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Tamara Robbins
climber
not a climber, just related...
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Topic Author's Original Post - Apr 14, 2015 - 04:38pm PT
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I'm looking for any photos or recollections about the belay seat (or the hammock) that my mom (Liz Robbins) designed and handmade in the early 70's.... thanks for any replies!!
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Apr 14, 2015 - 05:14pm PT
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Hi Tamara!!
It's so good to see you back here!
I hope someone posts up with what you're after.
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Fritz
Trad climber
Choss Creek, ID
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Apr 14, 2015 - 05:32pm PT
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Tamara: Hopefully someone here can respond with a story & hopefully the real thing.
Unfortunately I have no memories of a Robbins belay seat.
If one shows up, it and the story should also be cross posted to the wonderful:
Royal Robbins/Mountain Paraphernalia history thread.
http://www.supertopo.com/climbing/thread.php?topic_id=1022257&msg=1022257
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F10
Trad climber
Bishop
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Apr 14, 2015 - 05:39pm PT
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Trying to find some photos. Usually when I used a Robbins Belay seat it wasn't the best place to take a photo.
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Apr 14, 2015 - 06:23pm PT
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We took a couple of these items on our expedition to humble the Bugs in '70.
Jeff and I hold the Robbins Belay Seat in high esteem.
They were red ripstop nylon and the webbing was super-light-weight--they were no more than a handkerchief and we carried them in our trouser pockets.
Benighted on top of Bugaboo Spire, Jeff had no hat, but he kept his head and remembered the belay seat.
He tied it under his chin using the loops so it made the strangest-looking bonnet!
It served to keep his a bit warmer.
I think he spent more time wearing it this way than he did parking his skinny butt in it at sling belays.
edit: Thanks to T Hocking, let me simply say the particular butt bag Jeff used is held in high esteem, regardless of the brand. But I got the thing from TNF at the Telly store; and Chouinard had refused to sell to them any longer at that point, so I figured it must be a Robbins product.
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Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Apr 14, 2015 - 07:13pm PT
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Tamara- As I understand the history Liz sewed the first all-fabric belay seat and the two point hammock (which was simply a larger version of the same basic design) for Royal's solo second ascent of the West Face of the Leaning Tower in May of 1963.
I have a Tom Frost photo from the second ascent of the Dihedral Wall on El Capitan of Royal using the hammock and I will scan it and post shortly. This ascent in 1964 was the first time a party of two climbed El Cap in a push from the ground without fixing ropes using the "Yosemite method" of cleaning and hauling with Jumars that your dad developed. Being able to stop and bivy anywhere on the ledge scarce Dihedral Wall was a huge help.
Yvon was never one to let a good product sit idle. Tom borrowed the European net hammock shown in the photo above from Yvon for the occasion so Liz must not have made very many initially.
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Mark Force
Trad climber
Cave Creek, AZ
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Apr 14, 2015 - 07:13pm PT
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Tamara, Here is a pic of your dad sitting in one from the 1972 Chouinard Catalog.
Here's a link for the catalog. http://climbaz.com/chouinard72/chouinard.html
PS Your dad is an amazing human being and an inspiration.
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Batrock
Trad climber
Burbank
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Apr 14, 2015 - 08:08pm PT
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Looks like my old Buttermilk Mountain Works belay seat. BMW probably copied the RR seat after RR stopped selling them.
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k-man
Gym climber
SCruz
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Apr 14, 2015 - 08:24pm PT
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I have an old BMW butt bag, it has a cool pocket that you stuff the whole works into. Cool rainbow tag...
I last used this in EPC, great for hanging belays on multi-pitch routes, I wonder why nobody makes then anymore.
What was the make of the one that had three straps instead of two, Diamond-C?
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clinker
Trad climber
Santa Cruz, California
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Apr 14, 2015 - 08:32pm PT
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I wonder why nobody makes then anymore.
^^^^^+1
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Batrock
Trad climber
Burbank
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Apr 14, 2015 - 08:34pm PT
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Peter Haan
Trad climber
Santa Cruz, CA
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Apr 14, 2015 - 08:54pm PT
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Common practice for awhile was to follow and clean a pitch with the belay seat as your main support off the jumars or earlier, Prussiks.
The two-point hammock: slept in it on the Salathe headwall, slung from single point half way up. Fully epic. Back in the day.
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Batrock
Trad climber
Burbank
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Apr 14, 2015 - 08:57pm PT
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Peter,
I could not imagine sleeping in a single point hammock. You guys were hardcore.
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Ghost
climber
A long way from where I started
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Apr 14, 2015 - 08:57pm PT
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If you're looking for photos, try getting in touch with Tom Frost.
Steve G said he'd post a scan of one of Tom's photos, but there must be dozens of others in Tom's files.
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mucci
Trad climber
The pitch of Bagalaar above you
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Apr 14, 2015 - 09:10pm PT
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Here is Warren Harding's Belay seat.
Well used.
Edit: Working on orientation.
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rick sumner
Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
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Apr 14, 2015 - 09:23pm PT
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If any one has a rip stop nylon butt bag in good condition they are willing to part with please pm me . Name your price, if its at all fair i'll buy it.
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Patrick Sawyer
climber
Originally California now Ireland
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Apr 14, 2015 - 09:23pm PT
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I had one, years ago.
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Darwin
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Apr 14, 2015 - 09:36pm PT
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Here's the tag on the one that I have. It's not obvious, but it is ripstop. So ... I guess I can retire?
w.r.t. color correction: it's more orange-red and less pure magenta.
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Tamara Robbins
climber
not a climber, just related...
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 14, 2015 - 09:46pm PT
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Thanks, everyone! T.Hocking, if that is in fact one of mom's I'd love to take you up on offer... Love this forum community and am grateful for the connections here.
As for the gratitude expressed towards dad (and mom), be assured that it reaches their ears (or eyes). They are doing better than could be expected and continue to inspire me. Anyone wishing to contact them, please feel free to email me and trust that it will be forwarded along!
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rockermike
Trad climber
Berkeley
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Apr 14, 2015 - 11:03pm PT
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I have a red one just like the thawkins photo above. Bought in the mid '70s either in the valley or in Telluride where Robbins lived at the time. I don't know who the maker was... but I'd say not a prototype. Looks factory made. Fits in a back pocket as mentioned above.
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JEleazarian
Trad climber
Fresno CA
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Apr 15, 2015 - 12:12am PT
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I still have my original Robbins belay seat, sold by Chouinard Equipment, and purchased in 1969. I ended up sewing a somewhat burlier replacement a few years later, but I couldn't stand to give up the original.
John
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Roger Breedlove
climber
Cleveland Heights, Ohio
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Apr 15, 2015 - 03:29am PT
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Hi Tamara,
This picture of me and Kevin Worrall was taken in 1973 on the first ascent of "Freewheeling" on the north face apron of MCR. George Meyers took the picture. I think I bought my butt bag a year or two before.
Say hi to your mom and dad.
This is Kevin at the same belay.
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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Apr 15, 2015 - 07:12am PT
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As soon as I saw one I shamelessly copied it on mom's sewing machine. Still have it somewhere.
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norm larson
climber
wilson, wyoming
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Apr 15, 2015 - 07:33am PT
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When we were wearing swami's with no leg loops they were a huge step up in comfort. Now with a good harness not so much.
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PhilG
Trad climber
The Circuit, Tonasket WA
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Apr 15, 2015 - 07:46am PT
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Spent a night in a belay seat when we failed to make the bivy ledge on Middle Cathedral Rock.
Long Night!
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Roots
Mountain climber
Tustin, CA
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Apr 15, 2015 - 07:57am PT
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I have a red one too, like pictured on the first page. No markings of any kind. I'll try and get it out this weekend.
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tolman_paul
Trad climber
Anchorage, AK
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Apr 15, 2015 - 09:21am PT
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Hmmm. I have one in the bottom of some gear bin, somewhere.
I suspect that is the answer to your question. They're a hassle to deal with. Modern harnesses provide a lot of the comfort missing from swami belts. Wall climbers prefer to sit on their portaledges, as well.
DMT
Yup, I have a blue Chouinard one at the bottom of a gear bag somewhere and I don't recall ever using it due to the comfort of modern harnesses.
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Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Apr 15, 2015 - 09:53am PT
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Tamara- Are you writing something in connection with this request for information or are you simply curious?
I have scans of Tom's photos in a working binder for our book which are low resolution so if you need better resolution images I can help with that.
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Barbarian
climber
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Apr 15, 2015 - 10:00am PT
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I was puttering around in the garage last night and came across mine. I thought it had disappeared years ago. I'll take a closer look at it when I get home this evening.
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eeyonkee
Trad climber
Golden, CO
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Apr 15, 2015 - 02:30pm PT
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I was just going to look for a butt bag at Neptune Mountaineering after work today. I've come to realize that, anymore, I get more sore from belaying than just about anything else after a day of climbing. Didn't realize that they were so hard to find. Might be hitting up the Fish.
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Tamara Robbins
climber
not a climber, just related...
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 15, 2015 - 04:23pm PT
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Steve - it's for an upcoming article in Outside, which from what I gather is a broadscope "history of gear innovations" in various sports. These days I am sort of a clearinghouse for media requests of mom and dad....
This one particularly struck my fancy, as the plethora of history related to the various business entities we had has seemed to be of far less interest to others than it is to me! ;)
I think it would be awesome if they ran a page with a compilation of old ads....
Anyhoot, that is what sparked the question - coupled with the fact that I had no idea mom had made the seat or hammock (and also apparently some of first loop ascenders). She even had to be reminded of doing so - it was dad who brought that up when I was inquiring for the article. Gotta love her ;)
Because of my ignorance about these items, throughout the years of sifting and sorting through our archives I'd never payed much mind to pulling aside info on them! Were I in Modesto, could surely find images, etc... but I won't be there before the article deadline.
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k-man
Gym climber
SCruz
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Apr 15, 2015 - 05:54pm PT
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Batrock, yep--Just like that (except red).
Modern harnesses are much better than the swami I fashioned out of 1" tubular (never did get the 2"). But they are nothing compared to sitting comfy in a belay seat.
Obviously not for all routes, but if you plan to hang out for an extended spell while your partner cleans, and then leads some tough pitches, these seats are well worth the extra couple of ounces.
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Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Apr 15, 2015 - 06:00pm PT
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So the list of Robbins products off the top of my head is:
Belay Seat
Two Point Hammock
BOOTS
Galibier Yosemite
Galibier Verappe
Salewa Hollow Carabiner (two versions)
Ropes
Alpelit Ice Axe
Which of these are of interest to you for this article?
The "Can of Worms" thread has several examples but not necessarily the first ad run
Summit magazine was the only game in town until about 1970 and Mountain started a little earlier. Fairly easy to find the first ad run in Summit, Climbing or Mountain for the above products if that would be of use.
Here is the classic Robbins hammock shot from the North American Wall FA in 1964 which pulled out all the stops with respect to innovation. Have Outside contact Tom Frost to arrange for use. This was taken from his website collection of photographs and named Tenement Flat.
http://frostworksclimbing.com/ThumbnailsA.htm
Chuck Pratt took the photo before climbing along the lip of the fearsomely exposed Black Cave to produce "the most spectacular lead in American climbing" in Royal's estimation.
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guido
Trad climber
Santa Cruz/New Zealand/South Pacific
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Apr 15, 2015 - 07:00pm PT
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Hammock design has come a long way from those days of old. Give my best to your parents please Tamara.
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Tamara Robbins
climber
not a climber, just related...
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 15, 2015 - 08:33pm PT
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Thanks everyone! Steve, I'll be in touch... prepping for unexpected guests at moment, and then tomorrow is my Friday so will get back with you then. Much appreciated as always - this forum takes me back to my roots and the people who were part of them.... salut!
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Mark Force
Trad climber
Cave Creek, AZ
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Apr 15, 2015 - 09:50pm PT
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Here are some more pics of the belay seat in use.
Tamara, here is your dad probably sleeping in a hammock your mom made!
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