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John M
climber
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There is plenty of blame to go around Chief. Both dems and republicans..
Trickle down economics is one of my pet peeves.
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philo
climber
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THURSDAY, NOV 13, 2014 05:00 AM MST
I was wrong about the Second Amendment: Why my view of guns totally changed
I used to think calls for gun safety reform were overblown. Then the world changed -- and with it everything I knew
PHILIP GULLEY
TOPICS: GUNS, GUN CONTROL, CONSTITUTION, SECOND AMENDMENT, EDITOR'S PICKS, SANDY HOOK, VIOLENCE, GUN VIOLENCE, CONFEDERATES, HITLER, MILITIA, NRA, FERGUSON, POLITICS NEWS
I was wrong about the Second Amendment: Why my view of guns totally changed
A photo of the author
Noah Pozner did nothing to change my mind, except die. Before he died, I believed a few sensible gun laws could save children like Noah Pozner. After he died, after he and his Sandy Hook classmates were mowed down by a man with a gun, I changed my mind.
After he died, I realized an old custom had to die with him, so a nobler one could take its place. Before Noah Pozner died, I thought there was nothing wrong with the Second Amendment a little common sense couldn’t fix. After he died, I’ve come to believe “the right of the people to keep and bear Arms” no longer promotes our life, liberty and pursuit of happiness, but daily threatens them. How free are we when more people are shot and killed each year in America than populate the towns in which many of us live? How free are we when a backpack that unfolds into a bulletproof covering is a must-have item for schoolchildren
“A well-regulated Militia being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms shall not be infringed.”
While I concede that a well-regulated militia might be necessary to the security of a free state, that role is now ably served by our military, professionally trained and highly disciplined, drawn from the ranks of our families and friends, from whom we have nothing to fear. We no longer need Minutemen. The British have not surrounded Concord. This is not “Independence Day” and we’re not under alien attack. I cannot imagine any circumstance in which our government would urge us to arm ourselves in defense of our country. Our nation has outgrown its need for an armed citizenry. The disadvantages of widespread gun ownership far outweigh any perceived advantage. Ask the parents of Noah Pozner. Ask African-American residents of Ferguson, Missouri. Ask what America’s love affair with guns has meant to them.
The merit of a position can be gauged by the temperament of its supporters, and these days the NRA reminds me of the folks who packed the courtroom of the Scopes monkey trial, fighting to preserve a worldview no thoughtful person espoused. This worship of guns grows more ridiculous, more difficult to sustain, and they know it, hence their theatrics, their parading through Home Depot and Target, rifles slung over shoulders. Defending themselves, they say. From what, from whom? I have whiled away many an hour at Home Depots and Targets and never once come under attack.
They remind me of the Confederates who fought to defend the indefensible, sacrificing the lives of others in order to preserve some dubious right they alone valued. They would rather die, armed to the teeth, than live in a nation free of guns and their bitter harvest. You can have my gun when you pry it from around my cold, dead fingers, their bumper stickers read. How empty their lives must be if life without a gun is not worth living.
The first thing Hitler did was confiscate guns, the gun lovers warn, a bald lie if ever there was one. But let’s suspend reality and imagine it was true. Where is the Hitler in Canada, in England, in Sweden, in every other civilized nation whose citizens have resolved to live without guns? Let the NRA trot out its tired canard about the housewife whose husband thoughtfully armed her, who shot the intruder and saved her family. I will tell you about the father who mistook his son for a burglar and shot him dead, about the man who rigged a shotgun in his barn to discourage thievery and accidentally slew his precious little girl when she entered the barn to play with her kittens.
What drives this fanaticism? Can I venture a guess? Have you noticed the simultaneous increase in gun sales and the decline of the white majority? After the 2010 census, when social scientists predicted a white minority in America by the year 2043, we began to hear talk of “taking back our country.” Gun shops popped up like mushrooms, mostly in the white enclaves of America’s suburbs and small towns. One can’t help wondering if the zeal for weaponry has been fueled by the same dismal racism that has propelled so many social ills.
When I was growing up, our schools and colleges were unmatched, our medical care unrivaled, our infrastructure state-of-the-art, our opportunities unlimited. America set the gold standard. We can be great again, but not without addressing the fear and ignorance that feed our gun culture, for no nation can ascend until it cures the virus of violence. We cannot let the most fearful among us set our nation’s tone, lest we descend to that sorry state we labored centuries to rise above. It is time for America to grow up, to become adults, so that children like Noah Pozner have a fighting chance to do the same.
A Quaker pastor, author and speaker, Philip Gulley received his masters of divinity degree from Christian Theological Seminary, and is co-pastor of Fairfield Friends Meeting in Camby, Indiana. He is also the author of “Living the Quaker Way: Timeless Wisdom for a Better Life Today” by Convergent
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rick sumner
Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
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If everyone was packen it wouldn't happen.
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John M
climber
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Everyone was packing in the wild wild west. Plenty of gun violence then.
In fact, many towns in order to become civilized forced their citizens and visitors to check their guns while they were in town. Can you imagine that today?
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Fritz
Trad climber
Choss Creek, ID
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Hey Chief!
Try to focus (rare, but possible for you) and read very, very slowly.
It’s ok to mouth the words too & I know that’s hard for mouth-breathers.
Thanks to all, but the chief & a couple other mentally-challenged folks, for posting up some great & sympathetic thoughts on this thread about ten college students gunned down in Oregon.
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The Chief
climber
Down the hill & across the Valley from......
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Thanks to all, but the chief & a couple other mentally-challenged folks, for posting up some great & sympathetic thoughts on this thread about ten college students gunned down in Oregon.
Yeah...
And fk the all them innocent people that have been "gunned down" in So Chicago this year...
ALL 375 of them.
They DON'T matter.
If everyone was packen it wouldn't happen.
Bingo...
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Q- Ball
Mountain climber
where the wind always blows
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I was always on the fence about "assault rifles" until this past winter. I never saw a use for one other than killing people. That has changed. I have a feral pig problem on my farm. A high capacity magazine/clip is crucial if you want to try and kill the whole sounder.
I wish I could get a clip that holds more than 20 rounds and works with my Ruger mini-30.
I hate hate breaking my rifles across the skulls of charging hogs when I run out of ammo.
Not complaining just don't make it harder for me to kill these pests.
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The Chief
climber
Down the hill & across the Valley from......
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^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Priceless!!!! RFLMAO!!! Thanks Q-Ball....^^^^^^^^^^^^
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John M
climber
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Its not that hard to legislate genuine need.. One could get a license for certain types of weapons based on need. A farmer killing a pest could be termed a legitimate need. Much like some pesticides have regulations limiting the general population from using them, but allowing someone with a permit to use them.
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Crimpergirl
Sport climber
Boulder, Colorado!
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What did he do to the non-Christians Cosmic?
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the albatross
Gym climber
Flagstaff
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That was an overwhelming link that Reilly posted.
http://www.samharris.org/blog/item/the-riddle-of-the-gun
That link suggested something like 100,000 Americans die every year because Doctors and Nurses don't wash their hands. I googled that sh#t and the truth may be even more shocking:
"between 210,000 and 440,000 patients each year who go to the hospital for care suffer some type of preventable harm that contributes to their death
That would make medical errors the third-leading cause of death in America, behind heart disease, which is the first, and cancer, which is second."
http://www.propublica.org/article/how-many-die-from-medical-mistakes-in-us-hospitals
I'm not all that great with math, but does this mean something like 1,000 people died today alone (and will die tomorrow and the next) in the United States as a result of "medical errors"?
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The Chief
climber
Down the hill & across the Valley from......
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What did he do to the non-Christians Cosmic?
Anyone that answered yes to being a "Christian" was shot point blank in the head.
If they answered NO, to being a Christian, he shot them in the lower leg or foot.
In other words, he went there with the sole intent to exterminate "Christians".
"The shooter was lining people up and asking if they were christian," a Twitter user posted.
"If they said yes, then they were shot in the head. If they said no, they were shot in the legs."
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johnboy
Trad climber
Can't get here from there
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I'm not all that great with math, but does this mean something like 1,000 people died today alone (and will die tomorrow and the next) in the United States as a result of "medical errors"?
I always get a kick out of comparisons like this, as if they're the same as murder.
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John M
climber
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I'm going to take back my statement above. To me it seems simple to determine genuine need, but the average human seems to have a very difficult time with that.
We should all be given tanks by our government. Talk about government subsidies..
I promise a tank in every yard if you elect me president.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Albatross, no chit, hospitals are scary places - we'd best be rid of them. ;-)
Me mum just had what initially was suspected as a possible MRSA infection.
The doctor I took her to had the most appalling 'sterile technique' imaginable.
She wasn't endangering me mum, so I didn't call her on it, but she most
certainly was endangering herself, everybody that would use that exam room
afterwards, and subsequent patients. I'm a passed master of sterile technique -
thanks to the wife I am well-schooled.
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MisterE
Gym climber
Being In Sierra Happy Of Place
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The gravy is flowing for The Chief.
Good job, reactionists.
You remind me why I don't.
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Fritz
Trad climber
Choss Creek, ID
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Das Chief? Try to focus, & don't mouth breathe while you read this.
Re the last comment I noticed from you?
If everyone was packen it wouldn't happen.
Then??? What's your problem with my proposal?
Oct 1, 2015 - 08:02pm PT
As a liberal tree-hugger, gun-owner, I am very sad about the mostly young & mentally-disturbed males who are resorting to gun-violence to solve, what to them must be very real problems.
Although I am not familiar with GLilligard, his post tonight does agree with some of my thoughts about this epidemic of disturbed teens shooting their classmates:
What has changed? The mindset of teenage males. What has occurred that causes them to overreact and murder people over being "bullied" or marginalized (and what adolescent male in the history of the world has never felt bullied or marginalized?)?
1) A lack of substantive interaction with strong adult personalities who
could teach them how to deal with their feels and how to become a man.
2) Thousands of hours of committing extreme violence and causing thousands of virtual death that has absolutely zero emotional cost or commitment. "First-person shooter" video games are the emotional equivalent of the simulators used to train pilots. No sane child could kill so many real animals "for fun".
I do blame video games & the TV culture of shooting series & movies fostered on young minds, until shooting people is ingrained in our national culture as a solution.
I’m not at all excited about youth interaction with strong adult personalities as a solution to the shooting their peers problem, but I do endorse programs that teach youth “self-esteem” through teaching them outdoor skills & encouraging them to rely on their own skills and minds.
I am thinking back to 1964 and Drivers Training. Before we Idaho teens could get our license, we of course had to do some driving and also see some movies about the carnage cars could cause. At age 15, we got to watch explicit after-crash movies of dead people in and around cars & horribly-burnt corpses in cars. Those images have stayed with me.
Perhaps, our nation needs to start mandatory classes on responsible firearm use, along with showing graphic videos of wounded & dead people resulting from shootings.
After, or concurrent with those classes, perhaps testing and counseling could identify those who might have a future problem with firearm mis-use.
Unfortunately, here in America, the land of equal opportunity, we can’t legally deny the right to drive or own firearms, unless the person has a previous criminal record.
Maybe that needs to change too.
Is it just because you have me down as one of "you people" as it seems you have everyone that offers up any thoughts that don't agree with yours?
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The Chief
climber
Down the hill & across the Valley from......
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You remind me why I don't.
We know....
Try to Focus here FRITZ!
375 Dead due to street violence in Chicago to date this year.
All under the watchful eyes of a Liberal Anti-Gun Loon and ex direct adviser/Chief of Staff to the POTUS..
Why?
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Lorenzo
Trad climber
Portland Oregon
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A MySpace profile identified as Chris Harper-Mercer from Torrance showed a young man with a shaved head and the barrel of a rifle pointing up into the frame of his portrait.
“Me, holding a rifle,” said the caption. “It was supposed to be all the way in the picture, but it didn't work out.”
Oregon shooting updates: Shooter identified as Chris Harper Mercer
Oregon shooting updates: Shooter identified as Chris Harper Mercer
Another photo on the account shows him wearing a suit for his sister’s wedding, according to the caption. Most of the images, however, showed armed gunmen from the Irish Republican Army.
Within a few hours of the shooting, FBI agents in Los Angeles fanned out to interview those who knew Mercer from his time in Torrance to help build a fuller profile of his history, beliefs and prior behavior, according to a law enforcement source familiar with the probe.
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