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FreeCoffee
Trad climber
Joshua Tree, CA
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Topic Author's Original Post - May 2, 2014 - 04:50pm PT
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As some of you already know, a climber was caught bolting in JTNP Wilderness in February 2014.
In JTNP Wilderness replacing bolts does not require a permit, but new bolts do. http://www.nps.gov/jotr/planyourvisit/fixed_anchors.htm
This climber did not have a permit and did not realize he was in designated wilderness. He established his route with a hand-drill from the ground up.
Since February, and and on his own accord, the climber pulled and patched his route.
Today, in court, he pleaded guilty to a Class B Misdemeanor. The max penalty could have been 6 months and / or $5000 fine. Instead, the judge went with the recommendation of the arresting officer and the fines amounted to $135.
The Wilderness boundaries in Joshua Tree National Park aren't always obvious. For example, the upper tiers of Saddle Rock are designated Wilderness while Walk on the Wild Side is considered non-wilderness. As climbers, especially climbers looking to establish new routes, it is your responsibility to know where these boundaries are and to acquire the proper permit before permanently altering the rock. About 94% of JTNP is in the Wilderness.
And on a side note, there are over 8,000 established routes already in the Park. How about we replace more of those old manky bolts and bring some routes back to life?
Bernadette Regan
JT Climbing Ranger
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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All this without one hint of the militia. Admirable.
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Elcapinyoazz
Social climber
Joshua Tree
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So name them. It's a matter of public record.
How about we replace more of those old manky bolts
We? Out of curiosity, how many have you personally replaced this season?
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mtnyoung
Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
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It sounds like all three parties (NPS, the climber and the judge) reacted fairly and proportionately.
I sympathize with the climber for not knowing (and yes, I think he/she really didn't know).
But FreeCoffee does have a legitimate point: in Joshua Tree, in the modern age, would-be first ascentionists have to be be careful about how and where they're putting in routes.
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FreeCoffee
Trad climber
Joshua Tree, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - May 2, 2014 - 05:28pm PT
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"Out of curiosity, how many have you personally replaced this season?"
I'd have to ask KP, who keeps a proper log, but I'd guess I've helped replace around 30 bolts this season. How about you?
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Elcapinyoazz
Social climber
Joshua Tree
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Seventeen.
Now who got popped?
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FreeCoffee
Trad climber
Joshua Tree, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - May 2, 2014 - 05:36pm PT
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I'm sure there are more people than just me who will appreciate the seventeen bolts you replaced. Thank you.
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chill
climber
between the flat part and the blue wobbly thing
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FreeCoffee
I'd guess I've helped replace around 30 bolts this season. How about you?
Elcapinyoazz
Seventeen
FreeCoffee wins pissing contest. Congrats.
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overwatch
climber
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Where did it occur, Saddle Rock? So the guy was arrested? Any more details? I am obviously not one of the "in the know".
Thanks for the bolt replacement
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mtnyoung
Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
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FreeCoffee wins pissing contest. Congrats.
The climbing public wins from the 47 bolts that they've replaced.
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Elcapinyoazz
Social climber
Joshua Tree
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How 'bout you "Chill", how many have you replaced this year? Stainless fatties ain't free brah.
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mtnyoung
Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
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Pissing contest? Sounds to me like they're flirting.
Not so sure Dave. Elcapinyoazz has never struck me as the type to flirt.
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chill
climber
between the flat part and the blue wobbly thing
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How 'bout you "Chill", how many have you replaced? Stainless fatties ain't free brah.
I haven't replaced any. I drilled a few 1/4 inchers about 30 years ago and it made me tired.
I do appreciate the hard work of others.
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mhay
climber
Bishop, CA
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Thank you both for the bolt replacement. Now about those cracks that need some bolts....
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clinker
Trad climber
Santa Cruz, California
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He should have used a power drill and cut down on time to make a quick escape.
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mtnyoung
Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
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He should have used a power drill and cut down on time to make a quick escape.
Clink, no-one here knows who you are and they don't know that you're joking.
I know him (I admit it) and I can assure the Supertopo public that, while Clink does put in bolts, he does it ONLY on lead, and ONLY by hand (and for that matter, he only bolts from stance, not from hooks and the like). And he doesn't bolt in Joshua Tree.
Sh#t man, comments like that are going to cause an explosion of unneeded, unwanted indignity here. Be more careful.
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clinker
Trad climber
Santa Cruz, California
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Sh#t man, comments like that are going to cause an explosion of unneeded, unwanted indignity here. Be more careful.
Your right, wilderness power drill bolters should be buried with their drill on site. Deep enough to not end up as food for local wildlife.
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clinker
Trad climber
Santa Cruz, California
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Ron A, where have you been? Were you the bolter, incarcerated?.
Tried my best to keep things interesting during the interim.
Glad your back
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mucci
Trad climber
The pitch of Bagalaar above you
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Your right, wilderness power drill bolters should be buried with their drill on site. Deep enough to not end up as food for local wildlife.
Deep, sooo Deep.
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Mungeclimber
Trad climber
Nothing creative to say
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can totally appreciate the difficulty of knowing where a boundary is, especially in areas where maps conflict.
freecoffee, do you have an online map that can be posted to show the boundaries in JT, and how to go about permitting?
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FreeCoffee
Trad climber
Joshua Tree, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - May 2, 2014 - 07:11pm PT
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You have a few options for maps/figuring out if you're in the Wilderness:
(about 94% of the park is designated wilderness)
1) Free option: Ask for a Climbing and Bouldering Brochure next time you drive through the West Entrance. There is a map of the heart of the park with the Wilderness Boundaries.
2) Use the National Geographic Map that is sold in town. The trails aren't always accurate, but the Wilderness Boundary is.
3) Use the Park's website if the formation has had a name for awhile. http://www.nps.gov/jotr/planyourvisit/routes.htm
4) Still unsure, take a GPS point, send it to me, and I'll let you know.
The permit process is outlined on the website: http://www.nps.gov/jotr/planyourvisit/fixed_anchors.htm
Last spring, a local actually applied for and received a permit to bolt in the Wilderness. So, yes, it is possible. It took about a month, maybe 6 weeks.
Thanks for your questions.
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overwatch
climber
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you didn't answer mine but thanks anyway
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Michelle
Social climber
1187 Hunterwasser
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Wait, Ron's back?
Sounds like all parties acted like adults to resolve a potentially explosive situation. We need more reasonableness.
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mtnyoung
Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
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...(about 94% of the park is designated wilderness)
Any idea how much of that 94% contains rocks? In other words, are there any percentages to show how much of the (rock-filled) climbing areas are in wilderness? Vast parts of that 94% are irrelevant to this discussion.
Just curious.
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L
climber
California dreamin' on the farside of the world..
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This is such a nice thread.
Everyone is being so reasonable.
But I would like to know what you guys have against the local coyote population, when a burial just inches below the top soil could feed a litter of six for weeks...
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rlf
Trad climber
Josh, CA
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I think it should be made public who it was, and where this person was bolting.
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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it wasn't Jerry he was at the beach
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Ed Hartouni
Trad climber
Livermore, CA
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is there a boundary .klm file? or a GPS download for the boundary?
that might help...
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Greg Barnes
climber
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Some of the USGS maps had (have?) some Wilderness boundaries incorrectly located - a funny example was at Split Rocks where it zigzagged all over (it even included the road in Wilderness!).
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Mungeclimber
Trad climber
Nothing creative to say
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Freecoffee,
Thx.
With regard to gps coordinates, can the source against which you would check be provided to the public?
Greg, great point!
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
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Seems like the thread title should be "bolter takes responsibility" instead of "pleads guilty." Good on whoever this was. Both a ground up hand drilled FA and a patch job? Strong work.
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Tan Slacks
climber
Joshua Tree
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I think it should be made public who it was, and where this person was bolting.
Robert I am pretty sure you know him. He does not post here and it was in an area not frequented by many non-locals.
Talk to you soon
Edit
I agree that it seems like everyone involved played fairly and the climber took responsibility. Good on em.
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mike m
Trad climber
black hills
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Can you drill holes in wilderness if you don't up bolts in them. Perhaps using rb's.
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GDavis
Social climber
SOL CAL
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Can you confirm that the alleged culprit was wearing painters pants and smoking a 50/50?
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rlf
Trad climber
Josh, CA
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I concur as well Dan. I just think it should be out in the open. I also think that an equitable end result was achieved.
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Spider Savage
Mountain climber
The shaggy fringe of Los Angeles
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Bernadette - Thank you yet again for suffering your government job to represent us - the climbing community (of which you are definitley more one of us than them).
From free coffee, to keeping us updated on this forum, your work helps preserve quality climbing for now and the future.
There is certainly plenty of climbing for everyone.
I very much appreciate seeing rocks, not bristling with bolts and fixed gear.
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pyro
Big Wall climber
Calabasas
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And on a side note, there are over 8,000 established routes already in the Park. How about we replace more of those old manky bolts and bring some routes back to life?
wow! 8k that's more climbing than one man's life can handle
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| Messages 1 - 38 of total 38 in this topic |
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