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Messages 1 - 30 of total 30 in this topic |
originalpmac
Mountain climber
Anywhere I like
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Topic Author's Original Post - Jan 30, 2015 - 09:04pm PT
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The thought came to me recently while sneaking my dog into a hotel that does not allow them. Seems great for flying too, though you would need a letter from a therapist saying that you do need an Emotional Support Animal. Has anyone gone through the steps? Web searching found some useful info, but I am not sure if it is just some way to sell some doggie ID cards. Any thoughts?
Thanks Tacoland!
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Reeotch
climber
4 Corners Area
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Jan 30, 2015 - 09:25pm PT
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Its a slippery slope from an "ESA" to . . .
BEASTIALITY!
Be safe out there . . .
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originalpmac
Mountain climber
Anywhere I like
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Topic Author's Reply - Jan 30, 2015 - 10:07pm PT
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^^^^Reeotch, Bubbles, still laughing here. Seriously though...
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Reeotch
climber
4 Corners Area
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Jan 31, 2015 - 05:03am PT
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Seriously? Seriously???!!!
If you think you need a dog for emotional support, you need some serious help.
What is preventing you from forming emotionally supportive human relationships?
If you are just looking for a way to be allowed to take your stinking cur into public places where dogs are normally banned (and for good reason)then you need to have a little more consideration for your fellow humans who don't like dogs.
Let the dog be a dog. Dogs make lousy shrinks.
BTW, many hotels will allow you to have your dog in your room. But, like I said before, its a slippery slope
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drb
Trad climber
lesargento
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Jan 31, 2015 - 05:07am PT
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girl friend got her dog a regular schnauzer on most airlines by having one of my doctor buddies write a letter on signed stationary saying " GF
has agoraphobia with panic attacks and requires the assistance of her dog for emotional support", some airlines like US airways that is all, make sure to call in advance and make sure is a small dog , none of that orange vest nonsense needed. other airlines are clamping down, and have too many hoops for this scam .
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apogee
climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
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Jan 31, 2015 - 07:10am PT
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Rich, you have a dog, don't you? You used to...seems like I remember one...?
Dogs definitely fill an emotional niche...sure, it's not a replacement for a good, healthy relationship with a human, but it is a great adjunct.
I've thought about getting an ESA cert for my pup- as long as it isn't abused (like getting a blue handicap card so you can park anywhere), it has some attractive advantages.
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Reeotch
climber
4 Corners Area
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Jan 31, 2015 - 07:33am PT
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Yes, I have a dog, Jack. I lost Aussie in 2010, I truly grieved over her, as I'm sure I will when Jack passes on.
My dog has no delusions of being a human. He is not even allowed in the house. I think too many people have an unhealthy attachment to their dogs. They try to elevate them to human status. But, they're DOGS. Let em be dogs! Don't try to make them all soft and weak, like humans. Draw inspiration from their strength and endurance, their ability to focus on a single task until it is done.
Make sure they get lots of exercise, and for God's sake, stop over-feeding your dogs. It shortens their life and causes them to suffer from human-like diseases such as arthritis and cancer.
Let's not take away the legitimacy of service dogs for those who really need them just to satisfy the narcissistic desires of people who are in an arrested state of emotional development.
We have a cat who will not stand for being forced to cuddle and provide an emotional crutch for people. She's only interested in your warm lap and playing/hunting. People are so weak!
P.S. Apogee, you don't need an ESA cert for your pup. You are a well adjusted middle-aged man.
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apogee
climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
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Jan 31, 2015 - 08:32am PT
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I've considered an ESA cert for the advantages of being able to bring my pup places where he would normally be restricted. Of course, I wouldn't bring him anywhere where other people really don't want to have dogs around- don't want to impose him on anyone, for any reason.
Gotta agree with the anthropomorphism that takes place between dogs & humans. They are dogs, not humans. That doesn't mean the relationship can't be a loving, caring relationship, though- but it's going to be under the reality that they are a dog.
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James Wilcox
Trad climber
Goleta/Virginia Lakes
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Jan 31, 2015 - 08:52am PT
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we have 5 rescue animals, 2 dogs, three cats. that said....
I would not enjoy sitting next to someone on a plane with a pet. Nor do I think people should be allowed to buy service vests or certificates on Amazon, permitting them into taking their dog into markets and restaurants. Our neighbor did that. Dog is nice, but has zero training in even basic commands. Dog is like a klik klak when on a leash.
Imho, it takes away from the great work that service dogs for the blind truly do.
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rbord
Boulder climber
atlanta
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Jan 31, 2015 - 09:05am PT
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It's a good idea. Medical marijuana, deflategate, Lance Armstrong says If he had it to do over he would cheat again. Don't think of it as cheating, think of it as moving society forward. Stupid rules. You need this. You deserve it. Praise Jesus!
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Bullwinkle
Boulder climber
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Jan 31, 2015 - 09:07am PT
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It's very simple to get a Service Dog Cert online, i know a few people that have done this. The ADA act does not allow anyone to ask what your disability is or even ask to see the cert so you can take your beast where ever you'd like.
Edit, rather sit next to a dog on a plane than some of the posters on ST. . .Better Company. . .and so much nicer. . .
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Rock!...oopsie.
Trad climber
the pitch above you
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Jan 31, 2015 - 10:18am PT
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This is EXACTLY like the open carry thing for guns. Most people understand that there is a time and place for things, the rest are as#@&%es.
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apogee
climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
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Jan 31, 2015 - 10:22am PT
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As of January 1, it became legal to bring your dog to any California restaurant (outsiding dining area), provided that the access to that dining area is from the outside (not through the restaurant itself).
Much as I love my pup, I really don't think this is a great law. I don't want to dine with dogs around- too many poorly managed dogs around that results in chaos. That's not what I want in a nice meal that I pay for.
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Happiegrrrl2
Trad climber
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Jan 31, 2015 - 10:55am PT
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I used to want to have Teddy certified as a therapy dog so I could bring him to the movies with me. I went, often, and Teddy was a good dog. He would have just curled up on my lap and sat with me.
Teddy would have been GREAT as a therapy dog to visit the sick and old, and the only thing that stopped me was that I knew - beyond a doubt - that he could not pass the "No" command to food. It is one of the tests - a choice bit of food gets dropped, and the handler can give one command only, and the dog must obey and not grab that food. As I said, I knew Teddy would fail, and I chose not to embarrass him - hahah.
Yes, I have issues with forming human bonds. Be thankful those of you who don't.
That said - I always did know it would have been a scam, bringing him to the movies with me. And I have since come to realize that all these people running around with their fake "It's a service dog" with dog's that CLEARLY are not, are as#@&%es.
For those who will insist on insisting their dog is a service dog when it's not. The law does state that service dogs:
Must be trained to perform a specific service. It is with the legal rights for someone granting access to ask what service the dog is trained to do, but they may not ask for "a performance"
Must be under the control of their handler at all times
If the animal is causing others to be uncomfortable, it is legal to ask the person to remove the dog(note: people are generally NOT going to complain about a well-trained service dog, but one that is running around off leash, barking, begging for fun and attention, off playing games with sticks, lifting leg on nearby items... that is NOT a service dog, and people who try to pull off that the dog IS a service dog are as#@&%es, plain and simple. They make it difficult for those who truly DO need and make use of a service animal.)
And yes - those online Orange Vest and Service Dog Emblems are nothing but a scam.
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Lorenzo
Trad climber
Oregon
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Jan 31, 2015 - 12:30pm PT
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Jan 31, 2015 - 09:07am PT
It's very simple to get a Service Dog Cert online, i know a few people that have done this. The ADA act does not allow anyone to ask what your disability is or even ask to see the cert so you can take your beast where ever you'd like.
Edit, rather sit next to a dog on a plane than some of the posters on ST. . .Better Company. . .and so much nicer. . .
You can, however, be asked what service your dog provides. It seems they don't have right to privacy. but you can't be asked to have your animal demonstrate the service.
I'm with you on the preference for seat mates, though.
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Lorenzo
Trad climber
Oregon
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Jan 31, 2015 - 12:34pm PT
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^^^ ( two up) well, in Oregon, there is no state oversight. Service dogs don't have to be licensed or certified for a specific task. They don't need a special collar or vest. The owners need only claim it's a service animal.
Two guys in the Portland area have Service snakes.
One guy claims it detects impending seizures, the other guy says his is for emotional support.
They both wear them around their necks.
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perswig
climber
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Jan 31, 2015 - 12:40pm PT
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Its a slippery slope from an "ESA" to . . .
. . . esé.
Or cholo.
Chuknowhatimean,holmes?
Dale
(toolazytolookupapicoFidowithado-rag)
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originalpmac
Mountain climber
Anywhere I like
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Topic Author's Reply - Jan 31, 2015 - 12:58pm PT
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I certainly have no delusions of my dog being 'human'. I agree that too many people elevate their dogs too much. I used to work as tour guide running dogs in Oregon. Dogs were chained to their houses made from industrial wire spools, 140 of em. At the same time my girlfriend was making a room for her dog under the stairs, with nice soft bedding. Thought it was a funny contrast.
I do have a very intelligent Australian Cattle dog puppy that will stick by my side and obey my commands. And I definitely don't need him for emotional support. Also, not so I can bring him in restaurants. I have worked in the food and beverage biz for a loooongg time and that sh#t always annoyed me. I was just thinking for hotels and airlines.
I would rather sit next to a well behaved dog on a flight then some screaming baby anytime.
Also, Reeotch, don't assume from my original post that I actually need the dog for emotional support or that I lack the innate social skills to develop emotionally supportive relationships with others. I have lots of really, really good friends. My friends are my family.
On a side note I was bar tending a really busy night, like five deep around the bar, everyone yelling for booze and I see this guy walk in with a dog. I yell over the crowd, "Get that fvcking dog out of here!" My buddy working the door looks at me, points at his eyes and shakes his head. He's blind, dumbass! Whoops. Certainly wasn't deaf. This beers on me.
Cheers ya'll!
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujò de la Playa
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Jan 31, 2015 - 01:07pm PT
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Get yourself a mail order sheriff's badge. (look on the internet).
With your newly acquired authority, certify your dog as a police dog.
Bring his passport with you when traveling.
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dave729
Trad climber
Western America
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Jan 31, 2015 - 01:10pm PT
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Interesting how primitive as a race we humans still are.
Requiring set piece playacting with a lower species to adjust our emotional state.
I just rescued a few packs of hotdogs from the store and I'm in heaven!
Sick!
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Reeotch
climber
4 Corners Area
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Jan 31, 2015 - 01:28pm PT
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Dogs can definitely be better companions than people. I think it is because of their unconditional style of love.
I took a solo backpack trip over Thanksgiving, just Jack and I.
And, yes, I felt less insecure with Jack by my side. Except when I had to save him from drowning when he punched through the ice in the middle of the creek!
Edit: originalpmac, don't take my abrasive brand of humor too seriously;)
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originalpmac
Mountain climber
Anywhere I like
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Topic Author's Reply - Jan 31, 2015 - 01:35pm PT
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Oh trust me Reeotch, I am still laughing about the slippery slope. Hilarious
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originalpmac
Mountain climber
Anywhere I like
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Topic Author's Reply - Jan 31, 2015 - 02:36pm PT
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Kinda brings a whole new meaning to the term 'sh!t eating grin'
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James Wilcox
Trad climber
Goleta/Virginia Lakes
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Jan 31, 2015 - 02:41pm PT
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one cat's litter box is another dog's buffet table. Ugh!
Teach the dog to sniff bombs. They can sit on my lap while flying! :)
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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Jan 31, 2015 - 02:59pm PT
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Cut to the chase.
What the OP is saying is that he want's a pass on lying for his convenience.
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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Jan 31, 2015 - 03:10pm PT
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The things that is ultimately tragic about this sort of thing (fakes), is that it creates a bias against real working dogs, and their owners.
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Reeotch
climber
4 Corners Area
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Jan 31, 2015 - 05:32pm PT
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Again, I sincerely apologize to any of you who had my dog (pictured above) piss all over your climbing gear. It just means he thinks you're cool . . .
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Jan 31, 2015 - 09:26pm PT
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hey there say, ken m...
i go by this thought too:
The things that is ultimately tragic about this sort of thing (fakes), is that it creates a bias against real working dogs, and their owners.
there are very serious needs for service dogs, and folks that 'fake it' add up, and make a lot of extra 'bad reception' for those that need them...
blind,
deaf, hard hearing,
and seizures,
are some of the well-known reasons, of course...
oops, edit:
the emotional support, issues are newer:
but my friend's service-dog
(she had her dog go through a program, for a certificate)
DID this kind of work, in private type hospitals, etc, nursing homes, and senior centers... (IT WAS not for her emotional support)...
her dog could travel by bus, train, plain, etc, to GET to these
folks that used her dog for some SERIOUS emotional pains,
that these folks were getting over...
or, for neglected elders, that could not have a dog for themselves...
i have not learned much about who, or how, individuals,
though, USE the dog for themselves, in public settings, yet...
:)
and
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