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chefer
climber
Altadena, CA
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Topic Author's Original Post - Feb 16, 2017 - 09:52pm PT
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Joshua Tree n00b here. Does anyone know the status of the pit? Havent been able to find much recent info on it. Is it still around?
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jstan
climber
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Feb 16, 2017 - 10:02pm PT
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The Pit is still there but due to zoning complaints received by the authorities, the owner of the
property can no longer allow camping. That is what I understand.
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guyman
Social climber
Moorpark, CA.
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Feb 17, 2017 - 08:49am PT
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The pit is closed.... it was starting to attract aliens from Mars and after one crashed their spacecraft, it was deemed a fire hazard.
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Russ Walling
Social climber
from Poofters Froth, Wyoming
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Feb 17, 2017 - 09:19am PT
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Occasional squatters still show up, and are usually rousted by the Sheriff on the late night patrol.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Feb 17, 2017 - 09:44am PT
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It takes a special sort of twisted tool to get off on rousting people in the middle of the night
from a place like that. How is that upholding a mandate "To Serve and Protect"? If it is
private property then it seems incumbent on the owner to fence and gate it.
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Jon Beck
Trad climber
Oceanside
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Feb 17, 2017 - 09:52am PT
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The property owner probably gave the LEOs authority. I wonder how this affects the VRBO and AirBnB people renting camping space in their yards. Seems like the pit became a sort of cluster bomb, with mini-pits all over town.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Feb 17, 2017 - 09:55am PT
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Amen, gf, especially if they're too stoopid to know there's 10 million acres of legal
free camping nearby.
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jstan
climber
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Feb 17, 2017 - 09:55am PT
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Since climbers are no longer at the site there has been an increase in dumping. I have kept it clear of
residential trash such as TVs, sofas, and bedding but landscape cuttings do present a problem. At this
time I need to gather the cuttings together and bury the ashes from the burn.
An erosion gully is developing that will interfere quite effectively with entry from the East. After that is
complete the way can be restored using the landscape cuttings to vertical mulch the Eastern entrance.
The entry from the West remains problematic.
I could use some help.......
Edit:
For a brief time the site was used by a homeless person. I just remove trash from active homeless sites. Not my place to do more.
To reach free camping recommended by the NPS:
Go North on Sunburst.
Turn right on "....los amigos" at the northern boundary of the school property. Be aware Los Amigos will turn into "Broadway" after mile or so.
Go till you see RVs parked around and there is a single road sign nailed to an isolated power pole. I forget the name of that road.
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Happiegrrrl2
Trad climber
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Feb 17, 2017 - 09:58am PT
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The Pit was nice for what it was, and I appreciated it.
I've been sleeping in Walmart which is practically an RV park on Thursday-Saturday nights, and has at least 4-5 "regular" vans on other nights. No hassles from the outside world.
The only downside is that I haven't a place to set up and cook. I like to use the full set up two burner stove with the 20lber, and do not like having to pull out the entire bin of gear and put it all away when done. But many people cook much ore simply. So, I am spending money on food at restaurants, and I now realize I would have probably spent only a little more by camping somewhere "official" longterm. Oh well....sometimes I am a little slow. Still paying ore for "free wifi" as well, instead of getting back on a mobile broadband plan.
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Happiegrrrl2
Trad climber
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Feb 17, 2017 - 10:02am PT
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JStan - I am here until March 5th and have free time. Do you have any upcoming dates where you might like to meet up?
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chefer
climber
Altadena, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Feb 17, 2017 - 10:16am PT
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A bummer - it seemed like an interesting place. I guess it's gonna be BLM for me this weekend. If anyone needs a partner I'll probably be hanging around hidden valley Sunday and Monday.
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jstan
climber
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Feb 17, 2017 - 11:49am PT
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Happi:
The ten day forecast predicts good weather on 23 and 24(next Thursday/Friday. Until the weather
looks bad shall we plan to meet at the pit next Thursday/23rd at 10AM? I have tools and supplies.
We can prune the cuttings down to the needed shape, haul them to the place they are to be used. And
rake up the ashes and bury them. This is a lot. I may be able to get another person or two to join in. In
the Clean Team we usually repair afterward to the Park Rock Cafe to tell lies. If interested we could do
that too.
If the Eastern access has already been closed by natural processes then we can do at least some
vertical mulching.
Here too I need some ST help. Before we can really go ahead with this I need to contact Wally Barker.
Anyone here know how to contact him? Need to know right away.
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jstan
climber
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Feb 18, 2017 - 10:55am PT
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Happi:
I have to cancel working on the Pit. My truck is in the shop. Hope you see this.
John
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NutAgain!
Trad climber
South Pasadena, CA
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Feb 18, 2017 - 03:44pm PT
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Amen, gf, especially if they're too stoopid to know there's 10 million acres of legal free camping nearby.
At least until the feds turn it over to California, and then California sells it to a solar company for cheap or something like that.
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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Feb 18, 2017 - 03:52pm PT
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Twas truly a "pit" not fit for man nor beast.
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Happiegrrrl2
Trad climber
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Feb 18, 2017 - 04:05pm PT
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JStan - I see your posts. Sorry about your truck!
If you'd like to exchange phone #, you can contact me through my chalkbag shop at https://www.etsy.com/shop/ClimbAddictDesigns
I'm going to be here till around March 5th - only about two more weeks, unfortunately, but happy to do some work if you set time/date.
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BLUEBLOCR
Social climber
joshua tree
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Feb 18, 2017 - 04:17pm PT
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Jstan, you can talk to Wally on FB👽
vvv Hahahahaha, you little devil
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jstan
climber
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Progress report on the JT Pit.
And the associated 18 acres need refreshing. Comes at a bad time. There are pillows alongside Rt.62 that are visible to National Park visitors. Park season is nearing.I have four miles of shoulder to work on East of La Contenta. Eight days of work there. Never rains but it pours.
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Happiegrrrl2
Trad climber
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What a shame. Once you hauled out all that trash from the Pit a few years ago, the place was kept nicely. It's kind of sad that people are dumping there.
I a heading away on Sunday, JStan. Next winter, I hope I can spend some time working with you on some of your cleanups. Sorry it didn't happen this season.
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jstan
climber
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Happi:
Next winter. You are on. In the interim, drive low and slow.
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SofCookay
climber
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Jstan, I live in JT during the winter and I am more than happy to help with clean-ups. I will be here until the end of April so if you need a volunteer for any clean-ups before then, please drop me a line.
Sonya
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jstan
climber
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Sonya:
Very much appreciate your interest. On such short notice I don't expect you to adapt your schedule. By 11AM I plan on beginning trucking the trash and wood away. On the chance you can help and find me not there I will leave a rake to use in raking up ashes after pulling slash away from the ashes. If the rake is not there yet you can pull the slash away from the ashes. Lots to do!
PS Someone trying to drive in on the road from the east got hung up on the wash that cuts that road. The west entrance from Hillview is exciting but still drivable approached up Hillview from the north. I am thinking now the slash can be used to make both entrances more than dumpers are interested in negotiating.
Supposed to have rain on Sunday. Will post again at the end of today.
John
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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hey there say, jstan, and sofcookay... wow, good hearts...
good work, and may you succeed...
and hopes for the long term, as well...
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jstan
climber
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Jebus:
In the beginning the landowner, Wally, and Robert Fonda elected at no personal gain to move a hella lot of dirt so that climbers could stay there at no cost. While there were people there residential trash was not a problem.
The county decided this use of the property could not continue. That decision does not change the fact our community benefitted and, in all fairness, we should do what we can to return the favor. I am sorry you feel you personally did not benefit enough for you to recognize the favor that was offered. But that is your problem.
Today all the residential trash was taken out, The ashes left after some slash was burned, was raked into piles ready for burying, Those areas will then be top dressed with clean sand so as to be largely restored. Slash useful for vertical mulching of the access roads has been separated and laid out so as to be accessible. The remaining small brush will be run through a chipper shredder. After this has been completed we will search out and remove wind blown trash everywhere on the 18 acres. A couple of years ago I, Robert, and a youngster using the Pit cleaned the whole parcel, so this will be just a refresh.
Years ago I did a little climbing and there the ideal was to leave no sign of your passing. That was very satisfying and I find the present work just as satisfying. But everything we do here is clearly a visible improvement. It's a different game.
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ß Î Ř T Ç H
Boulder climber
ne'er–do–well
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Still paying ore for "free wifi" ... I heard that, that you can buy stuff with gold dust and nuggs.
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SofCookay
climber
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Jstan, I apologize for not seeing this in time as I don't visit ST that often. Does the email work through here? Better to shoot me an email and I'll make every effort to come lend a hand.
Sonya
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Happiegrrrl2
Trad climber
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The Pit WAS a unique place and situated in a location that really did require users to follow the KNOWN and even POSTED(by JStan himself, as a courtesy - he printed out the OWNER's guidelines and posted at the Pit)) guidelines.
People refused to do so. If those who were more "in residence" said anything they got in a kerfuffle. "Who are YOU to tell ME what to do." People parked their cars up on the visible above grade area, where they were not supposed to, rather than park down low, because it was "too crowded." They would not early rise and as neighbors were up and about, there on the horizon behind their homes would be cars parked.
There was also some reports of house break-ins happening in the neighborhood in 2013, and though I sincerely doubt that had anything to do with people using the Pit, it is reasonable that people would at least consider that possibility.
It was a good thing while it was available, and too bad it ended. But Wally was very generous for many years.
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jstan
climber
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Happi:
My email is out and will remain so until I get a more modern computer. If you have the capability and the time you could do me a huge favor. Could you contact Wally at 510?
To solve the trash problem I am thinking we need to prevent vehicular access. BTW the rain has already impeded approach from the east. Before I do anything I need to contact Wally and ask two questions?
1. Does he want the two roads shut off? Following the MDLT I propose to use vertical mulching.
2. Do those roads lie on an easement? Shutting off a road on an easement causes legal problems.
There are two kinds of easements.
Dedicated: These are called out on the grant deed and required by county policy stating one exists on each border of a parcel( 33 feet wide unless 44 feet wide on a section boundary). If Wally owns two unjoined parcels the access roads could be on an easement.
Prescriptive easement: Since Wally knew about the roads and their use, as I understand the law, I doubt this easement is a factor.
Cokay:
Sorry about all the rush. Today I am going to be dealing with the ashes, collecting materials for the mulching, and time permitting shredding the small brush. The mulching starts only after Happi gets a go ahead from Wally.
Jebus etal:
You all have viable arguments. But the fact is the Pit existed and we need to deal with it. I have heard some of the neighbors preferred there be people on the site. Fewer problems from locals that way. I do see more signs of cookie cutting, trash dumping, homeless occupation, and dirt biking since it was closed.
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Happiegrrrl2
Trad climber
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JStan - Perhaps someone who knows Wally can get in touch with him by telephone. I have personally never met him, and though I don't want to give false information, I understand he isn't with that company at this time. I can try calling Clark Jacobs, who's staying at the Ranch, and see if he can relay your message, but maybe someone else, as I said, can get a more "direct line" for you.
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jstan
climber
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Happi:
Forget my request entirely. While working today I saw evidence local residents are using the access road routinely and people are even walking their dogs there as if it was a public park. There will be no closing off of the access roads. Controlling of trash will be like it is everywhere else - a maintenance activity.
It took a day but I dealt with the ashes left over from the burn. When I am done photos will follow. All the slash has to be chipped up and the rest of the 18 acres cleared of litter.
Done.
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jstan
climber
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Yesterday I buried the ashes and top dressed the area with clean sand. The clean sand was moist so it can be seen in today's photo.
All of the brush has been shredded and left as mulch. Cleaning trash from the entire eighteen acres will be done later as time becomes available.
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Russ Walling
Social climber
from Poofters Froth, Wyoming
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Jun 21, 2017 - 09:09pm PT
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Once again....
FREE FIREWOOD AT THE PIT!!!!!!!!!!!
Some ADHD dip stick has dumped a bunch of wood in the Pit again. All sorted and waiting for pickup! Looks like maybe Chinese Elm? Pine? Rounds to kindling... And a tweaker table to rest at while you load your trailer.
Who wants it? Go get it.
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Mungeclimber
Trad climber
Nothing creative to say
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Jun 21, 2017 - 09:23pm PT
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Doesn't the Marine sniper school practice there? If not, they should. Each dumper gets a rubber bullet in the arse.
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Todd Gordon
Trad climber
Joshua Tree, Cal
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Jun 21, 2017 - 10:36pm PT
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i was informed by jstan that this "free" firewood was dumped off there because the tree from the firewood was attacked by bark beetle. I am not an expert on this...but do you really want some firewood that has a disease that might spread to YOUR trees if you take it home. This seems like a logical question to ask oneself;....Jstan requested me to post this;...his computer is getting old like John and myself;...and doesn't take his posts anymore. Happy summer!. If you are at the pit now....you are enjoying our 120 degree weather. Lovely.
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Russ Walling
Social climber
from Poofters Froth, Wyoming
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Jun 21, 2017 - 10:48pm PT
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Great... let's encourage dimwits to camp out and have a fire.... If the pit is closed, how about not providing "services"? Can't have it both ways ya'll...
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jstan
climber
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Jun 23, 2017 - 10:29am PT
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I seem to have figured out how to get round what was blocking my posting.
Great... let's encourage dimwits to camp out and have a fire.... If the pit is closed, how about not providing "services"? Can't have it both ways ya'll...
You may remember the burning of a previous landscaping dump at the Pit that left a huge scar. Clearing up that scar doubled the number of days work it took me to restore the area. Why do I “provide services?”. Here's why...
In the late 60's the dystrophic among us said there was no hope of reducing the use of pitons. That I was crazy to try. As it turned out it worked because climbers were ready to change.
Drive up Quail Springs road. Fancy new houses everywhere you look. The JTNP reports park visitors are leaving over a hundred million dollars each year in the local economy. Joshua Tree is changing, Go down to the visitor center. People are coming from all over the world.
That's not the only change. Last week the JT Clean Team removed a dumped sofa near Sunburst. The team got a call from a resident nearly in tears; so happy we had made her world a little better. The people in JT are ready for a change.
We get many such expressions of support. Between the Clean Team and the Yucca Valley Improvement Team I estimate we take out one hundred tons of trash each year, I'm betting having Wally's parcel become a local dump is not part of the future.
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Russ Walling
Social climber
from Poofters Froth, Wyoming
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Jun 23, 2017 - 11:06am PT
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That's a lovely story JStan... but WTF does it have to do with a dumped load of wood at the pit? Did you dump it there? That would be a weird turn of events.
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dee ee
Mountain climber
Of THIS World (Planet Earth)
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Jun 23, 2017 - 09:03pm PT
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"The Pit" is still a pit. Color me surprised.
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jstan
climber
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Jun 23, 2017 - 11:13pm PT
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Should not be a problem. The Mitsubishi cement plant burns 6000 tires each day.
Edit:
Now that you are retired this will make a good first new activity for you. Ramos' assistant is based over at Whitefeather. He is probably the one who can get you an appropriation from San Bernardino county for transport of these tires.
The Clean Team can play a role so there won't be tipping fees. You are one lucky dude, Locker. What a great opportunity!
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Studly
Trad climber
WA
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Jun 24, 2017 - 05:57pm PT
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Seems like good firewood to get the next cleanup burn pile going.
If someone is willing to go clean up that place, seems like he should get an award.
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jstan
climber
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Jun 24, 2017 - 08:03pm PT
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Your picture was not taken in the Pit. I have contacted the NSA so we can search all of So Cal using US National Means to try and find where your photo was taken.
After working on 62 today and disposing of four large screen TVs, I went to the Pit around 4PM. You won't believe who I found camping there. Robert Goulet!
Anyone who wants that wood should, I think, cut and split it in the Pit, and leave it there in the sun for at least six months. When they get it home it would be wise to tarp it tightly for another six months.
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Russ Walling
Social climber
from Poofters Froth, Wyoming
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Jun 24, 2017 - 08:34pm PT
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So Jstan... seems pretty obvious you were the dumper, or at least orchestrated the deed
Instead of a convoluted bedtime story, can you explain why you are dumping fire wood at the pit?
Simple question
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zip
Trad climber
pacific beach, ca
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Jun 25, 2017 - 06:53am PT
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This appears to be a very nice option to staying at the pit.
https://www.rent29.com/
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Jun 25, 2017 - 07:15am PT
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I've never been aware of The Pit as an option, especially with millions of acres of BLM land to the east.
But then I'm not inclined to consorting with tweakers and opioid addicts.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Jun 25, 2017 - 09:53am PT
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Locker, you should sign up for my ST Reading Comprehension and Political Correction Re-programming class.
You assumed I was referring to whoever might use The Pit.
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jstan
climber
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Jun 25, 2017 - 12:22pm PT
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Well, satellite technology has come through. I had to get top secret clearance but the NSA has located the TV in locker's photo. It is in Morocco. I have booked passage next week to deal with it.
I really have to admit something. I find what I am doing to be great fun. Some time ago we found a king size mattress in the middle of 62 across from Gary's tire. I was not about to man haul it 300 feet to the Team's collection point. So I hooked on to it with the truck and hauled it down the road in a cloud of dust. As I pulled it up onto the shoulder I opened the driver's window and let out a "YeeeeeHah". So much fun.
Mike:
Why donate labor to maintain someone's private property that's closed to public use?
OK Mike I have a question for you.
Why type stuff into ST when it does not pay?
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jstan
climber
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Jun 25, 2017 - 12:43pm PT
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Mike:
Good talking with you. I have enjoyed the conversation.
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Mighty Hiker
climber
Outside the Asylum
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Jun 25, 2017 - 12:47pm PT
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Mike: Most of the selfless work that jstan and associates do is as steward of public land, or land adjacent to it. He has abolished the absurd notion of the "Somebody Else's Problem" field.
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Russ Walling
Social climber
from Poofters Froth, Wyoming
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Jun 25, 2017 - 01:02pm PT
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JStan, you should run for office... you have a knack of not saying anything in the face of easy questions.
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Studly
Trad climber
WA
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Jun 25, 2017 - 01:09pm PT
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Russ, you should start a company and call it Fishing Expeditions. Wait, that's a little long so maybe shorten it.
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jstan
climber
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Jun 25, 2017 - 02:01pm PT
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Russ:
You know now how John McCain felt after he questioned Comey.
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jstan
climber
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Jun 25, 2017 - 02:32pm PT
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Mike:
I'm not going to try and say something like Anders.
Posting today for reasons the same as yours. Yesterday while picking up litter it was somewhere hotter than 110F. Nearly passed out in the bush. Years ago I could go all day with no water. Now?
Pffft!
You can believe that answer. Goldstone is another kettle of fish. He used to throw cartwheels on 5.10..... while whistling. I figure he probably can't include the whistling now.
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Russ Walling
Social climber
from Poofters Froth, Wyoming
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Jun 25, 2017 - 02:48pm PT
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That's one way to look at it JStan. (!?!)
Thanks for the non answer and it would be great if you could stick to removing couches from freeway lanes with a hearty "yoo-hoo" and not dumping any more firewood or doors at the Pit. Stocking the Pit with firewood and a table is sending the wrong message, because supposedly, THE PIT IS CLOSED. Encouraging the dimwits with an incentive to be there is a bad precedent, regardless of who is cleaning it up, monitoring it, or writing the citations at some later date. Resist...
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jstan
climber
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Jun 27, 2017 - 05:26pm PT
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Russ:
Just to stay current I went down to the Pit Tuesday morning. Perhaps three quarters of the large rounds from the dumped pine were gone. A whole lot of the problem was suddenly solved!
Since you seemed interested in it as fire wood I want to thank you for relieving me of a couple years of work. Thank you, Thank you, Thank you!
When I first saw about four trailer loads of Bark Beetle killed pine had been dumped, I knew I had a problem. I could not use my chipper shredder to convert the small stuff to mulch. If I would use it and then shred anything on my place I would be spewing fungal spores everywhere. That meant I had to take all the small stuff to Landers. Two truck loads it turned out.
I did not want the county to bury the big stuff. At the present rate Landers will be higher than Everest in 100 years. So given no help from anyone else, the only way out was to do the onerous two years long work needed to process diseased wood so I could safely use it as firewood. I am assuming you will come back and take the rest soon. The whole problem has been taken off my back! You can imagine how pleased I am. By the way today I got rid of the door that some one had used as a table.
Was good that it got only to about 100 today. Hard day. On that road behind the Hospice I took out
2 recliner chairs and recycled the iron
2 recliner chairs on wheels and recycled that iron
1 box spring and recycled that
1 queen sized mattress
If you want to see what this is all about the Clean Team will be meeting at 7AM at the Post Office in JT tomorrow. Then on Thursday the Yucca Valley Improvement team will meet at 7AM on the east side of Von's parking lot in YV. Watching these two groups tear into the trash and litter is a real trip.
Again. Thanks so much for the help!
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Russ Walling
Social climber
from Poofters Froth, Wyoming
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Jun 27, 2017 - 05:38pm PT
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One time in the Valley I saw a bird up in a tree, making all sorts of noise. It was a fat bird, no doubt a fan of tourist food and bad habits. I pondered this bird and how it must be to have such a gift as flight, yet not even know it. It was then I decided that even a bird must know it is fat. Fast forward to modern day Joshua Tree: a dry land filled with ample opportunity to get fat, and not know the gift of flight. During the warm nights I think of this bird and just how fat I am, but the difference is I DO know it, unlike our twig sitting friend.
Through it all, the Pit is still closed and the fat bird is probably still fat in the Valley, with little care for the many mattresses and nightmarish fungi under his feet and within his gaze.
Clear as mud... I'll remove the rest when I can
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Russ Walling
Social climber
from Poofters Froth, Wyoming
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Jun 27, 2017 - 06:13pm PT
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It used to but I think they were used as firewood... maybe a fake camera sign now. Signs don't mean much to the illegal dumpers and junkies. Just makes it safer for them
At some point this summer it will be closed off at the access roads... with terrain most likely instead of the shoddy "gate" used in the past. I bet the "workers" might even be sloppy and drop a few hundred nails in some critical spots. We'll see
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Jun 27, 2017 - 06:57pm PT
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Fast forward to modern day Joshua Tree: a dry land filled with ample opportunity to get fat, and not know the gift of flight.
This is a conundrum that will occupy me for at least the rest of my Samuel Smith Oatmeal Stout, if not into the wine course.
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Russ Walling
Social climber
from Poofters Froth, Wyoming
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Jun 27, 2017 - 07:06pm PT
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Tad: Got another truck load of wood out this eve... one big pile of really small stuff left. All the rounds and long rounds are gone. Kinda wish a tweaker would just drop a match on the remaining pile.
The only sign there is a half of an alarm company sign.. nobody is falling for that!
Reilly: let me know if you need more nonsense to ponder with your wine... I can deliver
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Brian in SLC
Social climber
Salt Lake City, UT
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Jun 27, 2017 - 07:50pm PT
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Maybe something to accompany a bourbon and ginger ale?
Darn fine thread.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Jun 27, 2017 - 08:52pm PT
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BTW, Russ, saw yer UK sales rep on the train...
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jstan
climber
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Jun 27, 2017 - 09:57pm PT
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T: I've had to haul a couple mattresses and other assorted junk low life's illegally dump on our road in the country, pisses me off each time and I end up paying the dump fee. :(
I have found controlling one's self is crucial. If you let others upset you, you lose sight of what you are trying to do. As I was cleaning up along 62 in YV once, a car slowed in front of me, the passenger window opened and two water bottles flew out. My immediate thought was how fortunate I was. I would not have to drive all over hell's half acre to find those bottles. It was clear the driver had been affected.
The fact someone is seen removing litter has an effect. A road being clean has an effect. When a dumper gets into a situation where they might be confronted they prepare emotionally. They prepare for the confrontation. Don't confront. That just convinces them they are right to litter. Just keeping going leaves them dealing with the probability of going through bad situations in the future. Preparing for confrontation is not fun. With only a few exceptions true dumps we have cleaned up, stay clean. Trash draws trash. Don't dump signs just identifies places where others have dumped.
Signs:
Robert, Phil, and I put a sign up giving the rules for using the Pit. It is turned so you have to go over if you want to read it. Seemed to me signs have to be read only once. Actually according to the code such a sign shows the owner is aware of the use being given the land. Under certain situations it can prevent a user's claiming they have a legal (squatter's) right to use the land. Believe me. You don't want to have to hire a lawyer.
R: I found that security sign in YV. Thought I would try using it. People in the neighborhood are using the Pit as a dump. One neighbor drove in as I was working on the Bark Beetle tree. Turned around and left. I saw the house he went to. He knew I saw the house he went to. I once followed a truck drawing a trailer load of cuttings into the Highlands. When he turned around and left I turned around and kept following. Probably the person who dumped some roofing on Section 11 a few months ago.
Please don't dump nails at the entrance of the Pit. When I get a flat I'll know who to talk to.
And please don't burn anything. In an earlier post I explained that the last time someone burned dumped wood in the Pit it doubled the amount of work I had to do.
On blocking the access road:
I would advise you not to do that. It may be an easement. Can get really nasty if an access has been in continual use for five years. You can get into trouble blocking an easement. Possibly it is even a prescriptive easement. The eastern road is being blocked by erosion. Nature's doing that. Perfect.
Thanks in advance for taking the rest of the wood. You and Locker might consider joining us tomorrow or thursday. I'll take the kindling to Landers tomorrow. Not much and not worth risking my trees.
Other situations:
Once I was cleaning up two sofas and two mattresses just east of the Post Office and this woman came close but walked by, saying nothing. I was destroying her home. Took the mattresses out of my truck and put her clothes in a clean bag. I had broken up the sofas. Could not put those back. Went back months later after the area had flooded. No sign of a resident.
Still have not been able to forget this.
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drF
Trad climber
usa
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Jun 27, 2017 - 10:06pm PT
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I've got my load continuing to dry
This is normal for a man of your advanced age ;-)
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Jon Beck
Trad climber
Oceanside
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Jun 28, 2017 - 07:38am PT
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When a dumper gets into a situation where they might be confronted they prepare emotionally. They prepare for the confrontation. Don't confront. That just convinces them they are right to litter.
I confronted a guy in a parking lot last weekend. He tossed an oil container he had just poured into his car. I told him "That is not where that goes" his response was "It is empty". I just shook my head and muttered something about being lazy. When I got finished shopping and was walking back across the parking lot the guy drove up to me, I was thinking the guy was going to get in my face. Instead he rolled the window down and said he had thrown the bottle in the trash. I thanked him. I would agree that not all litter confrontations go so smoothly, but I will continue to do it.
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Splater
climber
Grey Matter
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Jun 28, 2017 - 02:08pm PT
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"It may be an easement. Can get really nasty if an access has been in continual use for five years. You can get into trouble blocking an easement"
Thanks for all your work!
however Why would you think there is an easement?
By not blocking access, by this reasoning, maybe it could create an easement?
All across the world, and managers block access to prevent unwanted use.
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Gary
Social climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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Jun 28, 2017 - 02:17pm PT
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There's no adverse possession if people were given permission to camp there.
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Jon Beck
Trad climber
Oceanside
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Jun 28, 2017 - 02:48pm PT
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that is why property owners put up signs saying "Right to pass by permission of owner"
in California the sign is not required to avoid creation of an easement, but posting it is advisable. The courts really disfavor adverse possession as an outdated concept.
http://codes.findlaw.com/ca/civil-code/civ-sect-1008.html
No use by any person or persons, no matter how long continued, of any land, shall ever ripen into an easement by prescription, if the owner of such property posts at each entrance to the property or at intervals of not more than 200 feet along the boundary a sign reading substantially as follows: “Right to pass by permission, and subject to control, of owner: Section 1008, Civil Code.”
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blahblah
Gym climber
Boulder
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Jun 28, 2017 - 02:54pm PT
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There's no adverse possession if people were given permission to camp there.
Maybe. How would you prove the people were given permission, instead of just camping there without permission.
Did all (or any, or most) of the people camping there acknowledge they were doing so with permission? Either in writing or even orally? Was it obvious they were there with permission, or was there anything that may have objectively showed anything about it one way or the other?
What I'm getting at, if it isn't obvious, is that a land owner can't defeat a claim of adverse possession by simply stating that the putative adverse possessors actually had permission. If it were that easy, no one would ever win an adverse possession claim, unless there was somthing like a long pitched battle between the land owner and adverse possessor. I don't think the pitched battle scenario happens very often.
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zip
Trad climber
pacific beach, ca
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Jun 28, 2017 - 05:42pm PT
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So the pit is closed now?
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BLUEBLOCR
Social climber
joshua tree
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Jun 28, 2017 - 05:58pm PT
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^^^yes. But I'm opening the New Pit! But it's more like, The Bump ✊
Pm me for directions. Camping, showers, fires, slacklines, boulee ball, golf, frisbee golf, target practice, good food shared, laughs,,, ALL CONDONED!!!!
pooper even!!!!!
Nice post jstan
Still have not been able to forget this.
Me eyether. I've come over 15-20 homeless camps in just the past 2yrs walking around town👀
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Gary
Social climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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Jun 28, 2017 - 09:10pm PT
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Maybe. How would you prove the people were given permission, instead of just camping there without permission.
It was advertised on the Internets.
Adverse possession also has to be open and notorious. Mostly you just need to pay attention to where your neighbor builds his fence.
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jstan
climber
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Sep 13, 2017 - 10:43am PT
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Russ
Locker
A new contribution of slash has been left at the Pit. Not bad. If you want to pull out the one to two inch branches you can use and take them away it would be a big help. Off hand I don't see any diseased Pine in this lot. Right now I have an overhead of tires, sofas and mattresses I am working off in other places, so it will be awhile before I take my chipper shredder down to the Pit. Appreciate the help.
PS:
The BLM and MDLT held a very successful clean up at Giant Rock on 9/9. Huge roll off load of trash removed. I concentrated on broken beer bottles and bum wipes right near the Rock.
PPS:
If any of you in JT has a road legal single axle trash trailer with a 24"x6' open box they want to sell, let me know. I need to up my game to three or four mattresses at a crack.
John
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Deb Battista
Trad climber
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Sep 16, 2017 - 08:28am PT
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Hello John. First, thank you for inspiring so many climbers and rangers to have ethics when it comes to climbing, leading by example, and loving the land.
Would you be interested in talking with me about your experiences with Rich Romano? I'm a rock climber, hiker and outdoor enthusiast who is considering writing a paper about Rich and you were a huge inspiration for Rich and I'd like to hear, first hand, your stories/thoughts.
Let me know.
All the best,
Deb
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