America the "exceptional" should provide free healthcare....

The United Socialist States

Incredible that ppl can argue with the OP statement. That is super f*#ked up.

I will work 60 hour weeks to make a modest salary and do the weekend warrior thing and pay for your health care.

Incredible that ppl can argue with the OP statement. That is super f*#ked up.

How much do Canadians and Germans and Swedes contribute to medical R & D compared to the U.S.?

Free, anything

I'm already doing that to pay for my own healthcare.

how in the F*#K can you think obama's signing a market based system developed by romney and tweaked into GOP congress passable implimentation by paul ryan as a win for socialism?!?!?!?!?!

And even though the U.S. spends $2.7 trillion a year, nearly 18 percent of gross domestic product (GDP), on health care, it’s not keeping up with the rest of the developed world when it comes to improving people’s health.

“It does show pretty clearly that price is the culprit here,” Dr. Hamilton Moses of the Alerion Institute in Virginia and Johns Hopkins University told reporters.

“Based on this review…the U.S. ‘system’ has performed relatively poorly,” Moses and colleagues wrote in the report, published in the Journal of the American Medical Association. Their findings echo what other experts have found – U.S. health care gives little value for the money.

Still way cheaper? Hahahaha

You might want to do a little less posting and a little more thinking there.

But i do agree BEFORE A DIME is given to any foreign country,, our health care system should be fixed first.

You thought , like millions of Americans, that Obamacare would result in someone else paying for your health care.

The Michael Moore documentary "SICKO" addresses this problem quite well.

But we can't afford healthcare

Obamacare is not an attempt to provide affordable health care to the American people , it is a project by the radical left to gain control of 1/6 of the American economy and to expand the control of the Federal government over the lives of individual Americans.

Obama and his extremist supporters want nothing less that total control of health care access in the US.. A single-payer system is what they are incrementally striving towards, in which the federal government , run by themselves of course, will be in complete control of people's health needs and services.

Oh, (not to Kos) and please don't slander my best friend unless you know him as well as I do. lynnie

Just annoying when people make comments that are not based on knowledge

You think the Obamacare website is a disaster? I've worked on several major government/defense IT major projects that were 10X the budget of the Obamacare site. All of them complete disasters. And we keep throwing money at them, without question.

What the heck does jesus have to do with it? If you read Matthew 5,6 and 7 you'd see that jesus took care of the poor and the sick and encouraged people to not make possessions, but people, their priority. :)

Fixed it for you.

Socialism levels the field to lower middle class....and the poor go wanting.

One only needs to visit a Socialist society to see this in action.

The happiest people in the world apparently reside in northern Europe, according to a 156-nation survey published by the United Nations Sustainable Development Solutions Network.

Released Monday, the 2013 World Happiness Report ranks the happiest countries around the globe, with Denmark, Norway and Switzerland leading the pack. Among North American countries, Canada took sixth place, while Mexico (16) slightly outranked the U.S. (17)...

And standing in the way of a solution? the repub party

Also, let's look at it this way...

A bunch of privileged, "exceptional" and special individuals aka
citizens of "first world countries" wants to engage in egotistical,
"adult child" lifestyle by engaging in various risky sports.

OMG, they owe to cover my MRI I was climbing without warmup!!!
I neglected my conditioning and I just have to be The First sending
this one!

hahaha...really, no one owed free care to anyone

Norton wrote: the truth? you think you can handle the truth, Sparky?
http://images.politico.com/global/2013/09/27/politico_understanding_obamacare_guide.html

Socialism levels the field to lower middle class....and the poor go wanting.

One only needs to visit a Socialist society to see this in action.

@Pyro"..Simple, really".

Those who can debate, do

Those who can't, post pictures and cartoons.

he U.S. government has just passed a new law entitled “The Affordable Boat Act” declaring that every citizen MUST purchase a new boat by April, 2014.

These ‘affordable’ boats will cost an average of $54,000-$155,000 each. This does not include taxes, trailers, towing fees, licensing and registration fees, fuel, docking and storage fees, maintenance, or repair costs.

This law has been passed because, until now, typically only wealthy and financially responsible people have been able to purchase boats. This new law ensures that every American can now have an ‘affordable’ boat of their own, because everyone is ‘entitled’ to a new boat. If you purchase your boat before the end of the year, you will receive four ‘free’ life jackets (does not include monthly usage fees).

In order to make sure everyone purchases an ‘affordable boat,’ the cost of owning a boat will increase on average of 250-400% per year. This way, wealthy people will pay more for something that other people don’t want or can’t afford to maintain. But, to be fair, people who can’t afford to maintain their boat will be regularly fined and children (under the age of 26) can use their parents boat(s) to party on until they turn 27, after which date they must purchase their own boat..............

Let's prove that "American Exceptionalisim" is more than just hubris. The richest country on earth....a country with 27 year old billionaires and super rich hedge fund managers and venture capitalist who produce nothing, a country with a growing and dangerous divide in the wealth of it's citizens....the least a country like our's can do is provide universal health care from the cradle to the grave.
The rich can grumble about socialisim but they'll still be able to build 20,000 square foot mansions in Aspen that they use two weeks a year.

In our current system often the uninsured seek treatment in the most inefficient way possible. They wait until they are really f*#cked and then they go to the ER.

History has proven that the recent health care system for America , the so-called free market system , didn't work and was failing horribly.

Could we have a government provided system for all AND private providers for those who could afford pay for it? What if the gov. system regulated prices and/or negotiated prices.

The providers who opt out of taking gov.-funded patients could compete for the high-paying customers. Those providers could charge according to the market. And patients who choose to go to them would be responsible to pay for services themselves. Those patients would still be funding the gov. system through taxation, and the conservatives would cry foul. Let 'em cry, because right now the majority of us are crying foul. If my hypothetical system improved the situation for the majority then democracy might be working.

I realize there are a nearly infinite number of variables and details to work out. My point is that I'd like to hear this type of discussion rather than the nonsensical delusions about a capitalist system or socialist system that doesn't even exist.

The ACA is a result of a weak-spined, capitulating, naive Democratic POTUS against the 'we don't give a sh#t about healthcare' GOP who wouldn't do a goddam thing to address the problem at any time, in any way, shape or form.

Damn right that's the true intent. Only a moron would believe that the shithole ACA was the intended end product of this effort.

well, another difference is that i admire people who have become rich (as long as they do it legally) including the hedge fund managers and venture capitalists who risk the funds and capital that allow entrepreneurs to build cool stuff and employ lots of people

bharata = corniss chopper?

Hahahahaha

Moron.

You're correct

The rest of you are just deranged , brain-damaged , perverse baby boomers who are more or less permanently disfigured by the historical era you grew up in.

I always gave most of you the benefit of the doubt, just dyed in the wool Dems. But after reading some of this bullshit you're spouting, it's apparent that you've made my case for me. You're Socialists and outright Commies!

ACA is great for poor people. It completly sucks for the just getting by working class. I will have to pay a rather hefty monthly premium that I can not afford for a plan with huge deductables and co pays. The bronz plan Works out to about 12+K a year if I actually got hurt or real sick. The way I see it I allready pay pleanty of taxes! Use my tax dollars to provide us with real universal health care instead of pissing it all away on lawmakers salerys and bennifits as well as invasions, meddeling and nation building. Don't hit me with a $3200 tax for a health plan that dosen,t cover sh#t and will cost me an additional 9K if I actually need care.

Welcome to Communism. Destroy the middle class and steal the welath of the 'rich' in the guise of 'helping the poor'.

It does not take a rocket scientist to figure out that providers are simply not going to take these plans

Europe is even waking up to this, they are becoming more nationalistic and fiscally prudent as we speak.

It might be interesting to hear from people who do NOT feel that basic health care is a fundamental right within a civilized society. If you are one such person who does not feel that everyone is so entitled, can you tell us why? Do you feel education is a basic right? What about police protection? What about public roads? Also in your argument do not use extremes like a full set of dental implants for the patient who has "meth mouth" (abused methamphetamine and rotted out his teeth). We are talking about treating that patient's dental pain with antibiotics and analgesics along with someplace where he can go to extract the rotten teeth still in his jaw.

If you do not feel it is a basic right in a civilized society, please tell us why?

Yeah, that's totally true when one ignores the examples of Russia and China and Eastern Europe and North Korea and Cuba, and ...

venesuala has turned itself around brilliantly in the last 15 years under the direction of socialist not sold out to blueeys pride and joy

nowhere on the globe matches their achievements in the reduction of poverty and the advancement of education and healthcare

no wonder the capitalists are pissed...

Venezuela is still part of opec!

Do you follow geo-politics? Venezuela is seizing private businesses by the gov't! They are actually turning from communism into a fascist State.

My old man always taught me that the good lord saw fit to give you two things for free. Air and water. Everything else in life that you want you'd better go and get yourself.

Nothing is free in the world - including health care. If you want it you'd better be willing to work for it.

Your old man was wrong. 1 out of every 8 people on the planet do not have access to safe and clean drinking water...free or not. 99% of all fatalities from drinking water occur in the third world.

You mean,better than the one he himself inadvertently presents?

No need.

Curt...

Just curious...

Why do you sign "Curt"???...

You're name's right next to your post...

???...

we should have no public education, no public police and fire services and no public roads - to but name a few. No public libraries, either. That is the natural conclusion to what you are putting forth.

It does not sound to me as though they brought in on consult anyone who particularly knows his ass from a hole in the ground when it comes to healthcare.

he Atlantic reports that in practice, this means that a married couple in New York making more than a combined $62,040 gets no subsidies from Obamacare. But two people who live together without getting married? They can make up to a combined $91,920 and still get subsidies from the government.

The government has a clear and compelling interest in promoting marriage: Virtually all of the research shows that stable marriages increase economic output, reduce poverty, shrink income inequality, lower rates of incarceration and drug use, and spur the creation of future taxpayers (aka babies). The tax code already discriminates against the government's interest by providing an economic incentive for couples to choose cohabitation over marriage. Now Obamacare has come along to magnify the discrimination.

It's not clear whether this perversity is accidental or by design. But it's yet another line item in the argument against what is clearly the most catastrophic piece of legislation in modern American history

If you - or anyone else - opposes public healthcare, why are you not also opposing public education? Public roads? Public police services? On what basis do you make this distinction? What is your criteria. Using your logic, we should not pay to send poor people's children to public schools? Actually that is a rather good question given some of the outcomes of various schools but such is another issue altogether issue having nothing to do with what we are addressing, at hand.

What if someone never worked a day in his life but he goes to the library and checks out a book? He did not pay one cent for that book yet he read it cover to cover? Have you been violated? Blue, TGT, others? Why are you OK with public education and public police protection but you are NOT OK with public healthcare. On what basis do you make the distinction?

Water has never ever been free. Not in the history of the world.

DMT

blue:

people are not "f*#king stupid" albeit some may be so. We are not talking about "feeling" anything. We are talking about delineating what are your criteria for that which falls in the public realm. There is nothing "stupid" - f*#king or otherwise - about this question. It is simply asking you to define your criteria.

In 1st world countries we understand this shit!

Yea, that's why we don't have single payer though 1st world countries do, eh?

Right Todd....regarding other first world countries we are an exception but certainly not exceptional in this area.....pathetic might be a better word.

Perhaps it would be more helpful in understanding your position if instead of telling us all how stupid we are, you could instead share with us how you define the criteria which underlie the statements you make.

Well, yer real smart, huh? Ever wonder why the US is the #1 economy in the world and not Venezuela?

Is that really the most important criteria? Why is the US nowhere near the top of the list of countries with the highest standard of living, most satisfied (happiest) citizens, or overall quality of healthcare. Perhaps your priorities are a little whacked.

Curt

Don't you find that question weird? Like it was intended to draw a certain answer?

I did not think that comment to Donini answered the question I posed. Would you mind stating it again here. What is your criteria for determining what is and what is not appropriately in the public domain?

Everything public, is public!

It's just that you insist on using Venezuela as your poster-child example of "socialism" instead of Denmark, Sweden or a number of other socialized democratic countries where the comparison would look quite different. That's all.

Curt

I brought this up earlier, but watch Northern Europe in the future. They are changing. Socialism has rotted them and they know it and feel it.

Just sayin'....

Blue,

I pose the concept that healthcare is appropriately something which should l fall in the public domain - the same category as police protection, education, public roads, etc. I infer that you disagree. It would seem (from your rather colorful language) that you do not feel universal health care is appropriately in this realm. So again I ask you - what is your criteria for making this determination?