Discussion Topic |
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Gimp
Trad climber
Missoula, MT & "Pourland", OR
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Topic Author's Original Post - Jan 11, 2017 - 10:17am PT
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Last time I checked the Federal minimum wage was $7.25.
When you consider that and look at the recent gear reviews where the Arc'teryx Macai was $925 and the Patagonia Primo Down was $699 you have to wonder who buys them and who they are targeting. Also how does that fit with the "progressive" persona Patagonia tries project?
I don't consider myself an expert skier by any means but when I turned 55 now 10 short years ago I decided to try to spend my age in days on ski's each year. I still work, but have made that goal or come close most years since by skiing 8-10 months each year. Usually breaks down to about 1/2 lift served and 1/2 hiking up. For the lift served I have been using a knock-off primaloft like jacket for at least the last 10 years; first with and old Lowe Alpine shell and the last three years with a Northface Jacket I got for $20 or $30 at a ski swap that I think may last me the rest of my days (if I don't run into a tree like I did with the Lowe).
This budget setup seems fine and I was recently skiing in -10 at Bridger.
My first subject initiation so probably a little long winded.
Steve
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WyoRockMan
climber
Grizzlyville, WY
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Jan 11, 2017 - 10:33am PT
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Also how does that fit with the "progressive" persona Patagonia tries project?
Seems to me to fit perfectly. If the masses want responsibly sourced, eco green, recycled, fair trade, free range, gluten free, organic products that is going to come at a cost premium.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Jan 11, 2017 - 10:46am PT
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$900 is less than a week's wirth of lift tickets at Vail.
What's the big deal? Move this to the First World Probs thread.
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SilverSnurfer
Mountain climber
SLC, UT.
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Jan 11, 2017 - 11:04am PT
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I agree that those are stunningly high prices, keeping in mind that they don't seem unreasonable to some people and that they have no problem paying full pop for the shiney stuff.
On the other hand, much of that gear ends up being sold at vastly reduced prices on sale, at outlet sites like STP or through industry deals.
I like Outdoor Research for quality gear without the bells and whistles at more reasonable prices. Then again, I use my favorite stuff until it about falls apart, so there's not much money per year spent anyways.
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anita514
Gym climber
Great White North
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Jan 11, 2017 - 11:06am PT
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I sent my Arcteryx jacket in for some repair and I was shocked when they emailed me back saying that it falls under warranty replacement and told me to go to their site and choose a new one - $900 CAD!
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Cragar
climber
MSLA - MT
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Jan 11, 2017 - 11:58am PT
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wait, a $900 jacket? Is it SCUBA? Dang, you can get an entire outfit for that plus some colorful accessories, like a boutique wine bottle opener? Y'all are probably fine using a #1 nut on the wall but...
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Spider Savage
Mountain climber
The shaggy fringe of Los Angeles
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Jan 11, 2017 - 12:38pm PT
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Just dropped near $500 on a Spyder ski parka. Negotiated about 10% off but still. I got lucky with money last year or I'd still be using the thrift store layers.
Seems to be plenty of rich folks in the world to keep all these $500-$1000 outer layers going by a dozen different brands. They are pretty nice too.
Poor man works the thrift shops and Craigslist, places like that. If you have time and not money it's the thing to do.
I skiied for 6 years on perfectly good Ski's and boots for $20 from the local thrift shop. I feel like I actually made money doing that.
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WBraun
climber
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Jan 11, 2017 - 12:49pm PT
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6 years on perfectly good Ski's
How did you do that?
When skied I'd destroy 2 pairs of skis every season .....
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TWP
Trad climber
Mancos, CO & Bend, OR
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Jan 11, 2017 - 02:12pm PT
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"When skied I'd destroy 2 pairs of skis every season ....."
WBraun - along with free soloing with a ghetto blaster and balancing tire irons on his nose - has given me yet another measure of my own relative unworthiness.
In my career, I've only "destroyed" one set of skis in the actual act of skiing.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Jan 11, 2017 - 02:24pm PT
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When skied I'd destroy 2 pairs of skis every season .....
Were the curvy ends pointed downhill? That always werked for me.
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ddriver
Trad climber
SLC, UT
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Jan 11, 2017 - 03:19pm PT
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I don't think skiing is so specialized that you need special "skiing" outfits. Any Gore-Tex/fleece combo or similar should work fine, these generally being available at discount prices. Ski brands are generally for Texans who want to impress when they arrive at the slopes.
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Jon Beck
Trad climber
Oceanside
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Jan 11, 2017 - 03:33pm PT
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yeah that ^^^^
I ski cheap generic at the resort, save the Arcteryx for the backcountry. If you wear TNF and nobody sees you are you still hip?
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Ezra Ellis
Trad climber
North wet, and Da souf
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Jan 11, 2017 - 03:48pm PT
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I bought a moonstone gortex ski jacket in 1999 for $150, that's still in great shape.
The retail price was $450 at the time, so it seems to be about the same as now, counting inflation.
Who the hell pays retail though??
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divad
Trad climber
wmass
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Jan 11, 2017 - 04:26pm PT
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Last time I checked the Federal minimum wage was $7.25.
I don't think many who earn minimum wage are skiers.
When skied I'd destroy 2 pairs of skis every season.....
Try skiing on snow, not rock...
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WyoRockMan
climber
Grizzlyville, WY
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Jan 11, 2017 - 05:22pm PT
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When skied I'd destroy 2 pairs of skis every season.....
Try skiing on snow, not rock...
Going through 2-3 pairs of skis/season was normal ops for skiing at Bridger. It used to be pretty easy to "pound out" the camber in 15-20 days of hard charging. Core shots were usually repaired, sometimes you could repair a blown sidewall for a few extra days if you were short on skis.
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Spider Savage
Mountain climber
The shaggy fringe of Los Angeles
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Jan 11, 2017 - 05:40pm PT
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^^^^ Parka envy!
I would love to find something like that Latok.
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Splater
climber
Grey Matter
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Jan 11, 2017 - 05:44pm PT
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Werner,
there is no way you could have been skiing back then since there was no Gore extreme pro super3D digital betternallthat.
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NutAgain!
Trad climber
South Pasadena, CA
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Jan 11, 2017 - 06:05pm PT
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WHen I go with my kids, my outer layer is a jacket I picked up at a thrift store for about $8. We've spent all day skiing when it is raining, and it got the job done. But I did have more good layers underneath. And I had goretex pants (maybe REI?) I bought a decade ago. My first ski day ever was wearing jeans and a cotton flannel shirt in the middle of a blizzard. Pretty much sucked. But I still loved it!
And my goretex ski-type jacket from 1991 (purchased with my college financial aid money) is still going strong too.
These days you can buy a soft shell strongly water repellent jacket at Costco for $20, and it would have cost $200 a decade ago. What technology advances justify so much money on the new jackets? Is it just a jewelry type of mindset?
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Peater
Trad climber
Salt Lake City Ut.
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Jan 11, 2017 - 06:10pm PT
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Most of the hi end tec brands use Goretex or proprietary fabrics that I've found don't really work that well if at all. Try looking for Event fabric garments. Much less expensive and work great.
When I did some at home tests, applying steam to the inner face of the Event fabric I couldn't get moisture to build up. It passed through faster than I could supply it. But it's just as waterproof going the other way.
On the other hand I did buy a Patagonia light weight shell that retailed for 400 during the ski season for 150 off season.
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rbord
Boulder climber
atlanta
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Jan 11, 2017 - 06:51pm PT
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Like most things, what we think we pay for is not what we pay for. Drink the Patagonia koolaid. They're good at selling it. We're good at buying it.
"John Muir walked away into the mountains in his old overcoat a crust of bread in his pocket we have no knowledge and so we have stuff and stuff with no knowlege is never enough to get you there it just won't get you there" Greg Brown
My old coat works fine. My back, not so much. $1000 to ski again sounds like a steal.
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Mtbphoto
Trad climber
Mammoth Lakes, Ca
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Jan 11, 2017 - 07:20pm PT
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I have an Arcteryx jacket, I think I have 5 or 6 seasons wearing it. I got it for cheap on pro-form but the jacket retails around $550 back then. I have gotten over 400 days of skiing in it and its still in great condition. The jacket fits me perfectly and has the features I want, and the thing is still 100% waterproof. If it got stolen I would gladly buy another one.
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
Sands Motel , Las Vegas
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Jan 11, 2017 - 08:18pm PT
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Moose.....C*#k roaches have a greater R-Value than wool...FYI
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NutAgain!
Trad climber
South Pasadena, CA
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Jan 11, 2017 - 09:41pm PT
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Hey Moose, I don't know if it relates to psoriasis or a coincidental allergy, but my skin can't stand wool. I know within 2 seconds or less if I put on a wool sweater or wool socks, etc. just gives me an instant itchy funky get-it-off-me feeling. If it came down to that or freeze to death I'd probably deal with it.
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Peater
Trad climber
Salt Lake City Ut.
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Jan 12, 2017 - 01:46am PT
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Thanks GCF
"""Good observations on the event fabric peater
This one deserves more attention by gear manufacturers"""
The problem is that the best thing that Gore does is marketing. Patagonia and others with their custom versions as well.
Unfortunately most people shopping will buy something with a marketed label.
To explain it briefly, all shell fabrics need to be glued together. All the layers breath fine before the glue is applied. The gluing makes them stop working. Event sticks them together in a way that is way better than the others.
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Barbarian
climber
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Jan 12, 2017 - 11:04am PT
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I've been using pretty much the same setup for 35+ years-
Warm conditions (above freezing):
T shirt, long sleeve shirt, $25 Costco soft shell jacket (the only "new" innovation).
Normal conditions (15f and above):
Base layer, fleece, shell (I've never spent more than $100 for either the fleece or the shell).
Cold conditions (below 15f):
All the above with a Black Ice down parka ($275 in 1980 at the Yosemite Mountain Shop, but was a gift from a friend, so $O for me).
Never cold. Don't care what I look like.
I was always the most frugal guy I knew (translated: dirt cheap SOB) as I never had any money BITD. Brands don't interest me. Still a dirtbag after all these years.
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Gunks Ray
Trad climber
Gunks
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Jan 12, 2017 - 11:34am PT
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Now this is a pricey ski jacket, makes all those sub $1,000 Pataguchie, Arcteryx jackets seem like discount store sales.
Kjus Hublot Limited Edition Jacket
Kjus Hublot Limited Edition Jacket review. OnTheSnow reviewed this ski jacket as part of its men's 2015/2016 Jacket Buyers' Guide.
Favorite Features: The Hublot Limited Edition Jacket retails for $3999. Still reading? When Kjus says “Limited Edition” they mean it—the jacket tested came with an engraved alloy plate reading “No. 015 of 200.” Standout features include a carbon zipper, left gaiter watch window, built in neck gaiter with anatomical seaming and a left sleeve 3D logo. How’s it look? Like Batman at high altitude.
Room for Improvement: Can you really bash a $4000 jacket?
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Jon Beck
Trad climber
Oceanside
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Jan 12, 2017 - 11:47am PT
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Gotta have some stylin goggles to go with that 4k dollar jacket. At a mere $550 these Oakley Airwaves are a bargain
http://www.oakley.com/en/mens/goggles/asia-fit-goggles/snow/airwave-1-5-asia-fit-/product/WGOO7049A?skuCode=59-449J
Ever have one of those downhill runs where you’re sure you broke some speed record? Ever pull-off a trick with such amplitude that you could swear you left earth’s atmosphere for a sec? And wouldn’t it be cool to know for sure? Well now you can. Airwave™ takes Oakley goggle design and technology to the next level with a built-in heads up display that integrates GPS, Bluetooth® and more. Onboard sensors give you instant access to jump analytics that show distance, height and airtime. But there’s so much more: preloaded maps, music playlist control, buddy tracking, and so on. Airwave isn’t merely a goggle; it’s a mobile dashboard.
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Cragar
climber
MSLA - MT
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Jan 12, 2017 - 02:23pm PT
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Dang Gunks, that's gnarfukkel for sure!! That jacket yells "HODAD" at about 160dB
I get 3-4 years max out my jackets...skiing, winter bicycle commuting, moto, fall and summer mtb stuffs just takes it's toll and I take care of my stuff with tx-direct. I get the same life outa my softshell as I did/do 3-layer g-tex. I spend between $150-250 it seems these days; I always get last year's color or some crap like that.
They do not need to be $$, especially if you layer with woolness n'stuffs.
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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Jan 12, 2017 - 04:59pm PT
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Shopping is the number one leisure activity in our fractured country and a major aphrodisiac for multitudes. There are tons of people with serious cash who believe you get what you pay for......music to the ears of marketers.
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
Sands Motel , Las Vegas
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Jan 12, 2017 - 06:09pm PT
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Wait till " Dynamic pricing " hits the local Smatagonia retail outlet...You'll be glad you bought that $900.00 Gougetex parka midweek when it was 30% less than it was on the weekend...
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Jon Beck
Trad climber
Oceanside
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Jan 12, 2017 - 06:14pm PT
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Wait till " Dynamic pricing " hits the local Smatagonia retail outlet.
or they scan your retina from 20 feet away and figure out that you pay full retail midweek. Cha-ching!!!
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Peater
Trad climber
Salt Lake City Ut.
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Jan 12, 2017 - 10:57pm PT
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Ok I'm too lazy to post the stats (they are out there on the web) but don't buy Goretex. It works as well as everything else but just costs more.
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Peater
Trad climber
Salt Lake City Ut.
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Jan 13, 2017 - 12:36am PT
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hmmm good point
I never have and never will.
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BASE104
Social climber
An Oil Field
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Jan 13, 2017 - 07:52am PT
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I needed a new jacket 2 years ago when out on a well. I ran into the nearest Wal-Mart and bought a warm fleece jacket for 18 bucks. The jacket is still solid. Good zip and no holes. My previous Mountain Hardware fleece jacket fell to pieces within 18 months or so.
Some of that converse stuff is just as good as name brand stuff. I just got a mountian hardware jacket for Christsmas. It wasn't any warmer than a heavy weight underwear. It will only bee good for warmup stuff. Not for real cold. Buy the cheapo for warm, but get the best down bag you can afford, along with a Marmat bivy sack. I have sat out many storms without a tent. If you are going light, and not cooking, you save more money. If you have to melt snow for water, I use the MSR Superlight.
So I've gone cheap. 25 bucks for Patagonia knock-offs, 18 bucks from Wal_Mart.
Nobody seems to care, either.
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
Sands Motel , Las Vegas
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Jan 13, 2017 - 08:37am PT
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Base...thanks for the hot tips on affordable clothing ..What were those Van Morrison lyrics ...? " All the girls go by , dressed up for each other "..?
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Spiny Norman
Social climber
Boring, Oregon
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Jan 13, 2017 - 09:44am PT
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Alpine skiing has always been a rich kid sport.
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Peater
Trad climber
Salt Lake City Ut.
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Jan 14, 2017 - 10:32pm PT
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###Peater
Good explanation
How about the issues of oil contamination with event -iirc there have been some problems in past -i have a jacket i've been using for touring though that has not exhibited any problems in this regard -my field test is solid -lots of steep skintrack action in a coastal climate -perfect lab for coat testing in that if it works here it works anywhere. ###
Sorry I missed this earlier: All these fabrics are subject to contamination/delamination. My first NF Goretex coat delaminated around the shoulders. Maybe I don't bathe enough. My friends Bibler tent delaminated where he put his socks to dry on the top.
I'm curious GCF, how have you found Event compared to others especially in the Cascades. Sounds like you know something.
Anyway the tech is out there to make better fabric. The factories know how to do it but the manufactures don't know what to ask for.
(Way over simplified)
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justthemaid
climber
Jim Henson's Basement
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Jan 15, 2017 - 07:02am PT
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Skiing is too rich for my blood these days.
Hit the thrift stores in resort towns and you can get amazing expensive jackets cheap. Rich folk pay a fortune for winter gear and toss it the minute the color is out of style.
When my parents moved from Mammoth to Palm Springs last year I drove an entire carload of virtually unused quality winter gear to the thrift store. I was sort of cringing at the retail $ they spent on that stuff that was now getting donated.
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stevep
Boulder climber
Salt Lake, UT
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Jan 15, 2017 - 07:24am PT
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justthemaid nails it, in both regards.
Second hand shops here in SLC are an excellent source of all kinds of high quality used gear and clothes. Little while ago, picked up a nice Mt Hardware soft shell for $20. And my skate skis are top of the line Madshus bought for $100 from an Olympian up in Park City selling his extras.
But jackets are just a small piece of the pie when it comes to resort skiing. Buying individual lift tickets at regular price is ridiculous. Most of the bigger resorts here are over $100/day, with many over $120. It's become a sport really only for the rich or the locals that get passes.
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crankster
Trad climber
No. Tahoe
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Jan 15, 2017 - 07:26am PT
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Others might trust their lives to a cheap jacket in a sideways blizzard on a skintrack, but I'm going with a quality product designed by mountaineers. $600? Nah, I'll wait for the sales. I'm into season 5 with my Arc'Teryx Stingray..well worth it.
stevep, most Tahoe-area resorts have pass options that pay for themselves on day 5.
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Jon Beck
Trad climber
Oceanside
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Jan 15, 2017 - 09:39am PT
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Buying individual lift tickets at regular price is ridiculous. Most of the bigger resorts here are over $100/day, with many over $120. It's become a sport really only for the rich or the locals that get passes.
Mammoth season pass can be had for 700 bucks, good at Mammoth, June, Big Bear and Bear Mt. you get 5 half price tickets with it for your friends that do not have a season pass, and a killer free breakfast once a month at early-ups. Gotta buy it at the end of the prior season.
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
Sands Motel , Las Vegas
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Jan 15, 2017 - 09:50am PT
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Ekat....try $180.00 for a lift ticket...I was in brians and he was giving me the low down...Rusty's reverse psychology is that by chraging dynamic prices it rewards the people that ski mid week when a lift ticket is $99.00....Of course most people have to work mid-week so they end up getting hosed by the dynamic pyramid scheme....The sheet has an article on it from a few weeks ago...Dynamic pricing has been around for a long time...It used to be called gouging...
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
Sands Motel , Las Vegas
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Jan 15, 2017 - 10:46am PT
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Strangling the goose that layed the golden egg....
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Jan 15, 2017 - 10:52am PT
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Actually, I rather doubt that $150 tickets are much more pricey than $25 tickets were if
adjusted for inflation. That said, there should be Locals Only pricing, you know, like ya
gotta present yer trash collection bill, or local medical pot card.
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Studly
Trad climber
WA
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Jan 15, 2017 - 11:10am PT
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Its only expensive if you pay for it. Anybody can put any level of price on something, its getting someone to ante up for it that's the real trick.
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
Sands Motel , Las Vegas
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Jan 15, 2017 - 11:14am PT
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Reilly...Valid point on the inflation remark...? Damn you...I think the $700.00 season pass is the locals only option and i think there are restrictions on which days the pass are usable..? but who in their right mind would want to ski Mammoth Mt. on a weekend...? Maybe the people wearing $900.00 dollar wind breakers...? rj
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
Sands Motel , Las Vegas
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Jan 15, 2017 - 11:24am PT
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F... Joey's... ? LOL...In Tahoe they're called Gapers... $900.00 worth of those skins could almost make a nice one piece jump suit...Much more trendy than an Acertyx wind shell..
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seano
Mountain climber
none
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Jan 15, 2017 - 12:12pm PT
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The inflation argument is BS. At 2% inflation, $25 30 years ago is $45.28 now. Back then, resort skiing was affordable for a frugal individual or upper-middle-class family. Now, it's obscene. I still remember how much fun it was to do dozens of laps a day, but it's just not worth the obscene cost anymore.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Jan 15, 2017 - 12:20pm PT
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seano, yer numbers aren't even close. Granted, ski tickets have probably outpaced the core
inflation rate but not by that much. And even if they're 50% higher so are a lot of luxuries
that aren't staples. That's why it's called discretionary spending. ;-)
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Jon Beck
Trad climber
Oceanside
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Jan 15, 2017 - 01:05pm PT
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i think there are restrictions on which days the pass are usable..?
no black-out dates. Average weekends are not bad at Mammoth if you ski the top half. I do not go near the mountain on holidays. Ski seven days and it is paid for
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Ghost
climber
A long way from where I started
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Jan 15, 2017 - 07:44pm PT
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The US Bureau of Labor Statistics says that $25 bought the same goods and services in 1970 as $155 bought in 2016.
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GuapoVino
climber
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Jan 16, 2017 - 11:36am PT
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I've gotten to where it pains me to pay retail for anything. Most most recent ski jacket purchase (an Arcteryx shell) was bought used on eBay. I've bought quite a bit of stuff in eBay. Lots of close out and 2nds online. My last pair of skis were new but two years old. About 1/4 of what they cost new. Good enough for me.
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Peater
Trad climber
Salt Lake City Ut.
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Jan 16, 2017 - 11:28pm PT
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GCF
**I have not seen issues with oil contamination on recent gore product -this for sure was an issue in the past as you have noted.
With regard to laminates and or breathable coatings, one of the core issues are the face-fabrics choosen. Most are shite.....
Pick a tighly woven flat filament yarn for starters.**.
Our industry is fixated with Nylon when Polyester is a much better choice. Poly is much easier to laminate, it doesn't absorb moisture like nylon, it's lighter, more UF resistant and it's less expensive. But I think that consumers don't get it and think Nylon is the best. So that's what Mfg's use. The sailing industry only uses Poly. for their ropes and sails.
As far as the Tech which is mostly done in Asia, if they just keep their fabric rollers smooth and super clean and the laminating environment controlled ie: temp, humidity, air borne contaminants they could make some really good stuff. But I don't think the US Mfgs know to ask for that.
Still love eVent fabric because of their lamination tech.
BTW GCF I'm enjoying discussing this with you.
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Spiny Norman
Social climber
Boring, Oregon
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Jan 17, 2017 - 02:30pm PT
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NA-assembled Westcomb eVent stuff bought on closeout has done really well for me & spouse. I haven't used GT Pro but this stuff outperforms any GT product I used previously.
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Peater
Trad climber
Salt Lake City Ut.
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Jan 17, 2017 - 09:19pm PT
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GCF and welcome Spiny for chiming in
Designers want to make it look pretty, Developers just want to get it done. (gross generalization here but it is true)
I've worked in Mfg mostly and development the rest. A good combo for me.
It is frustrating when you tell the designer that this can't be done yet. Maybe later we can have no seams on this (non garment). I know it can be done with fabric molding but just not yet. On the other hand I show them something I invented and they say "Oh that's just what I envisioned". Oh please.
Back to Tech fabrics: The inside of tech fabrics should be laminated with a wicking material so that it can spread moisture faster over the surface, go figure, and let it pass quicker. No garment Mfg does this to my knowledge.
Seam sealed garments are a diamond mine for improvements. I know a lot has been done by some brands for weight and volume but not for function. (some may call me on this as I haven't really looked for a bit).
Teijin is awesome but their minimums are so high that all but the few could use them.
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mcreel
climber
Barcelona
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Jan 17, 2017 - 10:53pm PT
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seano, yer numbers aren't even close.
Huh? They look pretty good to me.
I think the reason that ski jackets are so expensive is because they have high tech fabrics that are resistant to cocaine and vodka, and which look good in selfies.
(interest compounded daily - added at the end of each day)
Year Year Interest Total Interest Balance
1 $0.51 $0.51 $25.51
2 $0.52 $1.02 $26.02
3 $0.53 $1.55 $26.55
4 $0.54 $2.08 $27.08
5 $0.55 $2.63 $27.63
6 $0.56 $3.19 $28.19
7 $0.57 $3.76 $28.76
8 $0.58 $4.34 $29.34
9 $0.59 $4.93 $29.93
10 $0.60 $5.53 $30.53
11 $0.62 $6.15 $31.15
12 $0.63 $6.78 $31.78
13 $0.64 $7.42 $32.42
14 $0.65 $8.08 $33.08
15 $0.67 $8.75 $33.75
16 $0.68 $9.43 $34.43
17 $0.70 $10.12 $35.12
18 $0.71 $10.83 $35.83
19 $0.72 $11.56 $36.56
20 $0.74 $12.30 $37.30
21 $0.75 $13.05 $38.05
22 $0.77 $13.82 $38.82
23 $0.78 $14.60 $39.60
24 $0.80 $15.40 $40.40
25 $0.82 $16.22 $41.22
26 $0.83 $17.05 $42.05
27 $0.85 $17.90 $42.90
28 $0.87 $18.77 $43.77
29 $0.88 $19.65 $44.65
30 $0.90 $20.55 $45.55
Standard CalculationBase amount: $25.00
Interest Rate: 2%
Effective Annual Rate: 2.02%
Calculation period: 30 years « amend figures
Now, it took me a while to do all those computations and type this sh#t in, so I may have made some mistakes ot typos. But my numbers agree pretty well with Seanos.
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Peater
Trad climber
Salt Lake City Ut.
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Jan 20, 2017 - 10:46pm PT
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George, I should have known it was you but I don't know anybody here.
P
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Gimp
Trad climber
Missoula, MT & "Pourland", OR
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Topic Author's Reply - Jan 21, 2017 - 11:48am PT
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Have been looking since I posted this (my first actually) for what the average garment worker makes in Asia where most of these garments are made.
Surprisingly hard for at least me to find.
Did find this apparent tweet about this:
May 17, 2013, 4:36 PM.
SR.
Average hourly wage for garment workers: Bangladesh $0.24, Cambodia $0.45, Pakistan $0.52, Vietnam $0.53, China $1.26, tweets EurasiaGroup President Ian Bremmer.May 17, 2013
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Oplopanax
Mountain climber
The Deep Woods
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Jan 23, 2017 - 02:46pm PT
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Quoting average hourly wage for garment workers is of questionable utility if they are paid for piecework rather than hourly?
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Peater
Trad climber
Salt Lake City Ut.
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Jan 23, 2017 - 06:29pm PT
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Gimp, thanks for posting
Workers minimum wages in Asia are generally set by their governments, not the factories. Though some may use the "piece work" system the ones I've visited do not. I personally think the "piece work" system is better because the worker gets rewarded above their base wage for more output. But the factories don't have the industrial engineering capacity to deal with that.
I think the wages you were quoted are outdated. Without any actual data I suspect that wages are somewhat higher than that. Yes clothing brands scour the world for the cheapest labor market but you still see the workers on break texting on their cellphones.
But I also despise the inevitable slime that "run" factories in oppressive conditions.
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| Messages 1 - 64 of total 64 in this topic |
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