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keep looking up
Trad climber
San Francisco South Bay, CA
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Topic Author's Original Post - Oct 10, 2006 - 07:14pm PT
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anyone have information on this?
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Chicken Skinner
Trad climber
Yosemite
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Oct 10, 2006 - 07:28pm PT
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Are you sure it wasn't near Cascade Creek on 120 approaching the Valley? I saw the remains of a nasty one there on Sunday.
Ken
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keep looking up
Trad climber
San Francisco South Bay, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 10, 2006 - 08:21pm PT
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the fatality was about 50 yards from the pullout to climb Knobby Hill on the 120 (sorry I mixed up Pothole with Knobby)
the guy was trying to pass two RV's on the double yellow and crashed into an oncoming car. killed instantly.
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Jaybro
Social climber
The West
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Oct 10, 2006 - 08:22pm PT
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There was a horrendous one on highway 89 north of Truckee about noon sunday. Lots of cops, closed the road used a helicopter etc, I saw a demolished red crotch rocket in the trees. A bunch of those guys were running around in groups around greater tahoe this weekend. Hope that guy made it.
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Mick K
climber
Northern Sierra
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Oct 10, 2006 - 08:54pm PT
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Jaybro:
I saw on the news that the driver was killed. A deer jumped in front of him.
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Minerals
Social climber
The Deli
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Oct 10, 2006 - 08:56pm PT
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Dirt bikes are dangerous; street bikes are death.
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Nohea
Trad climber
Aiea,Hi
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Oct 10, 2006 - 09:07pm PT
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All bikes are Fun!
Sorry to hear about a brother down.
wil
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Crimpergirl
Sport climber
St. Louis
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Oct 10, 2006 - 09:16pm PT
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Deer + motorcycle = very bad.
Lost a long time girlfriend this summer to that. She left behind a 15 month old daughter. :(
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stevep
Boulder climber
Salt Lake, UT
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Oct 10, 2006 - 09:56pm PT
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Riding a motorcycle on the road is not much above high-altitude mountaineering in terms of danger. I've had one friend killed and another seriously injured thru no fault of their own on motorcycles. Every time I think it would be cool to get a Ducati, I remember that and my daughter.
And while loud Harleys bug the sh!t out of me, I guess I can understand the reasoning behind wanting to be heard.
Not giving up my road bicycle, but probably not getting a road motorcycle. Be careful, those of you who ride alot.
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Anastasia
Trad climber
Near a mountain, CA
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Oct 10, 2006 - 10:52pm PT
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Anyone knows who it was? I know a few climbers with motorcycles. This news gets me worried. At least let me know what kind of bike, I can figure out a few things with that description.
AF
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WBraun
climber
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Oct 10, 2006 - 10:58pm PT
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He was not a climber, Anastasia.
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Shack
Big Wall climber
Reno NV
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Oct 11, 2006 - 01:39am PT
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Like the CHP motorcycle cops say...
"There are 2 kinds of motorcycle riders, those that have gone down and those that will go down."
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dougs510
Social climber
down south
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Oct 11, 2006 - 11:05am PT
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I've been riding since I was 7 or 8 years old. I started on a mini-bike, a yahama 60, a harley davidson 125, a harley davidson sportster, and now I ride a Harley Electra glide.
Everytime I get on the bike, I think about the pavement grinding my kneecaps off, and it reminds me to follow the rules I've learned thru the years. My main concerns are small animals and deer, along with idiot drivers.
It's a calculated risk, with unknown factors that must be dealt with. However, the wind in my face and the purr of the bike on a lone highway is a very beautiful feeling.
I've been lucky, the times I've dumped it, I didn't get hurt too bad (so far) and I have lost friends.
Motercycles are very dangerous and I'm only saying it is a personal choice. The best advice I've ever had was from my father when I was a young lad: "Son, when you loose your fear of it, it is going to get you". So I try and think of that pavement eating my a$$ up everytime I ride.
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pud
climber
Sportbikeville
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Oct 11, 2006 - 11:24am PT
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"Dirt bikes are dangerous; street bikes are death."
so um...
sitting in your car in bumber to bumber traffic breathing large amounts of carbon monoxide from the cars surrounding you will help you live longer?
Dirtbikes are an awesome way to get extraordinary amounts of exercise while having a great time.
Streetbikes are freedom.
Bikes aren't for everyone.
Those of us that have ridden bikes all of our lives know and accept the risks.
Does anyone on this forum do anything where this type of thinking may apply?
:)
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Ben Rumsen
Social climber
No Name City ( and it sure ain't pretty )
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Oct 11, 2006 - 12:43pm PT
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I saw the remains of that accident Sunday - it looked really bad. I'm sorry to hear the rider was killed. I assumed speeding was a cause too. People need to learn to not speed in the park. It's not a race course.
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Minerals
Social climber
The Deli
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Oct 11, 2006 - 04:33pm PT
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I still stand by what I said. Street bikes are death. If one were to ride a street bike solo on a maintained, closed track, then safety would be strictly in the hands of the rider (provided the bike has no mechanical malfunctions). But, once you get on a public street, all bets are off. You can be the best rider out there, but you still have no control over the millions of stupid idiots that were (unfortunately) given a driver’s license. Hell, the majority of dumbasses out there don’t even deserve a driver’s license. So why put your life in their hands? Mass always wins.
If public roadways are death, then the roads in Yosemite are ultra death. I can honestly say that when I drive between Crane Flat and Tuolumne, I am gripped for the safety of my truck and I’d be a hell of a lot more gripped if I didn’t have 7,000 pounds of metal protecting me. The lanes on 120 are illegally narrow and there is practically no shoulder (let alone a good-sized drop-off along many sections). And then you’ve got retarded tourists (they’re a dime a dozen these days…) that decide to try and park in micro turnouts (good job Pork Circus…) that are not big enough and their vehicle sticks out two feet or so into your already-too-narrow lane. Helloooooo????? I can’t believe that people actually ride a bicycle along that stretch of road, with all of the tour busses and inexperienced rental-RV drivers! Absolutely ludicrous!!!!! What happens when you are going the speed limit and come around a blind turn with a bicycle in front of you and this guy barreling towards you, partly in your lane?
I know for damn sure that if confronted with such a situation, that bicycle is going to bounce off of my front bumper because there is no freaking way that I am going to get into a head-on collision just because some dumbass decides that it’s a good idea to ride a bicycle along 120. If you ride a bicycle along 120 you are primitively stupid or are WAY over-trusting of the retards around you. Death!!!
So now, back to motorcycles…
ALL motorcycles are dangerous; it’s up to the rider to make things as safe as possible. In the case of dirt bikes, there are a lot fewer hazards that are beyond your control. Yes, when riding through the forest, a deer may jump out in front of you – bad news, for sure. But overall, safety is in the hands of the rider. What percentage of street riders are killed each year in accidents? What percentage of dirt riders are killed each year in accidents? In the case of the fatality on Sunday, it sounds as though it was the fault of the rider (RV frustration?), but how often is that the case? A section of I-80 west of Reno was closed for a few hours on the Friday before Street Vibrations last month because a rider was run over by a semi and a pick-up truck. I never heard how/why the accident happened but it resulted in another fatality.
I’ve gone down plenty of times in the dirt, some no big deal, some hurt. In every one of those cases it was pilot error – I f*#ked up and I paid the price. Klaus, with all due respect bro, of all the times that you’ve gone down on pavement, how many of those times were your fault and how many were the fault of someone in an automobile? I don’t mean to give you street riders a hard time here; I am merely sharing my views. I worry about you guys sometimes. My ex-girlfriend has taken a street rider's course and wants to get a street bike – that worries me too. Sh#t happens really quickly and often, you have no time to react; the next thing you know, the laws of nature have taken control and you’re just a puppet (or a rag doll…). Be careful out there and trust no one! They’re all out to get you!!!
This is what happens when you don’t respect the power of the 500 and flirt with it too much. I had two long-sleeve jerseys on as well as forearm/elbow guards with rigid plastic plates – all of that ended up around my bicep by the time I finally stopped (in a mud puddle). There is more road-rash on top of my arm that you can’t see in the picture and I also tweaked my shoulder and hip (wearing full armor).
11 days ago:
My friends still think I’m crazy to ride by myself in the middle of nowhere. Oh well. It could have been a lot worse (luckily I missed all of the trees around me and good thing I drank a quart of milk with lunch everyday when I was a kid… can’t believe I didn’t break anything… on me, that is… and good thing the bike started up and made the 10 miles back). Sometimes you’ve got to pay to play. I hope to be able to get back on the bike in another week or two, but in the meantime life has been a little slow. Oh well. Live and learn.
Ride safe, my brothers!
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keep looking up
Trad climber
San Francisco South Bay, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 11, 2006 - 05:20pm PT
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Well, when I first asked the question it was in regard getting some information per the fatality;
I felt goose bumps for awhile since it occured just as we pulled in to climb. I thought it was a climber.....
then I heard it was a motorcyclist, no pulse, eyes wide open;
he died instantly on a beautiful day in a beautiful place.
At least he got that right.
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pud
climber
Sportbikeville
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Oct 11, 2006 - 09:06pm PT
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I love streetbikes. :)
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Mountain Man
Trad climber
Outer space
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Oct 11, 2006 - 10:07pm PT
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Bikes are murder. I don't think many old people can even see you.
I've ridden many thousands of miles on bikes, but no more.
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Holdplease2
Big Wall climber
Yosemite area
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Oct 11, 2006 - 10:31pm PT
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Reminds me of listening to motorcycle friends discussing a local climbing accident. Fearfully dangerous activities, motorcycling and climbing...until you disect the accidents to the point that you can comfortably say "that would never happen to me."
Didn't (insert one) tie in, place a good anchor, make sure the ends were even, place pro on eas(ier) ground, communicate with belayer, check the weather, lock the biner, tighten the bolt, wear a helmet, double back the harness, notice the hold was loose...
*Kinda Equals*
Passing two RVs in the twisties on a double yellow line...at that exact moment when your luck runs out.
In hindsight, its similar stuff...easy mistakes to avoid, easy mistakes to make.
And the edge of the envelope is always there, asking for a push.
Condolences to friends and family, and to those who through no fault of their own were a part of this accident.
-Kate.
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LuckyPink
Mountain climber
north bay today/someplace else tomorrow
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Oct 12, 2006 - 12:51am PT
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We call them "donor-cycles" in the ED, nice young men, healthy , organs in good shape.... deep sorrow. Blessings to all .
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mark
climber
san diego, ca
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Oct 12, 2006 - 01:05am PT
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Motorcycle fatalities 2,057, Pedestrian fatalities 5,300, Bus/Truck fatalities 5,194, Automobile fatalities 51,054. Terrible numbers, but look at this: Medical Malpractice Fatalities 643,800. And they say bikers are a PUBLIC BURDEN?
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Jaybro
Social climber
The West
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Oct 12, 2006 - 08:23am PT
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Mark, so it's safer to ride a 'bike' than go to a doctor? could be.
Pink, other way around; the living out number the dead.
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426
Sport climber
Buzzard Point, TN
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Oct 12, 2006 - 08:29am PT
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S'too bad, seems to me that when you leave the continent a lot of places bikes of all types rule...
Ride safe! As my friend sez, A Cheap Way to Die...
Look ma, no helmet!
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LuckyPink
Mountain climber
the last bivy
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Oct 12, 2006 - 11:37am PT
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"Pink, other way around; the living out number the dead."
Think of all the humans ever incarnated onto (into?) the planet since the first ape stood up, and the mere 6 or so billion on the planet now. Many more of us are dead, than are living. In our psychology we don't really see ourselves as temporary. Perhaps a trick of the mind to support survival,or just as easily an illusion that will fade with evolution or enlightenment. In less technological cultures death is present at home every day. To live with death in our awareness is a gift from the Spirit, I believe. It gives us the impetus to appreciate the depth of the moment, which is where real joy lies. It gives us perspective.
Maybe it has something to do with why we climb. Jaybro I appreciate your post on that other thread... "can't help it"
Pink
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keep looking up
Trad climber
San Francisco South Bay, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 12, 2006 - 01:53pm PT
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"To live with death in our awareness is a gift from the Spirit,"
nicely said Pink
When death happens, it changes people who are still living.
All our days are precious. So the question is how do you make the most of your days on earth?
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hossjulia
Trad climber
Eastside
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Oct 12, 2006 - 03:17pm PT
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Werner, do you know if the bike was green?
Sunday I noticed a green crotch rocket heading for the east entrance. I thought, "that guy is out of his element." Looked like a city street bike to me.
I was a motorcycle mechanic out of high school. First girl to take the class offered there. I rode RD's for a few years, specalized in porting 2 stroke heads. The first time I tried club road racing, it feaked me out.
Then I had 2 friends killed, many others seriously injured/crippled for life, and I started losing me nerve.
After I discovered climbing & mountaineering, I never rode a motorcycle again, and quit wrenching.
I considered riding through Tuolumne to the Valley a few years ago on my road bike. After driving it, and getting run onto the little bit of shoulder twice, I decided that was a very bad idea.
(Good thing I was in a full-size 4x4!)
I still think roped rock climbing is the safest thing I do!
HJ
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pud
climber
Sportbikeville & Yucca brevifolia
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May 15, 2013 - 04:42pm PT
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Norwegian
Trad climber
the tip of god's middle finger
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May 15, 2013 - 04:54pm PT
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good riddance.
no, zero sympathy.
f*#king retards
screaming out their cowardice
into the unwilling ears and bumpers
of passive peers.
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pud
climber
Sportbikeville & Yucca brevifolia
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May 15, 2013 - 05:11pm PT
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Dapper Dan
Trad climber
Menlo Park
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May 15, 2013 - 05:21pm PT
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A beautiful day on the Oregon Coast ...
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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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May 15, 2013 - 08:32pm PT
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wow, Dan
beautiful picture of your wife, girlfriend, daughter I presume
I like that big thumper, doesn't look like a Harley, maybe a V star?
here's my baby, now 40 years old:
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Norwegian
Trad climber
the tip of god's middle finger
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May 15, 2013 - 08:49pm PT
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nuh uhh!
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labrat
Trad climber
Auburn, CA
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May 15, 2013 - 09:00pm PT
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I'm with you Norwegian! Totally agree on the noise aspects of the loud bikes. No need for it. I would fall down on the pavement laughing if I ever observed you doing it. Probably get my butt kicked as well :-)
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Dapper Dan
Trad climber
Menlo Park
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May 15, 2013 - 09:35pm PT
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It is a Honda vtx 1800 ... we rode to Key West FL on it last summer . It's super smooth , low end torque , Honda reliability ... a great all around big bike , bike and heavy being the key words .
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Peter Haan
Trad climber
Santa Cruz, CA
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May 15, 2013 - 11:05pm PT
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Pud, extremely funny, thanks for that! (The automatic speed limit image)
I do too.
The problem with motorcycles of all sorts is that they have such favorable power-to-weight ratios (like as low as 2-4 lbs per horsepower or more) that they are all pretty intoxicating, even the woosie ones. Some of us can handle it and some of us couldn't. (note the tense). And understanding that you have merely 15 square inches mas-o-minos contacting the ground apparently is beyond many as well. But holy mother whore (as Roper used to quoth) they are so so cool.
AS far as noise pollution is concerned and loud bikes, such bikers tell themselves and others that they have to be loud in order to be perceived by normal drivers and avoid accidents. Meanwhile, the most advanced stock street bikes (BMW, Ducati, similar) aren't very loud at all because those riders, usually way way better skilled people, use something a bit more effective than mere noise announcing their presence, namely riding skills and tactics that never quit. For the most part, loud bikes are only that, loud bikes, and soothe the owner in his or her insecurity. To me, riding is much like being on a lead. It is actually a kind of hyper vigilance and a bit exhausting mentally, as you are doing some of the driving for everyone around you on the road. Let that scheme drop, get tired or presumptive, and down you will go at some point.
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martygarrison
Trad climber
Washington DC
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May 16, 2013 - 12:05am PT
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Oh wait, wrong thread
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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May 16, 2013 - 12:44am PT
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If my car made the kind of noise the typical Harley does I would be pulled
over in a heartbeat. Why do they get a free pass on noise pollution? I
love bikes but there's no reason for the egregious noise. There should be
noise meters at park entrances. Aircraft are required to maintain a 2000'
separation above the highest point in a park or wildlife refuge. Of course,
the Navy and AF seem to think they're exempt too.
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Karen
Trad climber
So Cal urban sprawl Hell
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May 16, 2013 - 10:52am PT
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It's the Ducati doucebags that piss me off, not Harley guys (hate the noise however). When cycling-bike-up in the local mtns, it's not cars that scare me, it is the crotch rockets riding way above the speed limit that are dangerous to us cyclists.
Seriously, if you crotch rocket riders want to race around blind curves PLEASE go to a track, it will be safer for all.
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michaeld
Sport climber
Sacramento
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May 16, 2013 - 01:26pm PT
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Man, some of you guys are disgusting.
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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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May 16, 2013 - 01:34pm PT
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reilley said
If my car made the kind of noise the typical Harley does I would be pulled
over in a heartbeat. Why do they get a free pass on noise pollution? I
love bikes but there's no reason for the egregious noise.
could not agree with you more, reilly
the very first thing Harley buyers do is buy a much louder exhaust system and this is not unique to Harley boys and girls, the vast majority of all street bikes have illegal exhausts
why? one reason, louder exhausts simple sound better, more cool, more muscular
and the reason the owners give is because "loud pipes are so cars hear me, save my life"
unlike autos and trucks, motorcycles are not required in most states to undergo semi annual emission testing, they get off scott free
enforcement of existing laws largely does not apply to motorcycles
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michaeld
Sport climber
Sacramento
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May 16, 2013 - 01:35pm PT
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You can't tell me the sounds of this bike accelerating to 180+mph doesn't make you hard.
[Click to View YouTube Video]
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Mark Hudon
Trad climber
Hood River, OR
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May 16, 2013 - 01:40pm PT
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I was up on ZM a few years ago and heard a motorcycle start down the road at probably the Lodge. I was fuggin LOUD up on ZM and got louder as it approached El Cap. As it came into view it was louder still, the guy turned at the Bridge and rode back to maybe Curry before I couldn't hear it anymore!
The thing was fuggin LOUD!
The helicopter that rescued someone right below me the next day didn't seem much louder.
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guyman
Social climber
Moorpark, CA.
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May 16, 2013 - 02:03pm PT
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enforcement of existing laws largely does not apply to motorcycles
So True NOW but not BITD...
Back in the 70's it was very common to have the CHP's go visit the Rock Store, bust out some sort of decible meter and read your volume. If over the mark.... busted, fix it ticket, come back and pay the fine withiin two weeks.
I wonder why they have, apparently, ceased this enforcement???????
I don't understand all the hate directed at the dead rider......
He used very poor judgment, paid with his life.
I have used very poor judgment with bikes many times, got lucky and walked away. I learned from this stupidy- stopped riding and got into racecars that you race on the track.... that will let one get really stupid and learn just how to take risks - every lap.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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May 16, 2013 - 02:22pm PT
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I wonder why they have, apparently, ceased this enforcement???????
Because cops and the justice system are hypocrites. A few years ago there
was a motorcycle cop in Laguna Beach who carried and wielded a decibel meter
with unflinching rectitude. The public uproar from all those older/retired
Harley riders caused his boss to order him to desist.
"We can't have policemen enforcing the law with equanimity and honesty!"
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Anastasia
climber
Home
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May 16, 2013 - 02:32pm PT
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"Shaking my head...."
I bought a Harley in my twenties... Greatest thrill was taking my best friend on the back and showing up for events. Talk about a grand entrance... Nothing like two long haired descent looking girls getting off of a purple Harley. I had a really pretty female dragon painted on my gas tank. I bet that was why they kept staring... We never paid to get into a club. NEVER.
Anyway... I tried first not buying a loud exhaust. Yes, I thought it was obnoxious too. People kept swerving into me on the road. Then... I gave up, put in loud exhaust and magic happened. A whole lot less close calls.
So... I totally get the safety aspect. Especially with a bike that doesn't split lanes easily to get away.
Now, I lost that bike years ago when I tried to avoid hitting a dog and ended up laying it down, sliding into a guard rail. The car behind me hit the dog anyway. I'm still upset over that. I still feel bad about that poor dog. I rebuilt it, repainted the gas tank, lost the dragon and rode it for a month afterwards before selling it... I simply lost the good feeling and knew my time was up.
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Sierra Ledge Rat
Mountain climber
Old and Broken Down in Appalachia
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May 16, 2013 - 05:29pm PT
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I'd NEVER do anything dangerous, like riding a motorcyle.
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