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Patrick Sawyer

climber

Originally California now Ireland

Topic Author's Original Post - Oct 25, 2013 - 07:39pm PT

Some months back Ron started a thread about SF. Okay being born and raised in the East Bay, so not a native of The City, I still worked there and played football there.

My Irish partner Jennie, who has worked and travelled in a number of countries, like I have, we think that over Paris, London, Singapore, Cape Town, Rio, Buenos Aires, Sydney, New York, Chicago, Munich, Moscow... you name it...

San Francisco is the best.

Seattle and Paris come a close second.

But this is all subjective. Boston, New Orleans, Tokyo, Kobe, Hong Kong, Perth (both Australia and Scotland, oops on the latter), Auckland, Santiago, Mexico City (hmmm, not sure about that one), but Guadalajara (prettiest city in Mexico IMO), Atlanta (not too bad), Barcelona (okay, up there with Seattle and Paris), Madrid, gosh the list is endless of great cities.

But The City By The Bay, Baghdad by the Bay as Herb Caen put it, it's tops in my eyes.

Just no good crags around SF.

At least Dalkey Quarry is a good place, 20 minutes from Dublin city centre by train. But now I am in the Sunny Southeast (yeah, and pull the other leg while you are at it).

Now I have to find out what the rock at Rocklands, Wexford town is like. Short, but let's hope it is sweet.

g-tech

Trad climber

Oakland!

Oct 25, 2013 - 07:52pm PT

I loved SF 15 years ago when I first moved there. It's turned into one big yuppie filled Marina district since then. Oakland is the place
To be these days!

Reilly

Mountain climber

The Other Monrovia- CA

Oct 25, 2013 - 09:56pm PT

SFO is ok but I prefer Quebec City, Chicago, or Boston on this side of the Pond. It doesn't hold a candle to Paris, Prague, London, or Venice. Buenos Aires is a crime-ridden arm pit
these days. I also give high marks to Stockholm.

Dr.Sprock

Boulder climber

I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!

Oct 25, 2013 - 10:58pm PT

all the cool people moved out by 67, Winterland turned into condos, Bay Bridge series turned into a nightmare, Salvadorian gangs took over the Mish,

however, Giants won the series and the new ballpark is a hit,

carol doda retired, tower records is gone, Jerry Garcia passed, Bill Graham is toast, financial district is 24 hour gridlock, crab cocktails on wharf cost a fortune,

however, Planet Granite SF is awesome,

sutro towers turned into an AIDS factory, south of market is a death trap, muni drivers are full of hate, golden gate costs 5 bucks, irish drinkers in north beach are buried in shallow graves,

however, Bimbos 361 Club is still open,

kerouac, cassidy, ginsberg are dead, mayor moscone gunned down by a mutant, X took the place of owsley LSD, no more drunken new years eve concerts at the cow palace, just the exotic erotic freak show,

however, the Ampex sign along 101 is still there,

kenny morrell

Trad climber

danville,ca

Oct 25, 2013 - 11:32pm PT

First of all Hi patty. Being a bay area boy I always loved going into the city for either music (winterland) or just to party. I remember the first time I heard "lights" by Journey I was standing up on highway 80 in Rock Springs Wyoming hitch-hiking home. This girl stopped to give me a ride so I jumped in and asked where are you going she said san francisco. great! ,we took off and she put on the radio thats when I heard lights. It made me kind of home sick. She was super nice and it was a great ride. Wyoming to walnut creek ca. one ride yeah!

climbski2

Mountain climber

Anchorage AK, Reno NV

Oct 25, 2013 - 11:37pm PT

SO far San Francisco is in a tie with Vancouver for best city I have visited. I like Seattle and San Diego also but they are not as good as those two.

climbski2

Mountain climber

Anchorage AK, Reno NV

Oct 26, 2013 - 12:26am PT

Always go there when I visit.. Beautiful spot... uhn it's sorta south of Baker though ..

paul roehl

Boulder climber

california

Oct 26, 2013 - 02:18am PT

I love the city, went to grammar school at Starr King Elementary near Potrero Hill and then moved to San Bruno. San Francisco is a great city, the city of St. Francis of William Keith and Arthur Matthews and so many great artists and poets and musicians and writers and comedians. The only city that compares to Paris in its lightness and beauty. I love the city.

Patrick Sawyer

climber

Originally California now Ireland

Topic Author's Reply - Oct 26, 2013 - 03:30am PT

g-tech, yeah Indian Rock (okay Berkeley not Oakland), I met some great climbers there.

My mother worked in dentistry for years in Oakland (Naismith Dental Group, next to Kaiser).

I spent first and second grade at Saint Francis de Sales school (the cathedral was demolished after it suffered extensive damage in the Loma Prieta earthquake). It was across the street from the main Greyhound station in Oakland.

Since St Mary's Elementary in Walnut Creek did not have any spaces open after we moved from Lafayette to Saranap, Mac, Mary and I commuted by Greyhound for two years, the old El Curtola (Highway 24) on-ramp (now gone) was a Greyhound stop. Mac would always get to Oakland and then skip school. I was kicked out of First Communion for speaking in the cathedral, the nuns were harsh (aren't they always).

There were the three musketeers Jesse (Hispanic American), Tony (Anthony, African-American) and Patrick (Euro-American), and we kicked up a fuss for the nuns. I suppose I should not really mention ethnic backgrounds but it does illustrate the diversity.

Back in those days a kid could travel safely on a bus by himself with just primarily businessmen as passengers who would look after you. I wouldn't do that nowadays. But then we also left our front door open (albeit with a screen door), such innocent times.

There was one burglar in the area (Saranap) and he ended up in San Quentin. One of his sons was the bassist in a band I played in (I was a lousy rhythm guitar).

Oakland is a good city. Jerry Brown and other mayors (Ron Dellums, Jean Quan) helped to turn the city around.

Despite denials by the state authorities in places like Nevada and Idaho, it has been proven that they would give their homeless a stipend and one-way ticket to SF. Check it out. It's true.

Dump everything on SF.

Playing for San Francisco Celtic, San Francisco Hungarians (I have no Hungarian in me, but I went out with a gal of Hungarian ancestry), AC Mexico, and San Francisco Concordia (okay, I do have some German blood in me), head chef and kitchen manager at Sea of Cortez (Pier 39), playing football at the old Balboa Park and on the soccer fields of Golden Gate Park, freezing my butt of surfing and swimming off the Great Highway.

Escorting (sort of) Paul Butterfield and his blues band who were staying at (I think) The Seal Rock Hotel. He was going to do a gig at Diablo Valley College and one of my brother's (and mine) best mates Craig Smith had organized the gig, and as a 14-year-old walking in the parking lot with a Woodstock veteran like Paul and chatting with him, unforgettable.

(Just a side note of another unforgettable experience, spending a late evening at the Jazz Basement in Soho, London - I was working on Jazz Express magazine at the time - with Benny Carter on his 83rd birthday, being regaled by his tales of being an African-American playing jazz in the 1930s/40s/50s/60s/70 and the discrimination he came up against. And as well his stories of playing alongside jazz great. Unforgettable.)

But back to SF. Is there any city in this world that does not see the problems that SF has... name one and I will send you a dollar.

Patrick Sawyer

climber

Originally California now Ireland

Topic Author's Reply - Oct 26, 2013 - 04:29am PT

Tioga, my late father was from Olympia/Tumwater, where his father was a well-respected judge. I have loads of relatives in the Puget Sound area.

You claim that SF is the armpit of the West Coast, actually I always heard that Tacoma is the armpit of the Pacific Northwest.

Dr.Sprock

Boulder climber

I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!

Oct 26, 2013 - 07:10am PT

OlyWa is a cool place, not too many people and not much traffic, beautiful views of Budd Inlet, the Capitol building,Percival Landing has been spruced up, a couple of yacht harbors, big ships still pulling into the port which loses 1.5 million a year, people stop in their cars if you even look like you want to cross the street, everybody is friendly because they are trying to help each other through the depression of the pacific northwest, the homeless are looked after on cold nights, never seen a traffic wreck or somebody getting a ticket, crime is low which means very few cops, food is of higher quality due to healthier cattle and plenty of clean water for farms, there are tons of musicians in the streets and open mics everywhere, plenty of granola lesbians, karaoke at the Clipper, Hannahs, and the Urban Onion hosted by Tina Turntable, a cross dressing Indian from montana, there is Fishtail Brewery and pub, Boston Harbor for sea kayaking, western chehalis bike path is 40 miles of beautiful riding, there is salmon at the capitol lake bridge every fall, mt ranier, and free music at the farmers market, chicken and waffles at solomons reef, there is the artesian well where people fill up jugs 24/7 with rusty tasting water, don rich, buck owens guitar player for may years, grew up in tumwater, Olympia Brewing Co is closed but you can still break into the old factory for a self guided tour,
there is a small climbing gym for 12 bucks a visit,

however, there was a stabbing at McCoys Tavern and another one outside Jakes, which means there were 2 murders this year,instead of the average which is about 1, if a big earthquake hits here, most of downtown will collapse, but not too many big ones here, weather is not as bad as you would think, kind of like SF, everybody is white so the radio stations have no soul, they think All Blues by Miles is still hip,

Tacoma is the closest place for hookers and gangs, next stop is Seattle which is one of the snobbiest cities in the us due to microsoft and boeing jacking up the avg incomes, Tacoma Aroma is that nasty smell from the logging mills when the wind is right, traffic sucks as soon as you get north of Olympia, especially when bridges collapse on I-5,

Dr.Sprock

Boulder climber

I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!

Oct 26, 2013 - 08:20am PT

country living is cool if your hooked up,

lots of farm animals getting molested up here,

Risk

Mountain climber

Olympia, WA

Oct 26, 2013 - 03:54pm PT

I’ve lived in Seattle and Olympia each about 5 years. Olympia is super safe and all of what the Dr. says is true. I’ve left my car and house unlocked for years and nothing has ever been stolen. Downtown has its creeps and “tattoo district,” but that’s because of accessible social services concentrated there. Seattle is a big city, but has a small town feeling outside of the scummy, bum riddled downtown. Bellevue and the eastside of lake Washington are pretty snobby. Seattle’s heyday has been over several years now, and the wave of NW culture seems to have drifted to Portland.

Olympia is a perfect small city to raise a family, with good schools, good public trans, nearby hiking, college town feeling, cheap housing prices, walk able neighborhoods stable economy. There are “better” places, but I’m not complaining about being stuck here where I can drive 10 minutes to a native forest with a creek or salt water beach, and buy locally grown fruits, vegetables, meat, fish and dairy.

San Francisco (Go 49ers!) is my hometown big city, but I’ve never lived there. It’s hard to beat for culture and excitement.

hellroaring

Trad climber

San Francisco

Oct 26, 2013 - 04:02pm PT

Hey Tioga...would you really cheer on a devastating earthquake? There are a few of us here that are neither hipsters or self entitled rich f*#ks. Big man on the intrnet throwing out desire for pain and suffering on others, others that your hugely open mind casts as either this way or that. I find it hard to believe you would really wish that. Of course if it does I hope you are a hard worker cuz a lot of your tax dollars are gonna be spent helping rebuild this place some us call home.

Dr.Sprock

Boulder climber

I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!

Oct 26, 2013 - 04:59pm PT

snobbiest cities article>

No. 5 (tie) Seattle

In this city of coffee connoisseurs and tech-savvy early adopters, it can be easy to feel hopelessly out of step. To relive the city’s pre-Internet tech scene, check out the Museum of Flight (home of the original Air Force One) or Everett’s Flying Heritage Collection, launched by Microsoft alum Paul Allen. And you don’t have to be schooled in contemporary art to appreciate the city’s Olympic Sculpture Park and its view of Puget Sound.

and this>

As a newcomer to Seattle (2 years) and having lived many places in the world, I would say that I find the old time residents here lovely, friendly, but becoming a little guarded -- and I don't blame them. The general techie and other types that arrive for the paycheck bring no social skills, a ridiculously misguided sense of entitlement, and are hugely unfriendly. Just watch the faces of drivers passing, or look someone in the eye as you pass them on the sidwalk, they continuously wear an expression that conveys, instead of "hello", says more like "I think I need to fart". Yes, there is some snobbery, but it's mostly just like the rest of the world, people trying to make themselves feel better about their own condition by putting others down. They will get what's really coming to them when they someday realize that all that "upscale" living really meant "overpaying", and they have nothing to show later in life.

but at least there are jobs in the Seattle area, Oly has no jobs unless you get lucky with the state capitol,

Patrick Sawyer

climber

Originally California now Ireland

Topic Author's Reply - Oct 26, 2013 - 11:07pm PT

Kenny, long time no talk, how's Danville nowadays? How's Mt Diablo? When was the last time we climbed together? It seems like after the American Revolution. ;-)

I have to laugh at the ride bit. If a gal gives you a ride here in Ireland it means...

I learned that many years ago. I helped organize a football match for a charity between the Department of Arts, Culture and Gaeltacht, where I was working as an intern on my masters, and the Department of Justice and Equality.

The football pitch we found to use was at Herbert Park. I was working in the minister's constituency office (Michael D Higgins, now president of Ireland).

The executive officer (EO) in the office was Aidan. His wife Brid was the PA to the Department's General Secretary.

So, when I was asked how I was going to get to the match at Herbert Park, I said that "Brid is going to give me a ride".

Aidan and the others looked at me, then they all laughed. "It's called a lift over here Patrick."

BTW, we beat the Dept of Justice, only because the rule was that goals by the female players counted as double. It was a coed match.

SalNichols

Big Wall climber

Richmond, CA

Oct 27, 2013 - 05:39am PT

No offense, but Ron Dellums and Jean Quan are two of the most worthless elected officials in a city with a history of worthless officials.

Patrick Sawyer

climber

Originally California now Ireland

Topic Author's Reply - Oct 27, 2013 - 09:01am PT

Sal, since I have been living outside the US for some years, I only assumed Dellums and Quan were good mayors.

Also, to other posters on this thread, the last time I was in SF was December 2008, so again, based on assumptions, I only have fond memories of the city by the Bay.

But can it really be any worse than most large cities?

justthemaid

climber

Jim Henson's Basement

Oct 27, 2013 - 09:28am PT

I've worked in the Bay Area seasonally for over 20 years. I'm in Cragman's camp... I like to visit SF for the reasons listed, but I would never live there. The weather is just too cold and damp and getting to climbing areas is a pain in the rear.

Patrick Sawyer

climber

Originally California now Ireland

Topic Author's Reply - Oct 27, 2013 - 10:00am PT

Justthemaid, Mark Twain agreed with you, yet having worked and played football/soccer in the city, there are enough sunny days, but climbing? Yeah, I agree.

hellroaring

Trad climber

San Francisco

Oct 27, 2013 - 12:15pm PT

Yes that is one of the big negatives to living in the city here, being far from any decent climbing. Used to live in Boulder too, but then again I grew up in Kansas so it could be worse...

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Oct 27, 2013 - 12:24pm PT

San Francisco WAS a great city, and still can be a nice place to visit in small doses, especially if you know where to go.

Liberalism has destroyed the city. Just look at some of the city council initiatives over the past 15 years.

Homelessness uncontested, sanctuary-city for illegal immigrants, nude people sitting at cafes, openly obscene gay-pride parades. It's such an awesome place to do business that the SF 49ers built their new stadium in my town, Santa Clara, in the South Bay. 40 miles away!

I do my best to avoid 'the city'.

Bruce Morris

Social climber

Belmont, California

Oct 27, 2013 - 01:26pm PT

I grew up in Bay View - Hunter's Point out by the city dump when it was half African-American and half Italio-Catholic. Lots of Italian street gangs fighting turf wars as the African-Americans were block busting their way in. Remember how you could look out the window in the morning and see Norway rats the size of cats that had been run over by the garbage trucks as they emerged from the sewers onto the city streets. Sometimes us kids used to hunt them with bb guns. Beaters pounded on the ventilation ducks to drive the big rats out into the open in the basements where we would hit them with a withering cross-fire of BBs. Their bodies were so tough that only a head shot in the eye would really do the job.

Boy growing up in the slums of San Francisco was just great, great if you stayed alive. Sometimes us white kids would fight back against the Italians and the Catholics and spit on the priests and call the nuns whores. San Francisco was just so liberal and groovy out by the shipyards!

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Oct 27, 2013 - 01:50pm PT

See? Those are the good 'ole dayz I was talking about!

Bruce Morris

Social climber

Belmont, California

Oct 27, 2013 - 01:51pm PT

Depends on whether or not you grew up in Bayview-Hunters point out by the fiber board plant and the city dumps. The only ones who had ears were the dogs! No gentle people with flowers in their hair!

I think that level of violence, Blue, was why all the nice, upwardly socially bound, white people used the GI Bill and super-low interest FHA home loans to move down the SF Peninsula and establish the fascist suburbs where all the schools were college-prep and everyone was optimistic (i.e. white) and "making it". I think it's called "white flight" in them thar social science books that illiterate Italians can't read.

Chaz

Trad climber

greater Boss Angeles area

Oct 27, 2013 - 02:30pm PT

DON'T JUMP! Mr Milktoast!

THERE IS HOPE - MAKE THE CALL

Patrick Sawyer

climber

Originally California now Ireland

Topic Author's Reply - Oct 29, 2013 - 04:20am PT

What did I start with this thread?

I was a Catholic white boy from the burbs. Worked in SF and played football there.

However, what some of the other posters have said, so San Francisco has been the only city/conurbation area to suffer such "deprivations".

Please, do tell me more. Of course, Chicago, Seattle, LA, Vegas, NY, Boston, Prague, London, Marseille, Cape Town, Sydney, Singapore, Beijing, Tokyo, Auckland, Rio, Paris, Stockholm, the list could go on... do not suffer the sort of social breakdown that SF does.

hellroaring

Trad climber

San Francisco

Nov 6, 2013 - 12:14pm PT

Tioga, you gettin uppity for what you term ethnic hate, but then you appear joyful at the prospect of a major population center burning to the ground after a devastating earthquake. Is hypocrite too strong of a word here? Normally I do not respond to jerkish posts by.total strangers, but.you managed to get me going so congrats. Probably has something to do with my three young kids, or the fact that a lot of people here in SF are neither junkies or yuppie jerks. I am calling you out on your bogus bluster, because if you really desire our homes to be scorched and to.hear our loved ones cries of anguish...

Reilly

Mountain climber

The Other Monrovia- CA

Nov 6, 2013 - 12:25pm PT

Wait, did I miss hearing that Putin lives in San Fran now? WTF? I wouldn't think he would be real popular in the Castro.

Capt.

climber

some eastside hovel

Nov 6, 2013 - 12:41pm PT

tioga--- Seriously...Yer a f*ckin' idiot! Feel free to stay away.

PAUL SOUZA

Trad climber

Central Valley, CA

Nov 6, 2013 - 01:12pm PT

I'm not a big fan of SF, but it looks like SF will redeem itself for a day:

http://gma.yahoo.com/blogs/abc-blogs/san-francisco-transform-gotham-boys-batman-wish-200535617--abc-news-topstories.html

Wade Icey

Trad climber

www.alohashirtrescue.com

Nov 6, 2013 - 02:29pm PT

.. At least I'm not a Westerner with void, empty mechanical life. Thanks
Hope your city will burn in fire after the next quake-

Christian?

Reno, Nevada is one wonderful area they're passing by unfortunately.

As an expert on San Francisco from Tacoma, You'll fit right in in Reno. Good casino jobs I hear, and Taxidermy is on the rise....

paul roehl

Boulder climber

california

Nov 6, 2013 - 03:15pm PT

You know, you got to wonder what's going on in this world when folks get so damn angry over so damn little.

Patrick Sawyer

climber

Originally California now Ireland

Topic Author's Reply - Nov 6, 2013 - 04:34pm PT

What the heck did I start? And it is NOT called Frisco except by ignorant people.

Patrick Sawyer

climber

Originally California now Ireland

Topic Author's Reply - Nov 17, 2013 - 07:40am PT

You are weird Tioga. Such venom and vitriol.

paul roehl

Boulder climber

california

Nov 17, 2013 - 11:51am PT

^^^^^
Very, very nice!

ladyscarlett

Trad climber

SF Bay Area, California

Nov 17, 2013 - 04:06pm PT

I don't feel like she coddles the veteran residents either...

But she WILL seduce the n00bs...then work 'em over good once she feels she's got 'em warmed up!

No different from the vets, but I think the vets have the timing down...or maybe have developed a taste for that kind of thing?

HAHAHA

And somehow, I still hear the phrase "I left my heart in SF" so often...

Really folks, distance is your best defense!

Cheers

LS

Chaz

Trad climber

greater Boss Angeles area

Mar 12, 2014 - 01:20am PT

It's a tourist town.

The big attractions are an old fish dock and an abandoned prison. Go figure.

John M

climber

Mar 12, 2014 - 02:39am PT

The big attractions are an old fish dock and an abandoned prison. Go figure.

I grew up in the little town of Los Banos in the San Jouquin. My mother loved to sightsee, so we traveled to San Fran many many times. She also loved to show visitors around and since much of my family is from Texas, when they visited we would take them to see San Francisco. I loved it.

If folks came for a week, we would go see San Francisco, Yosemite, Monterrey, and Lake Tahoe, with my dad doing all of the driving in a 9 passenger station wagon. It was always a blast, though us kids often fought like cats and dogs. I don't' know how my dad put up with it, but he was a trooper.

When we went to SF we would go see all the sights.

The Golden Gate Bridge
The Wharf
Lombard street
Telegraph hill
Golden Gate Park
The Palace of Fine Arts
The Exploratorium
The Japanese Tea Gardens
The Symphony ( my favorite )
The Beaches
The Marin Headlands
Mount Tamalpais
The Academy of Sciences
The Cable Cars ( yep, we rode those many times)
China Town
The Chocolate Factory
Coit Tower
Haight Ashbury, ( In the 60s)
Sailing on the Bay ( a very fun thing to do, especially when the wind is blowing briskly, which it often is )
The Art Museums

And I could go on.. So in my humble opinion, SF is much more then a prison and a fish dock.

My parents were very frugal, so eating out was a big time luxury. Mom usually packed a picnic lunch. It was a big deal to get a crab cocktail. For a splurge, we would eat at Sabella's for lunch. Clam Chowder and Fresh Sour dough bread would be what we were allowed to have. It was fabulous. Of course I was a small town boy growing up in a tiny farming community, but boy was it good. My mouth still waters over it.

Growing up I continued to visit. I got to house sit there for a month. I wish I was a runner at that time. What a great place to run that would have been. I put a lot of miles in seeing that city on foot and bike. Now my 2 favorite things are the food and the symphony. I love going to dinner, the symphony, then out for drinks afterwards. Shazaam that is a good time. There is a pretty good piano bar right near the symphony, or at least there used to be. Its been 10 years for me.

SF is much much more then a prison and a wharf. If that is all you got out of it, then you really didn't see it. You needed a guide to show you around and immerse you in it.

climbski2

Mountain climber

Anchorage AK, Reno NV

Mar 12, 2014 - 02:44am PT

I saw something that blew me away in SF.

A suit of Samurai armor. The real deal..

Amazing.

Jaybro

Social climber

Wolf City, Wyoming

Mar 12, 2014 - 09:19am PT

Haha missed his thread, and Tioga's meltdown till no. Where else but the taco do you get that kind of entertainment, for free even?

San Francisco is my favorite medium size city any where! I lived there for a year. Have family jar there and get there a few times a year generally. It's a proud city, for the reasons stated. No wonder it sparks jealousy and animosity in the Tiogas of the world.

That Russian navy story was great btw, just the sort of colorful history the place generates. The boycott seems misplaced but a statement against Putins policies is clearly in order.

survival

Big Wall climber

Terrapin Station

Mar 12, 2014 - 09:55am PT

Cities are a disease, truly...f$$$ hell on earth.

As opposed to suburbs stretching to the horizon? Each square mile with it's own super box stores?

San Fran is a great City.

Liberalism has destroyed the city

Blue, you are truly half cocked sometimes. Give me such a f*#kin' break would ya?

kaholatingtong

Trad climber

Nevada City

Mar 12, 2014 - 10:43am PT

great place. It is the only major city I have lived in, and probably the only one I could. I left cause it was getting a bit expensive and crowded, but there is still a lot of great stuff there, and great stuff that comes through there ( think shows, music, etc ). It may sound strange but after all the hours I spent cycling around that city, the thing at the very top of my list to do when visiting the city again would be to just ride my bicycle around it all day and see various neighborhoods and places that way. As long as you are in good enough shape to hustle a few hills, it really isn't that large of a city so seeing it on bike works perfect. And you don't have to deal with the cars quite so much.

mechrist

Gym climber

South of Heaven

Mar 12, 2014 - 11:09am PT

Reverend Maynard gave a good sermon at the Civic Center last night

barry ohm

Trad climber

escondido, ca

Mar 12, 2014 - 12:25pm PT

I not to Hip on SF, but It's because I prefer more rural communities. I do think they could have worked out a plan to remove the dam at Hetch Hetchy and stored the water in another location .San Francisco had the opportunity to create one of the greatest conservation projects of the 21 century by restoring Hetchy Hetchy.But didn't!
http://www.hetchhetchy.org

mouse from merced

Trad climber

The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.

Mar 12, 2014 - 03:26pm PT

How many generations of disgruntled peeps will it take for us to realize the DAM ON THE TUOLUMNE is permanent?

Why waste your time grieving over a dead place?

There is something more valuable on which you can spend your time, which is limited, so find it and work it.

John Muir's resting quiet now, too, so let's just fergittit and move on.

And to TIOGA: Man, I sympathize and empathize, but grousing about city folks is like trying to dig a hole in sand. You never get far & there are more of them than of you by a long chalk.

The best thing about SF is that my honey's resting on the beach below the Cliff House there at the end of the Great Highway. Family on the Beach.

Berkeley has far better-looking women, too.

bergbryce

Trad climber

South Lake Tahoe, CA

Mar 12, 2014 - 04:02pm PT

As a community, if you're into 50-something females with long, grey streaked hair, then get ye to the Berkeley Bowl post haste.

Sounds like you gotta be a new millionaire in order to make it in SF these days.

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 12, 2014 - 08:09pm PT

Survival, liberal policies have indeed ruined a once great city. The remnants of the great people who built the town are still there.

If you actually researched the policies of the city gov't you may just agree that these people are almost crazy!

Nude people are allowed to sit in outdoor cafes?

Homeless people are treated like India's Untouchables, who in turn harass tourists and locals.

There's more, but that is a sample...

barry ohm

Trad climber

escondido, ca

Mar 12, 2014 - 09:16pm PT

The question was When we we quit bringing up the dam in Yosemite National park? Never!
Every time I meet someone from San Francisco I try to talk about Hetch Hetchy.

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 12, 2014 - 09:32pm PT

Personally, I think the Hetch Hetchy land whould be better as an outdoor destination like Tuolumne or Yosemite. Drain it!

There are way more areas that serve not nearly a beautiful purpose as that. Create 2 more resevoirs in its place.

All the yuppie elitists in SF politics will never let that happen though. Sacred cow for the SF liberals.

These are the same people that are in favor of diverting farm irrigation water from the Central Valley farmers, Cali's bread basket, to help save a stupid smelt taht is not even indigenous to the area it is in.

Like I said, they are crazy. And don't get me started on the cluster-f*#k known as the "bullet-train", which it isn't!

barry ohm

Trad climber

escondido, ca

Mar 12, 2014 - 09:37pm PT

There was 3 ideas for Hetch hetchy if the dam was torn down, 1. Try to repair the damge, 2. repair some of the damage then let nature renew the area, 3. let mother nature restore the area to its natural habitat. If it ever happens it would be a experiment in nature conservation that would contribute science for generations to come. To me thats exciting!

Chango

Trad climber

norcal

Mar 12, 2014 - 09:52pm PT

Was in SF this past weekend. Much like tequila...I enjoy it in small doses. Seems to me everyone was trying just a bit too hard. I get it...whether you are a vagrant, thug, hipster, techie...you are very proud to call SF your home. But don't serve it to me heaped on a plate and sprinkled with way too much arrogance and pretense. If you are so proud of your individuality, why can't I tell anyone apart in a bar? When you move from Ohio to SF, do they make you shorten your hair, grow a long beard and peg your pants? But I digress...I still rank in the top three big cities in the world.

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 12, 2014 - 11:21pm PT

Barry, the dam is probably concrete with some rebar. I say try to dismantle the the thing slowly in a dry year when it's at its lowest. Remove the upper portion of the dam, as much as possible.

Then, after consulting with structural engineers, start 'leaking' the lake over the dam by removing water holding pieces. As much as possible.

Blow the rest with explosive charges. And film it all!

Nature will do her wok naturally on that awesome valley. The bed of the lake will be super-fertile in a year or two.

Hetch Hetchy was damed (sp?) a long time ago. We do not really need that anymore with the dams on the Mokulumne, Stanislaus, and other rivers/watershed in the northern part of the western sierra.

They are much wiser areas to convert to resevoirs. They create awesome fisheries and receational areas while providing water in an area that provided little else in the past.

Hetch Hetchy could become a great area for mountaineering and similar outdoor activities. If it were up to me I would develop it like Kings Canyon. Simple 2 lane road in/out to a single ranger station/store. Trailheads and camping areas go from there. Nothing more, but just enough.

Kings Canyon is great that way.

Wade Icey

Trad climber

www.alohashirtrescue.com

Mar 13, 2014 - 12:54am PT

^^^^^^^^^^
I can see why Ron's so upset.

mechrist

Gym climber

South of Heaven

Mar 13, 2014 - 01:05am PT

the dam is probably concrete with some rebar.

genius! yeah, this guy definitely knows what he's talking about.

Reilly

Mountain climber

The Other Monrovia- CA

Mar 13, 2014 - 01:06am PT

Some rebar? You think?

No dam 1/4 its size has been removed to date.

mechrist

Gym climber

South of Heaven

Mar 13, 2014 - 01:08am PT

probably some concrete too.

meh, just dismantle it slowly in a dry year... like the man said.

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 13, 2014 - 01:22am PT

probably some concrete too.

meh, just dismantle it slowly in a dry year... like the man said.

Maybe you can explain. I'm not a construction type guy.

And any dam can come down controllably. Any dam. Somewhat....

Reilly

Mountain climber

The Other Monrovia- CA

Mar 13, 2014 - 01:27am PT

And any dam can come down controllably. Any dam. Somewhat....

Bwa Ha Ha Ha Ha! Dude, ever try busting up concrete 80 feet thick?

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 13, 2014 - 01:35am PT

Bwa Ha Ha Ha Ha! Dude, ever try busting up concrete 80 feet thick?

Nice attitude. Do you think that this job is above us? That what we bulit can't be brought down?

Who's the fool here? I understand the hydro-dynamics of releasing that much water, but you really think we can't pull that off?

I think we can.

Wes, knows we can. Hey Wes, have you ever actually contributed to society, or do you just run 'models' all f*#king day?

Reilly

Mountain climber

The Other Monrovia- CA

Mar 13, 2014 - 01:54am PT

Bluey, you sound like a right free-spending lib! It would cost billions to
take that thing down. I'd rather that money went to other things, that's all.

Chaz

Trad climber

greater Boss Angeles area

Mar 13, 2014 - 01:55am PT

You should get the indoor plumbing installed first, before you go and burn down the shithouse.

mechrist

Gym climber

South of Heaven

Mar 13, 2014 - 11:21am PT

Remove the upper portion of the dam, as much as possible.

Then, after consulting with structural engineers, start 'leaking' the lake over the dam by removing water holding pieces. As much as possible.

Just can't get over the pure genius of this! Remove the upper portion, then consult the structural engineers, then "leak" the water OVER the dam by "removing water holding pieces. As much as possible."

Vote libertarian, cuz they just know how to do sh#t and stuff.

survival

Big Wall climber

Terrapin Station

Mar 13, 2014 - 12:02pm PT

DMT, WTF are you talking about? They let naked people sit around in cafes there! Taking down that dam will restore SF to her once conservative glory!

I mean God knows a fully clothed person hasn't a chance of finding anyplace to eat in Sodom and Gomorrah!!

ontheedgeandscaredtodeath

Social climber

SLO, Ca

Mar 13, 2014 - 12:24pm PT

Actually, SF banned public nudity a year or so ago. Also, the place is a capitalist paradise where only the strongest survive. Try living there on some socialist government salary!

mechrist

Gym climber

South of Heaven

Mar 13, 2014 - 12:33pm PT

Mission Street is about the most right-wing sh#t strip I've ever seen... no left turns for miles it seemed.

Chaz

Trad climber

greater Boss Angeles area

Mar 13, 2014 - 12:38pm PT

A bunch of lots have an "early bird" special. Get there by 9 or 10, and park all day for ten bucks.

But otherwise, you'll be paying Manhattan parking rates. ( like $20/hr )

mechrist

Gym climber

South of Heaven

Mar 13, 2014 - 12:39pm PT

$20/hr? pffft... only if you are an idiot.

mechrist

Gym climber

South of Heaven

Mar 13, 2014 - 01:47pm PT

Awesome, another water expert (Ron) chimes in! Hey Ron, how does my recycled "water" taste down there?

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 13, 2014 - 11:15pm PT

Bluering has allowed hate to grow in his heart. He may not admit it publicly but he knows its true.

Duh? Do you want a medal? I will freely admit that I have certain degrees of hate 'in my heart' regarding things I find unjust and wrong.

You don't?

Actually, SF banned public nudity a year or so ago. Also, the place is a capitalist paradise where only the strongest survive. Try living there on some socialist government salary!

Didn't they just make the nudists put a towel down in the cafes so we don't have to 'share' their ass-sweat and feces?

And what about the Gay-pride parades? No nudity or perverse sexual acts in public?

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 13, 2014 - 11:29pm PT

Take it easy, man.

Exactly what the gov't wants from you. Just take it easy, pay no attention, we'll take care of you. Want some free stuff? Here....

EDIT:

The Buddha compared holding on to anger to grasping a hot coal with the intent of throwing it at someone else.

Was this intended to portray anger as a deficit, or more as tool to use as an inspirational reminder. I think he meant the latter.

This is the problem. If a conservative is angry it is "hate", but if a liberal is angry it's a "struggle", or a righteous fight.

Meh...

John M

climber

Mar 13, 2014 - 11:48pm PT

Didn't they just make the nudists put a towel down in the cafes so we don't have to 'share' their ass-sweat and feces?

Nope. its banned except for some special events. Nancy Pelosi even came out in support of the ban.

You are going to have to read more if you are going to be a state Representative. Or perhaps broaden where you get your news.

ontheedgeandscaredtodeath

Social climber

SLO, Ca

Mar 13, 2014 - 11:59pm PT

I lived in sf for 12+ years, including in the Castro. Saw the occasional naked person at bay to breakers or whatever but certainly not anything close to day to day. People that live there work hard, it's not a cheap and easy place to exist.

SF has its problems like any real city, or like any rural or suburban area. Some may not like s f's politics or social norms but the reality is that it's a national economic engine and innovator.

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 14, 2014 - 12:34am PT

John, you're wrong (and so id SF!);

**Public nudity is legal in San Francisco as long as the nude individual is not in a state of arousal. But last Thursday's meeting of the Board of Supervisors' Public Safety Committee resulted in a ruling that, if approved by the full Board, will ban practicing nudists from public eateries, the San Francisco Chronicle reports. Wiener's proposal also requires those in the buff to place down a towel or barrier of some sort before they sit down on public seating.

"San Francisco is a liberal and tolerant city, and we pride ourselves on that fact," Supervisor Wiener said in a statement. "Yet, while we have a variety of views about public nudity, we can all agree that when you sit down naked, you should cover the seat, and that you should cover up when you go into a food establishment."
**

http://www.delish.com/food/recalls-reviews/san-francisco-ordinance-bans-restaurant-nudity

Ontheedge, fair enough, but we shouldn't excuse morality and public decency, for productivity, should we? Think of the children! (to quote a common liberal mantra...)

John M

climber

Mar 14, 2014 - 12:55am PT

Blue, your info is outdated. Check the dates on yours and mine.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/02/13/nancy-pelosi-san-francisco-nudity-ban_n_2677948.html

San Francisco lawmakers outlawed public nudity last November in response to the increased presence of naked people on city property, especially within a specific plaza at the epicenter of the famous Castro neighborhood. The ban officially took effect Feb. 1.

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 14, 2014 - 12:57am PT

Hey bluering, you down there?

Depends on the time of day. I work right next to that airfield (Moffett Airfield), but mi casa is a bit further South down Central Expressway, just out of the right-side of the pic.

Are you in a C-130 in that pic? I've been seeing them coming/going from Moffett over the past few days.

Every once in a while the V-22 Ospreys fly in too. Kinda cool.

mechrist

Gym climber

South of Heaven

Mar 14, 2014 - 12:59am PT

Not ONE pump in the carson river pulls water out to service anything other than hay fields.

Learn to read bub. I never said the pumps pull out of the Carson River.

Why dont you come up here and ill point you to the tanks that have our water supply far up on Mcllelans peak.

I can see the tanks on google earth. The ones up high are puny compared to the one's "down by the river." Suggest anything?

You OBVIOUSLY dont know yur ass from a well hole when it comes to water supplies around my neighborhood..

Obviously! "One of the booster stations pumps water from Dayton over to Mound House." from your utilities guy.

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 14, 2014 - 01:02am PT

John, it did pass finally, but barely;

Opponents of the ban, which narrowly passed in a 6-5 vote, argued it would tarnish San Francisco’s reputation as a progressive haven. "I'm concerned about civil liberties, about free speech, about changing San Francisco's style and how we are as a city," said Supervisor John Avalos, largely considered to be the city's most liberal leader.

And then this;

The new law calls for a $100 fine for first-time offenders and could result in jail time for those caught in the buff more than three times. Certain sanctioned events, however, like the city’s famously racy Folsom Street Fair and the annual pride parade, remain exempt.

“Come see our gay pride parade,” Pelosi said. “It's fabulous; you'll love it. It's a lot of exposure, shall we say.”

So the most perverse remains exempt still? How can there be a "law" with exemptions like this. And they are perverse, I can provide pictures of sh#t I've seen. Google 'Folsom STreet Fair' or 'SF Pride Parade'....

John M

climber

Mar 14, 2014 - 01:11am PT

Blue, I don't need pictures. I dated a woman in SF.

ontheedgeandscaredtodeath

Social climber

SLO, Ca

Mar 14, 2014 - 01:19am PT

Well Bluey, when my kids got to be school aged we decided to leave the city, for a variety of reasons including the fact it's a pretty free wheeling adult type place, which also makes it so great. Every place doesn't need to be the same as the suburbs. Live and let live!

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 14, 2014 - 01:31am PT

I kinda agree with that, ontheedge, which is why I rarely go to the city (except maybe Fleet Week).

It's just a shame to me to see a great city run this way by progressives. The city has a much different history that I think they are ruining.

Good thing is that if you know yer way around, you can avoid most of the raunch and skank. I just wonder what the tourists think...

mechrist

Gym climber

South of Heaven

Mar 14, 2014 - 01:51am PT

Again, I never once said they pull municipal water from the river... but I'm quite entertained that you think I did.

Again,, just try and tell me about my own neighbor hood a place youve NEVER been to,, and that is most assuredly a fact.

Okay... and you try to tell me about science. BTW, I took a wrong turn there once, so technically I have been there.

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 14, 2014 - 01:57am PT

Homophobic? Maybe You’re Gay
By RICHARD M. RYAN and WILLIAM S. RYAN
Published: April 27, 2012

Why are political and religious figures who campaign against gay rights so often implicated in sexual encounters with same-sex partners?

In recent years, Ted Haggard, an evangelical leader who preached that homosexuality was a sin, resigned after a scandal involving a former male prostitute; Larry Craig, a United States senator who opposed including sexual orientation in hate-crime legislation, was arrested on suspicion of lewd conduct in a men’s bathroom; and Glenn Murphy Jr., a leader of the Young Republican National Convention and an opponent of same-sex marriage, pleaded guilty to a lesser charge after being accused of sexually assaulting another man.

One theory is that homosexual urges, when repressed out of shame or fear, can be expressed as homophobia. Freud famously called this process a “reaction formation” — the angry battle against the outward symbol of feelings that are inwardly being stifled. Even Mr. Haggard seemed to endorse this idea when, apologizing after his scandal for his anti-gay rhetoric, he said, “I think I was partially so vehement because of my own war.”

It’s a compelling theory — and now there is scientific reason to believe it. In this month’s issue of the Journal of Personality and Social Psychology, we and our fellow researchers provide empirical evidence that homophobia can result, at least in part, from the suppression of same-sex desire....

What leads to this repression? We found that participants who reported having supportive and accepting parents were more in touch with their implicit sexual orientation and less susceptible to homophobia. Individuals whose sexual identity was at odds with their implicit sexual attraction were much more frequently raised by parents perceived to be controlling, less accepting and more prejudiced against homosexuals.

More here:
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/29/opinion/sunday/homophobic-maybe-youre-gay.html?ref=opinion

One theory is that homosexual urges, when repressed out of shame or fear, can be expressed as homophobia

One theory? From who? SOme cock-sucker at the NYTimes, or some 'university idiot'? Or now we're going to go with Freud?

This is the sh#t I'm talking about with f*#king progressives....They have to shove this gay crap into your face! (like San Francisco)

You don't like this/that about gays, that means you're a closet gay. You're definitely a homophobe, and most likely a gay.

Eh, f*#k off!!!

John M

climber

Mar 14, 2014 - 02:15am PT

.They have to shove this gay crap into your face!

Karmic return, from having Christianity shoved at them. Force begets force. You reap what you sow. At some point, we have to break the cycle. This doesn't mean we have to lay down and let people run all over us, but in this case, a little kindness tends to go a long ways. I have a very good friend who worked for Catholic services in the bay area for 30 years. She treated gay people with love and fought to get services for them, such as counseling and health services, and they loved her and treated her with tremendous respect. She is a very strong lady. Much stronger then I am.

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 14, 2014 - 02:30am PT

John, why do I have to go out of my way for anybody? Shouldn't everybody just be treated the same? Even gays?

My point is that everybody is a f*#king victim nowadays except for Christians, who seem to be a legit target.

Christians are not only the majority in this country, but we're also very tolerant. To a point. We're sick of gay bullsh#t, abortions are just woman's liberation, and we need more trans-genders in the military.

We tend to turn the other cheek, as long as you keep things to yourself. I don't ask, you don't tell. I don't want to hear it.

I treat people on their merits.

John M

climber

Mar 14, 2014 - 02:39am PT

why do I have to go out of my way for anybody?

isn't that pretty much what Jesus taught. Love your enemy.

Matthew 5:43-48
New International Version (NIV)
Love for Enemies

43 “You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbor[a] and hate your enemy.’ 44 But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, 45 that you may be children of your Father in heaven. He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous. 46 If you love those who love you, what reward will you get? Are not even the tax collectors doing that? 47 And if you greet only your own people, what are you doing more than others? Do not even pagans do that? 48 Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect.

And If you think that gay people are no longer persecuted, then you need to get out a bit more. Where is your charity Blue? Do you only have it for those who agree with you? I am not saying that you have to accept everything that they want, but how you go about it matters. If you go about standing up for your beliefs with hatred in your heart, then you have failed everything Jesus taught.

Its a hard lesson. I know. Right now I feel pretty overwhelmed by the ugliness in the world. But It would be nice if that ugliness wasn't added to by those who purport to be Christians. And I include myself in that statement, though I don't follow any Christian church.

Chaz

Trad climber

greater Boss Angeles area

Mar 14, 2014 - 02:43am PT

Persecuted? By what measure?

What is gay per-capita income?

A: Higher than the average.

What is gay unemployment?

A: Lower than the average.

http://money.cnn.com/2012/12/06/pf/gay-money/

Bruce Morris

Social climber

Belmont, California

Mar 14, 2014 - 02:47am PT

I grew up in the Bay View - Hunters Point District when the African-Americans were moving in, block busting and driving the Italian gangs out. The fiber board plant was a local beauty spot as was the SF City Dump where we used to go to find used 50 cal brass casing from WWII. The Shipyards still existed so at least there was some work out there, but way too many Italians, too many Catholics. I was the only white kid in ten miles, but I did have the privilege of getting jumped by three dagos in an alley and coming out on top. There were three of them, a little one, a middle one, and the big one who was just entering puberty with big shoulders and a leather jacket. The big wop sichted the small one on me and I broke his jaw and knocked out three of his teeth. I can still remember the crack I heard as his jaw snapped on impact and the spectacle of watching three of his teeth ricochet off the opposite fence. When he went down I kicked him in the head and that was it. No more problems from the little Italian! Then, the big one said, "You're picking on my little brother!" and sent the mid-size wop after me. But I was thinking on my feet and kicked him right in the balls with my black leather boot and he went down crying like a little girl. But I was no match for the biggest of them and when he came after me with brass knuckles I jumped the fence real quick and just kept jumping fences and running for at least 15 minutes more. I remember getting back home and my hands were full of splinters from the fence jumping. I was taking those splinters out the palms of my hands for a whole week afterwards. Sure would have been worse though if the big one had caught up with me.

Still can remember the big dead Norway rats with tire tracks through them on 3rd Street where the garbage trucks had run them over. That's my San Francisco! No Peace, Love, Granola in those days! Us Protestant kids used to come up behind priests and piss on them and pull up nun's dresses and call them whores. But that's a whole different story.....

mechrist

Gym climber

South of Heaven

Mar 14, 2014 - 02:48am PT

What is gay per-capita "get your ass kicked for being gay"?

A: Higher than the average.

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 14, 2014 - 02:52am PT

isn't that pretty much what Jesus taught. Love your enemy.

Not really. God taught that it was better to slay your foe before he slayed you (Old Testament and Jewish Torah).

Also, the Commandment of though shalt not kill, is actually miss-translated. It read, "Though shalt not murder", or kill the innocent. Which, could also apply to abortion, by I digress.

Point is, you people constantly, selectively, pull Bible sayings out of your asses without keeping them in context.

As for 'passing judgement' on people? I'm supposed to! I have to beware of evil and sin at all times. I have to select those to associate with based on their character.

I don't have to "love" everybody. I can offer them God's grace, and well-being, but I do not have to accept all behaviors. I have to use judgement.

That's how I roll.

Chaz

Trad climber

greater Boss Angeles area

Mar 14, 2014 - 02:52am PT

Weschrist writes:

"What is gay per-capita "get your ass kicked for being gay"?
A: Higher than the average."

In San Francisco?

When was the last time that happened, in San Francisco?

Just today, in San Francisco, thousands of gay people earned an above-average income. Did any of them have their asses kicked for being gay?

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 14, 2014 - 02:58am PT

Discrimination much?

What is the percentage of innocent white people knocked-the-f*#k out by black youths in America? How does that compare to gay "hate crimes"?

One seems to be a protected class (gays), and the other are just victims of silly black youths (white people and Jews in New York).

John M

climber

Mar 14, 2014 - 03:02am PT

not really. God taught that it was better to slay your foe before he slayed you (Old Testament and Jewish Torah).

So you selectively chose to ignore Jesus' words? Or do you no longer follow Jesus?

Chaz

Trad climber

greater Boss Angeles area

Mar 14, 2014 - 03:04am PT

John M,

Do you think the country needs to follow Jesus?

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 14, 2014 - 03:08am PT

So you selectively chose to ignore Jesus' words? Or do you no longer follow Jesus?

I follow the writing of God AND Jesus. And also like some of the wisdom of the Torah.

Again, context of the writings is essential. Read the whole passages. Not just the phrase.

John M

climber

Mar 14, 2014 - 03:09am PT

I would say we need to embrace his teachings, but that there are few who understand them.

Chaz

Trad climber

greater Boss Angeles area

Mar 14, 2014 - 03:13am PT

And Jesus said: "You're the sons and daughters of God, and you're in God's house, so ACT RESPECTABLE, Goddamnit!"

( I'm not sure what this has to do with San Francisco. I apologize for allowing myself to diverge from the topic )

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 14, 2014 - 03:24am PT

Well, God (old Testament) and Jesus (new Testament), if you listen to liberals have 2 seperate messages.

They didn't. God was just more succinct. Jesus was more kind in his interpretation of God's will. He had a different mission than God. He was presented to us to live amongst us to try to personally convince us of the righteousness of God's way.

This is why Jews, feel free Jews to disagree with me here, hold God in a higher regard. He was the real authority. They thought of of Jesus as a prophet of God.

I don't want to pick sides in this fight. I look at it all.

But to say that Jesus wanted us to die instead of protecting our children from evil is ludicous. Or to say that I should not kill a terrorist preparing to launch rockets on civis is wrong, is equally insane.

Chaz

Trad climber

greater Boss Angeles area

Mar 14, 2014 - 03:31am PT

You can go to Israel and do that. You'll have to convert to Judaism first.

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 14, 2014 - 03:33am PT

Whew are you planning to do that?

Ding, as any good 'merican, I'm on look-out, brah. Rest easy, I gotch yer back.

And those Dirty Harry flicks were some of the best shots of SF ever! They were awesome. Even Alacatraz!

Chaz

Trad climber

greater Boss Angeles area

Mar 14, 2014 - 03:36am PT

Those Dirty Harry movies are almost a half-century old. Look how San Francisco was depicted in those. It wasn't Norman Rockwell and Andy Griffith there, even then.

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 14, 2014 - 03:42am PT

Well, good point chaz, but I was more referring to the awesome scenery of the whole city in those flicks.

Hat-tip to the filming crews.

Chaz

Trad climber

greater Boss Angeles area

Mar 14, 2014 - 03:47am PT

Wasn't Callahan hit on by a guy in one of the early Dirty Harry movies? That was like 1970. That was out there, for then.

But it was San Francisco.

Rest easy, though. A naked guy standing on the street in San Bernardino will get beaten to within an inch of his life, just on general principles. Community standards being what they are.

mechrist

Gym climber

South of Heaven

Mar 14, 2014 - 12:57pm PT

What is the percentage of innocent white people knocked-the-f*#k out by black youths in America?

More importantly what does that have to do with gay people?

Since you seem so upset about it, when was the last time you saw a naked gay guy blurring?

[Jews] thought of of Jesus as a prophet of God.

Wow, you are one stupid mother fuker.

mechrist

Gym climber

South of Heaven

Mar 14, 2014 - 01:16pm PT

How does one label or excuse that behavior normally found only in monkey cages at the zoo.?

I didn't see anyone here excuse that sort of behavior. It doesn't mean some don't excuse it. Maybe you should take it up directly with those who do excuse it?

mechrist

Gym climber

South of Heaven

Mar 14, 2014 - 01:33pm PT

They have watched this get worse in the last five years and will no longer tolerate such filth.

Yeah? After watching the public anal finger banging get worse for 5 years they will no longer tolerate it?

I was there last Tues. The closest thing I saw to that was Stinkfist.

mechrist

Gym climber

South of Heaven

Mar 14, 2014 - 01:38pm PT

You said they saw "this" get worse... by which one can only assume you meant the anal finger banging, since that has been the main subject of your previous few posts.

Just out of curiosity, would your friend have been as offended if it had been a guy fuking a woman on the street?

David Knopp

Trad climber

Mar 14, 2014 - 04:50pm PT

Ron, people like your friends, yep, goodbye to them. we don't need em here. don't let the door catch you in the head on the way out. it's cool-if you don't like it, stay away. we'll all be happier.

drljefe

climber

El Presidio San Augustin del Tucson

Mar 14, 2014 - 04:58pm PT

I've seen straight people do the same kind of sh¡t, worse even, in the City.

I'm more disgusted by Ron and Blue than I am a good ol finger banging.
Who doesn't love a finger bangin'?

Edit
I don't really care for extreme PDA, gay or straight.
But I'd take it any day over PDI (Public Displays of Ignorance)

Edit#2
I love San Francisco

mechrist

Gym climber

South of Heaven

Mar 14, 2014 - 05:09pm PT

Hey, doesn't Rong live pretty close to an establishment that openly advertises women (aka sex slaves) selling their snatch to any gun loving redneck with an extra $20? I went climbing at Dinosaur rock once and saw a pile of used condoms. It was disgusting... the condoms were kind of gross too.

mechrist

Gym climber

South of Heaven

Mar 14, 2014 - 05:39pm PT

Oh boy, I don't know how much Rong's favorite hooker costs... how ignorant could I be.

Rong, you never answered the question: would "your friend" have been offended enough to never visit the city again if he had seen a guy fingering (or fuking) a woman on the street? Be honest now...

I'll have to pass on the el fingering... at least until the scabs heal.

drljefe

climber

El Presidio San Augustin del Tucson

Mar 14, 2014 - 05:48pm PT

How does one label or excuse that behavior normally found only in monkey cages at the zoo.?

This is what disgusts me.

It's ok to feel uncomfortable with certain things in this world, Ron.

But I consider myself an Ally, which means when I see some blatantly biased, prejudiced, and hateful sh¡t said about gay people I'm going to speak up.

I ignore most of the sh¡t you spew on this website but occasionally I need to say something.

mechrist

Gym climber

South of Heaven

Mar 14, 2014 - 06:05pm PT

When i first got on the net,,which wasnt that long ago, a 15 yr old was showing me sites like rotten.com and porn sites.

THAT is sick, twisted, disturbing, and borderline illegal... but there is nothing gay about an old guy checking out porn sites with a 15 year old, so you were apparently cool with it.

There is an expert giving talks about school violence here and he points to the exact same thing im talking about here, in that youth today is exposed to the most violent videos and games sick minds can come up with- hence the fact they have no issue with taking a gun to school and shooting up the place. This a stark difference from the 60,s and 70s when i attended school with guns in the rig to go hunting right after class, and it didnt raise an eyebrow. We NEVER even considered shooting up the place, and fights were fists after class then becoming friends with the foe.

And this has WHAT to do with gay people? Last I heard, anal fingering doesn't cause people to go on killing sprees.

mechrist

Gym climber

South of Heaven

Mar 14, 2014 - 07:16pm PT

Again, wtf does that have to do with gay people? Seems like it has far more to do with a culture that exults killing machines than one that condones anal finger banging.

WBraun

climber

Mar 14, 2014 - 07:30pm PT

This means Jebus H Bomz is an anal finger banger expert with many years in the business .....

mechrist

Gym climber

South of Heaven

Mar 14, 2014 - 07:33pm PT

I admit, I've anally finger banged before... but only women and dogs.

Chewybacca

Trad climber

Montana, Whitefish

Mar 14, 2014 - 07:36pm PT

He was probably just looking for his car keys.

Psilocyborg

climber

Mar 14, 2014 - 07:37pm PT

Ron, lets talk about all those low life white people out there! I once saw a white guy f*#king a white prostitute in a truck. I have been getting fed up with what whites have done to my town for the last five years and this is the last straw. I need to find a new town. I mean I like the concerts, but oh my god white people are just sick....sick I tell you. I see all these homeless white people on the streets of Hemet, you know they are on drugs and collect welfare. White prostitues everywhere. I was at a party, and got jumped by a bunch of white guys. My nephews truck was stolen, and they caught him....you guessed it....he was white. Oh yeah, this lady that works with my girfriend refused hours because it would mess up her public assistence!

We need to ship all these as#@&%es back to europe

apogee

climber

Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy

Mar 14, 2014 - 07:37pm PT

"I don't really care for extreme PDA, gay or straight.
But I'd take it any day over PDI (Public Displays of Ignorance)"

+11

especially the really blatantly Rong ones

apogee

climber

Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy

Mar 14, 2014 - 07:45pm PT

He's a great ballcupper...keeps some of these greybearded usetabes reeeaaaalll happy....

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 14, 2014 - 08:05pm PT

It's funny how SF city-dwellers defend this kind of behavior in public. "This is OUR city and if you don't like it, STAY OUT!"

I guess my original point is reinforced. This is why I hate that once-great city, and why I avoid it now like the HIV, or plague.

That city's mantra should be, "Give me your Hippes, your homeless, and your homos".

Don't worry, folks you'll only see me there when I reaally have to be there...

mechrist

Gym climber

South of Heaven

Mar 14, 2014 - 08:09pm PT

It's funny how SF city-dwellers defend this kind of behavior in public. "This is OUR city and if you don't like it, STAY OUT!"

It is even funnier when ignorant white trash fukheads take those jokes seriously.

John M

climber

Mar 14, 2014 - 08:11pm PT

Court dates, huh?

Dude, sometimes you are funnier then all get out. hahaha..

This was a good thread until the perpetual haters got going.

apogee

climber

Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy

Mar 14, 2014 - 08:17pm PT

"This was a good thread until Ron showed up."

Fixed that for ya.

Elcapinyoazz

Social climber

Joshua Tree

Mar 14, 2014 - 08:18pm PT

Damn Jebus, I'm cryin' over here.

This one time, this friend of mine, he seen four elephants gang banging a midget, on the hood of Mitt Romney's limo, in the car elevator. Swear to biscuit! It's TRUE! HE DID TOO SEEN IT!

Tell your friends not to eat a 10strip on the first day in the Haight, Ron. Maybe start out with a single tab of blotter and work their way up.

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 14, 2014 - 08:37pm PT

Court dates huh?

No, Fleet Week.

Here is you typical SF Folsom Street "parade"; http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=Folsom+street+fair+pictures&qpvt=Folsom+street+fair+pictures&FORM=IGRE#a

drljefe

climber

El Presidio San Augustin del Tucson

Mar 14, 2014 - 08:47pm PT

Jeebz FTW

Blue, you too man, watch it with the hatespeech and bigotry.
Be a better man.

mechrist

Gym climber

South of Heaven

Mar 14, 2014 - 09:20pm PT

blurring, are you just as offended when you see a streaker's c*#k at sporting events? You do realize, EVERYONE who goes to one of those parades knows exactly what to expect... or they are fuking idiots.

ontheedgeandscaredtodeath

Social climber

SLO, Ca

Mar 14, 2014 - 09:23pm PT

In SF, if you want to find funky stuff going on you will find it. If you don't you don't. I lived in different parts of the city, with and without a family, and never experienced the horrors Ron and Bluey describe.

tradmanclimbs

Ice climber

Pomfert VT

Mar 14, 2014 - 09:39pm PT

Well i see you guys did not get ron banned but your still acting like 12yr old brittish school boys. that is all of your, ron included....

ontheedgeandscaredtodeath

Social climber

SLO, Ca

Mar 14, 2014 - 09:46pm PT

Re the Folsom fair, not possible to attend unless you seriously want to be there. Some people, uh, love to be so shocked and horrified! !!

mechrist

Gym climber

South of Heaven

Mar 14, 2014 - 09:50pm PT

if you want to find funky stuff going on you will find it. If you don't you don't.

It is the fact that it is happening, somewhere, anywhere, that gets them so... worked up. Whether they see it or not, they just can't stop thinking about it.

kunlun_shan

Mountain climber

SF, CA

Mar 14, 2014 - 09:58pm PT

SF looks pretty "normal" to me, but I'm from B.C.

Jaybro

Social climber

Wolf City, Wyoming

Mar 14, 2014 - 10:18pm PT

Full moon + st paddy's weekend it's going to be brutal on the taco, and it seems to have started!

Jaybro

Social climber

Wolf City, Wyoming

Mar 14, 2014 - 10:44pm PT

Wise move, it could get ugly!

MisterE

climber

Mar 14, 2014 - 10:51pm PT

There will always be the reactive element - try to rise above it, friends.

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 14, 2014 - 11:32pm PT

Just telling you why I personally avoid the City at all costs.

I was...'juss sayin'...

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 14, 2014 - 11:44pm PT

I agree, Jimmy. I was just trying to 'relate', man, on their level.

whatever....

Ghost

climber

A long way from where I started

Mar 14, 2014 - 11:46pm PT

I agree, Jimmy. I was just trying to 'relate', man, on their level.

"their level"???

Who are "they"

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 14, 2014 - 11:49pm PT

people who use term, just sayin'. I agree it is a cop-out term.

I use it....

mark miller

Social climber

Reno

Mar 15, 2014 - 12:01am PT

SF is a beautiful city, you just need to avoid certain districts.
The culture, museums and the ocean.....and better weather then B.C. or Seattle. Except of course the renown statement from the extinguished writer Marc Twain," the coldest winter I've ever spent was a summer in SF"....Funny stuff. They have pleasant cool weather through the early summer, thank gawd it beats the Heck out of the weather on the eastside during that same period. I try to get to the city at least once a year, it's fabulous. But then again I'm comparing it to Reno and Detroit, no wonder why I think it's the shite.

apogee

climber

Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy

Mar 15, 2014 - 12:04am PT

Hey, blue....what do you think about Ron?

You tend to be pretty much incommunicado whenever he takes a sh#t and gets the feathers flying. Silence = Acceptance?

Or... Silence = I don't want anything to do with that dipsh#t?

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 15, 2014 - 12:32am PT

Hey, blue....what do you think about Ron?

You tend to be pretty much incommunicado whenever he takes a sh#t and gets the feathers flying. Silence = Acceptance?

Or... Silence = I don't want anything to do with that dipsh#t?

Tend to like Ron. Seems cool.

survival

Big Wall climber

Terrapin Station

Mar 15, 2014 - 04:20am PT

Jefe, I'll finger bang you if nobody else steps up.

I've got a deformed finger that's all lumpy n sh#t, you'll love it.

Dr.Sprock

Boulder climber

I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!

Mar 15, 2014 - 05:27am PT

SF? more butt f*#king per sq mile than any other city,

taxi cabs? got about 5, the drivers are in the trunk,

did you see the Valet Parking deal?>

SAN FRANCISCO (CBS 5)

With space tight in downtown San Francisco, valet parking is a fact of life here. But did you ever wonder what happens to your car after you hand over the keys? CBS 5 Investigates has been looking into what happens in one popular nightspot.

Welcome to North Beach, where there are lots of Italian restaurants, lots of people, lots of cars with virtually no parking spaces. Here, the valet is king, and he gets to drive off with your car.

"Someone comes and gets my car and they park my car for me," one woman told CBS 5 Investigates.

"Some places do valet their cars and park them in and around the neighborhood," said another.

And when we asked a third he said: "Park it, immediately, then bring it back. Is that not what happens?"

Well not always. CBS 5 Investigates witnessed a valet takes a customer's Toyota SUV over Telegraph Hill and down to a waterfront parking lot, where you'd think it would stay. But a short time later, a group of valets pile back into that car and go for a ride. Not to the restaurant, but rather into a nearby alley, where they all jump out.

What's the reason behind that? Well the valets have to find spaces to park all those cars. So CBS 5 discovered they're actually driving some of those cars clear out of North Beach, up and down steep hills and down to the water, where they finally park the cars in a lot on the waterfront roughly three-quarters of a mile away. And how do the valets get back to North Beach to pick up their next car? Well we found their solution: In some cases they just use your car.

And not just once: One Saturday night, four valets get into a car already parked at the lot for a ride back to North Beach. But they don't get dropped off at the restaurant, since customers might see. So they drop them off at a familiar alley a half block up the hill. The valets then run down the sidewalk to pick up another batch of cars. In fact CBS 5 witnessed nine round trips for the Toyota 4-Runner over a 2-hour period.

"What are you guys doing with the cars here?" we asked the valets on one of those stops in the alley. "This is a client's car, yes?"

Their answer: No. It's rented.

Tell that to the customer who owns it. CBS 5 approached him a short time later after he and his family finished their meal at North Beach restaurant Bocce's and explained what happened to his vehicle during dinner.

"Huh! I'll have to ask about that," the owner said.

And we also wondered what the owner of a Porsche SUV might think if he saw his vehicle parked on Grant Street picking up a pizza. Evidently valets get hungry on Saturday nights too and what's better than a personal Porsche pizza delivery guy, bringing dinner down to the parking lot.

It's not exactly what Max Fattahian thought was happening with his Porsche.

"They're getting a takeout with my car? A pizza takeout? That's an expensive pizza delivery car," Fattahian said. "The guy buys his pizza and a whole bunch of them in the car and he's going all over the city. It's unacceptable."

Bocce restaurant owner Welat Yuksel agrees. "It's not okay to use customers' cars, it's not right" he told us after watching the video CBS 5 Investigates shot.

He said s it's all a surprise to him. "The pictures are clear there, it's very embarrassing," he said.

So we tried to talk to this man: Nurullah Zira, the owner of that valet parking service, but he didn't want to talk.

"You have no right to do what you are doing right now…You are interfering with my business," Zira said.

Interfering with his business? Our videotaping, a criminal matter?

"I am going to call the police department," he insisted.

And as restaurant patrons watched, the SFPD arrived, but not with the answer Zira wanted.

"My sergeant says you have every right to film, whatever you like to do." The officer said.

The parking company owner did tell us he would come by for an interview. But then he cancelled. Later, he did claim to us that he was unaware of his employees using customers' cars for shuttles and he plans to discipline those who did. He says he provides two shuttle cars for his valets and on the night we talked to him outside the restaurant, his employees should have been using them.

kaholatingtong

Trad climber

Nevada City

Mar 15, 2014 - 10:10am PT

knew i shoulda grabbed a valet job while i was in the city

survival

Big Wall climber

Terrapin Station

Mar 15, 2014 - 04:38pm PT

SF voters help keep this state from being run by a bunch of backward hillbillies and help keep America from being run by Rush Limbaugh and Glenn Beck.

GO SF!!!

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 15, 2014 - 04:40pm PT

Um, so it's communism or fascism, are the choices in your mind? Communism being the preference?

EDIT All conservative voters in Cali are hillbillies? If I don't play nice with Dems, I'm a Hillbilly?

That would make you a bigot, by definition.

survival

Big Wall climber

Terrapin Station

Mar 15, 2014 - 05:45pm PT

Whatever Cletus! Or is it Jed?

BTW, I will take you up on that climbing offer one of these days, just so I can count your teeth!

(But not until after I give you a good solid finger banging.)

drljefe

climber

El Presidio San Augustin del Tucson

Mar 15, 2014 - 05:58pm PT

I sense some white-on-white tension here.

Ghost

climber

A long way from where I started

Mar 15, 2014 - 06:00pm PT

Oh my god, the disease is spreading! First San Francisco, now Boston and New York.

Headline today:

Heineken and Sam Adams boycott St. Patrick's Day parades
Two of the country's biggest beer companies are withdrawing their sponsorships of upcoming St. Patrick's Day parades because gay and lesbian groups aren't allowed to march openly.

How much more redneck can you get than Sam Adams and Heineken? If outfits like those two are on the gay rights bandwagon, it's only a question of time before Ron can be scandalized right there in Carson City.

Time to move to Uganda or Iran, guys. They sympathize with your views in those places.

MisterE

climber

Mar 15, 2014 - 10:18pm PT

How much more redneck can you get than Sam Adams and Heineken? If outfits like those two are on the gay rights bandwagon, it's only a question of time before Ron can be scandalized right there in Carson City.

Time to move to Uganda or Iran, guys. They sympathize with your views in those places.

Bruce Morris

Social climber

Belmont, California

Mar 16, 2014 - 02:22am PT

I don't beat up on gays or African Americans, just Italians and Roman Catholics. Just so no to the Counter Reformation! Fight back against the Black Friars and their Satan Pope.

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 16, 2014 - 02:30am PT

Not sure why Ron and Blue are afraid of gays, but maybe they're homo.

Who frincking cares about gays, doesn't bother me, not sure what part of u is Relegious Blue, you seem like a pretty bitter guy, with a lot of hate and hostility.

Just disagree with the behavior, brah. Not a fear thing at all.

WBraun

climber

Mar 17, 2014 - 11:33am PT

Nobody wants to talk to you bonehead Bomz to begin with.

They know you're a certified nutcase .....

survival

Big Wall climber

Terrapin Station

Mar 17, 2014 - 11:35am PT

Tioga + Blue + Ron = Michael Savage

apogee

climber

Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy

Mar 17, 2014 - 11:51am PT

Man, tioga...that's harsh. Still, a pretty typical hyperbolic (angry, too) characterization from the right.

Sooooo...if SF sucks, then what's your idea of a good city?

apogee

climber

Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy

Mar 17, 2014 - 12:00pm PT

No answer, tioga? Or just bitching?

Typical.

Norton

Social climber

the Wastelands

Mar 17, 2014 - 12:06pm PT

gays live there

mechrist

Gym climber

South of Heaven

Mar 17, 2014 - 12:27pm PT

So much hate for liberals and those who help the homeless. Jesus would be proud.

jonnyrig

Trad climber

formerly known as hillrat

Mar 17, 2014 - 12:41pm PT

You guys are waaay too concerned about who,s f*#king who.

Gay, straight, Christian, atheist, pro-gun, pro-abortion. Too many as#@&%es forcing their own opinion of what should be restricted on the rest of the world.

STFU! Let people be. Let them hunt, let them screw, let them worship as they please.

Get over your own moral self-righteousness and limit your ideal of restraint to those who do actual harm in the world- murderers, theives, drug pushers, and politicians.

After all, we,re all judging you as well.

Patrick Sawyer

climber

Originally California now Ireland

Topic Author's Reply - Mar 17, 2014 - 12:45pm PT

Oh my gosh, what did I start? And how has it surfaced again?

I merely wanted to point out that I like SF, working there, playing football there. But I am a native of the Bay Area, so The City always held an attraction.

Yes, bring down Hetch Hetchy, it's time John Muir rose from his grave.

And the Giants and 49ers, actually where is their stadium?

Golden Gate Park and the Presidio… I want to fan the flames of ultra liberals and ultra conservatives. Randsi, big city, well not compared to China.

But a city that has had a very influential influence (is that redundant?) on the West Coast of arguably the best place in the world. Outside of Paris, New York, Rio, Cape Town, Rome, London, Dublin (I had to include that), Buenos Aires, Singapore, Beijing, Seattle, Vancouver, Montreal, Tokyo, Mumbai, and Lafayette and Walnut Creek (I had to include those two. The El Rey and Park cinemas, and Kaiser, where my mom spawned me). And the Rheem theatre, eh Jaybro.

And Canyon, the Redwoods and… Oakland? (I went to school there, St Francis de Sales, first and second grade). Mt Diablo, some of the best and shittiest sandstone in the world. Well, okay, not sure about best.

What about them Raiders and A's? And Glasgow Celtic and Rangers? We think SF has problems? Look at Manchester United, 'them' are problems.

Take down Hetch Hetchy, find another water source, down with the Stanisalus, wait a minute, is that Russian? Don Pedro? Wasn't that a tequila? And Obama and the Ukraine, real problems. Putin is a putz… Putin, putz, sort of an alliteration. Is Merkel a miracle? Doubt it.

Damn Yosemite Valley. I mean, dam Yosemite Valley. The Merced needs to be tamed.

I cannot believe one of my threads has surfaced. I am sooooooo proud.

And generated feedback.

And believe it or not, some interesting topics and news for me. Seriously.

But come on, why did Gene Rodenberry pick San Francisco as the headquarters for the United Federation of Planets? It must have something going for it.

Because SF is a great place. Especially if you have money.

I am East Bay grease, sort of… Diablo Valley Boy. But SF… what's Dalien like Randi? I briefly dated a gal, Jo Jing, from there here in Dublin.

Happy Paddy's Day y'all.

apogee

climber

Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy

Mar 17, 2014 - 12:55pm PT

tioga, why can't you answer such a simple question?

You clearly know the things you don't like about a city...so what city do you like?

Should be pretty damn clear, with such well-formed opinions of what you don't like.

survival

Big Wall climber

Terrapin Station

Mar 17, 2014 - 12:57pm PT

that is culturless at the same time--a soulless, void playground for the rich and the worst place in the US,

Mother nature might take down San Fran someday, but these angry little guys never will.

Rick Vena

climber

SF,CA

Mar 17, 2014 - 01:07pm PT

Yep, this place sucks. Nothing to see here. Please move along.....

jonnyrig

Trad climber

formerly known as hillrat

Mar 17, 2014 - 02:05pm PT

im gona clarify- what you do in private oughta be your business. f*#king someone on a public street isnt private and could mentally damage small children. westborough baptist protests? yeah, f*#k them too.

live and let live though, much as you can, and everyones lives would be simpler, better.

Brandon-

climber

The Granite State.

Mar 17, 2014 - 02:15pm PT

SF, worst city in the world.

Buncha people not like me.

I'll take Fairbanks any day, thank you very much.

Or maybe Carson City.

survival

Big Wall climber

Terrapin Station

Mar 17, 2014 - 02:27pm PT

Wha?? Should that be a PROBLEM Dingus?? How about an a MAIN street of an area heading to breakfast from your motel room, no "alleys" involved?

Name ANY city in America here:

Brandon-

climber

The Granite State.

Mar 17, 2014 - 02:32pm PT

And here we go...

John M

climber

Mar 17, 2014 - 02:53pm PT

It was aggressive and combative, meant to strike an argument, not a conversation. In your face kind of post. you weren't really talking to dingus, you are talking at him. So as a question wanting to know his opinion, then it isn't legit, because it really just wants to prove itself right. Not hear an opinion.

mechrist

Gym climber

South of Heaven

Mar 17, 2014 - 02:56pm PT

Personally, I found having sex in public places quite exciting when I was a teenager.

apogee

climber

Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy

Mar 17, 2014 - 02:56pm PT

"And here we go..."

...again.

So fecking predictable.

And a waste of pixels.

John M

climber

Mar 17, 2014 - 02:59pm PT

teenagers would have sex in front of the whole world if it meant that they could have sex. hahaha..

there is a subculture of people who like public sex. They like to view it and they like to have it. Personally I don't care to see it, whether its gays or hetersexuals. A little PDA is fine if its about love. If its about voyeurism, then I would just as soon not see it.

apogee

climber

Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy

Mar 17, 2014 - 03:07pm PT

So let me get this straight, Ron....

You don't think PDA's amongst gays are acceptable...because they are 'bad for the kids'.

I betcha you'd keep watching, though, if this is what you encountered in SF..

Or maybe you'd prefer...

John M

climber

Mar 17, 2014 - 03:12pm PT

Ron..

the question is legit, the way you asked it isn't. It gets old seeing the way you talk, which leads to responses like apogee's, which I didn't' care for. Just mean. Its this kind of conversation that has caused good people to quit posting on the taco and makes these threads go south.

Brandon-

climber

The Granite State.

Mar 17, 2014 - 03:13pm PT

Hey Ron, maybe you should resurrect your SF thread.

Pat wanted to talk about what he likes about the city, and you wanted to talk about what you dislike.

He didn't jump into your thread telling you that you were wrong, why rain on his parade?

Or, do you just like to read your own words?

Bump it dude, I'll comment on whatever you have to say.

apogee

climber

Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy

Mar 17, 2014 - 03:17pm PT

Ron Anderson...purveyor of thoughtful, articulate commentary at SuperTopo since 2009.

jonnyrig

Trad climber

formerly known as hillrat

Mar 17, 2014 - 03:25pm PT

Interesting how many people i see parked up Goni Rd here in Carson either screwing or drugging at sunset when i walk my dog or scramble around washoe Boulders.

Pissing in public in NV can get you sex offender status for life.

San Francisco? Some great food there.
But I dont much like the big city life. Theyre all just entertainment to me.

John M

climber

Mar 17, 2014 - 04:04pm PT

I much prefer to live in small towns with lots of wilderness outside the door, but I sure enjoy visiting large cities, especially ones as interesting as SF. At times live symphonies, great museums, and great food are just a must.

The Glowering Sailor

climber

Mt. Humphreys

Mar 17, 2014 - 05:19pm PT

Its this kind of conversation that has caused good people to quit posting on the taco and makes these threads go south.

Or prevented other good people from joining in the first place.

Ron, you are an as#@&%e, and your omnipresence on this forum makes it fairly useless for anything resembling a place to have a sustained, interesting dialogue with other climbers about climbing, and other OT stuff, buttressed by a shared love of climbing and the mountains.

Patrick Sawyer

climber

Originally California now Ireland

Topic Author's Reply - Mar 17, 2014 - 05:53pm PT

Come on people, I started this thread a couple of centuries ago to say why I think San Francisco is unique. And it is, but I suppose many cities are in their own sense. I did not want it to turn into a love or hate fest.

Now, St Patrick, who wasn't Irish but did drive the Burmese pythons out of Florida, he for some strange reason, this day transcends the world as it is. I just watched a bunch of TV showing Paddy's Day being celebrated around the world.

Except in SF, where it is St Patricia's Day. Okay, just joking.

But for such a small island, one has to admit, Ireland has found its place in the world. Me? I am Welsh, Irish, Scottish, German, English and Cherokee.

But for some indelible reason Paddy's Day lives on.

Now kids, let's just say that San Francisco, love it or loathe it, is a bit different than many cities. For better or for worse.

No arguments, name calling or bickering, as this is St Patrick telling you to behave. Well, okay, maybe I am not a saint, and my first name is Douglas, but I grew up as Pat. My other brothers also grew up by their middle names.

SF is unique, but I suppose so is New Delhi, Sydney, Santiago, Guadalajara (beautiful city), Saskatoon (what, where'd that come from? Next up Calgary), Manila, Des Moines, and of course, Casper. Boise to boot.

You know, St Patrick is the patron saint of San Francisco, uh wait a minute, maybe not.

I am at a bit at odds (war?) with the local farmer, he owns a lot and is very influential in these parts. He thinks he owns Ballytrent (and he is out plowing the field in front of the house, probably to bug me, come on it's almost 22:00 at night. On Paddy's Day). And his cows moo at me. He doesn't like my landlord either. What is a person to do? Moo back?

The City by the Bay, is there any other?

EDIT

Actually the cows also moon me (moooon), I see them in the pasture from the kitchen window, doing weird things like, well, you don't want to know. Mooooo.

My neighbor Jamie tells me to stay away from his cows, or the bulls might hurt me. I told him just because he owns a lot, don't "boss" me around. "You inherited this land, farm and houses. I am nothing, but don't boss me around." He didn't like that.

Ghost

climber

A long way from where I started

Mar 17, 2014 - 06:00pm PT

Saskatoon (what, where'd that come from?

Oh, come on. Everybody knows Saskatoon is the San Francisco of the North! But I will never go there again, because I heard from a friend that the last time he visited there, he saw two dogs going at it. Right in plain sight!!!

Patrick Sawyer

climber

Originally California now Ireland

Topic Author's Reply - Mar 17, 2014 - 06:07pm PT

Could have been worst Ghost, two sheep. Baaa, I am just joking.

Patrick Sawyer

climber

Originally California now Ireland

Topic Author's Reply - Mar 17, 2014 - 06:32pm PT

Timid, comrade, Вы говорите по-русски?, pray tell me, how do you know if two dogs are gay? Wait a minute, let me guess. But California or Russian dogs?

Oroville, wasn't he and his brother flying planes at Kitty Hawk?

Apologies, that was the Butte of the joke. Yuk, Yuk. And yeck Patrick, you can do better. Next (get this guy off the stage. Send him back to Creektown).

Okay… Winterland, Fillmore West, good jazz, nice crabs (itchy itchy), Anchor Steam, cable cars, steep hills (I drove the blood red van in Homeward Bound 2, Lost in in San Francisco, damn thing hardly had breaks, on SF Hills, Disney could have afforded better. Five takes, and no brakes. Thanks the heavens for gears slowing you down, downshifting on SF streets).

I love SF, but when I win the EuroMillions, it will be Sausalito.

mechrist

Gym climber

South of Heaven

Mar 17, 2014 - 07:45pm PT

My two female dogs used to hump each other all the time. Now where did they learn that? Surely grandma never... hmmm...

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 17, 2014 - 08:00pm PT

Who takes small children to the back alleys of a gay street fair?

Huh?

DMT

This is the crux of why I why I don't care for SF. Only in SF is this behavior not done in "back alleys", but rather on common main streets of the city.

mechrist

Gym climber

South of Heaven

Mar 17, 2014 - 08:11pm PT

Bullsh#t. I've never seen people openly fuking on the streets of SF. The only person I've heard of ever seeing it is Ron's anonymous friend. All the other cases that make you think it is common were conceived in your head.

I've seen far more people fuking in the woods, on the sides of dirt roads, in parks, or at popular "parking" spots around Salt Lake City than I have ever seen in the cities I have visited.

The only reason you get so upset about it is because you are homophobic. If it had been a heterosexual couple in Paris Ron's imaginary friends would never have feigned such outrage.

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 17, 2014 - 08:36pm PT

I never said they were f-ing. But public nudity and sodomy are not uncommon. Inappropriate for kids.

I've seen far more people fuking in the woods, on the sides of dirt roads, in parks, or at popular "parking" spots around Salt Lake City than I have ever seen in the cities I have visited.

Unlike, Ron, we're supposed to take you're anecdotal evidence with more authority? Like you 2 lesbian dogs?

The only reason you get so upset about it is because you are homophobic. If it had been a heterosexual couple in Paris Ron's imaginary friends would never have feigned such outrage.

It's a decency thing, brah. Has nothing to do with fags. Heteros should not be doing that either, that's why there are laws in place about this sh#t.

drljefe

climber

El Presidio San Augustin del Tucson

Mar 17, 2014 - 08:42pm PT

If it were two hot lesbians or a hot hetero couple you as#@&%es would be puttin' that image in the spank bank and you know it.

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 17, 2014 - 08:43pm PT

wrong, jefe....

apogee

climber

Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy

Mar 17, 2014 - 08:44pm PT

Right, jefe!

drljefe

climber

El Presidio San Augustin del Tucson

Mar 17, 2014 - 08:47pm PT

And if Ron's last girlfriend, the 90's stripper, wanted to give him a hummer in the alley he would most certainly oblige.

Elcapinyoazz

Social climber

Joshua Tree

Mar 17, 2014 - 08:53pm PT

Same hillbillies screaming "show me yer tits" at Mardi Gras, suddenly shocked and outraged by public nudity...because PENIS!

There is nothing inherently shameful or wrong about nudity. You weren't born with clothes on..or that stick up yer ass. Somehow european beaches haven't turned the entire continent into child molesters.

BTW, Ringsting, aren't you Catholic? Maybe keep your kids out of the Catholic church instead of worrying about gay folks, chances of them getting molested are about 10,000x more likely there.

drljefe

climber

El Presidio San Augustin del Tucson

Mar 17, 2014 - 09:04pm PT

I ain't your son.

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 17, 2014 - 09:06pm PT

Same hillbillies screaming "show me yer tits" at Mardi Gras,

Speak for yerself...

And if anybody molests children, it should be condemned, but that is not the issue here. In fact, you are agreeing with my premise.

drljefe

climber

El Presidio San Augustin del Tucson

Mar 17, 2014 - 09:09pm PT

I only know what you show me bubbs.

Edit: because you couldn't afford it. ;-)

Edit 2: my crystal ball is definitely not foggy.

The Glowering Sailor

climber

Mt. Humphreys

Mar 17, 2014 - 09:10pm PT

Unlike, Ron, we're supposed to take you're anecdotal evidence with more authority?

Where is YOUR anecdotal evidence? Did you live in SF? How long? How many times did you actually witness public sex? Can you prove it?

Here's my anecdotal contribution: I lived in SF for seven years, and I was out a lot, day, night, all over the city, all quarters, from Potrero Hill to the Castro to Church to North Beach, Broadway (back when Carol Doda was still a thing), Mission, Tenderloin, Civic Center, SOMA (before any of the museum expansions, before the dot com thing, etc.), upper/lower Haight, Diviz, etc., and I only ever saw public sex once, and that was a hetero couple. Two young white guys actually with a female prostitute in the alley below my apartment on Sutter near Taylor (sort of between Nob Hill and the Tenderloin) behind a car. That's it. One time. For all the leather and bears and everything else bigots like you are afraid of, I never once saw anyone having actual public sex.

In a club, different story, but there were no children or underage, un-consenting adults present. Your thesis is largely bullsh*t.

Unless of course you can prove it.

Which I'm pretty sure you can't.

Lollie

Social climber

I'm Lolli. Hey that's me and I want you only

Mar 17, 2014 - 09:11pm PT

Those times I've visited San Francisco I've only seen quite normal people. It's pretty much an ordinary city, more like a European city than other American cities are. Nice place to visit, but rather foggy and cold.

drljefe

climber

El Presidio San Augustin del Tucson

Mar 17, 2014 - 09:14pm PT

Not meant to be a cheap shot, except the edit.

Like I said before, I cannot blame you for feeling uncomfortable with homosexuality, you or Blue.
But Blue should take his own advice when, as the tolerant Christian he is, says "we just don't want to see it".
Go ahead, be scared of homosexuality but please keep it to yourselves.

survival

Big Wall climber

Terrapin Station

Mar 17, 2014 - 09:21pm PT

The thread that keeps on giving, just like good ol' San Fran!

WBraun

climber

Mar 17, 2014 - 09:23pm PT

All these guys here in this thread are all way homo.

They're all mind fuking each other.

:-)

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 17, 2014 - 09:35pm PT

You're a disingenuous liar. A simple search would find all kinds of stuff. Like this; http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=Folsom+Street+Fair+San+Francisco+graphic+pictures&qs=n&form=QBVR&pq=folsom+street+fair+san+francisco+graphic+pictures&sc=0-0&sp=-1&sk=

Elcapinyoazz

Social climber

Joshua Tree

Mar 17, 2014 - 09:45pm PT

Had that link close at hand did you ClosetRing? Right next to the tissue box I bet.

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 17, 2014 - 09:48pm PT

Elcrapinyerazz, it's a simple, quick search. Can you read?

Elcapinyoazz

Social climber

Joshua Tree

Mar 17, 2014 - 09:51pm PT

Indeed I can read, and spell too. I even know which continent contains Mexico. Sounds like you spend quite a bit of time googling for hot gay alley sex. Be careful of spiders in that closet.

drljefe

climber

El Presidio San Augustin del Tucson

Mar 17, 2014 - 09:54pm PT

I watched the first two videos.
Good times!!!!!!!!!!!

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 17, 2014 - 10:12pm PT

You people say there is no vulgarity in SF gay parades and say I'm a liar because I don't live there. I provide evidence that you ask for and that is still not enough.

Oh, and I must be a closet-homo because I did a search to find you the evidence.

Priceless denial and obfuscation.....

drljefe

climber

El Presidio San Augustin del Tucson

Mar 17, 2014 - 10:14pm PT

There was no sex in the videos I watched.
Have you watched them Blue?

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 17, 2014 - 10:17pm PT

Yes. And there was explicit sex in public.

But I know what you're trying to do here....

julton

climber

Mar 17, 2014 - 10:18pm PT

Folsom Street Fair isn't a gay parade. A lot of gay people though, I'll give you that. I walked through, once. Never again. Way too many people who really didn't look very attractive partially undressed. I saw one fully naked guy. No sex, unless you think spanking is sex.

This has really become a stupid thread.

kunlun_shan

Mountain climber

SF, CA

Mar 17, 2014 - 10:34pm PT

I've lived in SF for 21 years now. Haven't been to the Folsom St. Fair, and haven't seen any public sex in the City. Seen some nudity at Bay to Breakers (12k footrace) and other events, and its very non-sexual. Just young and old naked people being free.

Crack cocaine and heroin are available in most N American cities. I haven't tried either, or even to find it. I think both are worse for one's health than nudity and sex. :)

Have lived quite a few places and SF is near top of the list.

Psilocyborg

climber

Mar 17, 2014 - 10:39pm PT

I love living in Hemet. No good food, no culture, everyone is rude, lots of drug addicts and prostitutes. I dont live here for that....there is a pretty sweet mountain nearby.

In my apartment, everyone is nice and loving, great food, great culture, completely oblivious to the sh#t storm outside. So the f*#k what?

Weird how that works huh? People just like to be all over dramatic about everything.

bluering

Trad climber

Santa Clara, CA

Mar 17, 2014 - 10:57pm PT

Weird how that works huh? People just like to be all over dramatic about everything.

I concur about the whole drama thing. I was just trying to explain why I dislike the city, and why I'll tolerate, carefully, everything else for one day a year. Fleet Week.

On a more local level in the South Bay, there are reasons why I avoid East Palo Alto (near my work) and East Side San Jose where I could actually probably afford a house.

It's statistically unsafe and a haven for Asian and Mexican gangs. I CHOOSE to avoid it. No racism involved, they have created their own ethnic problem. They are self-stereotyping!

kunlun_shan

Mountain climber

SF, CA

Mar 29, 2014 - 10:52pm PT

It rained really hard today in SF. I finally got out to do laundry after the storm ended. A large number of apartment buildings in the City don't have their own laundry facilities. In my neighborhood, most renters use public laundromats. I left my laundry to wash, and when I went back half an hour later to dry and pick it up, there was a guy in the laundromat with no shirt on. He had almost overwhelming body odor, so I decided to not dry my laundry for long and just get out of there. I could hardly breathe. The guy is standing in front of a dryer waiting for his clothing. He's pacing, laughing and ranting.... seems quite psychotic, and has a bit of a threatening attitude.

I'm folding up my clothing and thinking, at least even if this guy doesn't bathe, he's washing his clothing. Then the guy goes to his bag, says loudly, "Look out, stinky socks!" and pulls out a dripping wet pair of long wool socks and flings them into the dryer. I realize he's not washing his clothing at all, just drying it out, as he got soaked in the rain. If it smells as bad as he does, I pity the next couple people who use that dryer!

I feel sorry for the guy, and would have gladly paid for soap and a washing machine for him. On the other hand, he doesn't seem like someone I really want to get in a conversation with. I haven't seen this happen at this laundromat before. There aren't many homeless people hanging out in this neighborhood. This does not make me feel good about public laundry facilities. Very San Franciscan, or at least big U.S big city, kind of story. A lot of the people living nearby are paying $2,000 month for a 1 bedroom apt without laundry facilities, and at times sharing dryers with the homeless.

Chaz

Trad climber

greater Boss Angeles area

Apr 7, 2014 - 12:32pm PT

Someone's "tipping" cars in San Francisco.

http://abclocal.go.com/kgo/story?section=news/local/san_francisco&id=9494533

In Oakland, they just pick them up and carry them away.

How do we know vandals are responsible? Some of the streets there are damned steep. Maybe it tried to climb that hill with a bag of cat litter in the trunk, or a full tank of gas, and ended up like this on its own.

Or maybe its butt itches.

mechrist

Gym climber

South of Heaven

Apr 7, 2014 - 01:05pm PT

A simple search would find all kinds of stuff. Like this;

https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=redneck+beastiality&FORM=HDRSC2

drljefe

climber

El Presidio San Augustin del Tucson

Apr 25, 2014 - 08:56pm PT

http://blogs.sfweekly.com/thesnitch/tumblr_n4hs8oGmEp1s4df8ko1_r1_1280.jpg

ontheedgeandscaredtodeath

Social climber

SLO, Ca

Apr 25, 2014 - 09:50pm PT

Funny jefe! I lived in new hipsters, long before the hipsters (pretty much only Irish drywallers and Asians, all freshly arrived) great surfing out there, at least sometimes. Also lived in blowjobs and lesbians / dog owners (I am the latter).

Was there last weekend- what a great city.

Chaz

Trad climber

greater Boss Angeles area

Apr 25, 2014 - 10:47pm PT

The map is missing a label.

"FOR FOOD ... NOT FOR PET" --------> Chinatown

Chaz

Trad climber

greater Boss Angeles area

Jul 31, 2014 - 10:01pm PT

Shrimp Boy Chow slept here:

( I don't know for sure if he slept there or not, but this is his organization )

State Senator Leland Yee and his pals getting popped for corruption piqued my curiosity of the going ons there in Chinatown.

http://www.sfgate.com/news/item/Key-players-California-state-Sen-Yee-and-others-28376.php

I've seen these places - tongs, triads, and benevolent associations, and had no idea what goes on there, and after looking things up, I'm sure I still don't. Chinatown strikes me as the type of place one can live for a lifetime, and still have no clue what's happening around them.

That's one of the things that makes Chinatown my favorite part of The City. And the food.

Unlike other parts of town, Chinatown is alive. Busy place. It's what you want in a city.

I'm always fascinated by the different ways people find to chase their American Dream.

Grant Street:

Stockton Street:

The two streets are separated by a block, but it may as well be an ocean between them. The tourists belong on Grant Street, and they all seem to know it. I like Stockton Street better. Stockton is for the locals. I was the only white person I saw on Stockton, and I had to look at my own reflection in the windows to see one.

I wish there was something like Stockton St closer to where I live. I took the opportunity there to stock up on what I hope is a year's worth of stuff I can't find anywhere else. Like dark soy sauce, and 76 proof rice wine. I would have hit the produce too, but it would go bad before I could cook it. But DAMN it looked good!

Where else can you buy fresh baby sharks, out of a cardboard box, right on the sidewalk?

I don't know what I would do with a baby shark, but I know where to go if I need one.

"Everybody Wang Chung tonight"

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