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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Topic Author's Original Post - Apr 28, 2014 - 11:51am PT
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Donald Sterling, the racist owner of The LA Clippers, must be forced to sell the team.
A million dollar fine means nothing to a billionaire. A little suspension won't hurt him either.
But if he tries to retain ownership of the team, and black men won't sign or renew contracts with the Clippers, he's in trouble.
"It bothers me a lot that you want to broadcast that you’re associating with black people," he is heard saying. "Do you have to?"
Stiviano says that all she did was take a picture with someone she admires. "I think the fact that you admire [Magic] -- I've known him well, and he should be admired," Sterling replies. "And I'm just saying that it's too bad you can't admire him privately. And during your ENTIRE F*#KING LIFE, your whole life, admire him -- bring him here, feed him, f*#k him, I don't care. You can do anything. But don't put him on an Instagram for the world to see so they have to call me. And don't bring him to my games. OK?"
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
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Apr 28, 2014 - 11:53am PT
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I don't see how the NBA can maintain legitimacy if they don't force him out. A fine just puts a price on being racist.
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 28, 2014 - 11:57am PT
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Magic Johnson has heard Sterling's alleged comments, and he's not pleased. "It's a shame that Donald Sterling feels that way about African-Americans," he told TMZ. "He has a team full of amazing African-American basketball players that are working to bring a championship to Clippers fans. The Clippers also have a strong minority fan base."
Sterling has long had a reputation for racism. The Clippers owner and real estate mogul settled a lawsuit confidentially in 2005 that accused him of discriminating against black and Hispanic tenants at properties he owned. He paid $2.7 million in response to another housing discrimination lawsuit in 2009. Sterling and his wife denied wrongdoing and said the settlement was not an admission of guilt, according to the LA Times.
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John Duffield
Mountain climber
New York
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Apr 28, 2014 - 11:58am PT
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Seems very strange. He doesn't mind her banging African American ball players but he objects if she brings one to the game? None of this sounds right.
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 28, 2014 - 12:01pm PT
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But one of Sterling's top property supervisors, Summer Davenport, gave some damning testimony about him in response to the first discrimination suit, according to depositions obtained by ESPN:
When Sterling first bought the Ardmore, he remarked on its odor to Davenport. "That's because of all the blacks in this building, they smell, they're not clean," he said, according to Davenport's testimony. "And it's because of all of the Mexicans that just sit around and smoke and drink all day." He added: "So we have to get them out of here." Shortly after, construction work caused a serious leak at the complex. When Davenport surveyed the damage, she found an elderly woman, Kandynce Jones, wading through several inches of water in Apartment 121. Jones was paralyzed on the right side and legally blind. She took medication for high blood pressure and to thin a clot in her leg. Still, she was remarkably cheerful, showing Davenport pictures of her children, even as some of her belongings floated around her.
Jones had repeatedly walked to the apartment manager's office to plead for assistance, according to sworn testimony given by her daughter Ebony Jones in the Housing Rights Center case. Kandynce Jones' refrigerator dripped, her dishwasher was broken, and her apartment was always cold. Now it had flooded. Davenport reported what she saw to Sterling, and according to her testimony, he asked: "Is she one of those black people that stink?" When Davenport told Sterling that Jones wanted to be reimbursed for the water damage and compensated for her ruined property, he replied: "I am not going to do that. Just evict the bitch."
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Apr 28, 2014 - 12:07pm PT
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The fact that no one on his team stood up for him is telling.
And what a hypocrite. His young black girlfriend couldn't bring friends of her own "race" to games?
I put "race" in quotes because it's about time we all become color blind.
This oaf and Bundy. Two of a kind.
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WBraun
climber
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Apr 28, 2014 - 12:08pm PT
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Donald Sterling sounds like a very cruel person period ......
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 28, 2014 - 12:40pm PT
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He doesn't mind her banging African American ball players but he objects if she brings one to the game? None of this sounds right.
Actually it sounds exactly right. He's sugar coating it for her because she's a mixed race woman and he's trying to keep all the juggling balls in the air with a woman who's not his wife.
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couchmaster
climber
pdx
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Apr 28, 2014 - 12:48pm PT
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Kick him out. And it caused the NAACP to reconsider and not give him the award they were going to give him too, that has to hurt.
..oooooh, and regarding the "girlfriend" (it is questionable if the word "friend" should be in there next to "girl" as there is current litigation): he clearly overpaid.
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
mammoth lakes ca
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Apr 28, 2014 - 12:48pm PT
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Little bit of irony going on here...The NBA is marketing it's brand name to the hispanic community by having the teams wear spanish worded jerseys...Los Lakers or choose whichever team you like... then there's Sterling making a profit off of the facade until he gets caught with his foot in his mouth..Oops...No suprise or shock going on there...
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Skeptimistic
Mountain climber
La Mancha
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Apr 28, 2014 - 12:50pm PT
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The things he said were in the privacy of his own home and not on a public forum. In America we have this thing called the First Amendment which allows citizens of this country to hold & express utterly repugnant opinions. We have become so hypersensitive and reactionary to any opinion that doesn't fit our world view. If you don't like his views, then don't support his business. But forcing him to sell the team is a direct assault on the principles that made our country strong.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Apr 28, 2014 - 12:51pm PT
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But, couchmaster, I doubt he overpaid if she uses his money to have her eyesight fixed.
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SicMic
climber
across the street from Marshall, CO
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Apr 28, 2014 - 12:55pm PT
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I may not like the guy or his "supposed" opinions, but he gets to hold whatever hateful perspective he wants.
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 28, 2014 - 12:56pm PT
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But forcing him to sell the team is a direct assault on the principles that made our country strong.
What principles are those? Slavery? Genocide? Forced relocation?
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Alpamayo
Trad climber
Sacramento, CA
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Apr 28, 2014 - 12:57pm PT
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I may not like the guy or his "supposed" opinions, but he gets to hold whatever hateful perspective he wants.
Yes, and the NBA, as a private organization, gets to decide what is acceptable behavior for its owners.
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Fat Dad
Trad climber
Los Angeles, CA
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Apr 28, 2014 - 12:59pm PT
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^^^
I agree. What Sterling said was offensive, and we are free to draw our own conclusions about the man based upon what he said, but it's a free country and, to paragraph Larry Flynt, the 1st Amendment grants him the right to be offensive. You may not like it, but there are both benefits and burdens to being in a free society.
Also, for all those who are mortally offended by Sterling's comments, where is a outrage over the misogyny and homophobia in rap and hip hop lyrics? The language there is actually far worse than Sterling's comments, which did not include racial epithets, threats of violence, etc. I don't see public floggings called for in these instances. Again, that's not to defend Donald Sterling. He seems like a total A-hole. However, either we have to hold our noses and deal with it, or you have to take a much broader approach to what limits you should impose on your right to express yourself.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Apr 28, 2014 - 12:59pm PT
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Skeptimistic, perhaps you are unaware of how the NBA works. It is like a
restaurant franchise chain and they can jerk yer franchise whenever they
damn please, especially if you ain't servin' the chitlins with a smile.
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climbski2
Mountain climber
Anchorage AK, Reno NV
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Apr 28, 2014 - 01:06pm PT
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There sure is a lot of confusion about the first amendment. All it says is the government cannot come arrest him or shut his business down for what he said.
The rest of us citizens are welcome to do as we please on those fronts. If I were the NBA there is no way I would let that guy anywhere near an event in the future .. let alone hold a franchise.
86d off the deepend forever.
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
mammoth lakes ca
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Apr 28, 2014 - 01:08pm PT
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One thing is certain for Sterling...His toupe can't hide his red-neck...
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 28, 2014 - 01:12pm PT
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Funny how it's ok for him to be seen in public with a woman of color, half his age, who's not his wife, but not ok for her to post a picture of herself with Magic Johnson.
Edit: Uh oh, someone's deleting posts already!
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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Apr 28, 2014 - 01:15pm PT
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But if he tries to retain ownership of the team, and black men won't sign or renew contracts with the Clippers, he's in trouble.
That will never happen, but he's already in trouble.
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Elcapinyoazz
Social climber
Joshua Tree
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Apr 28, 2014 - 01:19pm PT
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He can hold whatever repugnant, ignorant ass beliefs he wants to.
But he cannot continue to be associated with the private entity that is the NBA. If they do not force him to sell, they are allowing massive damage to their brand.
Given that being an NBA owner is kind of like owning a house in the most exclusive neighborhood in the nation, and people always vastly overpay for the franchise because of that (when considering ROI), and add the fact that it's in LA...there will be no shortage of the 1% lining up to take it off his hands at a respectable fee.
Biggest shame is that this sh#t is overshadowing what is probably the best year the Clippers have ever had.
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couchmaster
climber
pdx
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Apr 28, 2014 - 01:22pm PT
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Skeptimistic said: "If you don't like his views, then don't support his business. But forcing him to sell the team is a direct assault on the principles that made our country strong." That's exactly what's happening man. This is the principles which our country has. The players, coaches and fans who abor those kind of bullshit comments (the majority of us) will all be gone and there will be 6 guys with pointy white hats and you sitting in the stands as paying customers. Thus, the NBA, a private organization set up to enrich the owners, will defend it's brand and opportunity to make money by dealing with this dude. Capitolism at it's finest and at work. You should be supportive. The system works.
"But, couchmaster, I doubt he overpaid if she uses his money to have her eyesight fixed." Yeah I'm with ya on that Reilly, seeing that dude's photo I'm thinking that New World Order might possibly be onto something with the lizard people thing, she clearly was not banging him for his looks. I'll admit to some ageism here too, when the 84 year old Leopard-spotted Hefner (whom I otherwise have respect for) was banging those 3 20 year oldish young blond beauties on TV, it gave me the creeps and I was unable to watch. It was interesting to me that the 3 girls whom I had found so attractive perilously when viewed in photos, became unattractive to the extreme just from watching that show. Part of it might have been all the flaws revealed in the girls...but brrrrrr, who watches old people porn? Anyone into that? Didn't think so.
"Also, for all those who are mortally offended by Sterling's comments, where is a outrage over the misogyny and homophobia in rap and hip hop lyrics? The language there is actually far worse than Sterling's comments, which did not include racial epithets, threats of violence, etc. I don't see public floggings called for in these instances. Again, that's not to defend Donald Sterling. He seems like a total A-hole. However, either we have to hold our noses and deal with it, or you have to take a much broader approach to what limits you should impose on your right to express yourself. "
I have condemned it verbally, educated my kids about that and don't support it personally. Suspect that would be a common response to your point, which is neither here nor there.
Sicmic said: "I may not like the guy or his "supposed" opinions, but he gets to hold whatever hateful perspective he wants. " And we all get to hold our views, which is to universally condemn and not support these kinds of views. Dude wants to sit at home and grouse, have at it. If he says it to me directly, I'll tell him back directly, and that's whats going on here. People are expressing themselves and condemning this racist bullcrap.
BTW, it's not been proven it is the rich ugly dude saying such things. But it appears to be so, certainly in the court of public opinion, and that's where it counts.
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AKDOG
Mountain climber
Anchorage, AK
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Apr 28, 2014 - 01:23pm PT
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The things he said were in the privacy of his own home and not on a public forum. In America we have this thing called the First Amendment which allows citizens of this country to hold & express utterly repugnant opinions. We have become so hypersensitive and reactionary to any opinion that doesn't fit our world view. If you don't like his views, then don't support his business. But forcing him to sell the team is a direct assault on the principles that made our country strong.
This has nothing to do with the first amendment. There is no crime here, except maybe his girlfriend secretly recording the conversation of a rich moron without his permission.
The best thing that could happen would be for no one to show up for the next Clippers-Warriors game in LA. Empty stands would be an awesome response.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Apr 28, 2014 - 01:28pm PT
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Yes, and the NBA, as a private organization, gets to decide what is acceptable behavior for its owners. Exactly
The NBA is a profit making business. They've got their brand to protect and Sterling has put a major blight on the brand. They might not care about his racism at all (or maybe they do) but they're sure going to ditch him, as they have the legal right to do.
They'll have a full scale strike on their hands if the don't.
Not that I give a rat's arse about NBA basketball either. All I see is a slugfest wrestling match. I'd rather watch college basketball any day.
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 28, 2014 - 01:33pm PT
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Twas me... I realized I don't give a sh#t about professional cheatball.
That's cool. You do however, care about racism. Peace.
Yes, he has a right to free speech. But being a racist is still wrong, and we are free to say so.
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Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
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Apr 28, 2014 - 01:34pm PT
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Don't mess with Magic Johnson in L.A. He's the closest thing to a Saint L.A. has.
He owns Fatburger. That'd be enough right there to be sainted if he were Catholic.
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philo
Trad climber
Is that light the end of the tunnel or a train?
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Apr 28, 2014 - 01:38pm PT
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I think he should be forced to shower with the team.
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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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Apr 28, 2014 - 01:39pm PT
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The best thing that could happen would be for no one to show up for the next Clippers-Warriors game in LA. Empty stands would be an awesome response.
yep
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couchmaster
climber
pdx
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Apr 28, 2014 - 01:41pm PT
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Chaz said: "He owns Fatburger. That'd be enough right there to be sainted if he were Catholic." The guy who owns fatburger corporate Chaz, (not just an individual franchise or several like Magic and others) is a convicted thief (Andrew Weiderhorn) who has screwed up many peoples lives. Magic, and all of us, should run from that guy.
I'm in condemning mode today it appears....
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philo
Trad climber
Is that light the end of the tunnel or a train?
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Apr 28, 2014 - 01:46pm PT
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To the showers with him for a good ol' soap down.
He can be the spokesman for Mr Bubble.
Even cleans racists.
Well in his case maybe they should use Scrubbing Bubbles.
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
mammoth lakes ca
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Apr 28, 2014 - 01:57pm PT
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No one is showing up for the the Lakers playoff game so the protest is already beginning to work....
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philo
Trad climber
Is that light the end of the tunnel or a train?
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Apr 28, 2014 - 02:03pm PT
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His advertising sponsors are bailing on him like rats from a sinking ship.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Apr 28, 2014 - 02:04pm PT
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RJ, yer a cruel man, but lite compared to The New Donald. Werk on it!
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blahblah
Gym climber
Boulder
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Apr 28, 2014 - 02:12pm PT
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There sure is a lot of confusion about the first amendment. All it says is the government cannot come arrest him or shut his business down for what he said.
The rest of us citizens are welcome to do as we please on those fronts. If I were the NBA there is no way I would let that guy anywhere near an event in the future .. let alone hold a franchise.
Not sure what the legal position of the NBA is re: forcing him to sell the team. I agree that talking about "First Amendment Rights" is basically misplaced--this doesn't relate to the First Amendment, at least as I see it, because the government isn't involved.
I'm sure there are detailed agreements between the NBA and its owners, and that's what we'd need to see to have an informed opinion as to how this may play out.
But without seeing the agreements, and just in general--not sure that the NBA can do much. If I own something, and say something reprehensible, my business partners may get mad, but that doesn't change the fact that I own whatever it is that I own.
Fan boycotts and the like may be the way to go.
It's certainly possible that the NBA-owner agreements may change the situation, or that there's something I'm not thinking of--just want to point out that it's not self-evident that the NBA has the right to force him to sell.
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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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Apr 28, 2014 - 02:16pm PT
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blah is right
team owners are in business to make as much personal wealth as they possible can
and you can bet there is nothing in their ownership agreement with the NBA that says anything about limiting whether they shouldn't shoot their mouth off
hey, the guy was honest, he knows he is a racist and he's good with that.............
that girlfriend does not look so purely white though does she?
he must have to hold his nose when they have sex?
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 28, 2014 - 02:19pm PT
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He washes up REAL HARD afterwards.....
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
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Apr 28, 2014 - 02:20pm PT
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Sterling can say whatever he wants. This is a free country and he is free to deal with the consequences of his actions. We are also free to think that the NBA is exploiting black people if they compromise the majority of their talent and also allow for their owners to be so caustically racist.
Fatdad pleaded Also, for all those who are mortally offended by Sterling's comments, where is a outrage over the misogyny and homophobia in rap and hip hop lyrics?
Yeah. Where is that outrage? First I'm hearing of it! And why are you singling out rap lyrics? Songs have been racist, homophobic and misogynistic long before people started rapping in the South Bronx. Is sexism worse when set to a boom bap drum rhythm?
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Apr 28, 2014 - 02:30pm PT
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Not sure what the legal position of the NBA is re: forcing him to sell the team. I'd be very surprised if there isn't a catchall "you can't screw up the reputation of the league" clause in the contract. Fodder for the attorneys if he choses to remain owner.
Of course all speculation right now.
HDDJ
The difference of course is that NBA is a "respected" franchise with a worldwide audience. From recruiting from NCAA teams to watching it on cable TV it's all run by Big Money. A long trail of co-dependent Big Money. Just like NFL and Pro baseball.
It's OK for guyz in da hood to talk up dope dealing, gang banging and misogyny as long as it stays in da hood.
One black guy bad talks another in the excitement of the moment at the end of a closely fought championship football game and all Hell breaks loose.
Free market cynicism at its worst.
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Ghost
climber
A long way from where I started
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Apr 28, 2014 - 02:36pm PT
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The players should just let it be known that if the league doesn't promise to force him to give up his ownership, they'll stop playing. Not next year, but now. That should suit Mr. Sterling just fine, since he apparently isn't happy with black people at his games anyway.
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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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Apr 28, 2014 - 02:39pm PT
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the players would give up tens of millions of dollars in pay?
and go back to....filing their resumes online with Home Depot
ok, probably can live until they die with the money they already have
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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Apr 28, 2014 - 02:51pm PT
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I don't know how they measure this sort of thing, but it is said that his grilfriend is 1/2 black and 1/2 hispanic.
Maybe Shaq should arrest him. For what you ask?
Since when does a sheriff need a valid reason for arresting someone.
Edit:
Paul simon and Eide Brickell arrested
"Investigating officers gathered information and found probable cause to arrest" Simon, 72, and Brickell, 47, a police statement said.
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mrtropy
Trad climber
Nor Cal
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Apr 28, 2014 - 02:58pm PT
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I thought this summed it up well. From NPR
David West, the Indiana Pacers' power forward, provocatively characterized the exchange in a tweet:
Sterling basically articulated Plantation Politics...Make money off the Bucks/Lay with the Women/No Association in Public good or bad
— David West (@D_West30) April 26, 2014
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mike m
Trad climber
black hills
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Apr 28, 2014 - 03:05pm PT
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He's gonna wish he could sell the team. Might be worth half or less soon if things keep going the way theay are. What would stop players to stop playing for him then give another franchise to someone else. His wouldn't be worth much.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Apr 28, 2014 - 03:20pm PT
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Norton, those guys get paid regardless. Besides, they might all suddenly get 'hurt'.
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blahblah
Gym climber
Boulder
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Apr 28, 2014 - 03:41pm PT
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Norton, those guys get paid regardless. Doubt it.
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Largo
Sport climber
The Big Wide Open Face
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Apr 28, 2014 - 03:50pm PT
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I'm not so surprised an 80 year old LA attorney shot off his mouth like that. There's still that conservative, straight, white old guard who believes they call the shots for America lest this country will fail to be Home of the Brave. Got to keep the colords on the sidelines while the Sterling's rack in the green. Wanna hurt Sterling, go to the purse strings. He won't let go of ownership without a protracted legal struggle, I'd wager. Guys like that accord themselves more rights than they deserve. He'll go to his grave never knowing that the world marched past him when he wasn't looking.
Adios, Don. You're done.
JL
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Banks
Trad climber
Santa Monica, CA
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Apr 28, 2014 - 04:01pm PT
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The Clippers are a franchise of the NBA. The owners have the right to force him to sell the team. Just like if you owned a McDonald's and were doing crazy s**t that corporate McDonald's didn't like. The problem is that it will probably require legal action which will cost millions and take years to resolve. I imagine the NBA will try to pressure him to step down, but doubt Sterling will go quietly.
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Elcapinyoazz
Social climber
Joshua Tree
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Apr 28, 2014 - 04:44pm PT
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He'll go quietly and quickly. Because the advertisers are already fleeing in droves. The list of companies who've already abandoned them is impressive...like rats fleeing a sinking ship.
State Farm, Car Max, Kia, Virgin, RedBull, Amtrak, Corona, all canned or suspended their relationships.
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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Apr 28, 2014 - 04:45pm PT
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"Goodness, gracious, sakes alive"
-John Wooden
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pyro
Big Wall climber
Calabasas
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Apr 28, 2014 - 05:17pm PT
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being in his high money position he should not say stupid things.
he's okay to think it but not say it!
idiot!
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blahblah
Gym climber
Boulder
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Apr 28, 2014 - 05:20pm PT
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The Clippers are a franchise of the NBA. The owners have the right to force him to sell the team. Just like if you owned a McDonald's and were doing crazy s**t that corporate McDonald's didn't like. The problem is that it will probably require legal action which will cost millions and take years to resolve. I imagine the NBA will try to pressure him to step down, but doubt Sterling will go quietly.
If someone owned a McD's franchise, and a private call in which that person made racist comments was leaked to the press, I don't know what would happen. As with the Sterling situation, it would depend to large extent on what the franchise agreement said.
But absent some clear contractual right, it's not self evident that McD's could do anything.
And I'm not sure I see a contractual provision that says "if you get caught making private statements that were recorded without your knowledge and they get leaked and you were being racist, then you have to sell if we want you too . . . "
(Obviously the provisions would be general rather than specific as I wrote, but I'm not so sure that it's likely that there would be general provision that pick up what were intended to be, and ordinarily would would be, private private statements.)
I agree that the NBA and/or the public at large may make Sterling's ownership untenable, but that doesn't mean the NBA can necessarily exert legal pressure.
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hb81
climber
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Apr 28, 2014 - 05:56pm PT
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What a piece of human garbage. Was it his girlfriend who actually leaked this? Sounds like a private conversation with nobody else present?
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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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Apr 28, 2014 - 06:00pm PT
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Corporate sponsors started to distance themselves from the Los Angeles Clippers Monday after a tape surfaced over the weekend of the team's owner Donald Sterling allegedly making racist remarks.
In a statement provided to The Huffington Post Monday, Carmax, a used car chain, confirmed it would cut ties with the team, ending a nine-year partnership. Virgin America also confirmed to HuffPost that it would end its sponsorship with the Clippers, noting that the company continues to "support the fans and the players." A Mercedes-Benz spokeswoman also wrote in an email to HuffPost that the company "has moved to cease its sponsorship of the Clippers effective immediately."
Brands that have terminated their relationships with the Clippers: Carmax, Virgin America and Mercedes-Benz.
Insurance giant State Farm, carmaker Kia, AQUAhydrate, a company that sells enhanced water, energy drink Red Bull, as well as Sprint are all reportedly suspending their sponsorships with the team. LoanMart, an auto title loan company, also wrote on its Facebook page that it's suspending its advertising and marketing relationship with the Clippers and monitoring the situation. In addition, Yokohama Tire Corporation is suspending its sponsorship, company announced in a statement.
"CarMax finds the statements attributed to the Clippers' owner completely unacceptable. These views directly conflict with CarMax's culture of respect for all individuals," a CarMax spokeswoman wrote in an email to HuffPost. "While we have been a proud Clippers sponsor for 9 years and support the team, fans and community, these statements necessitate that CarMax end its sponsorship."
Brands that have suspended their relationships with the Clippers: State Farm, Kia, AQUAhydrate, Red Bull, Sprint, LoanMart, Yokohama Tire Corporation and Corona.
CarMax's decision just hours after Steve Stoute, the CEO of marketing firm Translation, which represents State Farm, told ESPN radio that the insurance giant will be pulling its sponsorship as well.
"What I'm going to do and what I think is important from my side is I'm telling the brands immediately 'let's pull sponsorship' starting with State Farm," Stoute said. "When you have things like this taking place, somebody has to stand up."
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Apr 28, 2014 - 06:01pm PT
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Still don't know sh#t about basketball, but in '99/'00 spent a year at the NBA broadcast studios in NYC running the on-site Intel team that put the playoffs and finals on the net for the first time. From what I saw on the technical/programming side of things it appeared the NBA has wide latitude to impose its will on the franchises.
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CA.Timothy
climber
California
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Apr 28, 2014 - 07:07pm PT
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The Clippers are the private property of Sterling. The NBA cannot force him to sell. If indeed the NBA forces him out instead of a combination of external pressures, Sterling has the bankroll to sue the sh#t out of the NBA and in a legal sense, he would most likely win. Luckily, with the advent of the viral video and the internet, Sterling's days are numbered.
EDIT: Part of the conditions of his ownership of the franchise is the right to use NBA logos etc
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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Apr 28, 2014 - 07:09pm PT
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V. says she's not his girlfriend, but rather his arhcivist. He does look like he's getting old enough to be losing his memory. In any event at least she surfs.
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CA.Timothy
climber
California
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Apr 28, 2014 - 07:11pm PT
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bankruptcy (as with New Orleans in 2010) and instances of gambling are the only two types of incidents where the NBA can force out an owner
EDIT: The only two types of incidents where the lawyers for the NBA would even allow them to remove an owner
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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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Apr 28, 2014 - 07:14pm PT
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Sterling is probably getting a brush on the side from her
regardless, can't see how any private team owner can be "forced" to sell anything
this is a 72 hour media event, next up who knows, maybe Rand Paul will puke in his shoes.....
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BrentA
Gym climber
Roca Rojo
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Apr 28, 2014 - 07:18pm PT
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Kareem Abdul wrote a good article about this.
We are all shocked at this "unacceptable" behavior NOW, after he was scammed into getting recorded...
But the guy has been deplorable for decades, on the public record for all to see.
Add a little TMZ = BOOM OUTRAGE
I listened to deadspin's version of the conversation, I have to say I've heard much worse from just about ANY 80yr old man.
--------------------
Kings to men, slaves to woman.
V is hideous looking catwoman freak.
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sandstone conglomerate
climber
sharon conglomerate central
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Apr 28, 2014 - 07:44pm PT
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Gold digging, black mailing slut. What's a 30 something doing with an 80 year old? Oh yeah, nice fat wallet. Disgusting. His dumb ass deserves to be put through the wringer for trusting someone like that. Goddamn i hate 1%..
P.S. She's ugly as f*#k
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Wade Icey
Trad climber
www.alohashirtrescue.com
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Apr 28, 2014 - 07:48pm PT
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In any event at least she surfs.
not bloody likely.
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sandstone conglomerate
climber
sharon conglomerate central
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Apr 28, 2014 - 07:50pm PT
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she surf's old man balls in hope of finding $$$ amongst the greys
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Lorenzo
Trad climber
Oregon
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Apr 28, 2014 - 08:00pm PT
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I'm sure the NBA will consider their brand, Not to mention the preponderance of dark skinned bodies their industry relies on, then will make an astute and pragmatic decision. Possibly even a moral one.
Stick with the pragmatic assumption.
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fluffy
Trad climber
Colorado
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Apr 28, 2014 - 08:00pm PT
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Nothing more funny than a bunch of climbers making fun of someone else's looks...
lol wut
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CA.Timothy
climber
California
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Apr 28, 2014 - 08:03pm PT
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Lorenzo I saw that link and it is a good read. I am gonna read the rest tonight
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 28, 2014 - 08:16pm PT
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That's a serious downer about Jack Ramsay.
I hope he got to see some of this series between Portland and Houston.
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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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Apr 28, 2014 - 08:28pm PT
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but wait, there's more!
didn't major league baseball back in 99 make that Marjorie somebody sell her interest
in the Cincinatti Reds for making racist remarks?
maybe there is some grounds for the league to do something
he paid only 15 million for the Clippers, now worth 500 million
so making him sell would not seem to punish him?
make him shower with the players....somebody said that upthread
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
mammoth lakes ca
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Apr 28, 2014 - 08:41pm PT
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Reilly...sorry about the Laker diss...There's always next year and Koby looks like he might be healthy next season....unless of course he's just lazy...?
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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Apr 28, 2014 - 09:36pm PT
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In any event at least she surfs.
WEll, in any event at least she has gone to the beach. She does a lot of "interesting" things. Go to her page and view all 50 or so. She is pretty when she is not trying to dramatize her image.
Jerry Buss had plenty of young women girlfriend/archivists. Did he ever wind up in this kind of situation?
Must be why he was Doctor Buss, while Sterling is Attorney Sterling.
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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Apr 28, 2014 - 09:42pm PT
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make him shower with the players....somebody said that upthread
Pretty rude comment. I don't think the players would appreciate it. I'll tell Sheriff Shaq to look into it. Send him your address so he knows where to go to interview you.
Make him shower with Sandusky! Now we're talking.
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Banks
Trad climber
Santa Monica, CA
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Apr 28, 2014 - 10:00pm PT
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The Clippers are the private property of Sterling. The NBA cannot force him to sell. If indeed the NBA forces him out instead of a combination of external pressures, Sterling has the bankroll to sue the sh#t out of the NBA and in a legal sense, he would most likely win. Luckily, with the advent of the viral video and the internet, Sterling's days are numbered.
Straight from the NBA By-Laws
Article 13
The Membership of a Member or the interest of any Owner may be terminated by a vote of three-fourths(3/4) of the Board of Governors.
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Banks
Trad climber
Santa Monica, CA
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Apr 28, 2014 - 10:06pm PT
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If someone owned a McD's franchise, and a private call in which that person made racist comments was leaked to the press, I don't know what would happen. As with the Sterling situation, it would depend to large extent on what the franchise agreement said.
But absent some clear contractual right, it's not self evident that McD's could do anything.
And I'm not sure I see a contractual provision that says "if you get caught making private statements that were recorded without your knowledge and they get leaked and you were being racist, then you have to sell if we want you too . . . "
(Obviously the provisions would be general rather than specific as I wrote, but I'm not so sure that it's likely that there would be general provision that pick up what were intended to be, and ordinarily would would be, private private statements.)
I agree that the NBA and/or the public at large may make Sterling's ownership untenable, but that doesn't mean the NBA can necessarily exert legal pressure.
It has nothing to do with whether it was a private statement of not. This is not a court of law. This is not the first time he has been outed as a racist, but it will be his last. His conduct is detrimental to the NBA and its board can vote him out if he wants to.
The McD's analogy is valid as well. If you are harming the name and product that you are representing, you may lose your priviledge(yes, its a priveledge, not a right) to represent the company and sell its product.
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dave729
Trad climber
Western America
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Apr 28, 2014 - 10:06pm PT
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In a nut shell:
Billionaire pays over a million bucks to (smokin hot worth every penny)
gold-digger to be seen with him at LAC games. Objects to her failure to
meet her agreement by posting pics of herself rubbing the Magic Johnson
instead of only him in 'public' while under contract. He was paying her to present the public with the illusion that she loved an 81yr old
rich white man.
Contracts 101.
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
mammoth lakes ca
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Apr 28, 2014 - 10:24pm PT
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It's damage control time for Sterling...Get Barbara Bush to sit next to him at the next game...
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sandstone conglomerate
climber
sharon conglomerate central
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Apr 28, 2014 - 10:28pm PT
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f*#k them both. root of all evil
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Apr 28, 2014 - 10:43pm PT
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here are the possible legal sanctions
according to Michael McCann, the director of the Sports and Entertainment Law Institute at the University of New Hampshire.
.
.
A fine "may be seen as the weak penalty," McCann says, "because Donald Sterling is worth somewhere in the neighborhood of $1.9 billion." He adds that if it follows this path, the NBA would very likely donate the money to charity.
A suspension "would be a bolder step," McCann says. "It's one that the NBA hasn't taken but it's one that I think many people would find to be justified, especially his own players who are clearly upset by the remarks that he allegedly made."
An expulsion would mean that Sterling "would likely sue the NBA for breach of contract, his franchise agreement and potentially an antitrust claim," McCann says.
A long suspension would be one way the NBA could try to pressure Sterling into selling the team. But as McCann tells KPCC, the Clippers owner could make prolonged legal arguments over the fair value of the franchise.
http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2014/04/28/307675955/what-can-the-nba-do-with-donald-sterling
As usual, the guy with the deepest pockets holds most of the aces.
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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Apr 28, 2014 - 10:48pm PT
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That dude better stay out of the woods during turkey season, with neck wattles like his he's bound to be shot.
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
mammoth lakes ca
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Apr 28, 2014 - 10:53pm PT
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He better stay out of the showers to...The players might make him gobble...
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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Apr 28, 2014 - 11:01pm PT
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Just got off the phone with Sheriff Shaq (not recorded) who reminded me that in California it is against the law to record a telephone conversation without consent.
Uh oh.
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ground_up
Trad climber
mt. hood /baja
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Apr 29, 2014 - 12:09am PT
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Dood has a face like a catchers mitt and he's slammin peoples race?
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Sanskara
climber
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Apr 29, 2014 - 12:25am PT
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I agree the guy is f*#king gross! That f*#king skin, belly and smug attitude are repugnant.
Take away his money and he is just another fat ugly classless white guy with terrible skin and shity taste. Between the clothes and that prop of a girl I would say he has some pretty dumpy tacky taste.
Bigotry and racism are the truest form of trash and this guy is trash...
We all have to wipe our own ass and at some point all of our hearts will stop beating. Plain and simple...
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Lorenzo
Trad climber
Oregon
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Apr 29, 2014 - 01:09am PT
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I agree the guy is f*#king gross! That f*#king skin, belly and smug attitude are repugnant.
Take away his money and he is just another fat ugly classless white guy with terrible skin and shity taste. Between the clothes and that prop of a girl I would say he has some pretty dumpy tacky taste.
Bigotry and racism are the truest form of trash and this guy is trash...
We all have to wipe our own ass and at some point all of our hearts will stop beating. Plain and simple...
What do you have against trashy , classless white guys with bad skin?
Isn't that most climbers?
(I'll not even git into the clothes....)
Now you know how the Awanee guests feel when they walk through camp 4.
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Sanskara
climber
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Apr 29, 2014 - 01:23am PT
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Nothing except when its some prick whom biggest concern is his next burger and fries and a Ferrari and he will get it at the expense of whatever and whomever he has to.
I'm not much for dumpy people in general. The reality is regardless of economic background one can still carry them self with dignity and class. Worse than the guy whom has little means or opportunity is a guy like this that has the means for any life he chooses but chooses to go about being nothing more than a thug..
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Lorenzo
Trad climber
Oregon
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Apr 29, 2014 - 01:48am PT
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I'm not much for dumpy people in general
No need for personal attacks. It happens to most people as they get older...
Yeah, that's it.
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Sanskara
climber
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Apr 29, 2014 - 02:12am PT
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Maybe our definition of dumpy is different or you misunderstand what I was trying to say. I more attribute dumpiness to a mans personality than anything else. Sure often ones body is also a reflection of how one cares for them self. Yes there is the exception but I think more often than not it's the other way around regardless of age.
I am a jeans and t-shirt kind of guy so don't get me wrong. This guy and his tacky fancy suits and jewelry are just as dumpy imop as the guy that's pants are falling off and thinks nothing of blowing his smoke in your face as he hocks a lungy and tosses his butt on the ground.
Beeber is a great example when he was a little kid he actually had manners and a certain amount of class for his age, I can remember watching him on Leterman and thinking this kid is polite and well spoken and kinda funny. I woulda kinda thought for a kid in his position he woulda been a brain dead idiot with a giant swollen head.. Clearly in a few short years this has since changed however he looked ok for a minute...
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The Larry
climber
Moab, UT
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Apr 29, 2014 - 02:15am PT
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Half of Blake Griffin is mad at him.
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nah000
climber
canuckistan
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Apr 29, 2014 - 02:51am PT
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Clippers Owner Must Be Forced To Sell Team.
there's a reason the original thread title is a statement rather than a question.
if the u.s. as a collective entity has any degree of self awareness regarding its historical and present race related realities the type of ridiculous rhetoric spewed by ole donald tokowitz [sterling is a self appointed last name] can not be tolerated.
this leaves the only thing worth debating being who should do the forcing?
the u.s. govt? central curtailment of dialog, even including despicable dissent, is almost universally more dangerous than its inverse. freedom of speech allows us to see people and ideas for who and what they are... even the f*#ked up ones.
the nba commissioner? now we're getting warmer. while it's in the nba's best interest [and i suspect their legal rights] for them to sanction mr. tokowitz by forcing him out, this has the same downsides to the govt doing it. i.e. it's a slippery slope with more pitfalls than upsides.
the clippers season ticket holders? imo, a boycott by those who actually "own" the team is the only way a forced selling would truly be based in power and legitimacy.
but, i won't be holding my breath.
if i'm correct, and the fans do nothing, this is a thousand fold more disturbing than any pathetic and pitiful mutterings of a pathetic and pitiful piece of playdough.
bread and circuses...
bread and circuses.
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 29, 2014 - 03:13am PT
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Great posts you guys. A real thoughtful conversation, instead of a bunch of name calling and internet yelling.
QITNL, that is a great piece about Jack Ramsay. I was a high school basketball player in Bend OR the year Dr. Ramsay and Bill Walton led the Blazers to their only championship. I was an inspired and emotional player, a little short, and a little short on high level skills. My friends dad had season tickets, a bunch of them, because he was a little rich. So as a very lucky kid, I got to see my first pro games that year, and the next, as the Blazers tried to defend their title. So yeah, I know about Jack Ramsay.
Bill Walton has referred to him many times over the years.
I hope the Clippers are able to make a strong protest tomorrow night. Many teams in the playoffs have worn black socks as a show of solidarity with Clippers players. I think Portland and Houston did it first.
The Heat came out in the pre-game, turned their warm ups inside out, and put them down at half court, the way the Clippers did.
I hope there will be enough pressure from all corners to make Sterling's ownership very unhappy.
Right before the next Clippers/Warriors game. Good timing.
The NBA will hold a 2 p.m. ET news conference Tuesday in New York to make an announcement about its investigation involving Los Angeles Clippers owner Donald Sterling, vice president of communications Mike Bass said Monday in a news release.
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Apr 29, 2014 - 04:25am PT
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The one thing from that interview which really rings true from my year of working there is no one at the NBA, from top to bottom, has any time for this sh#t right now. The timing is ugly as the playoffs and finals are frantic for everyone in the organization as is. And you can bet your ass all the league execs, owners, sponsors, and advertisers are feeling like Sterling just pissed all over their year. Given that, regardless of the NBA's formal response, there will likely be plenty of short- and long-term repercussions of all kinds for Sterling going forward.
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anita514
Gym climber
Great White North
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Apr 29, 2014 - 07:59am PT
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he's one of the chosen ones... he can say whatever he wants, right?
I don't get his gf though. wtf has she done to her face?
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Crimpergirl
Sport climber
Boulder, Colorado!
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Apr 29, 2014 - 09:16am PT
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It is alleged that she recorded him not only with his knowledge, but at his request. Hence his calling her the archivist.
He wanted things recorded supposedly because he forgot stuff. If true, then the whole - she committed a crime in recording him - is incorrect.
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 29, 2014 - 09:44am PT
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Blue, you're defending racists in two threads right now.
I guess it's ok, since they're white racists.
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Gary
Social climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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Apr 29, 2014 - 09:45am PT
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So, it seems like everyone just now figured out Donald Sterling is a disgusting human being? This is not news.
He should have been kicked out of the league for being a slumlord. Apparently, screwing over poor people is acceptable to the NBA, it's insulting NBA millionaires that gets you in trouble.
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 29, 2014 - 09:59am PT
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So, it seems like everyone just now figured out Donald Sterling is a disgusting human being? This is not news.
It's news to me. I never heard of the man before his latest as#@&%e move.
As a lifelong hoops fan, I kept track of Elgin Baylor and Bill Russell, not the owners, sorry.....
Explain the principle Ron! You're confusing Ron and Blue?
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 29, 2014 - 10:07am PT
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Dingus, OMG LOL WTF LMAO
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 29, 2014 - 10:24am PT
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Here's a little for you Dave.
Miller’s most prolific racist artist was known as Johnny Rebel. Click these song titles to hear some of Johnny Rebel’s 1960s output:
1. “Nigger Hatin’ Me”
2. “Some Niggers Never Die”
3. “Nigger Nigger”
4. “Move Them Niggers North”
http://undercoverblackman.blogspot.com/2008/12/most-racist-songs-ever-recorded.html
I wonder if Blue will like those tunes written so long before rap.
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philo
Trad climber
Is that light the end of the tunnel or a train?
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Apr 29, 2014 - 10:40am PT
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OK I have thought about this a lot and have come to conclude what I think would be a perfect punishment. He should be made to perform Mammy in Al Jolson black face on National TV at mid court at half time then be made to shower with the team.
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 29, 2014 - 10:45am PT
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No Dave, they clearly weren't mainstream songs.
Yes, they're still offensive.
What's your point?
Jefe, that's a great link to Kareem. No, it's not a surprise that there are still racists, but it was definitely a surprise to hear an NBA owner talk like that, at least to me.
No, unfortunately I won't be climbing today. I'm avoiding all the Gdamn ranch work I have on my plate today......
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Sanskara
climber
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Apr 29, 2014 - 10:51am PT
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Pretty telling that the clan of ST token resident racist have nothing to say about this....
Idk what should or should not be done shout this guy. All I know is he is a turd and people like him are quickly becoming the minority. It will be a beautiful day when every bigots fantasy of America is shattered. A black president, same sex marriage, a female president and a fair tax structure that no longer leans heavily in favor of wealthy white guys...
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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Apr 29, 2014 - 10:57am PT
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The NSA don't beep.
Was always concerned a bit about how tight the NSA and TMZ were. Too close for comfort. Harvey is an attorney and (once?) cocaine addict.
Who better to team up to bring the world "celebrity go sip".
He actually texts while driving, but does the NSA ever release any of his dirt?
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 29, 2014 - 11:05am PT
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Is Spike a racist? I know he's outspoken about issues, but I haven't seen him make any overtly racist statements. Not to say he couldn't, but I haven't seen it.
Here's ol' Johnny Rebel.
[Click to View YouTube Video]
[Click to View YouTube Video]
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 29, 2014 - 12:40pm PT
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No comment Locker?
Damn, that's rare!! I'm the first to shut you up? Ever? :0)
Seems like even ol' Blue's bailed on Sterling!
Just so Dave's not confused about racist music of the past.
[Click to View YouTube Video]
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Apr 29, 2014 - 12:54pm PT
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I can't listen to that tripe for more than a minute.
That is a truly disgusting peek behind the White Robes.
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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Apr 29, 2014 - 01:05pm PT
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Have you ever noticed that TMZ is not the obverse of DMT, but it's close.
Word!
"the opposite or counterpart of a fact or truth"
Regarding Attorney Levin. I guess all that really matters is whether he'll be at Facelift 2014, right?
Anyone up for changing the spelling of "you" to "yhou" or at least making it an acceptable variant?
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Lorenzo
Trad climber
Oregon
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Apr 29, 2014 - 01:27pm PT
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All parties must consent in Cali if recording... was there consent?
Was the recording done in Cali?
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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Apr 29, 2014 - 01:37pm PT
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Was the recording done in Cali?
Interesting point. What if the call was conferenced into say Nevada (or the Cayman Islands) and recorded there. Everybody knows anything goes in places like that.
Anyway, it's probably where the conversation occurred, rather than where it was recorded. Sterling and V. were both in L.A. at the time (Sheriff Shaq has investigated this already).
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Ward Trotter
Trad climber
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Apr 29, 2014 - 01:59pm PT
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LOL
This whole Sterling thing was a scam.
Most of the people who took it on face value have now got egg all over their faces.
Whoever pulled off this media-driven circus should be hired by the Obama Administration before his approval ratings go below 40%.
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little Z
Trad climber
un cafetal en Naranjo
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Apr 29, 2014 - 02:00pm PT
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bring basketball back to the northwest.
The Seattle Clippers, yeah, has a nice ring to it.
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 29, 2014 - 02:03pm PT
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WTF are you talking about Ward?
The audiotape that made Donald Sterling into a national pariah was breaking news only in the sense that most of us had little clue about the owner of the L.A. Clippers and his racist outlook.
Turns out that Donald Sterling’s lengthy history of racism was an open secret in the NBA and in Los Angeles. And yet, until TMZ obtained the don’t-bring-black-people-to-my games tape, no one much seemed to care—and that includes the national media.
Sterling was sued by one of his executives, basketball legend Elgin Baylor, for racial discrimination? That was a blip. Sterling paid nearly $3 million to settle federal charges that he tried to drive black and Hispanic renters out of his buildings? Another blip.
Tell us how it is Ward.
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Ward Trotter
Trad climber
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Apr 29, 2014 - 02:05pm PT
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Tell us how it is Ward.
Yawn.
The short answer---probably whoever ends up with the Clippers.
LOL
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Ward Trotter
Trad climber
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Apr 29, 2014 - 02:18pm PT
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He just got indefinite suspension and $5 million fine .....
The NBA front offices just got their cut. That's an easy payday.
They banned the 80yr old demented crackpot for life......wooooooooo
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Banks
Trad climber
Santa Monica, CA
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Apr 29, 2014 - 02:19pm PT
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The 2.5 million fine is nothing to Sterling but the Commisioner's hands were tied on that one.
Lifetime ban is appropriate.
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 29, 2014 - 02:21pm PT
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He just got indefinite suspension and $5 million fine .....
Yawn (for ward)
[Click to View YouTube Video]
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Marlow
Sport climber
OSLO
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Apr 29, 2014 - 02:27pm PT
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Congrats with the fine and the ban...
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Michelle
Social climber
1187 Hunterwasser
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Apr 29, 2014 - 02:31pm PT
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That guy probably sh.its in a toilet worth 5 mil, big deal? The ban, on the other hand, well now he can sell quickly...
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Lorenzo
Trad climber
Oregon
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Apr 29, 2014 - 02:35pm PT
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Los Angeles Clippers owner Donald Sterling has been banned for life and fined $2.5 million following the racist comments he allegedly made to his girlfriend, V. Stiviano.
NBA commissioner Adam Silver announced the penalties at a press conference on Tuesday (via Mark Medina of the Los Angeles Daily News):
I gotta say I'm kinda stunned. The nba did the right thing.
Whether they can make him sell is another matter.
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Banks
Trad climber
Santa Monica, CA
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Apr 29, 2014 - 02:38pm PT
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I'm not stunned at all. This story was too big to be swept under the rug or to be "bought off". The Commisioner has the power to do what he did and wasn't affraid to use it. It was the right thing to do and the NBA will be better off for it.
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Lorenzo
Trad climber
Oregon
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Apr 29, 2014 - 02:41pm PT
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... But he apparently still owns the team.
The ban is on involvement.
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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Apr 29, 2014 - 02:43pm PT
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I've bumped into a few wealthy people in my travels and from what I've observed the $5M, while certainly not financially crippling, is going to eat away at old Mr. Sterling's psyche until the day he dies.
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Sanskara
climber
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Apr 29, 2014 - 02:45pm PT
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Another step in the right direction for America.
The bigots and hate mongers will find some way to spin this to make themselves feel better as they always do. It sure is satisfying to see the hateful old bastards backed into a corner squirming. Watching as they scramble to take issue in whatever ways they have left, clinging to whatever they can to preserve their antiquated ugly bigoted increasingly unpopular ideologies and ways is vindicating to say the least!
What these idiots fail to see is their resistance to change is only forcing those who will not tolerate hate to stand up and insist hate be irradicted.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Apr 29, 2014 - 02:46pm PT
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not for long
NBA commissioner Adam Silver said Donald Sterling would also be forced to sell the team. I'm sure the NBA believes they are on solid legal ground before making this statement.
or as Obama said yesterday:
"When ignorant folks want to advertise their ignorance, you don't really have to do anything, you just let them talk," he said. Sterling at long last dug his own grave.
Both quotes from BBC
More accurate info from the LATimes (who outta know)
The NBA's bylaws allow for owners to be expelled from the league, though that power is reserved for limited circumstances, such as the inability to operate financially, gambling on league games or fixing games.
The more likely route, which Silver took, lay within Article 35 of the NBA Constitution, which allows the commissioner to indefinitely suspend owners for "conduct prejudicial or detrimental to the association."
There's the "you can't screw up the league's reputation" catchall.
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blahblah
Gym climber
Boulder
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Apr 29, 2014 - 02:54pm PT
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I've bumped into a few wealthy people in my travels and from what I've observed the $5M, while certainly not financially crippling, is going to eat away at old Mr. Sterling's psyche until the day he dies.
Good point.
I wouldn't be surprised if there's a settlement where he agrees to sell the team, and doesn't pay the fine. I don't think such a settlement would necessarily ever be made public.
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 29, 2014 - 03:09pm PT
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I hope he chokes on it, one way or another.
Can't wait to see the Clippers tonight, sans lizard face in the stands.
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
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Apr 29, 2014 - 03:12pm PT
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I expected the NBA to come up short or maybe juuust good enough. Woke up from my preshift nap to find them sinking a three pointer from half court. I also see that bluering has fled the thread.
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John M
climber
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Apr 29, 2014 - 03:22pm PT
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they're going to force Donald to realize a $500 million investment gain.
nothing they can do about that.
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SicMic
climber
across the street from Marshall, CO
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Apr 29, 2014 - 03:24pm PT
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Well, I'm glad to see this ugliness resolved. The guy is scum and deserves whatever falls on his head. Too bad it only adds up to big profit and tons of hookers for him, but we're rid of one nasty public figure.
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Lorenzo
Trad climber
Oregon
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Apr 29, 2014 - 03:27pm PT
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CNN reported that the NBA bylaws allow the OWNERS ( not the commish) to force a sale with a 3/4 vote.
Looks like more drama in the offing.
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 29, 2014 - 03:31pm PT
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So what? Getting him away from the NBA is still a great thing.
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Apr 29, 2014 - 03:35pm PT
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Like I said, everyone who matters likely feels he pissed on their season - no way he was going to get off lightly. The NBA's actions are great messaging on the topic for all concerned and makes the pointed statement money doesn't matter in the sport when it comes down to racism and bigotry. My guess is Silver would have walked if he wasn't given the latitude to bring the hammer down hard given this was forced on him and the NBA's formal response was going to define the rest of his reign.
To really hurt his business, other rich guys would have to boycott his real-estate dealings. Prolly not gonna happen. It's LA and sh#t like this tends to socially stick folks who rub up against it even in the business world so there's likely to be repercussions over time there as well.
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climbski2
Mountain climber
Anchorage AK, Reno NV
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Apr 29, 2014 - 03:40pm PT
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There sure is a lot of confusion about the first amendment. All it says is the government cannot come arrest him or shut his business down for what he said.
The rest of us citizens are welcome to do as we please on those fronts. If I were the NBA there is no way I would let that guy anywhere near an event in the future .. let alone hold a franchise.
86d off the deepend forever.
Called this one a few days ago as soon as I heard the news.
Nothing else the NBA could do. Nothing less could be acceptable.
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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Apr 29, 2014 - 03:40pm PT
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I don't want to dwell on this, but Jerry Buss (to whom certain analogies can be drawn, rich white guy big ego, not ever accused of any manner of racism) died at 80. Sterling is going to die and the insult to his big ego has already been done and will only become worse.
Good thing to get him away from the NBA. He will be forgotten soon.
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couchmaster
climber
pdx
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Apr 29, 2014 - 03:49pm PT
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Well, that needs a picture then. Jeanie Buss, Jerrys daughter (does she own the lakers now?) seen here relaxing, says that the comments were reprehensible.
Hope that furthers the conversation along although it hardly qualifies as the certain analogy Zbrown suggests.
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Largo
Sport climber
The Big Wide Open Face
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Apr 29, 2014 - 06:23pm PT
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Good riddance.
Now Magic can come in and clean up the mess.
JL
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blahblah
Gym climber
Boulder
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Apr 29, 2014 - 06:36pm PT
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Good riddance.
Now Magic can come in and clean up the mess.
JL
Actually that seems a little too convenient--
-rich owner (and A-hole) makes racist comments, specifically about Magic,
 NBA forces owner to sell the team to . . . Magic?
Somehow I'm not sure that will fly, we'll see.
And about forcing him to realize $500M gain or whatever--I'm not a tax guy, but now that I think about it, I don't know if Sterling will go for that. If he dies and leaves the team to his heirs, they get a step up in the basis value of the team, so they don't have to pay capital gains tax on it when they sell (they still have to pay inheritance tax) except to the extent it increases in value after his death.
If he has to sell now, he has to pay HUGH cap gains tax, and then the heirs still have to pay inheritance tax.
If I've misstated that tax implications of this, I hope someone corrects me. But otherwise, I'm going to predict NO SALE, voluntarily at least, and we'll what happens if the NBA tries to force him to sell. I'm a bit skeptical that they can do that, but I don't know, and it sounds like the so-called experts disagree.
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 29, 2014 - 06:54pm PT
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The next important question:
Will the Clippers bounce back tonight? I have a sneaking feeling that they will....
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couchmaster
climber
pdx
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Apr 29, 2014 - 06:58pm PT
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It will be interesting to see how many seats are empty at the game don't you think Survival? Unless the NAACP is still going to give him the humanitarian award of course....
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 29, 2014 - 07:15pm PT
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I have a feeling that there won't be many empty seats, especially after the NBA ruling today. It makes everyone feel better. Plus, it's a great playoff series.
Now if the commish hadn't taken a stand, and if Sterling were still in charge next season, it might be a different story.
That's my not-so-professional opinion.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Apr 29, 2014 - 07:31pm PT
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Actually that seems a little too convenient--
-rich owner (and A-hole) makes racist comments, specifically about Magic,
NBA forces owner to sell the team to . . . Magic?
Seems fishy, don't it?
Also got a lot of other stuff off the headlines....
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Braunini
Big Wall climber
cupertino
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Apr 29, 2014 - 07:33pm PT
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Pages late but LOL at anyone who believes this has anything to do with the first amendment
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 29, 2014 - 07:47pm PT
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Who said the team was being sold to Magic? It would be poetic justice if you ask me.
Seems fishy, don't it? What seems fishy?
Racist gozillionaire gets caught with pants down? Yeah, I guess you're right, if there were actually any consequences that would be FISHY!
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Apr 29, 2014 - 07:49pm PT
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How is this not a clear-cut 1st Amendment winner of a case in favor of the bigot? Even if it wasn't a private conversation, it's still valid.
Ever hear some black or Mexican radicals call for killing whitey? I can help ya out if you don't know already. Calling for violence is not protected by the 1st.
Racial discrimination in a private conversation is protected.
We should be careful where this is allowed to go. This could get many un-suspecting people in jail. Assuming we're willing to apply equal penalties under the law that this guy got.
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Braunini
Big Wall climber
cupertino
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Apr 29, 2014 - 07:54pm PT
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We should be careful where this is allowed to go. This could get many un-suspecting people in jail.
He didn't get arrested, he got voted off the island according to the charter rules of a private organization he belonged to.
Saying racist things will get you fired from Wal-Mart too.
Lotta constitutional scholars up in here
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Apr 29, 2014 - 08:00pm PT
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He didn't get arrested, he got voted off the island according to the charter rules of a private organization he belonged to.
Saying racist things will get you fired from Wal-Mart too.
Lotta constitutional scholars up in here
What I meant is what if it is violent rhetoric. Many rappers may find themselves in jail, despite us knowing it is just a song.
But it gets worse than that. Some, specifically black, activists call for killing white children. Why is that not criminal?
The head of La Raza has made some pretty violent statements too. Jailable? Or free-speech?
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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Apr 29, 2014 - 08:01pm PT
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On the upside (for Donald anyway), the Ku Klux Klan is scheduled to honor Attorney Sterling at an upcoming barbeque. Come to think of it where is the Sterling Militia?
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Apr 29, 2014 - 08:03pm PT
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bluey
don't you get that a great deal of this bas##ard's fortune comes from black players and tenants?
and that in the 21st century racism is just plain uncivilized?
Sure he's got a "1st amendment right". And the NBA has a right to protect their franchise.
The 1st amendment only applies to the government's relationship with the populace.
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances. As I pointed out earlier, there is specific clause in Sterling's contract that he can't screw up the league for the others. It will probably end up in court and he'll likely lose. In My Not So Humble Opinion
Some, specifically black, activists call for killing white children. Why is that not criminal? They CAN be prosecuted if it can be shown that their speech specifically led to murder. That's a pretty high bar, as it should be.
But irrelevant to contracts between private parties.
Every year I sign two or three Non Disclosure Agreements with clients. If I ever disclose any of their intellectual property I can be sued for damages.
That's a mutual contract, not signed under duress. And it is valid.
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Sanskara
climber
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Apr 29, 2014 - 08:05pm PT
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Hahahahhahahhahahnan
F*#king genius I tell you.
Hard to believe we all have an equal right to vote sometimes...
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Apr 29, 2014 - 08:08pm PT
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As I pointed out earlier, there is specific clause in Sterling's contract that he can't screw up the league for the others. It will probably end up in court and he'll likely lose. In My Not So Humble Opinion
I not defending the man. I'm defending his speech that was made in a private conversation. He was not aware this was going to affect the league. He was having a private conversation.
As such, shouldn't the 1st defend his private speech while released without his permission?
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Apr 29, 2014 - 08:13pm PT
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He was not aware this was going to affect the league. He was having a private conversation. He may well chose to argue this in court. Good luck to him.
Meanwhile public opinion has spoken, his sponsors/advertisers are fleeing the sinking ship.
As they all have a legal right to do.
His franchise is likely losing value by the minute.
A smarter man would get rid of the team as quickly as possible, take his mega millions and flee to Switzerland.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Apr 29, 2014 - 08:21pm PT
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He may well chose to argue this in court. Good luck to him.
Meanwhile public opinion has spoken, his sponsors/advertisers are fleeing the sinking ship.
As they all have a legal right to do.
His franchise is likely losing value by the minute.
A smarter man would get rid of the team as quickly as possible, take his mega millions and flee to Switzerland.
Funny how this only happens to rich white guys.
http://www.myfoxdetroit.com/story/25345293/mich-mans-selfie-mocked-by-celebrities-on-social-media
Shaq ridicules man with birth condition. How is this different? Shaq deleted it after he caught sh#t, but he's a hypocrite!
I can list other examples. There's a double standard. And the 1st Amendment wasn't designed for that.
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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Apr 29, 2014 - 08:21pm PT
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I haven't read the contract, but I would be surprised if it included any language that Attorney Sterling needed to be aware that his behavior did or would negatively affect the league.
Now as to whether V. signed a non-disclosure agreement with Attorney Sterling, that is another issue.
In my faovrite legal phrase he "knew or should have known".
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Apr 29, 2014 - 08:28pm PT
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I'm going to pull a Chief and re-post
From the LA Times today
The NBA's bylaws allow for owners to be expelled from the league, though that power is reserved for limited circumstances, such as the inability to operate financially, gambling on league games or fixing games.
The more likely route, which Silver took, lay within Article 35 of the NBA Constitution, which allows the commissioner to indefinitely suspend owners for "conduct prejudicial or detrimental to the association."
This is a contract between Lizard Face and the NBA. Sure they'll fight about it in court. As I said above. A smarter, wealthy man would cut his losses and get outta Dodge. Why Switzerland? because it's a great place for Rich Scoundrels.
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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Apr 29, 2014 - 08:30pm PT
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Poor rich white guys, my heart bleeds for them bluering.....especially the ones that use their money for beautiful mistresses. Their often so deluded from a privileged life that they actually believe the women think they're hot.
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John M
climber
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Apr 29, 2014 - 08:31pm PT
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Funny how this only happens to rich white guys.
http://www.myfoxdetroit.com/story/25345293/mich-mans-selfie-mocked-by-celebrities-on-social-media
Shaq ridicules man with birth condition. How is this different? Shaq deleted it after he caught sh#t, but he's a hypocrite!
I can list other examples. There's a double standard. And the 1st Amendment wasn't designed for that.
Its not first amendment. Its public opinion that counts in both cases. its not illegal for sterling to have the opinions that he has, but if they hurt the NBA, no matter how they are exposed, he can be censured by the NBA. not by the law.
Public opinion could harm Shaq, but since his career is over, it doesn't really matter. If that had happened while he was playing, it would have been a different matter. Look at the wringer both Kobe and Tiger Woods went through when it was found out they were having affairs.
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John Duffield
Mountain climber
New York
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Apr 29, 2014 - 08:31pm PT
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We should be careful where this is allowed to go. This could get many un-suspecting people in jail. Assuming we're willing to apply equal penalties under the law that this guy got.
There's been a stampede to judgement coming because of the Playoffs. There's a lot being legitimized here. Some sort of wiretapping or electronic surveillance. Weren't there people objecting to the NSA being up our a$$? Are we rewarding snoops?
Then there's the subject. "Forced to sell team". Really? Infringes on property rights. Do others want to put their possessions up for fire sale because they were bugged saying something non pc?
Yup. Some people who are going full out on this, are setting themselves up to be caught up saying something politically incorrect homophobic and the like. It will be lulz.
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Sanskara
climber
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Apr 29, 2014 - 08:36pm PT
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Because so many of these rich old white guys are bigots, maggots, crooks, tax evaders, tax loophole manipulating and often times creating scum. They have something the rest of us don't money. Money equals power and bad people with money need be kept in line or all us peasants pay the price for them.
Rich old white guys are the worst.
Pathetic anyone would defend a bigot on account of anything even the first amendment. So f*#king classy! But I guess it should go without saying we are not gonna find class with regard to this issue from the usual suspects wacko right wingers ST for some off reason attracts..
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John M
climber
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Apr 29, 2014 - 08:39pm PT
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Does the black panther own a NBA basketball team? Likely public opinion would keep him from being able to buy one even if he had the money. Thats how the NBA operates. They can do that because they deal in the public market and image is part of what they sell.
Public opinion is all that matters in this case. The NBA can censure their owners, and the other owners can vote to force an owner out. It is a private contract and he signed it when he bought the team.
It has nothing to do with the law.
At some point one has to figure that out. The government can't force me to sell my house even if I were a racist pig. This is and always was about public opinion and private contracts.
the only person in the case who might be in trouble by the law is the woman who released the tape. She can likely be sued.
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Apr 29, 2014 - 08:43pm PT
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Blue, the irony here is the more you type the clearer it becomes how much you and he share in common...
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crankster
Trad climber
South Lake Tahoe, CA
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Apr 29, 2014 - 09:00pm PT
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Yep^^^
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Largo
Sport climber
The Big Wide Open Face
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Apr 29, 2014 - 09:19pm PT
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I think diverting attention to other bigots of any race merely deflects the focus off what most of us are - empowered, older white guys used to being heard and having our opinions valued. I think Donald Sterling has no right to own an NBA franchise, but I'm a little reluctant to hammer him too hard - not because he hasn't acted poorly, but because I have also done lowdown bullshit things.
Poor old fart sure must be conflicted - having a biracial squeeze, a black coach, GM, lots of staffers, and 95% of his team. He's surrounded by black culture by choice, and yet part of him wants to remain apart from, feeling lessened if the implications are that he is anything more than tolerating the darkies. Except for his squeeze, but that's different.
What a mess.
JL
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Braunini
Big Wall climber
cupertino
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Apr 29, 2014 - 09:29pm PT
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Funny how this only happens to rich white guys.
http://www.myfoxdetroit.com/story/25345293/mich-mans-selfie-mocked-by-celebrities-on-social-media
Shaq ridicules man with birth condition. How is this different? Shaq deleted it after he caught sh#t, but he's a hypocrite!
I can list other examples. There's a double standard. And the 1st Amendment wasn't designed for that.
It's getting more and more obvious that you have no idea what the 1st amendment actually is
Sadly you are not alone
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Sanskara
climber
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Apr 29, 2014 - 09:34pm PT
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Omg...
What f*#king kinda world!
I just don't get how in this day and age anyone could be so deranged to feel anything but outraged by the slightest hint of bigotry.
People are f*#king lovely. More like gross..
I say give all you backward f*#kers Nevada or get Puerto Rico to trade and get you nut cases as far away as we can...
I got a better idea bigots become modern day slaves. You can do all the government state and town dirty work. Scrub toilets, prison guards, town workers and all for minimum wage, no vacation, no disability no nothing not one single public assistance program. Sounds just like the world you would all love doesn't it just the tables turned the wrong way ;)
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
mammoth lakes ca
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Apr 29, 2014 - 09:38pm PT
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Donini...Some women are looking for security and a father figure...It's not all about sex and hard bodies...Sometimes cuddles and hugs can win a womens heart...rj
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Apr 29, 2014 - 09:41pm PT
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I think diverting attention to other bigots of any race merely deflects the focus off what most of us are - empowered, older white guys used to being heard and having our opinions valued. I think Donald Sterling has no right to own an NBA franchise, but I'm a little reluctant to hammer him too hard - not because he hasn't acted poorly, but because I have also done lowdown bullshit things.
Poor old fart sure must be conflicted - having a biracial squeeze, a black coach, GM, lots of staffers, and 95% of his team. He's surrounded by black culture by choice, and yet part of him wants to remain apart from, feeling lessened if the implications are that he is anything more than tolerating the darkies. Except for his squeeze, but that's different.
What a mess.
Really, John? SO an old white bigot doesn't like his slut paid whore coming to games with black guys, but he's o.k. with her sleeping with them, but advocating the killing of white infants by black militants has no bearing in this discussion?
I'm conflating the issues? Maybe you're just too politically correct to not call out other races for their more violent bigotry?
Really?
Braunin, the !st was designed to protect offensive, non-violent speech. Especially against the gov't, but latter cases ruled it applied to hateful, non-violent speech.
Stop try to be superior in your Constitutional knowledge and try to lay some out, otherwise STFU!
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Braunini
Big Wall climber
cupertino
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Apr 29, 2014 - 09:50pm PT
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Braunin, the !st was designed to protect offensive, non-violent speech. Especially against the gov't, but latter cases ruled it applied to hateful, non-violent speech.
Stop try to be superior in your Constitutional knowledge and try to lay some out, otherwise STFU!
Sure
It was designed to ensure the government can't arrest you for what you say. Period.
It has zero relevance in a discussion about getting banned from the NBA.
If I call your mom a bad name and you punch me in the mouth, I can have you arrested for assault, but you didn't violate my constitutional right to free speech.
How's that
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John M
climber
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Apr 29, 2014 - 09:53pm PT
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but advocating the killing of white infants by black militants has no bearing in this discussion?
Correct.. no bearing on this case
in both cases public opinion is against them.
In only one case is there a civil contract. That civil contract is what is in play with the rich white guy.
In both cases the law has virtually nothing to say unless the advocating of killing white babies can be directly linked to a death because speech is protected. I can say just about anything that I want unless it directly leads to someones harm.
So the black militant case is different from what the rich white guy said because there is no civil contract in play.
Once you figure that out, then you will understand everything else that I have said.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Apr 29, 2014 - 09:56pm PT
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Sure
It was designed to ensure the government can't arrest you for what you say. Period.
It has zero relevance in a discussion about getting banned from the NBA.
If I call your mom a bad name and you punch me in the mouth, I can have you arrested for assault, but you didn't violate my constitutional right to free speech.
How's that
Apples and oranges. Can you seize a man's property or violate his rights for non-violent rhetoric? Contract-law with the NBA will be overthrown in this case. You cannot have a contract that is unconstitutional (violating the 1st Amendment).
It voids the contract. We'll see though....
EDIT: Punching somebody violates several other codes....
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crankster
Trad climber
South Lake Tahoe, CA
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Apr 29, 2014 - 09:57pm PT
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I guess there has to be someone who takes an arbitrary, illogical position in any argument to make it interesting.
Take it away bluering
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Braunini
Big Wall climber
cupertino
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Apr 29, 2014 - 10:01pm PT
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Apples and oranges. Can you seize a man's property or violate his rights for non-violent rhetoric? Contract-law with the NBA will be overthrown in this case. You cannot have a contract that is unconstitutional (violating the 1st Amendment).
Wow
Not even sure where to start on this one
Maybe help us out by showing where the government was involved in any way and we can go from there
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Apr 29, 2014 - 10:02pm PT
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I guess there has to be someone who takes an arbitrary, illogical position in any argument to make it interesting.
Take it away bluering
I though you already alluded that . What should I elaborate on?
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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Apr 29, 2014 - 10:02pm PT
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blue you need to pay closer attention here, the First Amendment pertains to Congress.
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.
I think you'd make more headway arguing on principles, rather than the law.
Is it fair, for example, that Attorney Sterling was tricked or sucker-punched?
Is it fair that there are tens of thousands, if not millions, just as bad or worse than Attorney Sterling who escape unscathed from being punished for their misbehavior?
...
you get the drift
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Banks
Trad climber
Santa Monica, CA
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Apr 29, 2014 - 10:02pm PT
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Really, John? SO an old white bigot doesn't like his slut paid whore coming to games with black guys, but he's o.k. with her sleeping with them, but advocating the killing of white infants by black militants has no bearing in this discussion?
I'm conflating the issues? Maybe you're just too politically correct to not call out other races for their more violent bigotry?
Really?
Braunin, the !st was designed to protect offensive, non-violent speech. Especially against the gov't, but latter cases ruled it applied to hateful, non-violent speech.
Stop try to be superior in your Constitutional knowledge and try to lay some out, otherwise STFU!
We'll just save this gem for later.
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Sanskara
climber
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Apr 29, 2014 - 10:05pm PT
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Maybe minorities would not have such a pole up their asses had we not made them pick our tobacco and cotton while we raped their women and abused their children.
So peculiar SOME minorities have a hard time feeling all warm and fuzzy with regard to the white man.
F*#king retards!
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Jon Beck
Trad climber
Oceanside
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Apr 29, 2014 - 10:05pm PT
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!st was designed to protect offensive, non-violent speech. Especially against the gov't, but latter cases ruled it applied to hateful, non-violent speech.
This is a generalization which illustrates ignorance of the 1st amendment.
Yes, the 1st Amendment protects speech, all speech, including actions that could be construed as speech, such as flag burning. It protects the speaker from GOVERNMENT regulation of the speech. The protection is not absolute, speech can be regulated but the degree of regulation will depend on the type of speech it is. Political speech gets the most protection, commercial speech gets much less. There is basically no protection from private regulation of speech. The NBA would be private
If the NBA wants to ban flag burning at basketball games they are free to do so. If the government tried to ban flag burning at basketball games it would be held to be unconstitutional.
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Apr 29, 2014 - 10:06pm PT
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Can you seize a man's property or violate his rights for non-violent rhetoric? Contract-law with the NBA will be overthrown in this case.
No, it will not be overturned. The owners contractually sign on to the NBA's constitution and by-laws and their governance structure when they buy a team - it's just not a matter for the government or courts. And really, you'd run to Federal Courts to protect this c*#ks@cker and yet claim "there's more to the story" when it comes to the finality of multiple Federal Court rulings on Bundy?
Crikey, dude, do you even know which side of your mouth you're talking out of at any given point?
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Braunini
Big Wall climber
cupertino
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Apr 29, 2014 - 10:18pm PT
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Momentary pause while blue googles "1st amendment"
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Sanskara
climber
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Apr 29, 2014 - 10:22pm PT
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It's too easy!
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Sanskara
climber
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Apr 29, 2014 - 10:29pm PT
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Must be outa Budweiser..
Had to run to store ;)
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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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Apr 29, 2014 - 10:36pm PT
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Can you seize a man's property or violate his rights for non-violent rhetoric?
taking a shot at this, 40 years since law school so correct me if I am wrong.....
no, one cannot "violate his rights" , by definition that would be illegal
however, yes, a court can sign a lien to garnish(seize) property
"violent rhetoric" is a broad term that is individually decided by Courts on the merits
for example, one can sue, win a judgment, and get a lien to seize property for "defamation of character", in addition to a number of other legitimate verbal or non verbal utterances
in this example, the actual slanderous thing said is "non violent" but does do harm
point is that yes we have "free speech" but there can be consequences .....
example: lying to the police is not illegal while lying in court under oath is
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Apr 29, 2014 - 10:44pm PT
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I've made my point here. ANd nobody once defended the killing of whites by The New Black Panthers or La Raza.
But, I'm the racist. Not one f*#king comment on either case!
I'm the one who doesn't understand limitations and protections of the 1st Amendment? I think you all don't. You just don't want to admit it.
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Braunini
Big Wall climber
cupertino
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Apr 29, 2014 - 10:45pm PT
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I've made my point here.
That you've never read the constitution?
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anita514
Gym climber
Great White North
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Apr 29, 2014 - 10:48pm PT
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"Slut paid whore"
Nice woman-hating comment...
Are all right wingers on ST mysogynists too?
Edit: and no one cares about killing babies. Get the f*#k over it, bubba
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Apr 29, 2014 - 10:50pm PT
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My favorite thread remains bluering's declaring Mexico to be in South America.
That's not what I said. Go back and dig up the full quote. It was a reference to South Americans from many country's being here illegally. PRIMARILY from Mexico, but largely from South America. That includes Central and South America. EVERYBODY who crosses our SOuthern border is from South America in my reference. South of the US border.
EDIT: "Slut paid whore"
Nice woman-hating comment...
Are all right wingers on ST mysogynists too?
I stand by those words. And you illustrate the problem in our current society. You can't call a gold-digging slut a 'slut'.
Whatever. Get over it with your feminist bullshit!
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Braunini
Big Wall climber
cupertino
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Apr 29, 2014 - 10:54pm PT
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I've been thinking about this and I think Fatty has a solid case against Chris Mac for violating his right to free speech
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Sanskara
climber
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Apr 29, 2014 - 10:58pm PT
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And Blue where are your ancestors from. I know at least on my mothers side my great grandfather is from Ireland. My great grandmother is a Bannano and right off the boat from Italy.
As I understand it the Irish where treated much like us white men have treated African Americans when they first emigrated.
What I want to know is what makes your sh#t not stink. Because from where probably 90% of people stand these days you are the one whom sh#t stinks!
I don't care what you or any other bigot ass hole might have done to defend this country your are a disgrace to what American stands for.
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Lorenzo
Trad climber
Oregon
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Apr 29, 2014 - 11:01pm PT
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My favorite thread remains bluering's declaring Mexico to be in South America.
That's not what I said. Go back and dig up the full quote. It was a reference to South Americans from many country's being here illegally. PRIMARILY from Mexico, but largely from South America. That includes Central and South America. EVERYBODY who crosses our SOuthern border is from South America in my reference. South of the US border.
Hell, I live in Oregon. I consider California to be South of the border. Come to think of it, they speak mostly Spanish in Woodburn, 20 miles South of Portland.
But Mexico ( and Woodburn) is in North America. It resides on the North American plate.
Not South America, not Central America.( which is on the Caribbean plate.)
NORTH America.
Some geologists consider the Caribbean plate to be North America.
The final proof is they belong to NAFTA.
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mrtropy
Trad climber
Nor Cal
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Apr 29, 2014 - 11:02pm PT
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First time I ever have agreed with blueringbutt or whatever.. she is a whore. I do not thing she is sleeping with him but anything for money. Some has to pay for those lips.
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Lorenzo
Trad climber
Oregon
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Apr 29, 2014 - 11:04pm PT
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Like you'd sleep with him for any reason but money?
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Crimpergirl
Sport climber
Boulder, Colorado!
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Apr 29, 2014 - 11:08pm PT
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Will someone call Sterling a whore slut? How has he escaped this label? Or it is for females only? I mean he's the only character (that we know of) in this story who is married and doinking someone else. He's the f*#king whore slut.
(oops, I did it - I called him a whore slut).
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Braunini
Big Wall climber
cupertino
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Apr 29, 2014 - 11:10pm PT
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I think it's assumed crimpie
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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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Apr 29, 2014 - 11:14pm PT
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He's the f*#king whore slut.
yes he IS!
I did not know that he was married
thanks for pointing this out, crimpie
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Apr 29, 2014 - 11:17pm PT
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I don't care what you or any other bigot ass hole might have done to defend this country your are a disgrace to what American stands for.
You just lost all my future comm's to you. I do not tolerate people that call me a bigot on BS grounds. And I never defended this country other than the US Constitution in an online fashion. Including the 1st Amendment.
You, sir, are off the radar of sensible people.
Will someone call Sterling a whore slut? How has he escaped this label? Or it is for females only? I mean he's the only character (that we know of) in this story who is married and doinking someone else. He's the f*#king whore slut.
(oops, I did it - I called him a whore slut).
I thought that went w/o sayin'. The dude is trash. But what 30 yr old hangs w/ an 80 yr old? That is gross....
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blahblah
Gym climber
Boulder
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Apr 29, 2014 - 11:19pm PT
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Will someone call Sterling a whore slut? How has he escaped this label? Or it is for females only? I mean he's the only character (that we know of) in this story who is married and doinking someone else. He's the f*#king whore slut.
Whore is basically a synonym for prostitute. Sterling's not a prostitute, he's a customer ("john" I think is the vernacular).
As I understand it, Slut generally is limited to women. But putting that aside, it can be mean "whore" or it can just mean someone who sleeps around promiscuously. I'm not sure having one affair would make one a "slut," but maybe.
Bottom line: Sterling is not a "whore" (and I don't think he'd do much business if he were); he may or not be a "slut," but probably not.
Edit: I'm not really sure the girlfriend is technically a "whore"--it's not technically prostitution for a young bimbo to have rich boyfriend, although it may be tantamount to being a whore depending on the relationship.
And again, we don't know if she's a "slut": she's technically not a "whore," and we don't know how promiscuous she is. Sterling's comment that she could have sex with Magic may suggest she it, but we don't know how literal that comment is.
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John M
climber
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Apr 29, 2014 - 11:22pm PT
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I thought that went w/o sayin'.
you mean like condemning the black panther for his hate speech, which had nothing to do with a private contract?
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Sanskara
climber
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Apr 29, 2014 - 11:27pm PT
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Blue you are so delusional its ridiculous.
Before they even let you outa the gate you were already lost way out in bleachers with regard to being sensible.
How can you not see that, on yeah that's right you are sick. It's simple as that....
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blahblah
Gym climber
Boulder
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Apr 29, 2014 - 11:27pm PT
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While I agree that Blue is off base with his First Amendment analysis, it may be useful to remember that "private contract" is not an absolute in American law (or anywhere else, I may suppose).
For example, discrimination on the basis of race is illegal even in situations that would at first blush seem to fall solely within the realm of "private contract," such as real estate sales and employment actions (subject to some limitations).
So, the government has decided to intrude into the realm of "private contract" in certain situations. Just food for thought.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Apr 29, 2014 - 11:28pm PT
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Yep. The New Black Panthers have a history. Just look at the rhetoric of Louis Farrahkan. And his disciples whom he's poisoned.
It's pretty clear, dude.
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Sanskara
climber
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Apr 29, 2014 - 11:28pm PT
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No it's not ok with me end I have said it before. How exactly do you contact CMac..
Can someone shoot me a lnk?
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Crimpergirl
Sport climber
Boulder, Colorado!
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Apr 29, 2014 - 11:30pm PT
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But what 80 yr old hangs w/ an 30 yr old? That is gross....
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Apr 29, 2014 - 11:35pm PT
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But what 80 yr old hangs w/ an 30 yr old? That is gross....
Flip that on it's head and you'd see why I called her a slut. What 30 yr old hangs with an 80 yr old rich guy?
The whore analogy may be harsh, but may be true. She received a lot of monies (cars, home) from him for the "deeds".
This whole thing displays the worst of human character.
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stevep
Boulder climber
Salt Lake, UT
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Apr 29, 2014 - 11:35pm PT
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Bluey, this has nothing to do with the 1st Amendment. It's a private contract.
If you buy and move into a property that has an HOA, and you violate the HOA agreement, they can do many things, depending on the contract, possibly even evicting you and forcing you to sell. This would even apply to things like flying a nazi flag on your front lawn, which would be constitutionally protected in regard to govt treatment.
It is a private contract. It may be that he isn't in violation of that contract, but that is a matter for a contracts court and nothing to do with the 1st Amendment. Get off the stupid Constitutional high horse. It making you look like you're protecting a racist, which I don't think you want to be doing.
If this possibly illegally recorded BS were there first bad thing he had done, the NBA would probably have given him a slap on the hand. But he has a long and well-documented history of racism. The fact that a timid organization run by a bunch of rich white guys threw the book at him pretty much says it all.
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blahblah
Gym climber
Boulder
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Apr 29, 2014 - 11:36pm PT
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Hmmm, I'm not an 80 year old guy and I admit that I sometimes viscerally recoil when I see a much older man groping a much younger women--especially when I first assume that the older gentleman may be escorting his daughter or, in aggravated cases, an even younger relative.
But I do think there's probably some innate biological factors at work that make relationships between men and women somewhat asymmetrical with age.
It's not strictly one way: consider the "cougar" phenomenon that has gained attention in recent years, although I'm sure it's been around since the dawn of time. But in general, old goats seem more interested in young maidens than old ladies are in young bucks.
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Crimpergirl
Sport climber
Boulder, Colorado!
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Apr 29, 2014 - 11:37pm PT
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Um, I flipped it on it's head first. Someone posted the opposite above.
It's equally problematic or not problematic for him and her. Unless one argues that they support double standards regarding women and men.
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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Apr 29, 2014 - 11:38pm PT
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I've made my point here. ANd nobody once defended the killing of whites by The New Black Panthers or La Raza.
But, I'm the racist. Not one f*#king comment on either case!
Care to take a second whack at what you're tryng to say here? I don't get it.
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Apr 29, 2014 - 11:45pm PT
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bluering:
You, sir, are off the radar of sensible people.
pfiap
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Crimpergirl
Sport climber
Boulder, Colorado!
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Apr 29, 2014 - 11:46pm PT
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I'm not condemning and 80 yr old with a 30 yr old or vice versa. I say to each his own. They are grown-arse people who live with the choices they make.
I am condemning the notion that a 30 yr old woman with an 80 yr old man makes her a whore or nasty or gross, but that (or the opposite) fails to make him equally despicable.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Apr 29, 2014 - 11:55pm PT
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Well, Callie, every 80 yr old bigot perv would love a tight-ass, so to speak.
But the typeof women that "fill this role", are gold-digging sluts. And they may not even be sluts (no sex). But that is kinda worse.
I feel dirty even talking about sh#t like this. People like this cheapen 'love', or 'relationships'.
I DO put a bunch of burden on the woman here. She is taunting the old pervert. But I don't excuse him.
Many old-timers remain loyal or celibate when their mate dies. Here I go with my morality again....
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Elcapinyoazz
Social climber
Joshua Tree
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Apr 29, 2014 - 11:57pm PT
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Fakinel! I know what's missing from this goatrope "conversation":
BENGHAZI!!!
Come on Bluetard, you're slipping boy. Must have missed your marching orders from Hannity. BENGAHZI BENGHAZI BENGHAZI.
Oh, and Fast and Furious, ACORN, and the Michelle Obama "Whitey" tapes.
I feel dirty even talking about sh#t like this.
Yeah, I don't think you have to worry about gold diggers anytime soon guy. Not many lining up to get on the Ford Ranger, Bud light and Hamburger helper gravy train.
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Bob D'A
Trad climber
Taos, NM
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Apr 29, 2014 - 11:59pm PT
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Blu...why don't you shut your lame ass mouth, sleep it off and maybe come back tomorrow.
You are pedaling backwards at a rapid rate.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Apr 30, 2014 - 12:00am PT
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Nah, Benghazi is enough today....
EDIT: Wow, the assault begins again....
Yeah, I don't think you have to worry about gold diggers anytime soon guy. Not many lining up to get on the Ford Ranger, Bud light and Hamburger helper gravy train.
I was referring to sluts demeaning themselves for cash and trinkets to ride a sick, sweaty, rich dude.
If you demean yourself for goods to ride fat, sweaty, rich dudes...you may be a slut.
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Sanskara
climber
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Apr 30, 2014 - 12:01am PT
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Watching Kimmel but I think this is more funny tonight.
Elcap you are talented !
Omg he has a gay guest on quick turn off the tv before I catch his gay or worse AIDS ;)
That's a joke people..
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Apr 30, 2014 - 12:11am PT
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In politics, when people use rhetoric or hyperbole to constantly demean or slander you, you are doing well. They fear your power and thoughts getting dispersed to more people.
They will do anything to denigrate you, your thoughts, or ideas.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Apr 30, 2014 - 12:29am PT
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Well, some of us are fortunate enough to have found love. We have no need for 'new sex', or whatever. The lady is a slut in this case. Can we be honest?
The old pervert is just that. He's a rotten old man with a ruined marriage and sex-life. He just buys sex.
This is disgusting to me, personally.
People like the chick and the old-timer are disgusting to me.
Do you know what it takes to raise kids and maintain a marriage? All the while these perverts run around f*#king and partying and playing the victim?
I have no real sympathy. These people (both) lead decadent lifestyles. I have NO sympathyies for them. NONE!
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Sanskara
climber
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Apr 30, 2014 - 12:31am PT
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Blue don't flatter yourself.
I am pretty sure that any of those slandering you only fear you as you seem to be a loose cannon and just might be a very real threat to the general public. That is all anyone with half a mind fears of you it sure is not you brain lack of intelligence or class.
Yes you and with a gun in one hand and your hand written personal nut job interpretation of the constitution in the other is indeed very very scary!
You and those like you make us fear for nothing more than the safety of innocent people and our smiles that may get caught in the crossfire when you and your wacho friends finally flip your lids...
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Apr 30, 2014 - 12:33am PT
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Nothing has changed since post #1, then again you have to give him uniqueness points as there are only so many bigoted, homophobic, chauvinistic, sexist, and divorced conservative catholic longhaired dopers out there.
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John M
climber
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Apr 30, 2014 - 12:35am PT
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come on sanskara. I don't know anyone on this forum who is afraid of Blue personally. Some of his thinking is a bit undisciplined, but lots of us know him.
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Elcapinyoazz
Social climber
Joshua Tree
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Apr 30, 2014 - 12:38am PT
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playing the victim
Lolz.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Apr 30, 2014 - 12:44am PT
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It's amazing to me that I get construed as unstable, gun-toting, misogynistic, gay-hating, and a n-er hater, by so few people who do not know me.
Sure, many of you will cite stupid references of mine that do NOT prove the point you're trying to make, but you'll still relegate me to the stupid redneck status. (If you have one, post it).
I've never been bothered by this kind of bullsh#t. Used to it. In fact, it's kinda nice. A thick skin is nice in bad weather.
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Wade Icey
Trad climber
www.alohashirtrescue.com
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Apr 30, 2014 - 12:46am PT
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Blue and I are total nut cases at opposite ends of the spectrum. Complete Looney tooners the both of us. I don't agree with a single thing he says. Except when he says "Let's have a beer."...Then we are in accord. Cheers.
Edit: A thick skin is nice in bad weather. That's pretty awesome.
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Sanskara
climber
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Apr 30, 2014 - 12:48am PT
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Idk those guys lined up at the Bundy ranch and on the streets of Nevada today armed stopping people and asking for identification before they allow people into their own neighborhood scare the sh#t out of me.
And anyone who does not run in opposition to these people screaming doing everything they can to see to it that type be detained is suspect imop. If you go as far as to defend the position of that type person I say you are that person and those people are a danger to all of society.
I am not saying so much about you personally John M but those defending Bundy or the militia right wing gun nut type..
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Apr 30, 2014 - 12:58am PT
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Hey, Wade I may go climbing next weekend, Wanna go? I may bring Michelle too. I'll pack 'the gear'.
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dave729
Trad climber
Western America
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Apr 30, 2014 - 12:58am PT
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Did Hugh Hefner ever have this sort of problem with his sugarbabies?
The games good and I can't be bothered to google it now.
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Apr 30, 2014 - 12:58am PT
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Mr healyje, sir - please leave the Catholics out of it. My mom lives in Portland and she is Catholic. I'm just about to call her because we are both big hoops fans and proud of what happened today.
Last night she probably prayed for Jack Ramsay.
couchmaster can start a thread "People who delete words...."
Thanks, Joe.
Sorry, as an ex-catholic (abandoned ship at age 12), I'm just not going to be able to recant those words as the irony and hypocrisy involved represent achievements bordering on unparalleled (might even require an addendum to the astor aeternus papal bull to reiterate what papal authority means).
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Chewybacca
Trad climber
Montana, Whitefish
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Apr 30, 2014 - 01:05am PT
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I prefer sluts and whores over bigots and those who defend them. If I still had the energy I had 20 years ago I'd happily slut around again. Sex is a lot more fun than dealing with self-righteous bigots. Just sayin...
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Jingy
climber
Somewhere out there
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Apr 30, 2014 - 01:18am PT
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Such nights of arrogance need to be put on display and flogged incessantly to show the rest of us what not to be and what no one needs to exist.
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dave729
Trad climber
Western America
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Apr 30, 2014 - 01:24am PT
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For a moment suppose you are a horny old billionaire who
owns a basketball team. All your players have beautiful
girl friends or wives and sometimes both.
These babes look right through you because you are an old putz.
So you hire a woman to be your arm candy at the games.
"Ha! Look what I got players!"
"Can't touch this!"
Life is good.
4 years later the hired woman stops following the script.
You get pissed.
The whole idea was she's playing your secret girlfriend in public.
No social media or selfies with players who are
notorious for not keeping it in their pants.
What will people think?
Your ego is on the line damnit! The snickering gets louder.
Oblivious she wants to invite male dates to basketball games.
Not going to happen!
2 million in gifts should buy dependability by god.
Unfaithful sugarbabies are infuriating
So you rant! Foolishly.
She records it.
And leaks to TMZ.
The rest is history.
And you are still a horny old billionaire who owns a basketball team.
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
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Apr 30, 2014 - 05:21am PT
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Bluering is back! And he's defending more bigots than ever.
You know who the real racists are? People who think that a racist white guy getting his comeuppance is an outrage.
"I don't agree with what he said but I mean come on...RAP MUSIC!"
Bluering raged
Apr 29, 2014 - 07:44pm PT
I've made my point here....
But, I'm the racist.
I'm the one who doesn't understand limitations and protections of the 1st Amendment
Yes you are and no you don't. You don't seem to get that racism doesn't cancel each other out. It just adds up. If your response to what this idiot said is "but a black person said something nasty about white people once" then you're a racist. A huge, whiny, butthurt, defensive racist.
What are the "non-bullshit grounds" for calling someone racist in your mind? So far in one week you've defended a guy who thinks that black people were better off as slaves and another guy who is embarrassed to have his friends seen with black people while at the same time making money off of them. How racist does someone have to be to be called "racist?"
And Crimpy is dead right about the rest of you calling that girl a whore. You're slut shaming her exactly why? Because she's having sex with people that aren't you? Do you know anything about her at all?
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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Apr 30, 2014 - 09:36am PT
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The beat gos on. Attorney (or as some say slut-whore) Sterling and wife are together estranged. All parties separately are just strange. Case of the whole being more than the sum of the parts I spose.
In the lawsuit that has been brought against the 31-year-old Stiviano by the 80-year-old Sterling’s 80-year-old estranged wife, Rochelle, Stiviano is accused of engaging "in conduct designed to target, befriend, seduce, and then entice, cajole, borrow from, cheat and/or receive as gifts transfers of wealth from wealthy older men whom she targets for such purpose."
http://www.latimes.com/opinion/topoftheticket/la-na-tt-donald-sterling-20140429,0,1149809.story#ixzz30NP5VhM8
Donald Sterling is finally learning there are limits to what money can buy. His wealth got him a basketball team, a gorgeous young woman to sit by him at games and even an award from the NAACP. But it is unlikely he can buy his way out of the shame he has brought on himself with rancid remarks about race. Maybe he should just retreat to Nevada where he could talk about black folks and find a receptive audience in Cliven Bundy.
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John Duffield
Mountain climber
New York
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Apr 30, 2014 - 09:40am PT
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These militia should be careful. They can lose their citizenship for taking up arms against the United States. I'm not a constitutional lawyer, but I'm reminded of this when I pass though immigration.
(a) A person who is a national of the United States whether by birth or naturalization, shall lose his nationality by voluntarily performing any of the following acts with the intention of relinquishing United States nationality—
7) committing any act of treason against, or attempting by force to overthrow, or bearing arms against, the United States, violating or conspiring to violate any of the provisions of section 2383 of title 18, or willfully performing any act in violation of section 2385 of title 18, or violating section 2384 of title 18 by engaging in a conspiracy to overthrow, put down, or to destroy by force the Government of the United States, or to levy war against them, if and when he is convicted thereof by a court martial or by a court of competent jurisdiction.
http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/8/1481
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John Duffield
Mountain climber
New York
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Apr 30, 2014 - 09:59am PT
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sorry, first post on this page threw me.
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Sanskara
climber
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Apr 30, 2014 - 10:06am PT
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I'm guilty I started it.
Now let's get this thread back on topic. Explaining to blue that he is the only one that does not know he is a racist...
Oh wait we should be celebrating a victory over Sterling but Blue had to barge in and start with his usual sh#t in opposition to a good fair and just act...
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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Apr 30, 2014 - 12:30pm PT
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Kevin is the white guy right?. It's clear now why he is no longer in the NBA. Everybody knows honky's can't jump, well except Dwight Stones.
And all the judges go doot da doot da doot doot dat doot.
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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Apr 30, 2014 - 12:34pm PT
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I believe that is a white-fro and lest you forget, google what happened to Samson.
As far as I can tell Javier Sotomayor of the United State Supreme Court who is the awkward position of being neither white nor black still owns the high jump at 2.45 m (8 ft 1⁄2 in). Parenthetically, Time magazine alway say 8 ft 1/2 in (2.45 m), but what does Time know.
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anita514
Gym climber
Great White North
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Apr 30, 2014 - 12:36pm PT
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I prefer the terms skank or hoe-bag to slut
slut is passé
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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Apr 30, 2014 - 12:42pm PT
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Well we can agree on that Ms. 514, I love them skank hoe-bags as long as they are polite and not overpriced.
BTW Cuba si, yanqui no
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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Apr 30, 2014 - 01:01pm PT
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Crimpergirl is right on, when she points out the use of a double standard, so pervasive in our society.
Someone pointed out that older man-younger woman is much more common, and it is. However, that has to do with the dominance that men generally have in societies...even to this day.
No one knows a damn thing about this woman's sexual history, and it is not clear to me why anyone should, or even feel free to speculate. It is way out of bounds to be labeling with sexual labels.
It seems pretty clear that she was after money, often the motivation for such stories. But we don't have any knowledge of what the quid pro quo was. To feel free to attribute a specific sexual reason, and label her as such, with nothing to substantiate it, while ignoring it with him, is unseemly.
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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Apr 30, 2014 - 01:02pm PT
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^AS Neil Young once said, "old man take a look at your life, you're a lot like me", but what does Neil Young know?
At the risk of being redundant, the punishment to Attorney Sterling's ego is by far the worst punishment he is (deservedly) receiving.
I was wondering what would have happened if it was Basketball Player Kevin Love had been recorded saying the same things as did Attorney Sterling.
EDIT:
Kevin Love who had been ...
I wish they all could be California girls!
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Gary
Social climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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Apr 30, 2014 - 01:16pm PT
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I was wondering what would have happened if it was Basketball Player Kevin Love had been recorded saying the same things as did Attorney Sterling.
Well, Art is Art, isn't it? Still, on the other hand, water is water. And east is east and west is west and if you take cranberries and stew them like applesauce they taste much more like prunes than rhubarb does.
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Largo
Sport climber
The Big Wide Open Face
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Apr 30, 2014 - 01:17pm PT
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Blue, the thing you do is called deflection. The issue here is Donald Sterling, NOT his squeeze. Regardless of her character etc. this has no bearing on the spew that tumbled out of Sterling's cakehole for which he is accountable. Talking about the squeeze merely deflects attention away from what it belongs right now: On Donald S. Like Craig mentioned, I've long been suspicious of his self-promoting and lambasting the news with pictures of his own self. They're all over.
This whole mess makes me value humility, knowing we all could come tumbling down - but if that ever happened, it wouldn't be owing to my girlfriend.
JL
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Sanskara
climber
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Apr 30, 2014 - 01:18pm PT
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I would say if in any way shape or form you relate to or are willing to defend Blue it's time to take a good hard look at yourself. Chances are you are more like him than not. And if you are at all like him well you need help!
I would also suggest that it has nothing to do with having hung up ones pecker and more to do with evolving past the novelty of ones pecker. How many times can you play the same stupid game with the same dam toy before you go looking for something with a bit more to offer.
Oh and that girl is as gross as him. Looks like Michael Jackson had all the surgeries gone as planned...
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WBraun
climber
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Apr 30, 2014 - 01:21pm PT
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Sanskara
You're just like Blue.
You run your mouth all day with your opinions.
No different ....
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Apr 30, 2014 - 01:23pm PT
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I'm just picking out one example of many on this thread (sorry blue, this is from you but you aren't alone in this)
the typeof women that "fill this role", are gold-digging sluts. And they may not even be sluts (no sex). But that is kinda worse
This is as bad as racism. Is it a coincidence that V is dark skinned?
Is V a gold digger? Does it matter?
Sterling and V were each getting what they wanted, for four years. There are PLENTY of relationships where one of the parties (usually the woman) implicitly or explicitly exchange companionship for financial security.
Did Sterling come to believe he owned her? That would be slavery. She could legally screw around with anybody she liked (Sterling is the married one).
This is the 21'st century. I've seen no reputable report that she's been screwing anyone else and I don't give a rat's arse if she has. That's HER business. Sterling could dump her anytime he liked.
Is it a "slimy" relationship? Depends on your point of view.
I'm certain that in this case (unlike many others, many Mormon polygamous marriages for instance) the initial implicit agreement was mutual. And like any unwritten agreement, vague in the extreme and either party can break it off at will.
V has every right to her life anyway she likes it. Sterling has his. She's being defamed as a slut. A dubious slander in the 21st century. V NEVER defamed S. He's shown himself to be a racist going back several years. He's finally getting his comeuppance.
This is by no means an equal relationship. Anyone who makes the absurd claim that V is exploiting S doesn't understand power.
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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Apr 30, 2014 - 01:24pm PT
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it's despicable, we know nothing about any of these women,
Well, obviously we ask Attorney Sterling's wife and her attorneys, then hop on down to the courthouse and check out the file and read the brief that was filed, unless we're among the in crowd and can ask for a copy to be emailed forthwith.
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WBraun
climber
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Apr 30, 2014 - 01:25pm PT
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Dr F
You're just like Blue.
You run your mouth all day with your opinions.
No different ....
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anita514
Gym climber
Great White North
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Apr 30, 2014 - 01:27pm PT
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Oh and that girl is as gross as him. Looks like Michael Jackson had all the surgeries gone as planned...
yeah..
wtf happened to her face?
why do women do that to themselves? and men too now.
creepy plastic doll face.
almost as bad as crazy protractor face
http://www.kewego.com/video/iLyROoaftuhI.html
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apogee
climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
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Apr 30, 2014 - 01:29pm PT
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"Someone pointed out that older man-younger woman is much more common, and it is. However, that has to do with the dominance that men generally have in societies...even to this day."
Yeah....I don't think that's the primary reason, exactly. It's pretty hard for any person...male or female... to not consider the wealth and potential financial security that a mate could bring to them and their lives together. I'd agree with you to the extent that the wealth disparity is more likely with a male, probably related to the social dominance that men have in this culture.
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 30, 2014 - 01:32pm PT
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Thank you Los Lobos, as usual, the boys are right there when I need them!
The advantage of being in high places
Is that you never have to look up
The advantage of being in high places
Is that you never have to look up
And you feel like a big shot
It makes you feel like a big shot
It makes you feel like a big shot
Makes you feel like a real big shot
The advantage of being in high places
Is that people look so small
The advantage of being in high places
Is that people look so small
And you feel like a big shot
It makes you feel like a big shot
It makes you feel like a big shot
Makes you feel like a real big shot
The trouble with being in high places
Is when you fall it's a long way down
The trouble with being in high places
Is when you fall it's a long way down
The trouble with being in high places
The trouble with being in high places
The trouble with being in high places
The trouble with being in high places
Is when you're down nobody picks you up
The trouble with being in high places
Is when you're down nobody picks you up
Cuz you acted like a big shot
So what happened to the big shot
So what happened to the big shot
You thunk you were a real big shot
The trouble with being in high places
The trouble with being in high places
The trouble with being in high places
The trouble with being in high places
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dirtbag
climber
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Apr 30, 2014 - 01:49pm PT
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The NBA did the right thing.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Apr 30, 2014 - 01:50pm PT
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the brief that was filed by Sperling's wife against V claims $2.5million in restitution.
For the Ferrari, Range Rover $1.8million apartment he gave V.
In the end V has the most to lose.
The $2.5million was pocket change for Sperling.
Sperling can sell his team today at a profit. There are several big name buyers already lined up. Mrs. S can divorce him and get half, California is a community property state....I know. V is very likely going to end up penniless or more likely in big debt. Did Sterling tell her this possibility when he gave her gifts? You can bet not.
A little person can't win playing in the big leagues. The attorneys will see to that.
The brief is available online: https://s3.amazonaws.com/s3.documentcloud.org/documents/1149327/stiv-complaint.pdf
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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Apr 30, 2014 - 01:59pm PT
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V is very likely going to end up penniless or more likely in big debt.
I had to read up on all this sheeit once. I can see where Attorney Sterling might be required to reimburse the community, but I don't see where V. would be. Admittedly, I didn't go far enough into it to examine the impact of findsings/accusations of fraud etc on the part of V.
Went to the Big Apple, took a bite (or got bitten).
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Apr 30, 2014 - 02:05pm PT
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From yesterday's LA Times
"everyone present had "NO doubt" that Sterling is the man" refers to NBA lawyers who listened to the tape at V's lawyer's office.
But TMZ Sports says everyone present had "NO doubt" that Sterling is the man on the recording, after listening to the 15 minutes that were made public.
The site is also reporting that sources who have heard the entire hourlong recording say Sterling absolutely knew he was being recorded. TMZ Sports has reported Stiviano has said she has more than 100 hours of recorded conversations with the 80-year-old Sterling, who is said to have used the tapes to refresh his memory because he frequently forgot what he said. So say TMZ Sports.
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blahblah
Gym climber
Boulder
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Apr 30, 2014 - 02:20pm PT
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Yeah....I don't think that's the primary reason, exactly. It's pretty hard for any person...male or female... to not consider the wealth and potential financial security that a mate could bring to them and their lives together. I'd agree with you to the extent that the wealth disparity is more likely with a male, probably related to the social dominance that men have in this culture.
No, the reason why old guys like (relatively) younger women is just basic evolutionary biology. Old guys are still fertile, old women are not.
Old guys who go around impregnating young women genes are more likely to be passed on. It therefore gives them an evolutionary advantage.
Old women who "mate" with young men will not get pregnant. It confers no evolutionary advantage.
Note that this is a consequence of basic human physiology. It has nothing whatsoever to do with "social dominance" or "wealth disparity." (Although it is possible that social factors add to the physiology that I have explained, that is pure speculation.)
While the above explanation is irrefutable, let me ask a question to anyone who may remain unconvinced:
Which is more common:
Old goat reading Playboy (or modern equivalent)?
Old cougar reading Playgirl (or modern equivalent)?
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Apr 30, 2014 - 02:20pm PT
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potential repercussions of 'going nuclear' V's attorneys claim they don't know who actually gave the tape to TMZ and apparently there are many more hours of tape. Could have been someone paid by Mrs. S or a business rival or potential buyer of the Clippers.
The wheels of justice turn slowly but grind exceedingly fine. (proverb)
The truth will become known eventually
Shakespeare, Merchant of Venice
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apogee
climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
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Apr 30, 2014 - 02:30pm PT
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blahblah, both the genetic and the practical (financial) elements play a role in why one gender might choose an older mate.
And there's a whooooole lot more to the equation, too.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Apr 30, 2014 - 02:33pm PT
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No, the reason why old guys like (relatively) younger women is just basic evolutionary biology. that's rather silly. Possibly true in earlier times when procreation was an imperative.
Not even true for Henry VIII who took young Anne Bolyn because none of his earlier queens had given him a male heir. A political imperative.
And of course because she was a physical and intellectual hottie by all accounts. Why'd he whack off her head? No male heir (stupid Bustard, Queen Elizabeth I was one of the best monarchs in English history) and he believed she was plotting against him and/or screwing around (history still unclear).
Do you think Sterling is wanting children?
No
it's social/sexual status
"I've got the hot babe that all you young studs want. Because I'm a fossil it proves I'm richer and more powerful"
An older man wanting children is not likely in Spermling's case. Rich old Bustard exploiting a young woman for status and ego.
In my opinion.
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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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Apr 30, 2014 - 02:35pm PT
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Do you think Sterling is wanting children?
No
it's social/sexual status
+1
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AKDOG
Mountain climber
Anchorage, AK
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Apr 30, 2014 - 02:38pm PT
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Basic human physiology is young people mating (best chance at healthy reproduction), the social order is rich old dudes with power also get young people to mate with. Old poor dudes don’t get sht.
Listening to Sterling he most likely has some mild dementia, his family should be worried that some gold digger is going to fleece their inheritance as he seems like an easy mark.
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blahblah
Gym climber
Boulder
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Apr 30, 2014 - 02:42pm PT
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OK apogee and HT, I can see you remain unconvinced; it may require more explanation of evolutionary biology ("EB") than I am really qualified to give or is appropriate for this thread.
But please do remember that the biological impulses affecting Sterling and his ilk are not necessarily operating at the conscious level.
Here is a related point: most men think sex is pleasurable, and desire it even when the don't desire children. They may even have had a vasectomy.
But those studied in the science of EB will explain that the reason men perceive sex to be pleasurable is because of EB, even when the impulses are no longer relevant to modern conditions or even the conscious desires of a particular specimen.
Thus with Sterling--he is not necessarily conscious of why he desires a relationship with a young (fertile) woman, and he consciously does not want children with her, but nevertheless EB provides the key to understanding this "relationship."
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Jon Beck
Trad climber
Oceanside
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Apr 30, 2014 - 02:44pm PT
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his family should be worried that some gold digger is going to fleece their inheritance as he seems like an easy mark
Where is Anna Nicole Smith when you really need her?
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Apr 30, 2014 - 02:44pm PT
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Attorney Sterling might be required to reimburse the community That doesn't work. He would be taking "community" $$ to pay back the $$ he spent from the "community" (community being the marriage). From his right pocket to his left.
No, if there's any restitution it comes from V.
Mrs Spermling wants her pound of flesh.
Shakespeare Merchant of Venice: Portia
//A pound of that same merchant’s flesh is thine.
The court awards it, and the law doth give it//
Shakespeare nails human avarice and vice.
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apogee
climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
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Apr 30, 2014 - 02:47pm PT
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"...I can see you remain unconvinced;"
Actually, blah, I agree that there is a genetic role in mate selection & age...
I just don't think that it is the only role in the equation. It's just not that simple.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Apr 30, 2014 - 02:52pm PT
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blah blah
I have no argument against the evolutionary biology explanation until a recent time.
As humans became more social creatures, status began to affect individual success. Attaining food, wealth, mates, beyond the biological imperative becomes an end in itself. Pride and avarice. Avarice is obvious in Spermling's case if you look at his enormous belly. Most Buddha statues would envy it.
The "biological imperative" to produce more children is the great excuse for denying contraception and for polygamous marriages.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Apr 30, 2014 - 02:58pm PT
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SuperTopo! No stone left unturned!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Marlow
Sport climber
OSLO
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Apr 30, 2014 - 03:07pm PT
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... and no worm left lonely... lol...
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fluffy
Trad climber
Colorado
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Apr 30, 2014 - 03:28pm PT
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Where is Anna Nicole Smith when you really need her?
Decomposing in a buried piano box
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Apr 30, 2014 - 03:28pm PT
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DMT: the bluey is not a racist. Come on now. He's just trolling you guys. He doesn't believe and especially, he doesn't live the sh#t he spews. Well now, that would be a possibility if there was any inkling of premeditation or cogency in anything he says.
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Crimpergirl
Sport climber
Boulder, Colorado!
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Apr 30, 2014 - 05:44pm PT
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So, if it is just natural and mother nature's way when an 80 yr old hooks up with a 30 yr old, then why does this 'natural' arrangement make her a whore or a gold-digger? Wouldn't that just make her a product of nature? Sounds like the way God would want it. Why all the hate TOWARD HER then?
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apogee
climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
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Apr 30, 2014 - 05:46pm PT
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These greybeards are just jealous, CG.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Apr 30, 2014 - 05:51pm PT
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Why all the hate TOWARD HER then?
Cause she isn't a real Clippers fan.
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AKDOG
Mountain climber
Anchorage, AK
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Apr 30, 2014 - 05:51pm PT
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You know in the old days
When a young man was a strong man
All the people they'd step back
When a young man walked by
But you know nowadays
It's the old man,
He's got all the money
And a young man ain't got nothin' in the world these days
I said nothing
Everybody knows that a young man ain't got nothin'.
Everybody!
Everybody knows that a young man ain't got nothin'
He got nothin'
Nothin'
Take it easy on the young man
They ain't got nothin' in the world these days
I said they ain't got nothin'!
They got sweet fk-all!
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blahblah
Gym climber
Boulder
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Apr 30, 2014 - 06:10pm PT
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So, if it is just natural and mother nature's way when an 80 yr old hooks up with a 30 yr old, then why does this 'natural' arrangement make her a whore or a gold-digger? Wouldn't that just make her a product of nature? Sounds like the way God would want it. Why all the hate TOWARD HER then?
Robbing, raping, murdering and the like are all "natural" behaviors.
That doesn't mean we don't prosecute them when they are crimes,and cast opprobrium on them when they may not be criminal, but nonetheless constitute behavior that most of us find to be morally repugnant.
Many of feel not "hate" but rather disgust that a young woman who could clearly find a mate of a more appropriate age but with a smaller bank account spurns that for a super-old, super-rich, super-disgusting racist.
What some of you call "slut shaming" has at least the virtue of edifying others as to what most of consider to be outside the bounds of acceptable, albeit legal, behavior. (And whether her behavior has been legal is not necessarily a given--that remains to be seen.)
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Apr 30, 2014 - 08:46pm PT
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Now let's get this thread back on topic. Explaining to blue that he is the only one that does not know he is a racist...
Oh wait we should be celebrating a victory over Sterling but Blue had to barge in and start with his usual sh#t in opposition to a good fair and just act...
How am I a racist? Please justify this slander.
Explain it to me. And don't be a f*#king coward about it! How am I a racist, as#@&%e!!!!
You f*#king people throw around rhetoric with no consequences. I stand behind EVERYTHING I say. Show me where I'm a racist, mother f*#ker!!!!
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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Apr 30, 2014 - 08:59pm PT
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Well I looked up racism. Here's one definition.
the belief that all members of each race possess characteristics or abilities specific to that race
{{obviously true by definition}}
especially so as to distinguish it as inferior or superior to another race or races
So bluering, is one group superior or inferior in your mind?
If not then, I'd say you are not one.
Can't you do some of this research yourself though?
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Elcapinyoazz
Social climber
Joshua Tree
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Apr 30, 2014 - 09:01pm PT
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Slander is oral, libel is written. This is pretty basic stuff, Mr. I Gots Me a 130 IQ.
Yes, Ringsting, you are hillbilly racist, and easily duped to boot. The wingnut wurlitzer plays and you dance a jig. Like a puppet.
And of course you stand behind everything you say. Well sort of. Well, not really. I mean you did THINK about joining the border patrol. And you did drive by, or somewhere vaugely near the Bundy debacle. I guess you were Moo-curious, but not ballsy enough to join your traitor militia bretheren.
BTW, no sh#t, last night on my phone, the ad at top of ST was for Customs/BP recruiting starting in May. So here's your chance to do more than think about it.
Countdown to "but I have a black/messcan/ore-intal/ay-rab friend" in 3...2...1
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Apr 30, 2014 - 09:16pm PT
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So bluering, is one group superior or inferior in your mind?
If not then, I'd say you are not one.
Can't you do some of this research yourself though?
I know what racism is, and I know I'm not one.
EDIT: Yes, Ringsting, you are hillbilly racist, and easily duped to boot. The wingnut wurlitzer plays and you dance a jig. Like a puppet.
And of course you stand behind everything you say. Well sort of. Well, not really. I mean you did THINK about joining the border patrol. And you did drive by, or somewhere vaugely near the Bundy debacle. I guess you were Moo-curious, but not ballsy enough to join your traitor militia bretheren.
BTW, no sh#t, last night on my phone, the ad at top of ST was for Customs/BP recruiting starting in May. So here's your chance to do more than think about it.
Countdown to "but I have a black/messcan/ore-intal/ay-rab friend" in 3...2...1
How am I a racist, ElCap?
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rockermike
Trad climber
Berkeley
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Apr 30, 2014 - 09:25pm PT
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off topic.... but what the heck
An interesting observation. . .
1 The sport of choice for the urban poor is BASKETBALL.
2 The sport of choice for maintenance level employees is FOOTBALL.
3 The sport of choice for front-line workers is BOWLING.
4 The sport of choice for supervisors is CRICKET.
5 The sport of choice for middle management is TENNIS.
6 The sport of choice for Corporate Executives is GOLF.
Conclusion. . .
The higher you are in the corporate structure, the smaller your balls!
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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Apr 30, 2014 - 10:20pm PT
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I know what racism is, and I know I'm not one.
Well then that settles it. Let's move on. Why argue with folks you know are wrong and whose opinions you have no chance of changing?
However, what if even though you know in your own mind that you are not racist, what if your words or statements are ones that most people would say emanate from a racist person?
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Apr 30, 2014 - 10:22pm PT
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It's much more soul enriching calling V a slut than calling bluey a racist.
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
mammoth lakes ca
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Apr 30, 2014 - 10:23pm PT
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Reilly is right again...She thought she was at a Dodger game and brought her catchers mit...
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Apr 30, 2014 - 10:23pm PT
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what if your words or statements are ones that most people would say emanate from a racist person?
I don't care what people 'perceive'. Meet me, and get to know me.
People 'perceive' racism because they enjoy labeling people as haters when they have no other valid recourse.
It' s really weak.
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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Apr 30, 2014 - 10:56pm PT
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Apr 30, 2014 - 11:37pm PT
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So, if it is just natural and mother nature's way when an 80 yr old hooks up with a 30 yr old, then why does this 'natural' arrangement make her a whore or a gold-digger? Wouldn't that just make her a product of nature? Sounds like the way God would want it. Why all the hate TOWARD HER then?
You know damn well what was going on here, Callie. Do we really need to play the feminist-card in addition to to race-card?
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Gary
Social climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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Apr 30, 2014 - 11:42pm PT
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You know damn well what was going on here, Callie. Do we really need to play the feminist-card in addition to to race-card?
No, she got you there. Or are you playing the moron card?
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Chewybacca
Trad climber
Montana, Whitefish
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Apr 30, 2014 - 11:45pm PT
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Does anybody know for a fakt if they actually performed 'The Deed'? Or is this just some weird, perverse speculation?
[Click to View YouTube Video]
PS- I'd whore myself out for a Nikon 200-400m f4. Any takers?
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John M
climber
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Do we really need to play the feminist-card in addition to to race-card?
what the heck feminist card is she playing? She asked a basic question. Her premise was that if its natural, then why is the lady a slut, if she is just doing what nature created her to do. Thats not feminist, thats just a basic question based on the conjecture that, "If its natural". . So what is your argument against. its just natural? Or do you even have one? You say you don't like labeling, but isn't that what you are doing by labeling her question a feminist card, whatever that is.
I thought it was an interesting question. I do understand, or rather believe that crimpie is trying to highlight the disparity between how a woman is judged and how a man is judged. Why isn't he the one who is a slut, since he is married? I was just looking at it from a different angle. How do you explain naturalism, when you have spiritual beliefs? That is my angle.
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
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Dave Kos said I do recall you defending racism and misogyny in rap music though.
When and how, exactly? I questioned why the go to position for so many people is to be offended about ugly language in rap music when there is no shortage of it in rock or country music. It seems to me it is just another way of saying "that guy might be racist but it's kind of ok because rap music." bluering defended Silver in exactly that manner when he said "but guys, Black Panthers." When you try to divert attention from one offense by pointing to another completely and entirely unrelated and irrelevent offense, you are in fact defending the first. Bluerings whole point was "well not a single person got upset about Black Panthers calling for the murder of white children therefore your outrage about Silver is false and should be disregarded."
Dave continued The Donald Sterling outrage is more about schadenfreude than it is about racial justice.
Um...no it isn't?
bluering raged How am I a racist? Please justify this slander.
Explain it to me. And don't be a f*#king coward about it! How am I a racist, as#@&%e!!!!
I've spelled it out for you more than once so you're either trolling or you just like to pretend you don't know.
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John M
climber
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I've spelled it out for you more than once so you're either trolling or you just like to pretend you don't know.
My quess would be something else, as Blue sometimes has difficulties seeing his own actions, such as complaining about being labeled, while labeling others. I would lean towards believing that he didn't' understand what you wrote, so disagreed with it without really trying to understand. If a person can't explain back to you what you said, then likely they didn't understand you. Whether they agree or disagree, they should be able to explain your point, if there is to be communication.
Sorry Blue, but thats how I see it.
So I could easily see him deciding that you are nuts because he would fully believe that he isn't trolling, nor is he pretending not to know what you said. He doesn't know what you said because it went in one ear and out the one ear without being fully understood.
My two cents blue. Just as its your two cents that I am a socialist and you are not, even though you believe in some social programs. Many of the same ones that I believe it, Yet I am the socialist and you are not.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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I've spelled it out for you more than once so you're either trolling or you just like to pretend you don't know.
I forgot, spell them out again. You seem to have them well documented.
Please post up, as I'm curious.
ElCap has gone silent on proving this racist edge that I have.
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ß Î Ř T Ç H
Boulder climber
extraordinaire
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evict the ... ß Î Ř T Ç H
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Do we really need to play the feminist-card in addition to to race-card? That you think there is a 'race card' involved in any aspect of this pathetic fiasco once again pretty much says it all. Trust me, we understand you don't get or see it, but then neither does Sterling.
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
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bluering challenged I forgot, spell them out again. You seem to have them well documented.
Please post up, as I'm curious.
If you were actually curious you'd go read my replies in this thread and the Ranchers thread. Or even just higher up on this page. But you're not actually curious, you're indignant.
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pyro
Big Wall climber
Calabasas
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clippers 3 goldenstate 2
dumb bitch probably got paid by goldenstate to set up sterling!
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
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Dave posted I see, so this thread is not about race issues in general, it's only about Donald Sterling.
The thread title might have been a spoiler there.
Well, conveniently someone has started a "Racism and misogyny in rap music" thread where you now have an opportunity to address the offensive speech that permeates our culture and has a far bigger reach than anything an old man says in private conversation. Given your concern for racial tolerance and women's issues, I'm sure you'll have a lot to say.
Saying demeaning things about women is bad. Saying demeaning things about white people is bad. Pretending that because an 18 year old with a record contract says something racist it has the same importance as the pervasive institutional racism that exists in our country is bad. Using the premise that because someone calls someone out on defending racism that if they don't address every possible permutation of racism they are disingenuous is bad.
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Elcapinyoazz
Social climber
Joshua Tree
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ElCap has gone silent on proving this racist edge that I have
Two things:
1. No need to prove what you demonstrate over and over again every time you start babbling.
2. Your idea of the importance of your demands are completely detached from reality...kind of like most of the gurgling nonsense that spills from your mouth. To put it in words you might understand: You don't matter in my world. You are an insignificant, moronic little piss ant that I occasionally poke with a stick. Because smacking racist hillbilly fuktards around amuses me.
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Crimpergirl
Sport climber
Boulder, Colorado!
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I have been asking questions because there is some interesting lack of consistency in some points of view expressed here. I'm only trying to understand others' views. Not sure how asking questions is 'playing the feminist card'.
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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^me neither, but to get back to Attorney Sterling.
I'm predicting that he will not sell the team and that this issue will not be resolved for 52 months.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Why isn't he the one who is a slut, since he is married? I was just looking at it from a different angle. How do you explain naturalism, when you have spiritual beliefs? That is my angle.
I thought it was evident that the old dude was a rotten SOB. I was just pointing out that she is no little angel in the fight against racism.
EDIT: Two things:
1. No need to prove what you demonstrate over and over again every time you start babbling.
2. Your idea of the importance of your demands are completely detached from reality...kind of like most of the gurgling nonsense that spills from your mouth. To put it in words you might understand: You don't matter in my world. You are an insignificant, moronic little piss ant that I occasionally poke with a stick. Because smacking racist hillbilly fuktards around amuses me.
As I suspected, you have nothing, hence the rhetoric and bullsh#t. Keep digging though, brah, surely there's something out there if I'm such a racist.
Or maybe just more baseless name-calling is good? Race-baiting is always pretty effective now though, so I see where you went.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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bluey
she is no little angel in the fight against racism. That is either racist or sexist or likely both. You are dragging her sex and supposed race into it.
Pray tell. what race IS she? Is she "little"? Have you seen her toe to toe with Sterling? Does she look small next to Magic? Do you?
She certainly is a party to the scandal, she is also "little" in terms of economic power compared to Spermling. And she doesn't have to be an angel at all for Spermling to be a racist power freak. Her race is irrelevant. Not so the race of the men she's not allowed to sit with at games.
As far as I know she hasn't called him a fat-arsed pot bellied honky.
Unfortunately I'm 100% Anglo-saxon and Celt. Frequently I'm embarrassed by members of my "race"
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BLUEBLOCR
Social climber
joshua tree
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clippers 3 goldenstate 2
dumb bitch probably got paid by goldenstate to set up sterling!
It's LA baby! Makes for good Holywierd don't it?
Either way I'm sure she'll have a payday. A Big one!!
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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I was just pointing out that she is no little angel in the fight against racism.
Quite possible then, that she is a Big Angel, in the fight, right?
Quite possible also that she is fighting back with the tools she has available after being hired, apparently doing her job (except getting photographed with niggers) and getting severely attacked by Attorny Sterling's wife and her cadre of lawyers.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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That is either racist or sexist or likely both. You are dragging her sex and supposed race into it.
Pray tell. what race IS she? Is she "little"? Have you seen her toe to toe with Sterling? Does she look small next to Magic? Do you?
She certainly is a party to the scandal, she is also "little" in terms of economic power compared to Spermling. And she doesn't have to be an angel at all for Spermling to be a racist power freak. Her race is irrelevant. Not so the race of the men she's not allowed to sit with at games.
WTF are you talking about? "little angel" is an expression of innocence. WTF does that have to do sex or race?
You're projecting.
I'm implying that she was not only a gold-gigger, but also a slut, because she was accepting 4 vehicles (expensive ones) and a house from the SOB in return for being his 'girlfriend'.
Do you really think she'd found him to be awesome if he had no money or gifts to give in return for 'her company'?
Her mixed race has nothing to do with my point.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Bruce, her release of the tape without his knowledge seems pretty nefarious to me. She knew it would harm him.
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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And her attorney states clearly that she did not release the tape.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Quite possible then, that she is a Big Angel, in the fight, right?
Quite possible also that she is fighting back with the tools she has available after being hired, apparently doing her job (except getting photographed with niggers) and getting severely attacked by Attorny Sterling's wife and her cadre of lawyers.
It's possible, but based on her lifestyle choices, I find it unlikely. But that is just my observation.
EDIT: And her attorney states clearly that she did not release the tape.
Of course...
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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bluey
Her attorney claims they don't know who released the audio. V claims she didn't. She had a good thing going until the tape came out.
Spermling's wealthy, estranged and soon to be divorced wife had the most to gain since she's filed a motion for V to return $2.5 million. I suspect you know CA is a community property state. Blatant infidelity and giving away community property without her consent would be convenient for her to claim more than 1/2. Who knows, perhaps V or his wife was trying to blackmail him? Makes about as much sense as anything else.
I'm sure not going to guess whodunnit. Time will tell.
Don't need to guess to see Spermling's character as a result. Don't forget his previous racist dealings with his tenants for which he had to pay undisclosed fines and damages.
It's also evident that Spermling ASKED V to record their conversations. He's one stoopid SOB.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Don't need to guess to see Spermling's character as a result. Don't forget his previous racist dealings with his tenants for which he had to pay undisclosed fines and damages
I find this more criminal than his private rantings.
It's also evident that Spermling ASKED V to record their conversations. He's one stoopid SOB.
Agreed. But he never gave her permission to release them publicly. If she didn't do it, who did? Good question.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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I find this more criminal than his private rantings. indeed he was found liable. I don't know if it was civil or criminal and I'm not going to look it up. He had to pay a big fine (for us), pocket change for him.
Article 35 of the NBA Constitution, which allows the commissioner to indefinitely suspend owners for "conduct prejudicial or detrimental to the association. The attorneys will have a field day.
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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I haven't read the contract, but I would be surprised if it included any language that Attorney Sterling needed to be aware that his behavior did or would negatively affect the league.
Surprise, surprise.
Looks like zBrown messed up again. The conduct must be "willful", it is written.
Hadn't seen that V. is denying releasing the tape to TMZ. I'm gonna have to bump of my estimated time to resolution to 60 months. Are there Las Vegas odds on this yet?
Is it just a rumour that V. was placing bets against the Clippers for Attorney Sterling?
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
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Dave Kos replied Sorry, I didn't realize that the billion-dollar rap music industry was just one kid.
Sorry I didn't realize the billion dollar rap music industry was run by black people. I also thought you said you weren't going to comment on it for lack of knowledge.
bluering raged As I suspected, you have nothing, hence the rhetoric and bullsh#t. Keep digging though, brah, surely there's something out there if I'm such a racist.
Or maybe just more baseless name-calling is good? Race-baiting is always pretty effective now though, so I see where you went.
Say something offensive, get called out on it repeatedly, pretend you didn't see any of the posts and then demand that they be repeated then pretend you don't see those posts either. Call your opponents' attacks "baseless." Repeat in every political thread for 5+ years.
bluering bluering bluering bluering bluering bluering bluering bluering bluering bluering bluering bluering
You're attempting to justify Sterling's comments somehow because some black people are racist or say racist things. Trying to deflect the importance of or the offensiveness of someone's comments just supports a culture of racism. If you started a thread about how certain Black Panthers called for the death of white people and I posted "yeah I don't agree with him but I mean, come on, Donald Sterling" I'm subtly infering that calling for the death of white people is justified or excusable. It's no different than "just asking" if black people wouldn't be better off as slaves. "I'm not saying they SHOULD be...I'm just asking the question, ok?" It's a bullshit cop out. The proper response to racism or support of racism is "that's racist, cut it out." If you think what Sterling said/did is racist, just say so in clear, unequivocal language. If you think what he said might be ok, that's fine that's your right and you can say so, just don't act so surprised when you keep getting called a racist about it.
bluering bluering bluering bluering bluering bluering bluering bluering bluering bluering bluering
There I even put little banners around my paragraph so you know it's about you and you can't pretend to have missed it!
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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You're attempting to justify Sterling's comments somehow because some black people are racist or say racist things. Trying to deflect the importance of or the offensiveness of someone's comments just supports a culture of racism.
Um, no. I was pointing out that national media goes into a frenzy when a rich white Jew says something racist, but ignores clearly violent rhetoric from minorities towards whites. Or when minority youths target certain ethnic groups for random knock-outs.
Seems like there's a double-standard.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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bluey
I'm not even going to start with that one. I'm outta here. g'night and Kumbayah
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Elcapinyoazz
Social climber
Joshua Tree
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I don't believe he holds any malice toward any race.
Malice is not the determinant or defining feature of racism. That is a simpleton's view, though admittedly one that is commonly held.
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
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bluering said Um, no. I was pointing out that national media goes into a frenzy when a rich white Jew says something racist, but ignores clearly violent rhetoric from minorities towards whites. Or when minority youths target certain ethnic groups for random knock-outs.
That's true...so long as you ignore all the media attention paid to that subject which is a classic trope of someone trying to not address an issue. Much like Christians claiming that America has become anti-Christian. There is no overwhelming media culture of anti-whiteness. Responding to Silver's remarks by getting upset about the lack of attention paid to anti-white rap lyrics is classic white guy defensiveness and nothing more.
Dave KOS posted You seem to be ... what's that word? ... deflecting a bit here.
I'm responding to your selective quip in kind. I already answered your question in my first response a page or two ago. I was pretty clear and I'm not going to getting baited into a rap music derail. Sorry.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Whoa, I don't hold malice towards any race/ethnicity in particular, or explicitly. Muslims are on my radar of late, for good reason. But I will admit only a small minority of Muslims are extremists.
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dirtbag
climber
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Why do the same small group of posters here always-ALWAYS-defend miserable fooks like sterling, Zimmerman, nugent, Bundy and the rest of the klan?
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anita514
Gym climber
Great White North
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Oppressed white man
Me so angry
Arrrgghhhhhhhghhhgghhggh
Life's real tough when you're white in Amurica eh?
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philo
Trad climber
Is that light the end of the tunnel or a train?
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^^^ Hypoxia.
Because Dirtbag the air is thin under the sheet.
Bigger eye holes might help but Lawd all mighty knows they don't want a larger perspective.
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dirtbag
climber
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Bingo.
Anita--no one likes losing power.
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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No these gals were not given the chop, don't worry - Pomona, Ca
A Southern Californian county will be wary of the religious rights of anyone they arrest after having to pay $45,000 in damages for violating the rights of a Muslim woman by making her remove her hijab or headscarf in public.
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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Meanwhile, no word on how much excessive profit Bridgestone derived from the price fixing. What to do with Attorney Sterling, you say? Aren't those ticket prices fixed for all thirty teams?
Bridgestone Corporation pleaded guiilty to conspiring to fix the prices of rubber car parts. From 2001-2008, the company met with competitors to discuss splitting up the market for rubber parts (used to reduce vibrations). They then submitted false bids with inflated prices to auto makers such as Nissan and Toyota. This ensured that particular supplies won certain pieces of business.
This isn't the first time the company had been accused of such a crime. In 2011, Bridgestone pleaded guilty to conspiring to price fixing of marine hoses and other agreement. Back then, the company cooperated with investigators and therefore received a reduced penalty. Bridgestone did not do the same this time in the anti-vibration parts business, leading to an increased penalty.
The $425m fine will be reflected on Bridgestone's 2013 results.
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
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Dave posted If we look at Sterling's actions from an ethical perspective and try to step away from the politically-charged aspects, it's reasonable to ask "what harm has he done by his actions?" Strictly speaking, all we know he did was attempt to deny a few people access to a game because of their race. Not cool, but hardly devastating to society. Of course his attitude suggests a pattern of this behavior and, given that he has money and influence, it's likely that he has done more significant harmful things for the wrong reasons. Reasonable speculation, but still speculation. We know that the court of public opinion has rather lenient rules for evidence, so there's enough to damn Sterling by that standard. If the NBA wants to take drastic action it's their business and I have no problem with it.
Not speculation actually. From the article I just linked above:
The Justice Department announced today the largest monetary payment ever obtained by the department in the settlement of a case alleging housing discrimination in the rental of apartments. Los Angeles apartment owner Donald T. Sterling has agreed to pay $2.725 million to settle allegations that he discriminated against African-Americans, Hispanics and families with children at apartment buildings he controls in Los Angeles.
Coates goes on to explain how housing discrimination is at the very foundation for so many of the "race related" problems Americans have such as why minorities are so much more likely to be poor, incarcerated or have a poor education. Rather the opposite of what you describe as not "devastating to society."
It's pretty clear that you don't actually care about what "personally offends" me. You are only seeking validation for what offends you. It's also clear you've already made up your mind as to what is, and is not, offensive. You certainly never asked for my "personal" input, and have already dismissed my concerns about what I do consider to be questionable behavior.
What personally offends you, apparently, is rap music. I'm sorry that you didn't feel that I went out of my way to ask your personal opinion on this matter on this open forum where you have a long history of having no problem expressing your opinion as you wish (as do we all). I will make sure to genuflect appropriately in the future. My point was that you seemed to be taking the position of someone who had nothing at stake by Sterling's comments and actions and thus a calloused view of the entire situation. These are your words:
Why are we even talking about racism anymore?
The Donald Sterling outrage is more about schadenfreude than it is about racial justice.
That does not sound to me like someone who has taken offense. In fact it sounds like someone who does not think this is much of an issue of race at all. So tell me, Dave. Why are we even talking about racism anymore?
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
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So, according to you (Dave), people are not actually upset that he's horribly racist they are just taking delight in the fall of a wealthy team owner? Or do you not understand what schadenfreude is? You are absolutely right that there are greater issues here vis a vis the NAACP lifetime achievement awards and the willingness of businessmen to continue to do business with horrible racists so long as they keep making money. But you didn't say that you said "why are we even talking about racism?" If you're looking for an opportunity to better articulate yourself then by all means do it but pretending that I'm "changing my story" by bringing easily found information to the discussion instead of dismissing that charges of his greater racism is "speculation" is incredibly hollow.
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Topic Author's Reply - May 2, 2014 - 01:39pm PT
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Ron says this issue has ZERO to do with any of us.
Ron has spoken.
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anita514
Gym climber
Great White North
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thus spoke Rong
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anita514
Gym climber
Great White North
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I dunno about schadenfreude, but I love me some schniztel with krautwickel on the side. mmmmmmmmmm.
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Topic Author's Reply - May 2, 2014 - 01:43pm PT
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I love me some schniztel with krautwickel on the side. mmmmmmmmmm.
No sh#t eh? Bring on that German foody goodness!
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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bluey
Muslims are on my radar of late, for good reason. But I will admit only a small minority of Muslims are extremists. So are gun totin' anti-American white racist Patriots on your radar?
Muslims aren't, never have been and never will be on my radar. 99.99% of them are decent god respecting people. Oh yeah, they share their God with Jews and Christians. When Mohammed was on the run from his enemies he fled to Hebrew settlements in the mountains where they took him in and later joined him in battle against enemy tribes. At least one of his wives was Hebrew. I have a couple of Muslim friends and have worked with many. I'd trust all of them with my life. I wouldn't trust a couple of "Christians" I know.
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Topic Author's Reply - May 2, 2014 - 02:01pm PT
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Everybody knows that Old man Donald Limpwinkel has PPE (Player Penis Envy).
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anita514
Gym climber
Great White North
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I had a feeling bluering wasn't down with Muzzies
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Sanskara
climber
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Ah come on you guys are just being over sensitive and taking his words out of context so they fit your context because that's what you guys do lol..
Dontcha see that lol....
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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So are gun totin' anti-American white racist Patriots on your radar?
Sure, if they target innocent people with death.
Do any of you read what is happening in Africa with regard to radical Islamists?
See my map here;
https://maps.google.com/maps/ms?msid=217892262123461097139.00047d7300789724c91fa&msa=0
Yellow indicates a terrorist action, blue is law enforcement against terrorists. Red/Purple thumtacks are US drone strikes.
If you don't think there is a problem with radical Islam, you are putting your head in the sand. They are much more of a threat to innocent people than any other group right now.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Muslims are on your radar?
Got a trip planned to Central African Republic or Nigeria or Somalia or Sudan?
Or Beirut, Cairo, Baghdad, Tehran, Kabul or Islamabad? How about climbing in Yemen?
No?
didn't think so.
Find something credible for your radar please.
Do any of you read what is happening in Africa with regard to radical Islamists? yeaaahhhhhh, very possibly more than you.........so?
Do you feel pain for the Muslim women and children that are being murdered, raped and kidnapped? Whether by Muslims or Christians?
Are you more concerned about the Christians who are murdering, beheading, raping and kidnapping in the Central African Republic than the Muslims they are slaughtering? Yeah, there's plenty of blood on the Muslim's hands as well. So whose religion is right?
I do have Radical Whacko "Patriot militias" on my radar. I suspect there are one or two living down in the canyon below my house. I know there are still a bunch of them harassing the populace down in Bunkerville (appropriate name it seems).
Otherwise my radar screens are blank (well excepting for good ole ex KGB Russian Orthodox Putin) There's an irony for you.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Muslims are on your radar?
Got a trip planned to Central African Republic or Nigeria or Somalia or Sudan?
Or Beirut, Cairo, Baghdad, Tehran, Kabul or Islamabad?
No?
didn't think so.
Find something credible for your radar please.
You do realize that they do indeed come here too, right? Those planes that flew around on 9/11 departed from domestic soil with the visas we gave them to to come here.
In fact, they met with relatives of the Saudi royal family before 9/11, who lived in Sarasota, Florida;
http://www.judicialwatch.org/blog/2013/06/fbi-lied-to-congress-about-fla-saudi-familys-ties-to-911-hijackers/
And we should not forget the first attempt on the World Trade Center, or the Boston Bombings, nor the other attempts that were actually foiled by the FBI by wanna-be bombers. There have been several.
Also, I suppose I should put inner-city black thugs on the radar, as well as South American gangs including Mara Salvatruca (MS-13) and cartel hitmen from Mexico. I forgot about those, thanks. All domestic threats.
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anita514
Gym climber
Great White North
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it's OK bullring, I'm sure there are others here who hate muslims too
f*#king jihadist motherf*#kers
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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bluey
tell me again about the Murrah Federal Building in Oklahoma City and the dead children.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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it's OK bullring, I'm sure there are others here who hate muslims too
f*#king jihadist motherf*#kers
It's o.k., I'm used to being mocked and marginalized. When terrorism touches you or those you love, I'll try to empathize with you.
Also did you hear about the Organ chick who actually invited these rats to her farm? No?
http://buzzpo.com/al-qaeda-set-training-camp-oregon/
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Ah yes, I knew McVeigh would come up. He was a rotten pagan despite peoples' attempts to paint him as a Christian. And there is word that he had help from 'others'.
Why do you think he was executed so quickly? He was an anomaly. It's quite disingenuous, actually very disingenuous, to equate that to the level of Islamic attacks today.
See the last link I posted above.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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go right ahead bluey
Suspect all Muslims. There are only about 1.6 billion of them to check out.
Sweet dreams. Bomb throwing baby eating father raping boogeymen are not in mine.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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go right ahead bluey
Suspect all Muslims. There are only about 1.6 billion of them to check out.
Sweet dreams. Bomb throwing baby eating father raping boogeymen are not in mine.
Okay, now we're going a bit off point. You're trying to marginalize an actual statical threat (Islamists, inner-city youth, and gangs) , in favor of non-threats like legal gun-toting Patriots (Bundy ranch militias).
We disagree here
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
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bluering said You do realize that they do indeed come here too, right? Those planes that flew around on 9/11 departed from domestic soil with the visas we gave them to to come here.
You do realize that "they" (Muslims) are Americans too, right? And that Americans are terrorists. One of the most cited events in reducing the number of militia groups in the 90's was the Oklahoma City bombing, committed by noted Muslim and middle easterner, Timothy Mcveigh.
bluering said Okay, now we're going a bit off point. You're trying to marginalize an actual statical threat (Islamists, inner-city youth, and gangs) , in favor of non-threats like legal gun-toting Patriots (Bundy ranch militias).
Hahah holy sh#t dude. "It's not that I am racist it's that there are these statistical threats, see?" Biotruths are just around the corner. Paging Dave KOS to explain this.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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HDDJ, are you denying who's behind the global violence? From N. Africa and Europe to SouthEast Asia?
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Just last week over 120 girls were kidnapped from a Nigerian school. The group out of Nigeria is Boko Haram (Western education if forbidden), was responsible.
WWBD (What Would Blue Do?).
It's really easy, and covert. Nobody has to know.
British SAS (Who are the best at this shit), SEALs, and Air Force Spec Ops guys start tracking these bastards down. Drone strikes and AC-130 Gunships.
The cancer is defeated one cell at a time.
The cancer is already being attacked in AQAP's Yemen districts. AQIM needs attention too in N. Africa.
Map of Yemeni ops;
https://maps.google.com/maps/ms?msid=217892262123461097139.00047d21bd6d913501f82&msa=0&ll=14.455958,47.867432&spn=6.337527,10.821533
Again, the red/purple thumbtacks are drone-stikes.
These are the people who participated in Benghazi, Ansar-Al-Sharia.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Can I just STFU, Dingus?
No. And you know why?
Because nobody ever says anything when 130 school-girls are abducted by Islamists from their school just because they want to be educated and the Islamists hate Western education.
Racism, bigotry, and misogyny only seem to come forward when it's politically convenient. When it involves whites, Jews, and Christians.
The easy PC targets. I will not be quiet.
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
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bluering asked HDDJ, are you denying who's behind the global violence? From N. Africa and Europe to SouthEast Asia?
Is it Obama? It's Obama isn't it? Or was I supposed to say Agenda 21? I can never get these questions right. Oh wait...BENGHAZI! Nailed it!
In any case, your "Muslims in predominantly Muslim countries are shooting each other therefore I am totally justified in being suspicious of Muslims literally everywhere" justification is really terrible. You also cannot look at conflict in those regions without factoring in the massive influence of colonialism and western intervention. In fact by this same logic pretty much the entire world should be horribly suspicious of Christians and Christian majority countries considering that America has the highest murder rate in the world and the seems to be the most invasion-prone. Not that I expect you to have the ability to reflect on the consequences of your ideology.
bluering complained Racism, bigotry, and misogyny only seem to come forward when it's politically convenient. When it involves whites, Jews, and Christians.
This absurd strawman whining has to stop. Your argument is literally "I am the only one who cares about vulnerable people in Muslim countries which is why I fear Muslims." Everyone here agrees that abducting girls and forcing them to go to religious schools is bad, just not that it means Muslims everywhere are bad. Christians had no problem abducting Native American children and reeducating them and that was literally in the last century.
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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JJ... Just in - "half the people can be part right some of the time"
According to a CBS News/New York Times poll, 49 percent of all Americans think Sterling should be forced to sell the team, but the poll also shows that support is divided along racial lines.
Most African-Americans - 71-percent - think he should be forced to sell while only 43 percent of whites do.
What says the ST poll?
and
V. to BabaWawa
"I think Mr. Sterling is from a different generation than I am," said Stiviano. "I think he was brought up to believe those things, segregation, whites and blacks ... but, through his actions, he's shown that he's not a racist. Through his actions, he's shown to be a very generous and kind man. If he was a real racist, then why would he help the world the way that he has?"
I will observe that she did not follow up with a detailed, or any kind of, list specifying Attorney Sterling's good works.
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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Because nobody ever says anything when 130 school-girls are abducted by Islamists from their school just because they want to be educated and the Islamists hate Western education.
Well, somebody must have said something, else how did you find out?
You're not making stuff up are you?
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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I'm here to tell you nobody ever says nothing when Attorney Sterling's kid od's on drugs:
A drug overdose is the suspected cause of death for Scott Sterling, the son of Los Angeles Clippers owner Donald Sterling, who was found dead at his Malibu home on New Year’s Day.
Scott Ashley Sterling, 32, had not been seen by his friends and family for at least two days before his body was found at the home in the 22600 block of Pacific Coast Highway about 11:30 p.m on Tuesday, reported the Los Angeles Times.
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Topic Author's Reply - May 3, 2014 - 12:30pm PT
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Nobody else's racism excuses Sterling in any way. Why do you guys keep thinking it's ok for Sterling to be a racist because there are other racists in the world?
Yes, I have heard of the girls in Nigeria being abducted. What are you doing about it? Sweet baby Jesus, you didn't even start a thread about it, you just use it here as some kind of bizarre defense of Donald Sterling.
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anita514
Gym climber
Great White North
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no one cares about the girls in Nigeria because they are black and in Africa
if this was a bunch of wholesome white girls from a first world western nation, it would be all over the bloody news.. not like up here where the big news of the day is a crack smoking mayor and a f*#king whale about to explode. or some actor dying.
it is total bullsh#t. no one gives a sh#t about those people.
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WBraun
climber
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anita514 -- "no one gives a sh#t about those people."
Painting a broad gray brush stroke over the landscape never works.
When me Kauk, Bridwell and Shultz were in Africa our govt liaison officer was mistreating the local women.
We told him if he ever tries that again we will kick his ass to kingdom come.
He never went near a woman again while with us for the rest of that month ....
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Nobody else's racism excuses Sterling in any way. Why do you guys keep thinking it's ok for Sterling to be a racist because there are other racists in the world?
You're missing my point. You only celebrate the Donald's of the world while missing the wider picture of more intolerant people.
Yes, I have heard of the girls in Nigeria being abducted. What are you doing about it? Sweet baby Jesus, you didn't even start a thread about it, you just use it here as some kind of bizarre defense of Donald Sterling.
I'm doing quite a bit by bringing awareness to here and on other sites. Why are we deposing Ghaddfai and Morsi, and doing absolutely nothing in Nigeria? Even in Mali we do nothing while the Frenchies are shooting Islamists in the face.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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no one cares about the girls in Nigeria because they are black and in Africa
if this was a bunch of wholesome white girls from a first world western nation, it would be all over the bloody news.. not like up here where the big news of the day is a crack smoking mayor and a f*#king whale about to explode. or some actor dying.
it is total bullsh#t. no one gives a sh#t about those people.
Isn't it funny that the "bigoted misogynist" is the only one talking about abuses of young black women in Africa?
I don't really care about race or sex. The crime against humanity and the being is the focus here.
It just puzzles me why this sh#t doesn't get wider support, where is the stupid UN on this?
Lets focus on that rich, white, old Jew who owns a sports team.
People are f*#king stupid, while sanctimoniously claiming to be just.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Painting a broad gray brush stroke over the landscape never works.
When me Kauk, Bridwell and Shultz were in Africa our govt liaison officer was mistreating the local women.
We told him if he ever tries that again we will kick his ass to kingdom come.
He never went near a woman again while with us for the rest of that month ....
See, now that's a man. A real man. Werner should be our next Secretary of State.
He could even do body recoveries out of embassies....
(maybe a bad joke...)
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Maybe Anita has more sack than you, Bruce.
I'll admit that this was uncalled for.....just 'sayin
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anita514
Gym climber
Great White North
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give me a few more months on these hormone supplements and I'll catch up
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John M
climber
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Painting a broad gray brush stroke over the landscape never works.
Exactly..
then again.. "Americans are stupid" is a pretty broad stroke too.
:-D
Hey Blue..
If you had said. "you know, that Sterling guy really sucks, I don't like that stuff, I also don't like that these black panthers say they want to kill white babies and they appear to get away with it". Then you might have drawn more people to what you had to say.
But you didn't say that.
Instead you said.. " why are people always picking on rich white guys rather then these black panthers?".
The answer is simple. This particular rich white guy deserves every bit of trouble that comes his way. You chose a poor example for your cause of "those poor rich picked on white guys". You and Lois should join up because she feels the same way and is as bad at picking examples as you are.
And now you are still trying to make your case by bringing up these kidnapped girls. You are doubling down on your bet. The problem is.. this particular rich white guy isn't a good example of "why does the media/liberals pick on the rich white man?" which appears to be one of your premises.
just for you Blue.. the bible has a teaching about this. It says.. "to whom much is given, much is required". Thats why rich guys get picked on a lot. They should if they act out of line because they have been given much. They have all of their physical needs met, and yet still they are greedy for more. I don't have a problem with people getting rich. I have a problem with what they do with it and how they got rich. People who use their wealth to bully poor people are unworthy of respect, no matter how much money they have.
has this guy changed and is now doing good works? I haven't seen any evidence of it. Did he repent and help those poor people he trod on? He paid a fine but I haven't seen any contrition or a change of heart.
So just exactly who are you defending?
there are many reasons why Jesus said "sell all that you have and give the money to poor and come follow me". One could be because the rich guy in the bible was just like this white guy, he hadn't yet gotten over his feelings of superiority.
If you want to say.. Its a shame that the media hasn't picked up more on these girls being kidnapped, and that America doesn't seem to be concerned, but instead you keep tying it back to your premise.. " those poor picked on rich white guys".
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John Duffield
Mountain climber
New York
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Donald Trump doubles down, insists racist Donald Sterling rant recording 'was a total set-up' captured by 'the girlfriend from hell'
Somehow, I figured there'd be no "Celebrity Apprentice" appearance for her.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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John, I think you see the trees through the forest regarding my sentiments. Maybe I'm not as coherent as I should be. Or maybe I'm just stuck fighting off race-baiters who would like to paint me in a certain light.
Whatever.
Sterling did nothing wrong, aside from professing his personal opinions. Sure, the guy's a racist but that is his personal liberty! He doesn't hurt anybdyd. Quite the opposite! He hires "slaves" at million dollar contracts.
His racism comes from his feeling his superiority to those people. But is that really racist? Or is it more ELITIST?
I think that was his additional problem.
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John M
climber
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Sterling did nothing wrong,
thats where you and I disagree. In fact its quite disturbing to me that you would say such a thing. Just because ones racism is "under control" and not blatant doesn't make it right. How he treated that girl was wrong and ugly and that has nothing to do with whatever their relationship was.
Its his right to have these feelings. But that right doesn't mean that he is right or that it is okay to have those feelings/beliefs. They are ugly and he should be ashamed of them. I applaud everyone who expressed their disgust and I wish that people would boycott anything he owns or does until he shows contrition and a changed attitude. Otherwise we are just rewarding that behavior.
you may be defending his right to have that attitude. But then We are defending our right to say its an ugly attitude. The law can do nothing about him because he has the right to have that attitude, but the public certain can do something by expressing its right to say they find it disgusting.
For you to say that he did nothing wrong is either ignorant or ugly.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Bluey is right, but that don't make it right.
And I would aver that "Americans are stoopid" is painted with a rapier.
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John M
climber
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Blue is right in his statement that the man has the right to have this vulgar opinion. But he is wrong to state that the man did nothing wrong. Sterling most certainly did do something wrong and I would want nothing to do with him.
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Topic Author's Reply - May 3, 2014 - 03:31pm PT
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Quite the opposite! He hires "slaves" at million dollar contracts.
"I feed them, and buy them cars and houses."
As though the money came directly from his pocket.
To me it seems that the hired slaves, their skill, their charisma, and THEIR ability to put asses in stadium chairs and sell products is where the money comes from, not the deep abiding goodness of Donald's heart.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Well, Survival, you are hinting at my point. This as#@&%e was 1/3 racist and 2/3 Elitist pig.
Generally, the guy's not a good person. But I never met him.
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dirtbag
climber
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A person can be 100% both.
Earlier he also called called black people are smelly and claimed they attract vermin.
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
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bluering posted You're missing my point. You only celebrate the Donald's of the world while missing the wider picture of more intolerant people.
Uh, no actually. You just like to pretend that's true so you can avoid dealing with your own issues. It's the very definition of a "strawman." Race issues get brought up all the time and you dismiss them by saying they are "playing the race card." You're literally using these examples to explain why we shouldn't be upset about Sterling and also why we should fear Muslims living around us. That is your point. We are not missing it. We are explaining how your "point" is bigotry.
bluering posted Sterling did nothing wrong, aside from professing his personal opinions. Sure, the guy's a racist but that is his personal liberty! He doesn't hurt anybdyd. Quite the opposite! He hires "slaves" at million dollar contracts.
So long as you define blatant housing discrimination for which he was fined over $2 million and the marginalization of an entire class of Americans as "nothing wrong." That's really the whole point isn't it? So long as he's not literally kidnapping black women you don't see a crime here. What's more American than marginalizing black people and redlining them out of neighborhoods where they might have good schools and a low crime rate, right? Plus that helps keep most of the Muslims in one place. bluering and Donald Sterling: True Patriots!
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Uh, no actually. You just like to pretend that's true so you can avoid dealing with your own issues. It's the very definition of a "strawman." Race issues get brought up all the time and you dismiss them by saying they are "playing the race card." You're literally using these examples to explain why we shouldn't be upset about Sterling and also why we should fear Muslims living around us. That is your point. We are not missing it. We are explaining how your "point" is bigotry.
Wow, you might be clinically insane on this race crap. How am I a bigot again? Feel free to use anything I posted here to demonstrate that.
You f*#king idiots strive so hard to find racial issues in anything that you lose sight of real problems.
It is YOU that has a problem. I like about 20% of the people I meet, the others I tolerate...You f*#king people seem to have a hate that I think you don't realize. You are actually probably more intolerant than myself.
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
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bluering retorted How am I a bigot again? Feel free to use anything I posted here to demonstrate that.
Cripes. You have to be trolling so I'm out.
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pyro
Big Wall climber
Calabasas
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Clipper 3 golden state 3
damn if the golden state wins then their plan worked.
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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Boko Haram is apparently some sort of Nigerian militia and a force to be reckoned with. No tactic, including exploiting the Internet, is beneath this sorry lot. It is unlikely that ST posters will be contacted (see below), but if you are you should familiarize yourself with this group so that you know who you are dealing with.
It was gathered that the group uses the Internet to propagate its activities and enhance its radicalisation and circulation of extremist ideologies. Boko Haram is reportedly planning to greatly increase its following in many states. Talk of Naija reported that Boko Haram has been involved in a recruitment drive, and they are allegedly targeting Muslims between ages of 17 and 30, and have also been recruiting freed prisoners through prison breaks. The group is also known to assign non-Kanuris on suicide missions
Avoid in particular the Al Muntada Trust Fund and the Islamic Word Society.
Funding sources for Boko Haram are not certain, but is believed to be partially funded by bank robberies[16][24][26] and by other Islamist groups. In February 2012, recently arrested officials revealed that "while the organisation initially relied on donations from members, its links with Al-Qaeda in the Islamic Maghreb, AQIM, opened it up to more funding from groups in Saudi Arabia and the UK". They went on to say that other sources of funding included the Al Muntada Trust Fund and the Islamic World Society
Join with bluering and zBrown in condemning these Muslim thugs. They have not yet been seen in the Southern California deserts, but signs are rumoured to be in the process of modifcation, warning travelers to be careful.
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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Boko update
Nigerian Islamist militant group Boko Haram has threatened to "sell" the hundreds of schoolgirls it abducted three weeks ago.
Militant leader Abubakar Shekau sent a video obtained by the AFP news agency, in which he said for the first time that his group had taken the girls.
About 230 girls are still believed to be missing, prompting widespread criticism of the Nigerian government.
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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Definitely not a Whiter Shade of Pale, I'd say.
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
mammoth lakes ca
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DMT...The waitress left her tazer at home...?
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Dingus, yer right, A Whiter Shade Of Pale is germane to this discussion.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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The inevitable Conspiracy Theory!
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Topic Author's Reply - May 5, 2014 - 07:12pm PT
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I knew it was a black mans fault!
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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“Gigalo?” “Slut?” Same difference
Is a 'gigalo' a million sluts?
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
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Rosoide posted You guys are missing the key element here. This whole thing is not about racism. It is about a ploy to get the owner to sell the team. Somebody (Magic Johnson? ) wants to purchase the Clippers. Little problem. It is not for sale and even if it were, 500 M is just a bit pricey. So how about we create a big ruckus to force the sale of the team and, in the process, the team gets devalued i.e. we get a better price?
I think you're watching (and believing) a little too much House of Cards.
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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Boko update. Has Magic and/or Karim joined us in condemning these Muslim thugs? Maybe too busy trying to get back into round ball, huh?
Nigeria abductions: 6 reasons why the world should demand action
http://www.cnn.com/2014/05/06/world/africa/nigeria-abductions-why-it-matters/
Ownership, ownership, owndership
"We need to take ownership as if this happened in Chicago or this happened in Washington, D.C.,"
People are thinking, this doesn't affect my country, but I'm telling them terrorists ... didn't just wake up one morning and decide to become terrorists,"
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Topic Author's Reply - May 6, 2014 - 09:37am PT
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What I offered is but a speculative theory but it does say a whole lot about human nature.
It says a lot about your imagination, that's for sure.
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Topic Author's Reply - May 13, 2014 - 12:17pm PT
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Old Donald the CLOWN certainly didn't do himself any favors in his interview on CNN did he?
He went from pseudo apology, to Magic rant, to calling Anderson Cooper more racist than he is!
[Click to View YouTube Video]
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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May 13, 2014 - 12:28pm PT
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In my wife's professional medical opinion he has early dementia.
In The Donald's defense I averred that it is full-blown.
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John Duffield
Mountain climber
New York
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May 13, 2014 - 12:34pm PT
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But Magic overplayed his hand. Saying he would like to buy the team. Prolly be a dust up over who gets the team. Always something in that little world.
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Sanskara
climber
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May 13, 2014 - 12:37pm PT
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Omg!
I can't help but say it its so obvious. I should bite my tongue but f*#k it..
Guy sounds just like Blue trying to backtalk his way outa some ST forum sh#t show lol..
F*#king classic these retards..
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Topic Author's Reply - May 13, 2014 - 12:41pm PT
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He's the whiniest gozillionaire I've ever heard!!
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crankster
Trad climber
South Lake Tahoe, CA
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May 13, 2014 - 01:13pm PT
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In an extraordinary television interview that deepened the anger over his ownership of the Clippers, Donald Sterling attacked Lakers great Magic Johnson, suggested that African Americans have not done enough to help their community and blamed the media for creating the turmoil that envelops his team and his family.
Text book right-wing strategy, blame the media (see any post by Ron, et al).
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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May 13, 2014 - 01:42pm PT
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Seriously, he would be well advised to pull out the Alzheimers card.
That would end this tout de suite.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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May 13, 2014 - 02:39pm PT
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to my mind the worst piece is at the end of the interview (and that's saying something)
Through the Magic Johnson Foundation, the former Laker has donated millions to children and minority entrepreneurs. “I spend millions on giving away and helping minorities,” Sterling said. “Does he do that? That’s one problem I have. Jews, when they get successful, they will help their people. And some of the African-Americans — maybe I will get in trouble again — they don’t want to help anybody.” Yes, he probably has dementia. He shows a lot of the symptoms. I watched a friend suffer from it for about 5 years. He slowly lost his ability to filter his thoughts and generally said exactly what came to his mind which was often very hurtful to his wife of 60 or so years.
I believe Sterling's real character comes through in that interview. He's also totally dismissive of V. It's clear she was just his playtoy. How she felt about S is not so clear.
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blahblah
Gym climber
Boulder
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May 13, 2014 - 02:55pm PT
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The NBA seems fairly confident now that they will win any legal battle that Sterling or his wife might start.
Not clear to me that Sterling or his wife will be ones that "start" any legal battle.
Right now, they own the team. Seems to me that the NBA will be the one that will need to start a legal battle if it wants to change that unilaterally (but I admit this could be tricky and of course I may be mistaken!).
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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May 13, 2014 - 02:59pm PT
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You can tell that, due to his money, he's become way overly accustomed to sycophantic people just nodding their heads in agreement whenever he talks. His problem now is that he's talking to the general public, media and league people used to dealing with rich folks, and a circle of peers with as much money as himself. Everytime he opens his mouth the whole situation just becomes that much clearer.
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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May 13, 2014 - 03:12pm PT
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When you see dudes like Sterling and hear the shite that comes out of their mouths (Trump also comes to mind) you really wonder how the income inequality gap ever came about.
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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May 13, 2014 - 03:39pm PT
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"It bothers me a lot that you want to broadcast that you’re associating with black people," he is heard saying. "Do you have to?"
Stiviano says that all she did was take a picture with someone she admires. "I think the fact that you admire [Magic] -- I've known him well, and he should be admired," Sterling replies. "And I'm just saying that it's too bad you can't admire him privately. And during your ENTIRE F*#KING LIFE, your whole life, admire him -- bring him here, feed him, f*#k him, I don't care. You can do anything. But don't put him on an Instagram for the world to see so they have to call me. And don't bring him to my games. OK?"
I dunno. Seems like he invited her to bring him around, hang out, have sex, what have you but felt insecure about his girlfriend being seen with studly black NBA players. That in a private conversation is enough to fine millions and force the team to be sold?
The guy already had received one lifetime achievement award from the Naacp and was slated to receive a second lifetime achievement award (before this scandal) Seems like there must be bigger fish to fry than this. If some gal friend recording any black NBA player telling her not to be seen with rich white dudes or even making blatant "reverse" racist comments, I doubt a eyebrow would be raised. Why not just let the chips fall where they may and if black stars won't play with the team, it problem resolves itself.
Otherwise, how many of us have worked for a jerk boss? At least they get millions and millions for it.
Peace
Karl
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Topic Author's Reply - May 13, 2014 - 03:48pm PT
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Shut up Karl.
KIDDING!!!! BWA HA HA hahahahaaa!!!
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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May 13, 2014 - 03:52pm PT
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Certainly not Sterling silver. The old rust bucket definitely has many holes in it.
What I want to know is when Anderson Cooper is going to interview himself and ask "Anderson, why did you not challenge him on ... [your list here]?"
e.g.
Who do you have sex with?
Do you have HIV?
Have you ever screwed any of your tenants?
Did you get a receipt for all those Goodwill Donations?
What is the amount you claim for charitable deductions on your return?
What is your tax savings for those deductions?
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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May 13, 2014 - 04:55pm PT
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Ok, now is coming out a very problematic likely truth: Sterling has dementia.
His rambling, bizarre interview on CNN is hard to understand in any other context.
Perhaps those of you who have had demented parents can talk about the bizarre personality changes, paranoia, rants, racial and religious diatribes that are seen.
So, is it reasonable to take action against someone who is so severely handicapped?
If you had a mentally disabled child who said hateful things, would that be sufficient grounds to take away that families' business?
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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May 24, 2014 - 10:37am PT
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Grant Hill and Yao Ming join Justin Bieber, Magic Johnson, Rihanna, Oprah, Floyd Mayweather and former Microsoft CEO Steve Ballmer on a rapidly-growing list of potential investors in the club.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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May 29, 2014 - 08:58pm PT
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I wouldn't relish going up against Oprah, she'll go all Moses Malone ovah ya!
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de la Playa
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Jun 11, 2014 - 06:53am PT
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Donald Sterling calls NBA brass 'despicable monsters' in bid to keep Clippers
"The NBA continues to thrive and exact its reign of terror in large part from the money it receives from the fans," Sterling said in a statement obtained by the Daily News. "The NBA is a band of hypocrites and bullies. They will not stop until someone stands up. They have taken the liberty to desecrate my privacy rights and my right to own property."
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/sterling-calls-nba-dispicable-monsters-bid-clippers-article-1.1824955
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