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John Barleycorn
climber
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Topic Author's Original Post - Oct 24, 2006 - 04:37pm PT
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i've talked a friend into taking me to josh this weekend but he has to bring his dog with him. i checked the park regs and it says no dogs 100 ft off the road. we were planning on going somewhere off the beaten path but if you can't take your dog, what are you supposed to do with it? can anyone recommend an area in josh where it would be ok or "safe" to bring a dog. we're looking for some easy cracks, maybe some shade and some solitude. Any suggestions? I'm open to going someplace else if it's within 3 hours of LA. Thanks.
jb
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, Ca.
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Oct 24, 2006 - 05:05pm PT
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Echo Cove at Josh is in bounds I believe but not alot of crack, maybe Fun Stuff (5.8). There're alot of places just off the road to climb at Josh, and just out of campgrounds.
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lamadera
Trad climber
New Mexico
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Oct 24, 2006 - 05:28pm PT
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Yeah, it's a rule. I got yelled at by a Ranger while having my dog on a leash a couple hundred yards from the road. Our dog is pretty mellow, so we tied it up under a tree at our site while we climbed last Xmas. This isn't such a good idea if it's hot out.
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Russ Walling
Social climber
Out on the sand, Man.....
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Oct 24, 2006 - 05:31pm PT
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ummm.... unattended dogs in cars, tents or tied to trees are also a bust. Bring a big wallet or look into plan B.
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Matthew Fischbach
Sport climber
San Diego
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Oct 24, 2006 - 05:33pm PT
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Your best bet is Indian Cove. There's a ton of climbing and almost everything is within the campground where dogs are okay. If you go into the main part of the park you're going to be very limited and stuck with the crowds. Trashcan rock has some good stuff and is within a day use area (crowded). A few areas within Hidden Valley campground are good, but don't get too far from the campground. There are some climbs near the parking lot at Cap Rock that are okay.
Most of these areas in the park are going to be crowded as it seems that most climbers don't want to hike more than 100ft from any road either...
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lamadera
Trad climber
New Mexico
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Oct 24, 2006 - 05:49pm PT
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Yeah, well speeding is a crime too Russ, but I do it occasionally. I have tied the dog under a tree (during winter months with plenty of water and a chew toy of course) many times in the past and not had a problem. We have also taken the dog cragging cause the Rangers seldom venture far from their vehicles.
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Matt
Trad climber
places you shouldn't talk about in polite company
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Oct 24, 2006 - 06:12pm PT
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Chaz
Trad climber
So. Cal.
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Oct 24, 2006 - 06:21pm PT
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I've taken one of mine all the way to Carey's Castle on the other end of the Park, but that's not exactly a heavily patrolled area.
Looks to be tons of FA's just waiting for someone to make the approach out that way though.
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susan peplow
climber
Desperately Seeking Climbing Related Topic!!
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Oct 24, 2006 - 07:26pm PT
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Direct from http://www.nps.gov/jotr/parkmgmt/dogs.htm
Although many national park visitors enjoy the companionship of their dog pets when on vacation, dogs are not a beneficial addition to natural ecosystems such as those found in Joshua Tree National Park. While dogs, when accompanied by their owners, are allowed in the park, their activities are restricted by the Code of Federal Regulations:
Pets must be restrained on a leash that does not exceed six feet in length, or otherwise be physically confined at all times.
Leaving a pet unattended and tied to an object is prohibited.
Pets are prohibited on trails and beyond 100 feet from legally open roads and campgrounds.
So basically to answer you question. The Parks in general are not pet friendly. The Valley is just as bad or even worse. If they catch you there you get two choices, leave or kennel.
Lamedra is correct. Best I can tell, THEY don't go more than 100 ft from the road. Consider the Astro Domes or Big Horn Mating Grotto. If the Rangers venture that far, the deserve to bust you.
Alternative location of Holcomb Valley at Big Bear. Russ and I went a few weeks ago, great fun, less crowds and pet friendly.
~Susan
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, Ca.
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Oct 24, 2006 - 07:45pm PT
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I've had dogs out at Atlantis, but you come close to a Ranger Station. Also to Astro Domes area. Either stay by the road or go deep. I've never been hassled but I hear the Rangers can be pretty strict. Basically, if you are prepared to go off trail, be prepared to pay a ticket and don't bitch about it. I do.
Nice pic Matt. I feel the same way as your dog.
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Matt
Trad climber
places you shouldn't talk about in polite company
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Oct 24, 2006 - 08:13pm PT
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whatever you do, if you go to JT w/ yer pooch, just plan accordingly...
like for example, don't take your dog too far off the road-
and if you plan to take the guy out slab climbing, mqake sure you get him some 5tennies w/ stealth rubber, just like you've got...
oh, and be sure to keep him cozy on those chilly JT nights!
fines are just user fees pal.
pay the kennel or pay the tool?
no brainer.
edit- i think this year i'll just buy him a saddle, will someone lend me a 4 year old?
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doghater
Trad climber
joshua tree, ca
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Oct 24, 2006 - 08:38pm PT
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matt, you are an ass. if i saw you on ryan with a dog, i would have kicked it. do you realize that your dog is a big stresor on bighorns, which are a species under more and more pressure.
so if it is ok for you to break the rules with your dog, is it ok for me to go chip holds on some of the classics?
think about it as#@&%e. leave your dog at home.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, Ca.
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Oct 24, 2006 - 09:03pm PT
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Doghater, you're either a ranger, a cat, or a mouse. I just think the dogs aren't as bad as said.
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doghater
Trad climber
joshua tree, ca
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Oct 24, 2006 - 09:12pm PT
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none of the above.
but national parks are national parks. take your dog where its allowed. the more people break the rules, the sooner it will be that dogs will be banned completely. matt is a retard. i hope his dog gets hit by a car.
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james Colborn
Trad climber
Truckee, Ca
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Oct 24, 2006 - 09:36pm PT
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Anonymous dog hater, kick a dog in my presence and you'll be doing some boot licking yourself. The hit by the car comment grants you status as supreme a$$hole.
Congradulations!
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Nefarius
Big Wall climber
Fresno, CA
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Oct 24, 2006 - 09:41pm PT
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It definitely is a pain to worry about where you can/can't take your dog in a park. The rules aren't always clear either, especially when it comes to campgrounds. Some allow them, some don't.
Wow! Trying to take my dog or kicking my dog.... You bes' be prepared for an ass whuppin' for either. Straight up.
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doghater
Trad climber
joshua tree, ca
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Oct 24, 2006 - 09:49pm PT
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Nefarius.
Youve got 3 chances to knock me out. slim chance, fat chance and no chance.
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doghater
Trad climber
joshua tree, ca
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Oct 24, 2006 - 09:58pm PT
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You are right locker, it is childish. BUT so is breaking rules when you know what the rules are, just for a pet. Leave it home, or stay away. Why do dog owners ASSume that everyone likes dogs?
Maybe i will be childish when matt is down for turkey day. A few bowls of radiator fluid left around the crags. A few "special" meatballs. Some delicious chocolate....
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John Barleycorn
climber
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 24, 2006 - 10:20pm PT
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doghater, based on your comments you must be a sad and sorry excuse for a prepubescent boy.
jb
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james Colborn
Trad climber
Truckee, Ca
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Oct 24, 2006 - 10:21pm PT
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The rules in the park are clear. I follow them for the most part . I also realize that not everyone thinks my dog is as great as I do, so I do my best to keep him out of peoples hair. Dogs are a pain in the a$$. Dogs in a national park major pain in the ass.
Anonnymous doghater- Mace and dog kicking? Very impressive!
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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Oct 24, 2006 - 11:21pm PT
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It's their home! Not Yours!
Leave your damn mutt at home Matt!
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Gumbelina!
Social climber
Meatchicken
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Oct 24, 2006 - 11:22pm PT
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Just curious Matt, where did you ever get tennies w/stealth rubber for your dog? My dog would love a set!
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zip
Trad climber
pacific beach, ca
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Oct 24, 2006 - 11:37pm PT
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i love dogs.
i love josh.
i don't love the two together.
most of my encounters are usually negative.
the dog is either mean, or it is whining while tied to something waiting for owners to return.
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Aya
Uncategorizable climber
New York
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Oct 24, 2006 - 11:53pm PT
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So what's more irritating?
The hatesdogs troll, or the OP for making a post about dogs that was guaranteed to start a cliche dogs at the crag thread?
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what_is_right
Trad climber
joshua tree
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Oct 25, 2006 - 12:03am PT
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While it may not be your dog, someone's dog:
1. Craps and the owner leaves it
2. Bothers other people
3. Whimpers, barks, growls, begs
4. Causes the owner to yell back to the dog while on the wall
5. Disturbs native wildlife
When you violate the park rules (even if you accept a fine) you set an example to others, that it is OK to have dogs beyond 100 ft in Joshua Tree.
It is not OK. Do what's right. Don't do what's wrong, even if you can afford the fine.
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Jaybro
Social climber
The West
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Oct 25, 2006 - 12:22am PT
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Blue-no in this case, at least, Doghater is just an (attention craving) Weasel.
Matt, at least, understands the value of parking a pooch under a spreading shade tree. I'll throw that canine a frisbee anytime!
Jay-avoidedthedogpolicbytheskinofsomebody'steethalltomanytimes-bro
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Nefarius
Big Wall climber
Fresno, CA
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Oct 25, 2006 - 12:38am PT
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I suppose the "dogs at the crag/in the park" tiffs will wage on forever. Kind of the way it is and it's really pointless. As with any other pointless debate in this country, a few bad apples can spoil it for the whole barrel. Think homies and gun rights. I certainly never said anything about breaking any rules with my dog. And if I do, well frankly, it's my business and when a Ranger catches up with me I'll have to deal with it.
I will likely be in JTree this Turkey Day and may or may not bring my dog. It really depends on what I decide to climb while I'm there and has nothing to do with what you or anyone else feels.
You certainly have a right to not like dogs, or even dogs in the park, doghater. That's certainly your prerogative. You also certainly have the right to be a self-righteous prick too - until others decide not to tolerate it and walk away or hand to a $20 spot and tell you to go play. Basically, I have the right not to associate with you when you act this way. No one likes an as#@&%e.
Now I know you're a real tough guy and all, Sport, but when you kick someone's dog or try to take their dog from them, you lose those rights. And, if you're messing with the wrong guy, you're likely to get the response I said. Not to mention, you'd be breaking the law. See, most people view their dogs as their children and, funny thing, so does the court to a large degree. So, you go ahead an do those things and then press the issue in court. Good luck to ya. Just remember the owner has a legal right to defend his dog and you should probably hope the guy's name isn't Randy Weaver.
Cheers,
Trying to Save You Some Trouble
California
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doghater
Trad climber
joshua tree, ca
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Oct 25, 2006 - 01:16am PT
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Nefarious,
In general, it's my experience that dog owners have an inferiority complex. The little man or low esteem complex. (Whereas, cat owners do not.) Dog owners need a waggy tail and a slobbery tongue to make them feel important. A dog yields that result. Therefore, why not bring a dog as a companion to make a little man feel bigger? I cannot exist at the crag alone...I bring DOG...DOG gives me power, DOG makes conversation, DOG always likes me, licks me. I look cool with DOG with cool DOG name. Chicks will talk about my DOG, thus talk to me.
I heart DOG.
Peace out--maced-in-the-face dog-owner and dog.
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Nefarius
Big Wall climber
Fresno, CA
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Oct 25, 2006 - 01:21am PT
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Well, that certainly makes a lot of sense then... I guess you'll be staying home to play with your pussy now then, won't you.
Sorry, couldn't resist. Maybe a joke can cure your bitterness for a few minutes.
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oldfart
climber
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Oct 25, 2006 - 01:24am PT
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DH -
I think it would be super if someone held you under water for a while.
Just long enough to take the edge off, you understand.
Cheers!
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kuan
Sport climber
CA
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Oct 25, 2006 - 01:39am PT
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doghater,
You truly suck. All of your posts are on this thread only, and I find it difficult to believe that you just stumbled across Supertopo right when the thread was put up. In other words, you have an opinion that you know will be unpopular, so you created a fake email and a fake identity on Supertopo becuase you are too much of a pu$$y to stand behind what you believe. I don't mean to talk smack, but what a coward!
So come on - tell us who you REALLY are!
Oh, and by the way:
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guyman
Trad climber
Moorpark, CA.
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Oct 25, 2006 - 10:11am PT
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John..the best place to take your dog in JT is NewJack City....
otherwise you will most likley run into doghater...all dressed up in his tool suit.....come on- doghater to afraid to use your REAL name???
Guy Keesee
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steelmnkey
climber
Vision man...ya gotta have vision...
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Oct 25, 2006 - 12:00pm PT
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Dude wrote:
>While it may not be your dog, someone's dog:
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>1. Craps and the owner leaves it
>2. Bothers other people
>3. Whimpers, barks, growls, begs
>4. Causes the owner to yell back to the dog while on the wall
>5. Disturbs native wildlife
And the stupid argument goes on...
Think about this:
While it may not be YOU, a lot of CLIMBERS:
1. Crap and leave it
2. Bother other people
3. Whimpers, barks, growls, begs
4. Causes their partner to yell back to them while on the wall
5. Disturbs native wildlife
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Matt
Trad climber
places you shouldn't talk about in polite company
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Oct 25, 2006 - 04:51pm PT
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DH is a troll- pretty funny too (not biting).
since it was brought up-
not every dog is every dog.
not every dog owner is every dog owner.
it might actually be more irresponsible of me to post these pics than to be there and take them in the 1st place.
anyone can do anything they want to in america, so long as they are willing to accept responsibility for their actions (at least that's how i see it).
show me a resource where all user impacts are equally considered in a non-political fashion and i will take the rules more seriously, until then, i will weigh the risks- tickets, mace, and big horn stress included.
btw- that would suck if you did kick my dog, and i wouldn't like it. i could threaten you and whatever, but the truth is, i don't quite know how i would react to that if it ever happened. i can tell you that:
1)my dog could take it- he's no sissy
2)he would still try to lick your face and make friends
3)he won't run off and chase or bother even a sidewalk pigeon without being told "ok" (and sometimes i do tell him that, since he's too slow and loud to catch pigeons)
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v10gripper
Boulder climber
Joshua Tree, CA
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Oct 25, 2006 - 05:50pm PT
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while wishing a dog hit by a car is kind of extreme you would get an earful from me and if it was off leash i wouldn't boot the dog i would boot the owner. Its not the dogs fault Its the retarded moron who owns him. If i see you out with your dogs at such places as Astro domes, ryan mountain or any other wilderness area you can expect a couple of pissed off locals yelling at you. Being the happy owner of a beautiful golden retrivier i know people love their dogs, but people also love their children. When children cant go somewhere with their parents, the parents go somewhere else (new jack city, any of the big bear crags, big rock, idywild ares....) or they find a baby sitter. if you think you are responsible enough to be in control of another life, you had better be responsible enough to make appropiate desicions for that other life. Dogs are terrible for the big big horn sheep who are way to stressed out as it is, why make it worse? just the scent of their urine can keep bighorns from reaching their water sources (they are not very smart animals)they chase animals (unless old and arthritic, in which case your a dick for making them walk out there) and i always hear the "my dog dosn't do that...." then ten seconds later they are barking at people walking down the trail or chasing a rabit or digging out a bush. Not to mention they are Fu*king annoying at the crag!!! keep them near the roads out of the wilderness areas. and yes all of the studies ever done on the issue have said that dogs are that bad in the backcountry.
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v10gripper
Boulder climber
Joshua Tree, CA
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Oct 25, 2006 - 05:57pm PT
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"show me a resource where all user impacts are equally considered in a non-political fashion and i will take the rules more seriously, until then, i will weigh the risks- tickets, mace, and big horn stress included"
with the last part of that comment you too have attained the grand master level of A$$hole. When there are no dogs at all allowed in the park we can all point at you and say a$$hole in unison, what a dip$hit thing to say... utterly moronic.
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v10gripper
Boulder climber
Joshua Tree, CA
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Oct 25, 2006 - 06:07pm PT
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"Think about this:
While it may not be YOU, a lot of CLIMBERS:
1. Crap and leave it
2. Bother other people
3. Whimpers, barks, growls, begs
4. Causes their partner to yell back to them while on the wall
5. Disturbs native wildlife"
Think about this, people have rights dogs do not. And the old classic two wrongs have never made a right. while people do cause harm we can manage ourselves we know what we are supposed to do to keep low impact,(such as not bringing dogs into the back country)dogs on the other hand do not know they are not supposed to chase rabbits, not poop next to waterways, and that Its prolly not a good idea to dig up that 1000 year old yucca plant. "oh my dog listens to me great...." heard it a thousand time and its never been true, ignorant dog owners make that up in there head so they feel better about being morons.
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caughtinside
Social climber
Davis, CA
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Oct 25, 2006 - 06:15pm PT
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Well, so much for the 'climbers are a responsible user group' argument.
"Whateva, I do whut I want!"
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Ouch!
climber
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Oct 25, 2006 - 06:38pm PT
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atchafalaya
Trad climber
California
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Oct 25, 2006 - 06:45pm PT
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cosmo (german shepard) loves Joshua Tree...
anyone got a cite for those bogus bighorn studies? Thanks
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doghater
Trad climber
joshua tree, ca
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Oct 25, 2006 - 06:47pm PT
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i'm trying do devise a little handout/ business card type thing to hand to ignorant dog owners, that hopefully, will get them to think.
any tips?
so far:
bad for enviro.
bad for dog owners.
bad for people.
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doghater
Trad climber
joshua tree, ca
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Oct 25, 2006 - 06:49pm PT
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atchafalaya
on the bright side, that dog is big and thus has a short life span.
you are a retard, retard.
you graduated from the mcgeorge school of law?
what a joke. no wonder you don't get it.
http://www.randolphlaw.net/rlc.htm
Second-Tier Law School?
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atchafalaya
Trad climber
California
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Oct 25, 2006 - 06:55pm PT
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cmon, you can troll better than that. Your earlier posts were actually pretty good...
Heres another one for you...
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doghater
Trad climber
joshua tree, ca
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Oct 25, 2006 - 06:58pm PT
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did they have a mcdonalds next to mc george?
i see its ranked right up there with chapman university. good on ya.
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caughtinside
Social climber
Davis, CA
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Oct 25, 2006 - 06:59pm PT
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nice edit, doghater. you were going to email atch's boss, until you realized atch is the boss? sniping the law school is definitely a step down.
Rich.
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doghater
Trad climber
joshua tree, ca
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Oct 25, 2006 - 07:02pm PT
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i've known a few mcgeorge grads. not the brightest bulbs.
he may be the boss, but so what. he is still a mcgeorge alum! :)
he should delete that off his site! he'd get more clients.
holy sh#t, they all went to mcgeorge. run for cover, or get the chair!
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Matt
Trad climber
places you shouldn't talk about in polite company
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Oct 25, 2006 - 07:05pm PT
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"with the last part of that comment you too have attained the grand master level of A$$hole"
either that, or you didn't quite get the gist of that comment (that being that said stress would be something to consider)
truth is, i do sometimes take my dog where he doesn't belong...
(here he is inside an awhannee guest room)
...so if any of you haters or v10 braggarts are ever there when we are, feel free to start spewing, it's a free country.
btw- i too see other peoples dogs chasing animals and digging sh#t up. what you are used to is what your dog does and what you see other dogs do. what i am used to is a constantly well behaved dog that sometimes lies on my rope, but otherwise might as well not even be there, and positive face to face reactions/interactions from every climber i can ever remember running into w/ him. you can get upset over ryan mtn, and that may have been a questionable choice, but the day we did it was a holiday and there were 100 other people on that trail, suffice to say that the sheep were miles away. (as for dog pee, he has nothing left to pee by the time we are 1/4 mile from the road- you can surely find better reasons to make me the boogeyman)
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Largo
Sport climber
Venice, Ca
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Oct 25, 2006 - 07:05pm PT
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A recent incident happened at a trail I sometimes ride. A woman didn't have her dog on a leash and when a buy went by on a mountain bike (uphill), the dog was startled and bit the guy in the leg. The guy (according to one witness) made a comment to the dog owner but was civil despite the hound drawing blood. Apparently the woman accused the biker of startling the dog, implying that had he properly compensated for the dog he wouldn't have been bitten. The biker grabbed the woman's arm, bit it (deeply) and told her that had she properly compensated for him she wouldn't have been bitten. Then he rode off and was never found.
Though I am a dog owner, and generally appreciate dogs, I feel that the first time a person has to compensate for a dog, no matter how big or small, the dog has become an needless intrusion. Nazi dog owners will start trotting out the rights of dogs and so forth but what they are generally defending is the "right" for them to bring their dogs anywhere and if you don't like it there's something "wrong" with you or me. At this point the conversation is, of course, no longer about a dog, but about an owner who has lost any sense of priority.
JL
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Chaz
Trad climber
So. Cal.
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Oct 25, 2006 - 07:15pm PT
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V10Gripper is mostly right.
But alot of the Idylwild Areas, and all of Big Rock is State Park Land where Dogs are not allowed.
Big Bear is NFS, and New Jack City is BLM where just about anything goes.
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Matt
Trad climber
places you shouldn't talk about in polite company
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Oct 25, 2006 - 07:17pm PT
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i agree w/ largo's post %100
(and like i said, go ahead and kick my dog as hard as you can, i'm sure he'll lick you right back)
what's more, when we go trail running together, my dog is physically under my control whenever a bike approaches, not so he doesn't bite, but so he doesn't get spooked and jump in front of the bike or something (and that goes for bikes on trails where they are not allowed too)
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doghater
Trad climber
joshua tree, ca
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Oct 25, 2006 - 07:41pm PT
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Tell ya what...
You've changed my mind! I will refrain from any dog kicking or macing. Instead, when we meet at the crag, you with your dog, you violating a rule, but risking the consequences because you have the right to do what you want, no matter how that impacts people and the environment, and wildlife.
I'll be cool to you. We'll be on good terms. I'll ask ya what route you're on, I'll pet your dog. I'll tell you that you have a well behaved dog. I'll climb a few routes. And just as you top-out...
I'll pat the pooch on the head and toss it a few of my homemade meatball Scooby Snacks.
Rut-Ro!
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Matt
Trad climber
places you shouldn't talk about in polite company
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Oct 25, 2006 - 07:54pm PT
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deal.
and then someday i'll give your children the same affectionate treatment-
...pats on the head and compliments to you included.
btw- that's awful nice of you to carry dog treats w/ you, mostly he just gets those from the rangers at the park entrance kiosks.
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doghater
Trad climber
joshua tree, ca
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Oct 26, 2006 - 12:21am PT
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locker:
no, i assure you, i am not jtdrip. what a loser. Do you have a dog? Does it sniff glue with you? What will you climb this weekend? I am headed for towers of uncertainty.
damn, Those dogs suck. I am praying that they die.
che guevera hates dogs.
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doghater
Trad climber
joshua tree, ca
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Oct 26, 2006 - 01:20am PT
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Rokjox,
The mojave desert is so much more than the snapshot weekend trip that many experience. Yet, so many people have a limited perspective based on their snapshot trip to Joshua Tree. They see themselves in isolation; the cumulative effect of every dog--pooping, digging, and posing a threat--adds up.
Doghater.
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Chaz
Trad climber
So. Cal.
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Oct 26, 2006 - 01:50am PT
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What about the cumulative effect of every Coyote--pooping, digging, and posing a threat--How does that add up?
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John Barleycorn
climber
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 26, 2006 - 02:15am PT
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just curious, does anyone know how to get in touch with the guy who teaches the coyotes to leave the sheep alone. that sounds like a cool job.
If everyone was responsible we could have dogs in the parks, we could have a beer in a movie theater, and we could leave our doors unlocked. unfortunately, it no longer is that way.
jb
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v10gripper
Boulder climber
Joshua Tree, CA
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Oct 26, 2006 - 11:37am PT
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"but otherwise might as well not even be there"
then why bring him?......
this thread just started sucking
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John Barleycorn
climber
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 26, 2006 - 02:53pm PT
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"don't kill the liberty. "America, Land of the Free", remember?"
Roxjox, couldn't have said it better. Our freedom has been legislated away because people won't take responsibility for themselves and when an accident happens, they sue. So another "no this" sign goes up and our liberties shrink a little more.
jb
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Melissa
Gym climber
berkeley, ca
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Oct 26, 2006 - 06:53pm PT
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The notice on the kiosk at Indian Creek recommends leaving your dog in your car while you climb?!
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doghater
Trad climber
joshua tree, ca
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Oct 26, 2006 - 07:29pm PT
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john b says:
"Our freedom has been legislated away because people won't take responsibility for themselves and when an accident happens, they sue. So another "no this" sign goes up and our liberties shrink a little more."
thanks for making my point. you dog folks are gonna ruin the possiblity of any dogs in the park, if you continue to break the rules. you refuse to take responsibility and follow the rules, so they tighten.
are you still gonna take your dog out to astrodome this weekend?
locker: why is it so cold today. news says its 87 in la la land.
but i'm freezin out here.
rokjox: the summer climbing here is great!
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v10gripper
Boulder climber
Joshua Tree, CA
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Oct 26, 2006 - 08:34pm PT
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coz wrote:
"I've had my dogs in Josh for about 8 years, I took them guiding with me everyday. They do not scare Bighorns, or disrupt anything. I say f- big brother and bring your dog, or get a sticker, that says, I'm a moron and I believe everything Mr Ranger tells me, and paste it on your head.
It's not a problem as the Ranger never leave their cars. My friend use to take my dog Hondo, (may he rest in peace), with her as she did the native plant study with the rangers in tow. They all loved the little bugger.
It's a joke Reg, think about the horses, do you really think a Big horn can tell the difference between a dog and a coyote.
And who is the big tough guy who wants to beat up dogs, bring it on you sad sap."
I personally know that rangers leave their cars often and get out on the trails(they might not look like rangers with street clothes on), also sheep can tell the difference between horses and dogs. the scent that a dog leaves behind is more like the scent of a predator. Your right its a joke getting a 50 dollar ticket... The times have changed since you were hangin out in josh all the time coz, its not the 80's anymore. Just remember if it wasn't for the man and all his regulations you would not have a joshua tree national park instead all you would have is "Hidden Valley 50 + community and 18 hole golf course"
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v10gripper
Boulder climber
Joshua Tree, CA
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Oct 26, 2006 - 08:40pm PT
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Chaz wrote
"What about the cumulative effect of every Coyote--pooping, digging, and posing a threat--How does that add up?"
come on you seem like a smart guy, don't degrade yourself with dumb remarks like this.
Ill break this down for you
your german shepard = not native
coyote = native (make sense?)
In a national park the goal is to keep the natural cycle of things in order, not have impact from outside sources.
(yes i realize yosemite has a full service deli and massive hotel, i dont agree with that either)
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Chaz
Trad climber
So. Cal.
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Oct 26, 2006 - 08:56pm PT
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"Ill break this down for you
your german shepard = not native
coyote = native (make sense?)"
It's a well known fact that Sheep can't tell the difference between the Wolf and the SheepDog.
Make Sense?
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happiegrrrl
Trad climber
New York, NY
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Oct 26, 2006 - 10:40pm PT
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"I say f- big brother and bring your dog, or get a sticker, that says, I'm a moron and I believe everything Mr Ranger tells me, and paste it on your head"
hahaha....fun-nee
I got a story. My dog Teddy goes unleashed at the Mohonk Preserve for the most part. Only by the steel bridge(next to a road) or in the parking lot(lots of cars) or at the Uberfall if I am not simply passing through(too crowded with bikes, kids, toruists and other dogs who are on leash for Teddy to have special priveledge). He goes past the rangers every time, and we often stop and talk with them. Never once (except last year before Teddy had earned his stripes) have I been told to rope him up.
But that's not the story...
The story is that, this summer, when I had that hippie guy visiting, he and I went to the Gunks with Teddy and his dog Shithead(Shih TAY ed - oy veh....). Shithead never was on leash either, and well behaved at all times.
One of the daze, he was hanging with the dog at Split Rock and some sticker patrol busybody told him he had to leash his dog. Hippie looked at him and didn't respond....
I said, "Leash your dog, man. Or I'm telling the ranger." he says.
"Go right ahead. He's over there, last time I saw him" says hippie Max, as he points yonder.
Stick guy stomps off toward the ranger, never to be seen again.
If only he'd known that Max had come that moring with an entire extra egg/cheese sandwich form the deli and had given it to the ranger..... he might have understood that his was a lost cause.
Later, when Max ran into the ranger, he asked about the leash patroller. He was told something to the effect of "I make the decisions as to who needs to leash their dogs, based on behavior." And he patted Shithead, who had been sitting by Max, unleashed of course, on the head.
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doghater
Trad climber
joshua tree, ca
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Oct 26, 2006 - 11:08pm PT
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LEB-
You are barking up the wrong atheist tree. I wish death to all crag dogs, bar none.
Roxlox, why were you upset your dog did not chase the deer? Did it make you understand your manlet status?
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doghater
Trad climber
joshua tree, ca
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Oct 26, 2006 - 11:12pm PT
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LEB-
Then what is it? karma? voodoooo?
Life is a mish mash of chance. what comes around, does not go around. Beleiving so, however, makes us feel better sometimes.
BTW i've probably done more good in my life than most, but i still wish death to crag dogs.
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Petch
climber
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Oct 27, 2006 - 01:22am PT
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billie eating bark beetles for the good of the community
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Chaz
Trad climber
So. Cal.
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Oct 27, 2006 - 01:46am PT
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"These two have killed uncounted hundreds of dall sheep and woodchucks"
Your two Vicious Curs have it good, S & S.
My guys don't get to kill anything more exciting than rats and skunks.
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Condorman
Trad climber
Garden Grove, CA
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Apr 28, 2016 - 05:11pm PT
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While I love dogs and cats, I've got to go with doghater on this one. I've got friends who have to bring their dogs to the crag too, but it's not OUR backyard, it's the bighorn, coyotes, and other indigenous animals' not YOUR dogs.
Try to have a little respect for what few animals are left out there.
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overwatch
climber
Arizona
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Apr 28, 2016 - 05:30pm PT
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You had to dig up a 10 year old thread to impart to us that Gem of wisdom?
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Jon Beck
Trad climber
Oceanside
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Apr 28, 2016 - 05:44pm PT
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Condorman wakes from a five year sleep and has to talk dogs and chalk. Stick to the chalk talk cuz this thread is the proverbial dead horse.
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Flip Flop
climber
Earth Planet, Universe
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Apr 28, 2016 - 08:11pm PT
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How do you even find 10 year old threads?
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BigB
Trad climber
Red Rock
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Apr 28, 2016 - 08:18pm PT
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The answer to th OP was obviously ....
Woodson braj!
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