 04:05pm PT
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Pain-point - completing a climb in any style while leaving visible blood on the rock. not to be confused with a red-point, although a red-point could also be a pain-point.
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Spider Savage
Mountain climber
The shaggy fringe of Los Angeles
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Jul 19, 2018 - 04:43pm PT
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Did the survey. Yes, it is poor. Please feel free to discuss you aims with us here. Many will answer seriously. Many will flame, tease, and insult you. It's part of the job.
I have encountered many flaring cracks in the last 45 years. They are scary. I have a good engineering mind so if there is a stance, I can make something work.
If there is no stance I run it out. Fooling around trying to place gear in a flair can take time. Safer to run it long of give up.
I have often pondered what type of gear one would need to protect a flairing crack. Physics and logic seem to defy a solution.
Permanent anchors such as bolts are a solution but we do not add them to existing climbs at this time.
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August West
Trad climber
Where the wind blows strange
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Jul 19, 2018 - 08:45pm PT
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I stand corrected RGold... lumping all EggHead Dudes in there was a knee jerk reaction to TWSE (The Worst Survey Evahhh)
Apologies to all the good Eggheads
The Dude abides.
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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Jul 21, 2018 - 06:45am PT
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Funny, in a few days I’m headed to The
Motherland of flared cracks, located in the equality state. If you don’t know where I mean, please remove your “survey” aka path to reinforce preconceived notions, until you do!
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