Climbing Gyms and disenchantment.....

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Messages 1 - 81 of total 81 in this topic

katiebird

Sport climber

austin

Topic Author's Original Post - May 23, 2006 - 12:03am PT

So, I'm up here in the big apple jonsin' for some climbing and i decide to hit up one of the gyms. keep in mind that i've no partner with me and time is of the essence, thus a quick trip to the gunks ain't happenin'. so i go to the gym and i'm totally unimpressed. it was small, the routes sucked and in general so did the climbers. i played around in the cave for a while until the muchismo fest rolled in and wnated to show off their ever so honed-in flailing skills. whatever, gyms suck! can't wait to be in the granite comfort of yosemite soon.

dirtineye

Trad climber

the south

May 23, 2006 - 12:12am PT

What a pleasure you must be, judging from your post.

How nice of you to share these good feelings.

Anastasia

Trad climber

Near a mountain, CA

May 23, 2006 - 12:14am PT

"Laughing."
The only gym I have ever liked is one that is being run by a big wall climber. I consider myself lucky to have Boulderdash in Calabasas CA.
Even though it can't replace rock, it gives a good workout when the season is wet. Plus it is full of good climbers that have spent years on rock before playing with plastic. Everyone is pretty friendly and not easily impressed.
Like I said, I'm lucky to have it near.

Anastasia

Trad climber

Near a mountain, CA

May 23, 2006 - 12:20am PT

Shush Dirt, girls need to express themselves to reach normalcy.
Shut them up and you'll be asking for it.
I'm sorry Dude, it is our nature...

I think it's better then what guys do when they strut around, swing their dicks while doing the stare off with other men. You can sense the competition until they reach an agreement to shake hands.

dirtineye

Trad climber

the south

May 23, 2006 - 12:30am PT

Sorry, Ishould hvae realized that the way fro a new gal to win friends and influence people would be to say negative, nasty, unkind things about every aspect of everything she did that day.

Silly me.

You are right, I just don't understand women.

maculated

Trad climber

San Luis Obispo, CA

May 23, 2006 - 12:34am PT

I dunno, give it a try instead of being so elitist.

I laughed at SLO-Op when I heard about it, but the guy who had started it sought me out and helped me join. Now I'm running a better version of it with him. And I LOOVE my SLO-Op. I love Tuesday nights with the crew, I love the routes to play on, love the tunes. It's not regular climbing, but it's great, and I'm getting better.

Yay for gyms.

WBraun

climber

May 23, 2006 - 01:38am PT

What are all those goofy colored tags for?

What a nightmare, you guys climb in that environment? Yech, blah, phfffftttt, uggghhhh!.

Hahahaha, ok, .... so you do.

pyro

Trad climber

Ventura

May 23, 2006 - 01:51am PT

Hey! I just joined the GYM.
The "Climbing Gym"....

I joined because I missed my best past time of working out in

the garage. listening to friends and their about their day.

Shack

Big Wall climber

Reno NV

May 23, 2006 - 01:56am PT

Ha Ha! Locker is a gym climber!!

(not that there's anything wrong with that)

Jaybro

Social climber

The West

May 23, 2006 - 02:37am PT

Climbing gyms rock! so to speak.

But it's not the same, at best a fractle of what can be found ...

Do-loop to the cave analogy

lightweight_yank

Trad climber

Sparx

May 23, 2006 - 03:19am PT

Yeah, climbing gyms suck, but some of us have to live in the city and groom poodles for a living.

dirtineye

Trad climber

the south

May 23, 2006 - 03:21am PT

NO locker, I have no idea what you are talking about.

I climb outside, most often on new rock, with a very small group of friends, usually no more than 4, more often just two of us, and we all get along, we are all older, and we don't ever have stupid young anti social bimbo wannbe climber chicks or dudes wander up to sashay around.

In fact, we almost never see anyone else, and if we do, we usually know them.

People with the attitude of the bird woman or the guys you are talking about would not be welcome, but they normally would not find us anyway.

slayton

Trad climber

Morongo Valley, Ca

May 23, 2006 - 03:25am PT

Lightweight yank: ".. . .but some of us have to live in the city and groom poodles for a living."

Not "have to" but "get to".

Karl Baba

Trad climber

Yosemite, Ca

May 23, 2006 - 03:42am PT

I guess folks make the best with what they have.

Isn't that why all those macho guys go for other guys in prison?

When I was going to Berkeley, there as no Gym. I would have totally joined if there were. I had to buy a motorcycle to get some adreniline. I went to Indian Rock a few times but nobody was ever there and there was no beta anywhere. Just seemed like a pile after yosemite but I hate bouldering

Peace

Karl

TradIsGood

Trad climber

Gunks end of country

May 23, 2006 - 06:44am PT

The OP was judgmental about the gym, the climbers in it, and the boulderers. The author pretty clearly implies that she was better than the other climbers. (She does not flail, of course.) Further, it extrapolated based on the experience of one "small gym" to all gyms.

Perhaps she just was having a bad day. "Time is of the essence." People in NYC do tend to let themselves believe that.

Nobody forced her to go to the gym. If she does not like them, she does not have to go again. (What are the odds that she will visit another gym? I would put it at 1:8.

Patrick Sawyer

climber

Originally California now Ireland

May 23, 2006 - 07:20am PT

Hey Karl, don't diss Indian Rock. It was handy for us East Bayers and I met some top climbers there - Chris Fredericks, Galen Rowell, Patrick Sawyer... ooops nix that last one, he ain't no top climber, according to his alter ego - Doug.

(My first name is Douglas, Patrick is my middle, I am also a Gemini, you know... split personality, heh heh)

dirtineye

Trad climber

the south

May 23, 2006 - 08:34am PT

Locker, spoken like a true entourage climber, I must say.

Mind your own store.

happiegrrrl

Trad climber

New York, NY

May 23, 2006 - 09:25am PT

I know the gym....59th Street. The place has a mix of "regulars" and "new to NY" climbers and people who go there because the memebrship is $250/yr vs. $600 (or $2,500! if you go to Chelsea Piers.....)

It's Gunks season, and those who climb outside are not in the gym at this time of year. It's just the regular guys, there are a few, who gym climb exclusively and possibly will boulder in Central Park.

The cave is small. Only 1 person can play at a time, and so....I guess it would suck to see the empty cave, start playing, and then find not one, not two but three others drifting over. Now one has to wait their turn....when only a few minutes ago, those same folks were engaged on the other walls, bouldering......

The girl was just jonesing for some climbing, didn't get her fix and tried to create a Seinfeldian diorama for us. She couldn't get her climbing on, so she did the next thing that came to mind - post up in her community..... There's no need for anyone to judge anything about her. She's probably a very nice person in real life.....

Katie - if you ever are in NYC again - I won't go gym climbing with you but will be happy to show you the Central Park boulders. And if you need a partner for the Gunks, let me know as well. Though I am not a hard climber, I am an attentive belay and I know the area.

golsen

Social climber

kennewick, wa

May 23, 2006 - 11:06am PT

Anastasia said, "I think it's better then what guys do when they strut around, swing their dicks while doing the stare off with other men. You can sense the competition until they reach an agreement to shake hands. "

sttzo said "Anastasia - What do you mean? After the handshake, it simply becomes "friendly competition" :-). "

I think she is referring to the "I will shake yours if you shake mine guys" This is an interpretation and not an offer...

WoodySt

Trad climber

Riverside

May 23, 2006 - 11:42am PT

Locker, you've already forgotten: Hanger 18 is in Upland and about twenty miles from Riverside. It is also wellknown for its wretched music.

Mick K

climber

Northern Sierra

May 23, 2006 - 11:59am PT

"There's no need for anyone to judge anything about her."

Isn't exactly what K-bird did when the bros came in and rained on her session.

katiebird

Sport climber

austin

Topic Author's Reply - May 23, 2006 - 12:29pm PT

hey happiegirl-
thanks for your post and understanding about the gym and such. i'd be down to take you up on that offer, so next time i'm in the big city i'll hit you up.

as for you dirtineye, sorry to so offend you. seems to me that you're the one with the problem. alls i said was that the gym sucked and in general so did the atmosphere. never said anything directed at you or your group of elitist friends. don't worry, i wouldn't want to climb with you anyways.

when did forums become these places where one gets ostracized for expressing views?

on a whole the gym i train at and coach at in austin is sweet. the people are great, the routes are good and i surely recommend it to any in the area. my post was by no means a slander of all gyms nor of the people that climb at them. it was simply a rant about one in particular and one visit in particular.

sheesh, people are sensitive.

G_Gnome

Social climber

Tendonitis City

May 23, 2006 - 12:40pm PT

While I prefer climbing outside and make Stoney Point my destination on Tuesday and Thursday evenings when light is available, when it isn't I am inside the gym. I guess I would rather be climbing than complaining. And we have a great crew that are all fun to be with so the social scene is a plus instead of a minus. I am in much better shape after a wet winter now that I do climb indoors so I guess I am happy to be a gym climber. However, I can see how a gym might be intimidating if you are not a good climber, all that proximity to people better than yourself. You just need to realize that those people probably don't care how you climb, the fact that you are a climber is more important. Try being friendly and see what happens, you just might make some new friends.

dirtineye

Trad climber

the south

May 23, 2006 - 12:49pm PT

LOL, yeah right cattybird, that's why I have friends all over the south-- nobody wants to climb with me because I am so awful, LOL.

And I am always trashing other climbers I don't even know, and when I post to a site for the first time, I try to make it all negative.

Elitist friends, yeah. That's right, I and all my elitist friends helped give beta and info to a climbing club that wanted to adventure a little in a remote area. Gee, you'd have thought they all had a good time and enjoyed my company from the looks on their faces.

WOW, us big mean elitists even invited the group to our secret batcave party, and wouldn't you know, everyone had fun there too!

Yep you sure have me pegged, LOL.

I'm going to guess you are under thirty.

Twerp.

happiegrrrl

Trad climber

New York, NY

May 23, 2006 - 01:02pm PT

To Mick K:
"There's no need for anyone to judge anything about her."

Isn't exactly what K-bird did when the bros came in and rained on her session."

Being that I have been at the gym she mentions, I can see exactly what happened to her, and have no doubt it was much as she described.

I "loved" 59th street when I first started climbing, and went 3 times a week. Got myself some really nice-looking arm muscles! hahaha.

But this winter, I tried to get back into going, as I didn't have money to travel and get outside. It was almost always a very frustrating experience. It really is very crowded, and you will have the guys with their dates who have never belayed. They have to take a lesson...and the staff at CCC does monitor things, but they can't be everywhere at once..... People refuse, even though requested, to anchor at belay when the weight difference is there. Then the climber pops off, and the belayer gets lifeted. Almost always banging into someone next to them, the place is that crowded.

And yes - if a girl went into the cave to boulder.....absolutely the guys would be there in a matter of minutes. Not the ones who are solid boulders; they wouldn't even notice. But....there are almost always people there looking to hook up(not that there's anything wrong with that!) and be "impressive" in their skills..... Ohhhh yeah....V minus Zero - send it, baby.....

bachar

Trad climber

Mammoth Lakes, CA

May 23, 2006 - 01:43pm PT

I'll go to a "gym" for a workout if I can't find rock - it's kind of fun, but I have to ask -how can anyone get used to the colored tape routes? It just confuses the hell out of me and I end up making my own sequences as I go...anybody else feel that way?
cheers, jb

atchafalaya

Trad climber

California

May 23, 2006 - 02:13pm PT

rain + hippie lettuce + gym = fun

quit thinking so much, and get in there and get strong(er)! the gym in sac makes winter in sac a lot easier. Cant climb there when its nice outside though.

dirtineye

Trad climber

the south

May 23, 2006 - 02:14pm PT

I'm not peeved, I enjoy laughing at twerps, and now I have two to laugh at. Thanks!

You are welcome to come flash any of my routes.

They are easy.

Really!

dirtineye

Trad climber

the south

May 23, 2006 - 02:16pm PT

Author:
bachar

Trad climber
From: Mammoth Lakes, CA
I'll go to a "gym" for a workout if I can't find rock - it's kind of fun, but I have to ask -how can anyone get used to the colored tape routes? It just confuses the hell out of me and I end up making my own sequences as I go...anybody else feel that way?
cheers, jb

YOU mean, you don't put little pieces of tape on the rock when you climb?

How do you know where to go next then?

I need help with this right away, please tell me!

And this "making up sequences as you go along", is that allowed?

Tahoe climber

Trad climber

Tahoe

May 23, 2006 - 02:39pm PT

Well said, Locker.
Dirty - thanks for proving my point.
-Aaron

ladd

Trad climber

land of fruits, nuts and flakes

May 23, 2006 - 02:44pm PT

happiegrrrl.... you just sparked what would have been a long forgotten memory - about those central park boulders.. Back in the early 80's, I was assigned to an off shore engineering systems pre-staging and acceptance testing site in NJ, and walking the streets of NYC during the weekends. Coming from a south Orange County beach town in CA., I felt like a lost and overwhelmed immigrant in the big apple - that is until I found those boulders in central park. I was amazed with the rock quality cept there was plentiful glass shards to be mindful, and homeless peoples "homes" on the top of some of the outcrops to not scare to death. What a trip...

cheers

todd-gordon

climber

May 23, 2006 - 02:47pm PT

Meet chicks and get injured; climbing gyms.....enjoy.

nb3000

Gym climber

Oakland, CA.

May 23, 2006 - 02:47pm PT

when did forums become these places where one gets ostracized for expressing views?

Welcome to the internet!

dirtineye

Trad climber

the south

May 23, 2006 - 02:53pm PT

HEY locker, your panties are in a wad.

That's great you climb every day, wonderful. Spray more by all means. Like most people here have not at some point, but thanks for pointing out that I currently do not, I had forgotten about that part.

Now ask if I give a crap or need to wiggle one bit.

NO, I don't, LOL.

And I guess you will feel bad about this too when you get over yourself later. Seriously, do you ever consider how often you fly off the handle over nothing?

It's like clockwork.

Just keep on doing what you do so well, it's part of your charm!

Now excuse me for discounting harsh words from someone who describes himself so aptly as the village idiot.

Tahotwerp, you are welcome. Since you proved my point with your first post, it was the least I could do.

Twerps are twerps. Period.

But thank you both for being entertaining, if predictable!

happiegrrrl

Trad climber

New York, NY

May 23, 2006 - 03:00pm PT

Ladd....yes, that is an apt description for the CP boulders(in the Northwoods, at least, still. The ones down at the lower end of the park are spiffy and clean; no more needles and people poop. More likely the objective hazzards will be dog poo and kiddies who scrambled up the back and are trying to downclimb the fronts....with the parents oblivious....).

John - So long as you don't spray about sending that "awesome new green route that is so reachy and has stymied everyone's redpoint so far".....I suppose it isn't going to hurt anyone if you want to climb off-route..... I wonder if you ignore the white, powdered tape that everyone works so hard to maintain for the climbing community when you're outside either......

NinjaChimp

climber

Davis, CA

May 23, 2006 - 03:07pm PT

I'm with you JB, I get paid to stick pieces of tape next to holds to tell people what to use and what not to use, but when I go in to climb myself I spend my whole time making up problems as I go. I don't have the patience for tape.

-Justin-

Patrick Sawyer

climber

Originally California now Ireland

May 23, 2006 - 03:12pm PT

I agree John, I just ignore the colors and climb. I still don't like climbing walls, but considering how much it rains in Ireland, then indoors down at the gym helps to keep in shape (that's not saying I'm in shape). I still have yet to visit a climbing gym as such, but the gym I belong to has a wall, so...

happiegrrrl

Trad climber

New York, NY

May 23, 2006 - 03:29pm PT

I think the $250 still includes use of the facility - swimming pool and weight room....But not 100% sure.

The thing that NYC is good for, climbingwise...is the proximity to airports that will have decent flight schedules to most climbing destinations.....hahahah

bachar

Trad climber

Mammoth Lakes, CA

May 23, 2006 - 04:14pm PT

Justin, Patrick... good to hear I'm not the only one who doesn't use the tape! I just see sequences and all the possibilities (like on the rock). It would be cool if they had enough space to just set "anything goes" type routes so that you wouldn't have to tape them (I guess if they had more space, they'd squeeze even more routes in! ). Overall they're a pretty good workout but I never get to grab as many "first-knuckle crimpers" as I would like - it's always these rounded sloper holds and weird shapes. Oh well....

Rara

Trad climber

Sanford, FL

May 23, 2006 - 04:19pm PT

yes...climbing gyms can suck. but when you live in flat florida, it's about my only haven for getting off the redundancy of the horizontal. hooray for aiguille! and yay for trips to the great outdoors!!

pyro

Trad climber

Ventura

May 23, 2006 - 04:21pm PT

Feeling is mutual when going for the right colored tape climbing route.

Just part of stick'n to it, so to play fair track the right color.

Tahoe climber

Trad climber

Tahoe

May 23, 2006 - 04:27pm PT

I hear what you're saying, John -
but sometimes, the route setter has a particular move that he wants you to do - for instance, setting a route so that a newer climber learns through trial and error, to do a drop-knee to become a more efficient climber, or to teach a heel-hook, or a smear by making the climber use a very small foothold to progress upward, etc.
I dislike the contrived nature of taped gym climbing, too, but it is not completely without some advantages - that can really pay off by increasing your odds of sending when you make it outside.
That's my take on it.
-Aaron

G_Gnome

Social climber

Tendonitis City

May 23, 2006 - 04:39pm PT

Fortunately the gym I climb at uses all the same colored holds for a route. Bouldering is by tape color though. The way I look at routes in the gym, is they are either well set and feel natural, or they are poorly set and contrived pieces of sh!t. If I am on a route that is well set, I climb on the correct holds. If I get on a contrived piece of ...., I either get off and go get on something better, or I start 'rainbow' climbing on any hold I want. It's supposed to be fun so that is how I try to keep it.

Zac 817

climber

New York City

May 23, 2006 - 04:56pm PT

Hey,
I normally just lurk here, but I felt like I should chime in on this topic. I work at the Manhattan Plaza Health Club climbing gym, setting routes and working the counter. You may interpret it as bias on my part, but I think this place is great for what it is. The walls are not high (bout 25 feet) but we have a very excellent lead roof and a separate room for bouldering and a lot of cool people without too much attitude or testosterone.

Katiebird, I invite you to check out MPHC on 43rd st. between 9th and 10th aves and see if it's any better than your experience at CCC on 59th. If you come in tonight or tomorrow night (5/23 or 5/24 after 6pm) I'll waive the day pass fee and call it a free trial.

Actually, that goes for any of you super-topo-ers who are in NYC. Happiegrrrl, if you think you can stand the plastic, come check it out. And anyone else in NYC. Just go in the club, ask how to find the climbing gym. When you arrive just ask for Zac and mention this thread (though, if a lot of people show up, I may have to start charging money).

-Zac

UberBabs1

Trad climber

Los Angeles, CA

May 23, 2006 - 04:59pm PT

I agree with Anastasia that Boulderdash is quite tolerable (just too far from Hollywood for me to frequent it). Gyms are just a training tool and not the place for attitude. As for the OP, not very attractive to spout negativity. Think carefully before you post for all the world to see. A future employer could be online!

And what's with the lack of capitalization? ee cummings LIVES!

katiebird

Sport climber

austin

Topic Author's Reply - May 23, 2006 - 05:09pm PT

Zac-
I appreciate the offer, but I'm flying back to ATX in a couple of hours. Next time I come up I'll be sure and see if your offer still stands.

-Katie

Zac 817

climber

New York City

May 23, 2006 - 05:20pm PT

K.B.

Too bad. If you're in town again, you should definitely drop by. Send me an email at lumberzac@hotmail.com to double check if I'm around and we'll work something out.

To everyone else, offer still stands for tonight and tomorrow night. If you can't make it, email me and maybe we'll work something out if you want to check out the gym.

(and after work, if you want to watch the Sox-Yanks game with me at the sports bar around the corner that would be fun too!)

edit to say: GO RED SOX

pyro

Trad climber

Ventura

May 23, 2006 - 05:48pm PT

anastasia must be refering to,"the ole Nixon charm".

that is a good one!

wyJames

Mountain climber

Dripping Spring, Tx

May 23, 2006 - 06:02pm PT

Hah KB,

I dislike the gym you work at for all the same reasons!

See you in the valley!

Cheers

sean stitt

Sport climber

sacramento

May 23, 2006 - 07:12pm PT

Tape confuses me too. Furthermore, I hate all of those lines and nets all over the grass and courts when I'm playing tennis, basketball, football or soccer. Now that you mention it, all those crazy colored lights at all the intersections confuse me when I'm driving too.

No offense guys, especially you JB you know I love you, but you are the definition of old school.

Try this, it works for me; when you start an indoor route, say the color out loud - YELLOW. Everytime you move your feet repeat the mantra. Pretty soon you will find yourself yellow-yellow-yellowing through the gym, your confusion will be gone and you might just appreciate the "lesson" the routesetter is trying to teach you.

I think you old schoolers problem is your ethic. You are looking for the path of least resistance up the wall, the way you would outside, and that is not necessarily the objective for many people inside.

dirtineye

Trad climber

the south

May 23, 2006 - 11:18pm PT

Damn Locker, you see right though me, that give me little shivers....

what are you doing later big boy?

dirtineye

Trad climber

the south

May 23, 2006 - 11:20pm PT

Re: Climbing Gyms and disenchantment.....
May 23, 2006, 02:51pm PST
Author:
Apocalypsenow

Trad climber
From: Cali
Perhaps Dirt and Rainbow would be good for each other?

I love TR. Always have. She knows that. But she wants to marry that scum Karl Babbler!!! I am CRUSHED!!!!

Patrick Sawyer

climber

Originally California now Ireland

May 24, 2006 - 08:44am PT

Sean Stitt, in one way I see your point, but I don't really think you can equate bouldering/climbing with a field sport where the lines and nets and all are part of the game.

I think you old schoolers problem is your ethic. You are looking for the path of least resistance up the wall, the way you would outside, and that is not necessarily the objective for many people inside.

And I don't think being old school, new school or any other school has much to do with it. Maybe some people don't like playing 'connect the dots'.

Maybe some people use gyms to keep in shape during bad weather or when they can't get out on the rocks due to other commitments, or such. Not because they like hanging out in gyms conforming to the routes that they have had created for them, or afraid to do the real thing. Some people like being creative and following their own dictates, not others.

To each their own. If you want to play 'connect the dots' then go for it, others want to be a bit more imaginative and original. No offence.

And path of least resistance? Trying telling that to Bridwell, or Charlie Porter, or JB and Largo, or Higgins and Kamps, or Kauk and Gullich, Batso, Chouinard, Don Whilliams, Doug Scott, Galibier, Bonatti, Ron Fawcett, Wunsch, Barber, Pat Littlejohn, the Lowes, Mugs Stumps, Joe Brown, Patey, or... the list can go on and on.

It seems to me that many gym monkeys can do all the hard moves indoors but shite their drawers when they get on the real thing. (PS, this is just a sweeping generality, but is there truth to it?) That is, if many of them ever do venture outdoors.

Question: Do sport climbers take the path of least resistance (ie pre-placed pro) or do they search out the toughest routes?

happiegrrrl

Trad climber

New York, NY

May 24, 2006 - 09:21am PT

Path of Least Resistance....Wasn't that the John Gill philosophy?

Oh wait.....my error, it was the Path of Least Existence.....

426

Sport climber

Buzzard Point, TN

May 24, 2006 - 09:35am PT

where the "new rock" is...

Here's an arch for anyone that cares

Anyone need directions to the local gym? (Tennessee Bouldering Authority)?? It's right below good climbing on Lookout...

dirtineye

Trad climber

the south

May 24, 2006 - 10:17am PT

I sort of thought that first least resistance comment along with the old school comment was meant to be funny.

Locker, new rock is any unclimbed rock, get it? Got it? GOOD!

Now get back in your closet, silly man.

MikeL

climber

May 24, 2006 - 11:08am PT

Anastasia, I liked your post.

Climbing gyms cause me injuries. Someone tell me why I get more injuries pulling plastic than I ever get outside. In fact, other than a sprained ankles and plenty of torn-up skin, I've never injured muscles, joints, or tendons outside. But in the gym I have, and more than once. I try to stay away from those places now.

-MikeL

bachar

Trad climber

Mammoth Lakes, CA

May 24, 2006 - 11:34am PT

Sean - you're right, I guess I'm pretty old skool. I have had some fun on taped "bouldering" routes but the tape still seemed to bother me. I suppose if I had to climb in the gym a bunch I would be playing the tape game as well just to keep it interesting but overall I think it can potentially create bad habits for when you get on real rock. I guess I prefer to pretend the gym is real rock and just use whatever holds are there in front of my eyes. It's already bad enough that no "holds" (especially tiny foothold things) exist between the bolt-on holds - which in of itself forces you into a connect the dots type of climbing approach and kind of "teaches " you to ignore looking for other possibilities (although some walls are getting better at increasing the amount of micro details). Sometimes I think taped routes also mess up your natural rhythm as well by making you pause to "find a color" instead of pausing to "discover a sequence".

Overall, I got to say that modern gyms are great! Way better alternative to no gyms (like 'back in the day'). I just wish they would set more "anything goes" type routes now and then (like they set for comps). That would help people train their "eyes and mind" (for real rock) - not just their "muscles"! cheers, jb

rhyang

Ice climber

SJC

May 24, 2006 - 12:05pm PT

Before I start climbing at the gym I first stretch (some basic iyengar yoga - so sue me, I'm getting old), then some light aerobic exercise (or maybe not so light if I have been riding my mountain bike beforehand). This seems to keep my gym sessions from injuring me, and I think it helps me with flexibility. Your mileage may vary.

BKW

Mountain climber

Central Texas

May 24, 2006 - 12:12pm PT

zardoz when is the last time you were in a climbing gym?

My goal in the gym used to be to not get injured. Then to get stronger.

dirtineye

Trad climber

the south

May 24, 2006 - 07:37pm PT

Locker, yes now you get it.

It's a dirty job, but someone has to do it.

But if there is a lot of PI on the rock, I try to trick someone else into leading.

dirtineye

Trad climber

the south

May 25, 2006 - 02:31am PT

Locker, you really are an idiot.

todd-gordon

climber

May 25, 2006 - 02:35am PT

With the price of gas, and most climbing areas to be closed because of Dean Potter climbing Delicate Arch.... we will all end up in the gym........(Beer, bolts ,and babes....).......(Just kidding......)

sean stitt

Sport climber

sacramento

May 25, 2006 - 05:15pm PT

Patrick and JB,
I wasn't trying to start sh#t just simply trying to describe another point of view.

I have found that the people who have the most "trouble" in gyms are actual rock-climbers, like you two obviously are. I think this is because we have trained ourselves to find the path of least resistance. And yes, even us sport climbers look for the path within the context of the route. Yes, we search out harder and harder routes, but once on the route ALL climbers, including the very prominent ones you mentioned, look for the easiest way up. Climbing hard cracks in the Valley, you look for the good jams, you don't use bad ones on purpose to make it harder.

However, a substantial percentage of climbers in gyms are not rock-climbers or are very inexperienced. For these folks, the "lessons" that the routesetters are trying to teach are very useful and do carry over to real rock situations. For guys like you, the lessons probably aren't necessary. In fact, you see it the way I described the situation above, why make it harder on purpose?

I appreciate rock climbers. I have more respect for the old school trad guys than any other climbers. I would prefer to hang out with Bridwell or Harding way before Sharma. But I also understand the mentality of the indoor climber and was just trying to impart upon you that perspective.

Good luck on the path!

WBraun

climber

May 25, 2006 - 09:32pm PT

No no no Mr. Stitt

It's the smell in those gyms, stale air with B.O. wafting everywhere. Outside you have power of nature all around. Inside there's death all around, no life.

The walls in the gyms don't breath. Outside is alive with life.

There's no wind or sky inside those un-natural imperfect man made attempts at playing God.

"It's the move, it's the moves, man" says the gym rat.

I'd rather not even go ........ to the gym at all.

Apocalypsenow

Trad climber

Cali

May 25, 2006 - 09:47pm PT

Author:
dirtineye

Trad climber
From: the south What a pleasure you must be, judging from your post.

How nice of you to share these good feelings.

Dirt, stop "driving" every woman away from this site! If you don't like your mother, seek help!

Gary

climber

Desolation Basin, Calif.

May 25, 2006 - 09:51pm PT

Werner,

I think you are on to something there.

dirtineye

Trad climber

the south

May 25, 2006 - 10:09pm PT

Apussylipcow,

Go blow yourself. It's what you're good at. And my mom can whip your sorry ass, even at 70+, LOL. But she would not waste her time on scum like you. First female life guard in Birmingham, AL, Red Cross Certified, how's that for women's rights?

Gym walls are terrible. get a scratch outside, no big deal.

Get a scratch on a gym wall, it WILL get infected, and hurt, if you don't take care of it right away.

Too much human crud on gym walls, no uv from the sun or wind or rain to clean em.

rhyang

Ice climber

SJC

May 26, 2006 - 03:13am PT

I've been to the new gym in sunnyvale and so far I like it a lot more than the old one in santa clara. But that isn't saying much :) Real Granite is much much better than Planet Granite.

dirtineye

Trad climber

the south

May 26, 2006 - 04:36am PT

Thanks stzzo,

I would think that since I am after all an equal opportunity flamer, people woould appreciate the non-discrimnatory aspects therein, but NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

Honestly, It would be wrong to not flame someone because of gender, just as it woould be wrong to assume a person is not capable of a climb because of gender.

But the Politikally Korreckt crowd don't like real equality.

But about gyms, really, the human scum deposits on the walls, UGH, one scratch left untreated, such an inflamtion and infection , GROSSSSSS!!!

When I did go to gyms, I quickly learned that ANY nick, however slight, had to get washed, scrubbed, ati-biotic-ed, right away, or NASTY things happen!!!!!

sean stitt

Sport climber

sacramento

May 26, 2006 - 12:23pm PT

Like I said Werner, guys like you do not belong in the gym. You understand the reasons we all rock climb and because of those reasons gyms are very unattractive even repulsive.

I agree completely. If I have to choose between climbing on the biggest choss pile of rock or going to a great gym, I probably choose rock. But frequently, I, and other rock climbers, don't have that choice. It's go to the gym or sit around and get weak and fat.

When I think of myself as an overweight, overworked lazy American, gyms start looking really attractive.

426

Sport climber

Buzzard Point, TN

May 27, 2006 - 09:04am PT

wombat

Trad climber

NY, NY

May 30, 2006 - 11:24am PT

K-bird, Happie...

take up Zack on his free offer but don't climb any of his routes. There are a bunch of nice, friendly people at MPHC and I have never witnessed any attitude. Route quality depends on who is working those days but can be somewhat inconsistent. The focus has certainly been on the lead roof recently.

And if you are sneaky, you can cop a swim in their very nice pool (note that I have not done this because I sink).

Go Sox (zack - thats your hint to who this is)

dirtineye

Trad climber

the south

May 30, 2006 - 02:13pm PT

426, you made me laugh.

But maybe that escalatior is for people who can't walk up steps, but can still do fitness activity of some sort.

that location does not look ramp friendly, maybe a wheel chair woudl work on the escalator?

You ever see wheelchair Basketball games? Those guys play HARD.

Sometimes they whack their chairs so hard into each other, it thows em out onto the floor. Seen it happen.

Apocalypsenow

Trad climber

Cali

May 30, 2006 - 02:50pm PT

Hey Locker...I saw in the movie Clerks that attempting to blow oneself can lead to death. However, being as Dirt has suggested it perhaps he could share his technique?

wombat

Trad climber

NY, NY

May 30, 2006 - 04:02pm PT

dirtineye

if you havent seen "Murderball", you should. Great documentary on paralympic quad wheelchair rugby featuring guys who know how to compete and more importantly, how to live. it is also damn funny, particularly in the extras when they hang with the Jackass guys from MTV.

Best line is in the extras when they ask one dude if he would go give up what he had done in rugby and gain back the use of his limbs. He barely hesitates before saying "no way, i never would have had these experiences and met these friends" [paraphrase] although there is a scene with a cardboard box that almost killed me...

I hope if something happens to me, I can find a way to get out on the rock again.

dr. kenneth niosewater

climber

May 30, 2006 - 04:37pm PT

It seems to me that:
A. those who bad mouth gyms generally aren't used to them.
B. those who don't climb outside, get their @sses handed to them when the do go.

In defense of Sean, taped routes and gyms in general are "a game", just like tennis is a game (with its own set of arbitrary rules). You don't HAVE to follow the tape if you don't want to, that's the point.
Of course most climbers would prefer to be outside. That is not always possible, and gyms are a great substitute for the real thing.
AND many gyms, like Touchstone or the Boulder Rock Club, go to great lengths to improve air quality and lighting.
Maybe the old schools and "trad only" guys should think about this. Tommy Caldwell, Jim Erickson & Roger Briggs regularly visit gyms and enjoy them very much. Are they gym monkeys? They even follow the silly tape.

dirtineye

Trad climber

the south

May 31, 2006 - 10:17pm PT

Wombat, wow, no I have not seen wheel chair rugby, I bet it is fearsome. those chairs move pretty fast, and the guys in em are as competitive as they come.

I had a girlfriend in a wheelchair once, she was a big influence on how I look at that stuff.

Locker, if you were telling me to STFU, you better watch it, you fvcking stupid dickless b@$tard.