Discussion Topic |
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SusanA
Sport climber
Bay Area
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Topic Author's Original Post - Nov 4, 2016 - 06:26pm PT
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Ok maybe I should not be starting a thread about politics but I want to try something and this place seems like it might work....
It's a survey and a game too. Here are the rules:
1) The first word of your first response must be yes or no. Nothing else. After that you can say what you want EXCEPT
2) You can't mention any candidates or anything about the election. I know the question came from one of the candidates but I think it is an interesting question to ask without getting personal.
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SusanA
Sport climber
Bay Area
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 4, 2016 - 06:28pm PT
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Yes
That's my answer, following the rules. I think America is not perfect but it is great. It's a beautiful country even though I have not seen as much as I would like to see. And it has beautiful people. I could go on but that should give everyone an example.
EDIT: Thanks for voting cragman!
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Climberdude
Trad climber
Clovis, CA
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Yes and No. The people of US are great and the politicians are pieces of sh!t.
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SusanA
Sport climber
Bay Area
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 4, 2016 - 06:32pm PT
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I think you bent the rules there, I didn't plan on anyone being clever ....but thanks for participating!
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Fat Dad
Trad climber
Los Angeles, CA
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Yes. This is the greatest in the world (which I've actually seen much of). Slipped from what exactly I'm not sure. The world and its economy have changed. Some fail to recognize that and think time can be reversed.
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Fritz
Social climber
Choss Creek, ID
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Yes!
We hope to see you at COR this summer to celebrate!
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skitch
Gym climber
Bend Or
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Yes! Let's keep the progress of the last 240 years moving forward!
Real national healthcare, more money into education and get the f*#k out of other countries wars!!!
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c wilmot
climber
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No. I have never seen so many homeless people as I do now. And in places Where there previously was no visible homeless population
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nah000
climber
no/w/here
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yes. [absolutely].
has America's greatness been predicated on and driven by foundational fundamentals that have necessitated expansion and therefore [economic] empire?
has said expansion reached its effective limits?
does this new reality mean that America therefore requires significant reformation to some of its foundational fundamentals if it is to retain its greatness?
yes.
yes.
and yes.
[absolutely].
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Ward Trotter
Trad climber
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Yes
But can remain so only if we and future generations adhere to and continue to value the founding principles that made it so. The contemporary scene is full of very powerful forces that are dedicated to transforming the country away from those founding principles into a radically revamped version of the nation that most people would not recognize if it were ever to come to pass -- which it will not.
These powerful forces are growing increasingly desperate because growing numbers of Americans are waking up to their modus operandi -- lies, distortions, exploitation, arrogance, self-aggrandizement, and world class narcissism.
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zBrown
Ice climber
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Yes. Both hemispheres.
Is China great?
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High Fructose Corn Spirit
Gym climber
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Ward, I hope you're voting for Hillary.
...
Hillary Clinton!
Last but not least: Trump Blocker.
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Todd Eastman
climber
Bellingham, WA
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No! Aspiring to greatness is a huge waste of resources and time...
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SteveW
Trad climber
The state of confusion
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It is very good. It would take some effort to be great.
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apogee
climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
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Yes. Of course it is. That hasn't changed one iota.
What blows my mind is that there is a slimeball sociopathic narcissist that has made the central meme of his campaign 'Make America Great Again', as though it's no longer great.
Hell, look at this thread- even the most ardent conservatives say 'Yes', America is great...yet they stand behind a candidate that has ZERO political leadership experience, is rife with business failures, and has used misogyny, xenophobia, and racism as central divisive elements in his campaign.
WHAT KIND OF DELUDED IDIOT COULD THINK THAT KIND OF SH#T MAKES AMERICA GREAT?
And how in the world can anyone be so hypocritical in their human and religious ideals as to support a person like Trump as their Country's leader?
Want to make the US Not Great? Vote for Trump.
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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America is AWESOME!!
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Fat Dad
Trad climber
Los Angeles, CA
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^^^
Deluded. (Didn't mention a candidate).
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rbord
Boulder climber
atlanta
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Yes!
It's the self-congratulatory way that we define great. Like me, and my extraordinary insane strength of mind! God loves me and has chosen me for salvation! Suck it Obama, you little girl who soiled his panties.
What are we gonna do - say that we suck, say that we're the ones who are pathetic? Unlikely, even for the best of us.
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Jon Beck
Trad climber
Oceanside
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Yes
Greatness is not defined through material wealth or power. Greatness ultimately comes from how we treat the less fortunate of both this country and the rest of the world. Most of the worlds problems are a direct result of people treating other people badly in the quest for material wealth and power.
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wilbeer
Mountain climber
Terence Wilson greeneck alleghenys,ny,
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This is the same as first world problems.
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apogee
climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
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"We have one chance left."
People...and candidates...like this, are the singular, best example why America could be destined for it's darkest, end days.
Sorry, T Hocking...I appreciate the higher sentiments of the OP, but this is the reality, right here, right now.
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10b4me
Mountain climber
Retired
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Yes. If it wasn't great why do people want to come to this country?
Hey wilmot, I am almost sixty-three. I remember seeing homeless people in the skid row section of LA back in the early '60s.
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apogee
climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
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^^^
Fact.
Like the 40%+ of Americans who are going to vote for this POS:
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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yes.
For most people who would say "no", they are arguing for perfection, which will never exist.
Because we ARE addressing:
poverty , crime, corruption, luck of health insurance and free college education, drone strikes, green house gass, to name the most obvious.
We are the largest seat of technical innovation on the planet:
The top five countries with the most Nobel laureates are all western nations - with the United States, the United Kingdom, Germany, France and Sweden topping the rankings for the best minds in peace, literature, science and economics.
The United States has had the most Nobel Prize winners, with 336 winners overall. It has been most successful in the area of Physiology or Medicine, with 94 laureates since 1901
And our dominance in this is INCREASING:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/northamerica/usa/11926364/Nobel-Prize-winners-Which-country-has-the-most-Nobel-laureates.html
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Bill Mc Kirgan
Trad climber
Cedar Rapids, Iowa
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No. Because as a nation we lack humility.
However, as a people we have the capacity for greatness, and that gives me hope.
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Marlow
Sport climber
OSLO
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Yes, America is great - the land, artistically, scientifically...
Problem is: Everything great can be destroyed. The corporate, juridical, politically system and people's blindness to it's flaws is slowly destroying America. There is a hook to everything and the same system that in its emergence brought greatness is now used for exploitation by the 1% corporate establishment - making fellow countrymen their "new-order-slaves" - which brings destruction...
More than half the American population believe they are saved by something that is damaging to them...
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Gnome Ofthe Diabase
climber
Out Of Bed
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Yes,
I like these birds - although there is no balance things are not in symmetry As no rules,apply to those who have the wealth and a mysagenistic perfect temperament
Or will hence forth be spelt trumperament?
but lest us never forget.; one ring to bind them one ring to rule them all
(((pHART Noise)))
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Bushman
climber
The state of quantum flux
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Yes.
America has always been great.
Then people showed up.
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gunsmoke
Mountain climber
Clackamas, Oregon
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Yes.
But what is the future? America was founded on a set of principles that included the notion of the individual having a great degree of autonomy over their own affairs (i.e., freedom). This was, and to a lesser degree still is, in great contrast to Europe. America became the greatest nation since the Roman Empire, and arguably the greatest nation ever. But why? Why did we vastly outperform Europe? Because we are somehow genetically superior? No, because giving individuals autonomy leads to prosperity. The question "Is America great?" seems to imply great compared to other nations. As we rapidly change our system to be like that of Europe, it is foolish to think that we won't have European results. Hence, a future of greatness seems unlikely.
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clinker
Trad climber
Santa Cruz, California
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rbord
Boulder climber
atlanta
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The great set of notions our country was founded on included slavery. The great set of notions didn't give half the people - women - the right to vote, to have a say in how we govern ourselves.
But we're going downhill compared to those great founding notions? In some ways, in this election, we seem to be returning to them.
But when push comes to shove, and we look at ourselves, the glass is half full - we're great! OK, human enough.
But even today, we're one of the very greatest greenhouse gas producers, both on a total, and per capita basis, so we still have that.
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gunsmoke
Mountain climber
Clackamas, Oregon
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The great set of notions included mechanisms for correcting errors. Finding problems, even grave errors, in certain aspects of society does not indicate a need to change aspects that prove beneficial.
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thebravecowboy
climber
The Good Places
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Yes! The physiography, quite! The people, the culture, less so
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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"America the Great." How stupid does that sound?
Gretzky was "great."
Show me how many goals the US has scored?
We have a lot of assists, sure, but how often do we score?
Not very.
I realize this is not a political thread. But, of all of the past presidents, only JFK was a true hockey fan, to my knowledge, though Barry will join him next year when Mystery Person takes over.
[Click to View YouTube Video]
There is a photo to be had of Barry with the 2013 Stanley Cuppers, the LA Kings.
(zBrown is no where to be seen in it...don't believe his BS.)
edit: Who's been to Great America in the Bay Area?
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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No. Switzerland and Norway are great. After them it is a race for the bottom.
In Switzerland you can bring yer whole kit onto the train. If you did that here you'd be shot...
Rather telling how many choose not to play by the rules. That is one of our greatest failings.
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rbord
Boulder climber
atlanta
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Completely agree gunsmoke. There is some greatness here for sure. Those mechanisms have meant that 150 years after slavery ended, black median wealth is 1/13 white median wealth, when it used to be 0/13. IMHO, how we see that as a reflection of our greatness probably has a lot to do with how we see ourselves to begin with.
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Fossil climber
Trad climber
Atlin, B. C.
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Yes. (There - played by the rules!)
It once was, or at least was pretty fair until 20 March 2003. Going downhill ever since, likely to continue.
It is presently in great danger from inequality, climate change, debt, upsurging Asian economies, world overpopulation, potential nuclear threat, and a narcissistic megalomaniac who is swaying a frightened and gullible electorate toward neo-fascism.
Refer to Malemute's post Nov. 4 for a glimpse beyond blind nationalism.
Look to some Scandinavian countries - especially Norway - for a higher degree of civilization. No, none is perfect, but humanity is not.
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AP
Trad climber
Calgary
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The top 5-10% of the people are great but many of the rest pretty much suck.
We aren't any better in Canada though, just more moderate ( by the way I have met many good Muricans).
The US was great economically in the 50's and 60's because it came out of WW2 with industries intact where as the main competition had most of its industrial capacity destroyed.
The biggest threat to the US is itself.
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zBrown
Ice climber
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是中国伟大的
Shì zhōngguó wěidà de
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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Yes.
The greatest economic power in the history of the world.
The greatest military power in the history of the world.
The place more people want to come to, than any other place in the world.
The entity that gives more assistance and aid to the desperate and destitute of the world.
The country that all others look to in leadership of our planet.
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Flip Flop
climber
Earth Planet, Universe
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Yes, we created the Muscular White Jesus
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hobo_dan
Social climber
Minnesota
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Yes, and I'm having a great time enjoying it. To quote fellow Minnesotan Bob Dylan " I don't have time for politics"
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Russ Walling
Social climber
from Poofters Froth, Wyoming
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YES:
This:
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Fat Dad
Trad climber
Los Angeles, CA
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^^^
Looks like a scene from The Walking Dead.
I agree things could definitely be better here, butnour country can preent remarkable opportunities for those willing to work hard. My wife's hairdresser was pregnant and living near Chernobyl when it erupted. She wasn't even sure whether she could do anything other than breastfeed due to the extensive contamination. Her and her husband were lucky to arrive here, though with nothing. Her son born healthy and graduated medical son (though sadly she has cancer.
Or Sonia Sotomayor. Born to immigrant parents from Puerto Rico. Father died when she was young and raised by her mother. Through hardwork and the public education system, she went to law school and now sits on the US Supreme Court. Where else do stories like this happen? I get really angry when all the self righteous dbags here complain about our country because they have a hard time buying assault weapons. So freaking clueless how well they have it.
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Russ Walling
Social climber
from Poofters Froth, Wyoming
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Have your little joke, Russ. You're going to die, too.
Thanks for the headsup. When do you start your killing spree?
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NutAgain!
Trad climber
South Pasadena, CA
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Yes, in the scheme of things we are lucky to be living in America compared to a great many places. There are definitely places that do a better job of enabling a quality life for all citizens because they don't have the same ignorant stigmas about "socialism", places that take a more rational science-based approach to solving collective societal problems. But there are more places that do a worse job- from honor killings and female castration to starvation to open warfare and kidnapping and environmental pollution. But these are not the peers that most Americans want to consider our nation among.
We enjoy near-universal access to electricity, water, heating, baseline public education. We are slipping more and more in terms of quality healthcare and education. Or maybe it's more accurate to say our upper-class are not slipping but the divide between rich and poor is becoming more and more apparent in terms of healthcare and education. We have a national crisis in terms of treating mental illness and how it relates to homelessness, and the rate of homeless and hunger (and then drug addictions and crime) is only going to grow as we have more and more people dislocated from jobs by automation and outsourcing, with no national backup plan to deal with these looming problems. We have a strong lack of national leadership to look squarely at these problems because too many voters want to keep their heads in the sand and pretend that these problems won't affect us all.
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Spider Savage
Mountain climber
The shaggy fringe of Los Angeles
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Yes: Wilderness, realtively good freedom, great food.
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Ksolem
Trad climber
Monrovia, California
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Yes.
The greatest economic power in the history of the world.
The greatest military power in the history of the world.
The place more people want to come to, than any other place in the world.
The entity that gives more assistance and aid to the desperate and destitute of the world.
The country that all others look to in leadership of our planet.
I'm with Ken.
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Chewybacca
Trad climber
Kelly Morgan, Whitefish MT
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Yes and no. We are great and terrible at the same time.
For example, on one hand various minorities are closer to equal treatment than any time in our history, on the other hand bigotries directed at minorities still exists in great abundance.
I'm glad to call the USA home, even with our many flaws.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Yes. But it has slipped significantly.
Time to bring it back.
America has lost it's soul.
I'm with Dean.
Seems like a trick question tho. America will always be great, because of what it was and how it came to be.
We have grown far from the principles that defined our country. And made it great.
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Fat Dad
Trad climber
Los Angeles, CA
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We have grown far from the principles that defined our country. And made it great. This has been posted a couple of times and I'm curious why no one has bothered to describe what they mean? Easy to be Trump and say everything sucks (and only you can fix it). Much harder to cite facts to support one's view.
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Sierra Ledge Rat
Mountain climber
Old and Broken Down in Appalachia
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No. Americans are really stupid people.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Malemute is feeling all superior because The Economist had its cover article
about how Kanada is the new bastion of liberty, or democracy, whatever.
Just wait til their real estate bubble bursts.
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yanqui
climber
Balcarce, Argentina
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People who live in the US should look up the defintion of America in the dictionary. And Malamute, Canada's poop stinks just as bad as anyone elses:
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Yeah, they talk a good Khumbaya up there like letting 25,000 Syrians in while denying my
autistic niece any meaningful help. And then their nazi immigration officers give me a hard
time trying to come visit her. Been through a lot of passport controls but never one as
unpleasant as Kanada's, and I was coming to see FAMILY!
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yanqui
climber
Balcarce, Argentina
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World opinion is not without irony, Malemute. The reference you posted also remarked:
In the survey participants were also asked:
“If there were no barriers to living in any country of the world, which country would you like to live in?”
Despite being the perceived largest threat to world peace, the US still topped the tables ...
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Branscomb
Trad climber
Lander, WY
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America is just irrelevant anymore. All we are is dangerous.
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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The USA can lead 5.10c!
USA!
USA!!
USA!!
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yanqui
climber
Balcarce, Argentina
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You made me laugh, survival, thanks!
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Sierra Ledge Rat
Mountain climber
Old and Broken Down in Appalachia
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The rest of world believes that the United States is the country that poses the greatest threat to world peace, beating out all challengers by a wide margin And when the rest of the world talks about "that country" with all of the religious extremists, they're talking about the USA
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EdwardT
Trad climber
Retired
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And when the rest of the world talks about "that country" with all of the religious extremists, they're talking about the USA
Definitely not Iraq... or Syria...
Afghanistan...
Yemen...
Nigeria....
ISIS can't hold a candle to Westboro Baptist.
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Cragar
climber
MSLA - MT
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Edward, he said world peace. You are describing regional areas with little influence on the rest. The US has over 200 bases world-wide...but maybe you forgot that?
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Mungeclimber
Trad climber
Nothing creative to say
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"Here are the rules"
Rules?
are you new here?
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EdwardT
Trad climber
Retired
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Conservative-minded glass-half-empty folk think the country is great but going to sh#t.
Yep.
America was (arguably) the greatest country in the history of the World for much of the last century. But we've lost much of that greatness. Economically and fiscally, we were clearly top dog.
With our economic and military strength, we had unprecedented clout around the World.
Socially, we made great gains in second half of the last century.
I'm probably wrong about the following, but I think a key component to continued greatness was having a super-power adversary. The USSR forced us to keep ourselves in check. With Russia's collapse, we got fat and lazy. We rested on our laurels and picked up (or reinforced) some bad habits.
IMO the 90s was our last great economy boom. Our peak. It was a result of economic fundamentals. The Bush recovery was fueled horrific lending practices. It was a house of cards. This current recovery is largely due to government policies. QE I, II, III ect... and interest rates at a 60 year low. If/when we a recession, we won't have the tools lift the economy. They're already maxed out.
America was great. And we continue to make advances socially. But as a global super-power, we're over the hill... on the backside.
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SusanA
Sport climber
Bay Area
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 9, 2016 - 07:20am PT
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It was fun reading all the responses. There are headlines that say more people voted for Hillary. I don't know what to believe though. My survey didn't have an electoral college, lol.
Maybe I should change the question to "Is America incredible"
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10b4me
Mountain climber
Retired
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When you have people voting against their own self interests, then no, the country is no longer great.
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EdwardT
Trad climber
Retired
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I think the generation that preceded us boomers did us a great disservice by continuing WWII into the 1970s. We were great at killing people on the other side of the world, for strictly ideological reasons. We boomers simply continued the war.
The continual references to Russia this, Russia that - what bullsh#t. Let it go, man. The Russians are not evil. Every hack now is Russian's fault, that is such a crock of sh#t.
Let it go man, let it go.
Good post. We should've minded our own business while Russia annexed Europe. Cold War? Pshaw!!! Tempest in a teapot.
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Wade Icey
Trad climber
www.alohashirtrescue.com
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no. f*#king illiterates
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Chewybacca
Trad climber
Kelly Morgan, Whitefish MT
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It will be interesting to see how this thread reads four years from now.
Cragman- The majority of Americans voted for Hillary. Trump won the electoral votes, not the popular votes.
Did Jesus tell you gloat over your fellow Americans?
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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Not any more it's not.. But it will be worse when the oppression starts, 1/20/17
Good bye civil liberties and rights for women.
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SusanA
Sport climber
Bay Area
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 9, 2016 - 08:07am PT
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Why do Christians like Trump?
Does he even go to church?
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SusanA
Sport climber
Bay Area
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 9, 2016 - 08:14am PT
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That is an admirable way to look at it.
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H
Mountain climber
there and back again
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No!
"Maybe I should change the question to "Is America incredible"". Maybe you should change it to "Is America credible".
I am ready for change. I doubt that Trump can do anything about the mega-corruption in our government and lack of concern for bulk of or population.
I hope the Rothchild's etc. and power mongers of our country finally realize that the people of this country are the ones who really have the power.
Should be interesting to see what transpires over the next 4 years. I will be surprised if Trump gets out of this one alive.
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rbord
Boulder climber
atlanta
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Nov 10, 2016 - 05:23pm PT
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Prayed for Trump and called Obama a little girl who soiled his panties.
K, we see how it is for you. Make America great again! Grab em by the pu$$ies!
I agree with you that role models are important, especially, in our society, for our black daughters.
My older Sikh daughter came home from school today and told me about how she defended the one Trump supporter from the overwhelmingly anti-Trump sentiment of the other students at her school, and tried to make a safe space for him and his beliefs to be heard. Me and my lax Christian values - I didn't role model to her to say that Obama (or Trump) is a little girl who soiled his panties, or grab em by the pu$$ies!, the way the real Christians do.
But she's 16 now. When Trump meets her, he'll say he's going to be dating her in 4 years, not in 10 years, like he did when he met that 10 year old girl.
Nice role modeling, dad.
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SusanA
Sport climber
Bay Area
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Topic Author's Reply - Jan 21, 2019 - 01:41pm PT
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Two years after my original question. How are we doing?
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Jan 21, 2019 - 01:44pm PT
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Nobody can equal us at baseball! NOBODY!
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Bale
Mountain climber
UT
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Jan 21, 2019 - 01:47pm PT
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Yes!
(Your results may vary, depending on race, gender, and whether or not you live in Flint, MI)
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Jan 21, 2019 - 01:50pm PT
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Yes. We have Reilly on our side.
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apogee
climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
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Jan 21, 2019 - 01:51pm PT
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Yes.
Still great.
In spite of all that's happened in the last two years, America is still great.
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Bale
Mountain climber
UT
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Jan 21, 2019 - 01:53pm PT
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Reilly would be great as our foreign ambassador.
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WBraun
climber
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Jan 21, 2019 - 01:58pm PT
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America has always been great but full of st00pid brainwashed ignorant people.
America's education system is predominately brainwashing ....
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10b4me
Social climber
Lida Junction
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Jan 21, 2019 - 02:06pm PT
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We are doing great as the laughingstock of the world.
Also, we are still great at killing people.
Oh, and our incarceration rate is great too.
I'm sure there is more.
Moose
Hahaha
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SusanA
Sport climber
Bay Area
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Topic Author's Reply - Jan 21, 2019 - 02:13pm PT
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What has changed in two years that makes America more, or less, great?
Personally, I can't think of anything that is better. Some say the economy is better, but my situation is about the same. It seems some things are worse :(
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Jan 21, 2019 - 02:46pm PT
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The only reason this greatness question arises is because of politicos and their rhetestoric oratory.
Mere verbal chest-thumpers, we are not more than great apes, but seek to emulate them.
Using the word "great" implies someone or something else is less.
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apogee
climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
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Jan 21, 2019 - 02:50pm PT
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Great question, Susan. It's been asked of many of the Republicans here that voted for Trump, and I can't recall a clear, straight answer.
They'll undoubtedly call out the economy, but that's no more of an effect of the current President than it was for Clinton.
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ecdh
climber
the east
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Jan 21, 2019 - 03:14pm PT
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Yes.
But it’s such an arbitrary term as to be meaningless. Perfect number sticker material tho.
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Bale
Mountain climber
UT
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Jan 21, 2019 - 03:16pm PT
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Mouse speaks the truth.
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AP
Trad climber
Calgary
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Jan 21, 2019 - 03:28pm PT
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Great compared to what?
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johntp
Trad climber
By decision or indecision we are where we are.
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Jan 21, 2019 - 03:41pm PT
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The US is both great and and horrible at once.
I wonder what it would be like to be a citizen of Canada or Switzerland.
The US does more to support humanitarian causes than any other nation.
We also promote extreme consumerism, profiteering and war. It's ying and yang.
The people of the US have good hearts. Our leaders (pfft!) suck.
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capseeboy
Social climber
portland, oregon
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Jan 21, 2019 - 03:54pm PT
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Great for some, not so great for others.
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Trump
climber
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Jan 21, 2019 - 04:06pm PT
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Great - of an extent amount or intensity considerably above the normal or average.
In terms of size, yes, we’re great! Second or so biggest!
https://www.cfr.org/backgrounder/how-does-us-spend-its-foreign-aid
“As a percent of gross domestic product (GDP), however, U.S aid spending ranks near the bottom of all developed countries.”
But the way we see it is that “The people of the US have good hearts.”
I’d say our ability to sustain unreasonably self-approving opinions of ourselves is pretty great too.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Jan 21, 2019 - 04:15pm PT
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Great compared to what?
Well, duh, Somalia!
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AP
Trad climber
Calgary
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Jan 21, 2019 - 06:53pm PT
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I heard that story too. What is not usually mentioned is that the Rangers had killed civilians in the process of previous attempts to get Hadid and the population was pretty riled up about US Forces before Black Hawk Down.
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nah000
climber
now/here
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Jan 21, 2019 - 07:38pm PT
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“america” is at least its land, its people and its systems of organizing the two...
greatness, as others have pointed out, is intrinsically comparative...
given both its size, but more importantly the place that that size spans on the globe and therefore its resultant diversity, beauty, and productivity i don’t think there can be any doubt that america as land is truly great.
and due to its time in history and that its systems of organization encouraged humans from all over the rest of the world to immigrate to, organize themselves on and then seek to fulfill their greatest individual potentials in america, i believe it is clear that america as a people is certainly great.
similarly, the systems of organization by many, many relative metrics [protection of its land, productivity, freedom of its people, creativity and innovation, etc] can not be considered anything but great.
and so finally, due to the combination of all three america’s influence on the greater world is, at this moment, inarguably the greatest.
which is why outside critics like myself focus on you and some of your apparent short comings more than most other countries...
you’re a bit like a 1950s era biff who has a sweet ride, the prettiest girlfriend and both academic and football scholarships to the school of his choice...
but yet still picks on tiny for lunch money now and again.
as per the follow up question regarding as compared with yourselves two years ago?
land: hasn’t changed enough to not still be great
people: ditto
systems of organization: this outsider can’t not see a near perfect attempt to replicate the mistakes of the 1920s and so while by many of the current metrics [stock market, productivity, etc] one could argue that america as systems is greater than it was, i suspect that from a future perspective on the present it will be clear that things have in fact become more worse than they were two years ago...
time, as always, will bring greater clarity.
with that said the greatest wild card is that as long as your democracy is mostly intact your ability to course correct in rapid fashion has always been one of your greatest strengths.
[with the afore mentioned people and land being two of the other wildcard strengths that are the most important.]
and so regardless: this outsider is rooting for you!
[especially since given the length of our border with you, i don’t think we can afford a wall... hahaha!]
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johntp
Trad climber
By decision or indecision we are where we are.
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Jan 21, 2019 - 07:47pm PT
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Who is Trump? Anyone know him/her? Has he/she posted any climbing content?
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johntp
Trad climber
By decision or indecision we are where we are.
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Jan 21, 2019 - 07:50pm PT
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F*#k nah00: the most salient post I've seen here in a while.
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Scole
Trad climber
Zapopan
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Jan 23, 2019 - 08:21am PT
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Yes. There are some really nice countries in America (It is two continents you know. Canada and Mexico are great countries in North America, and Argentina and Chile are pretty nice South American ones.
The one country I would avoid, except for the climbing and skiing, is the 3rd world shithole called the United States until it re-stabilizes. At this time I cannot advise unnecessary travel to the US.
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