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Bushman
Social climber
In this form at present
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‘Our Narrow View’
The unisex gods shooting arrows,
To prick your ire,
From up yon' condo remodel,
Who's who the husband wife?
When deities bear human strife,
And argue window dressing or furniture,
The correct way to live your life,
Is judged by none we would perceive,
No different than you or me.
-Bushman
02/05/2014
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John M
climber
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God is never ever female.
God is eternally, male.
huh.. didn't know that you believed that Werner. What teachings does that come from?
My belief:
God is Male and Female in balance. Each part has a different role, yet both can do both in fullness, which is the eternal and infinite nature of God.
in the material world. Spirit is male.. its expression in the physical is female. Ones higher Self is Male, ones lower self is Female. When one reaches their highest potential in the physical one take direction and life force from the Higher Male Self and brings it forth into the physical through the lower female self. thus bringing God into the physical. This teaching can get twisted to mean the female is lower in essence, but this is a misunderstanding. The female aspect is equal, she just has a different role. The male role is to direct. The female role is to Be More.
Expanding on that.. each human has a male and female nature. Depending on which body one takes on in a lifetime, that nature is expressed through the body in the balance of Males= 60 percent male and 40 percent female. Females are 60 percent female and 40 percent male. Problems arise when one gets away from this balance.
For a male who does not honor his female aspect, this leads to heartlessness as the mind is male and the heart is female. There are of course many other ways for an unbalanced being to present itself. Another way for a male to be unbalanced is to have too much heart, this comes from the false belief that everything is love. This person tries to love everything and thus can't or won't stand up to evil.
For the female who does not honor her male aspect, she can be weak, lacking intelligence, and needing a male to make her worthwhile. We see plenty of those in this world. One of the things I love about the climbing community is how strong the women are. They honor their physical strength which is a male aspect while at the same time keeping their heart center. Its awesome to see.
The interplay between the male and female aspects of God are called creation. Life does not exist without both.
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Jan
Mountain climber
Colorado, Nepal & Okinawa
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The above eastern definitions of God are a big improvement on the Abrahamic formulations but they are still anthropocentric and mysogenist.I'll go with Einstein's God who is above and beyond all that.Even Jesus said there is no marrying or giving of marriage in heaven as though it were a place where people got beyond gender.
And what are you going to do with transgender people? Many tribes in this world have thought they were wiser than either male or female because they comprised both and they were exalted accordingly. Wouldn't this apply to God also?
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MH2
Boulder climber
Andy Cairns
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I remember a student of the subject calling sports 'ritualized combat'. When I check the definition of ritual, religion figures prominently. However, this definition seems to fit the Super Bowl, too:
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John M
climber
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because they comprised both
that is what I said Jan
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WBraun
climber
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Everyone in the material world is actually female.
There are no males in the material worlds except for God Almighty himself.
You are all 0wned and subordinate with limitations on quantity.
Only God is complete with all quantity.
There is no misogyny only poor fund of knowledge of God himself ......
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Jan
Mountain climber
Colorado, Nepal & Okinawa
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Just listen to you guys. Only the male is complete, all the rest are incomplete females. And then there are the protestations that we are equal really except the male is higher and the female is lower and when the male doesn't live up to his role great evil happens in the world but when a female doesn't live up to her role, she needs a male to make her worthwhile. How would we ever guess that those scriptures were written by males?
If you're going to follow this model, at least the Taoist notion of Yin and Yang comprising the complete Tao does a better job of getting us away from human bodies and anthropocentric concepts. As both Buddhism and Taoism have noted, a personal God has major problems in retaining an image that doesn't get degraded to the anthropocentric.
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Jan
Mountain climber
Colorado, Nepal & Okinawa
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And meanwhile I am troubled by DMT's observations that the U.S. could be compared to Sparta with its god of war. Certainly it is in the interests of the politicians and the 1 % to foster such a state while preserving their own sons from the battle.
Athena the leader of the artistic and intellectual Athenians was of course female and it is their ideals that we glorify with lip service to at least, not those of Sparta. Perhaps the current elevation of science and technology over the humanities shows that Sparta is winning after all?
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MikeL
Social climber
Seattle, WA
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I’m surprised that Paul hasn’t weighed in recently on the topics.
I’ll make a paltry effort.
All the artifacts of culture provide impetus and meaning to everyone's everyday life. Ritual, ceremony, symbols, gods and goddesses, charisma, representations of any sort, folklore, myths, narratives, and art of any kind are all placeholders and references for things that are important to us that cannot be put into words.
Broadly and boldly stated, no person can live without them, for to live without them would be to lose one’s place and being. Birthdays, graduations, clothing, practices, any form of entertainment, roles, names, places that we call our own, etc. are all necessary. Sure, you may give up one (e.g., a religion or notion of spirit), but you can’t give them all up without destroying who and what you are. (In that, there may be real salvation, though.)
It appears to be impossible to be a human being and strictly reasonable and rational. (What would that look like?)
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WBraun
climber
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Buddhism was completely defeated by Caitanya Mahaprabhu in the famous debates with the Shankaras.
You need to go much much deeper.
You're misogynist interpretations are material mistakes .....
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John M
climber
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You are getting hung up on words Jan..
Male and Female are equal in my explanation. higher doesn't mean better. Its not an easy subject to explain. For instance, my teacher has said I originated as the female aspect of the twin flame creation. This does not make me less or more as I am now in a male body. We interchange bodies in order to understand how the different energies work and how to balance them.
This world is certainly unbalanced towards male energy. But everything is energy and thus has nothing to do with who is better. That is a humanistic perspective. Is a negative ion greater then a positive ion? Of course not. For life to work, both are required.
On this forum there is no way to adequately explain male and female energy. I have spent nearly 20 years trying to understand it from a spiritual perspective, and yet it is still difficult to do.
And by the way.. My guru is a woman. Her guru was a woman. Further back her guru was a man. And his guru was a woman. It matters not what body we have. We are all aspects of God.
It is the fallen nature of mankind that has lost the deeper understanding of the interplay of male and female energy.
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Byran
climber
San Jose, CA
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Male and Female are equal in my explanation. You said "For the female who does not honor her male aspect, she can be weak, lacking intelligence, and needing a male to make her worthwhile" which seems to me like you're claiming strength, intelligence and independence to be male characteristics. A couple sentences later you state more directly that climber chicks rock because "they honor their physical strength which is a male aspect".
Then there's the whole male/female ratios of energy, which at 60/40 for men and 40/60 for women, seems to imply that men are 50% stronger, more intelligent, and independent than women? Or am I missing something?
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Tvash
climber
Seattle
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Reason leads to atheism - an unwillingness to buy fantastic claims purely 'on faith'.
The 'this famous person believed' tact is a loser, of course, and not just because those who attempt to wield it never fail to fudge the data for a desired outcome. This doesn't necessarily degrade a fundamentalist's credibility - that Einstein was God fearing doesn't even register as incredible compared to Invisible Sky Kingdom and all the rest.
But, in the end, who cares what Einstein's religiosity or lack thereof was? That informs another individual's choice in the matter not at all - we all share the same data set from which each of us is perfectly capable of accepting or rejection the hypothesis of omniscient, omnipotent Eternal Guy in the Sky.
Even if a side glance at The Great Man were necessary for each of us to make an informed God/No God call, need we mention how wide of the mark that Great Man was on quantum physics throughout most of his life? Yup, smart people get things wrong, too.
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John M
climber
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Hey Bryan.. There is more then one kind of strength. Physical strength is enhanced by testosterone. Testosterone is a male energy. If physical strength is the only way one measures what is better, then yes, males have an advantage. Thankfully physical strength is not the only form of strength.
It is a very difficult subject to broach as words are easily misconstrued. Though Werner has said that I am good at explaining spiritual truths in laymen's terms, I'm afraid I'm failing on this subject. Hopefully no one will think too harshly of me. I fully believe that male and female energy are equal. I just also accept that they produce different things and are used differently. It makes me very sad that in this world we have put down the feminine energy. That is probably the most destructive form of evil in this world.
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Tvash
climber
Seattle
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Ah, the whole 'Does the One in Charge have a Dick or Not?' thing.
So much simpler when one recognizes the question itself is a fiction and therefore nonsense.
What is the true nature of male versus female?
Get to know one and find out for yourself.
YMMV.
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Jan
Mountain climber
Colorado, Nepal & Okinawa
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John, it is a difficult subject since each English word is laden with so much baggage. We are agreed however, that "It matters not what body we have. We are all aspects of God".
As for Werner's interpretations, it is really a joy to see someone with such a deep understanding of the Indian philsophical tradition. We have however, chosen different paths within that tradition. I believe this reflects our individual personalities more than anything.Of course you will no doubt disagree.
And speaking of cultural baggage, no religion has more of it than Hinduism in all of its fascinating and repulsive splendor.
Did you know that at the wedding ceremony of high caste Hindus, the bride washes the groom's feet and then sips some of the foot water to show her subservience? I've seen this myself.
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John M
climber
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We have however, chosen different paths within that tradition. I believe this reflects our individual personalities more than anything.Of course you will no doubt disagree.
I'm not certain why you would think that I would disagree. I fully agree that personality plays a role in our decision making process. Thats why its so important to fully understand ones personality in order to see where ones weaknesses can lead one astray.
Did you know that at the wedding ceremony of high caste Hindus, the bride washes the groom's feet and then sips some of the foot water to show her subservience? I've seen this myself.
plenty of ugliness out there. The caste system is one of them.
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WBraun
climber
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Indian philosophical tradition.
Vedic/vedas have nothing to do with Hinduism nor are they limited to Indian or India.
The entire planet was originally vedic.
Listen to the original American Indian chants and you'll see.
There's absolutely nothing Hindu or Hinduism in any Vedic knowledge.
Poor fund of knowledge makes one think that.
The word Hindu is not found anywhere in Vedanta.
It's a Muslim word made up because they couldn't pronounce the Sindhu river correctly.
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Listen to the original American Indian chants and you'll see.
Man, now that's what you call a serious projection.
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MikeL
Social climber
Seattle, WA
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Jan: . . . it is really a joy to see someone with such a deep understanding of the Indian philsophical tradition.
What a wonderful thing to say! Beautiful.
THE DRAMA OF DRAMAS
My wife has been taken with recent TV epics that are the rage these days on cable. Very dramatic, current, and complicated. “They are such interesting and powerful dramas—and in every single episode!” she says.
I think to myself: "yeah, sure—but look at real life. Each and every one of those identities think they really are that person!”
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