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rwedgee
Ice climber
canyon country,CA
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Topic Author's Original Post - Aug 13, 2012 - 12:39pm PT
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http://framework.latimes.com/2012/06/09/owens-valley-dust/#/0
Water war resurges
CALIFORNIA The L.A. DWP, which agreed to fight dust pollution from part of the Owens Lake bed, wants to rework the deal and is balking at taking on more territory
June 10, 2012|Louis Sahagun
LONE PINE, CALIF. — Los Angeles and the Owens Valley are at war over water again, with the city trying to rework a historic agreement aimed at stopping massive dust storms that have besieged the eastern Sierra Nevada since L.A. opened an aqueduct 99 years ago that drained Owens Lake.
The L.A. Department of Water and Power has spent $1.2 billion in accordance with a 1997 agreement to combat the powder-fine dust from a 40-square-mile area of the dry Owens Lake bed. By introducing vegetation, gravel and flooding, the DWP has reduced particle air pollution by 90%.
The efforts have brought a measure of peace in the rural valley where people have long had bitter feelings toward Los Angeles, although a noxious reminder of how much work remains to be done rolled over this tourist town on the afternoon of May 25. Fearsome gusts of desert wind kicked up swirling clouds thousands of feet high and so thick that drivers switched on their headlights and pedestrians scurried about with squinting eyes.
Despite the DWP's efforts, the air quality still doesn't meet federal pollution standards. So the Great Basin Unified Air Pollution Control District has ordered the DWP to expand its reach to an additional 2.9 square miles of lake bed, including areas so remote and geologically challenging that it could cost the utility as much as $400 million to bring them into compliance with federal health standards.
The DWP says the demand is unreasonable. "Just as we're nearing completion of our settlement agreement goal, Great Basin has pushed the goal post further away," DWP General Manager Ron Nichols said.
Water wars have raged over Owens Valley since the early 1900s, when the city had agents pose as farmers and ranchers to buy land and water rights in the valley, then began building the aqueduct to slake the thirst of the growing metropolis more than 200 miles to the south. L.A. diverted so much water via the aqueduct system that it was nearly impossible for local farmers and ranchers to make a living -- a scandal dramatized in the classic 1974 film "Chinatown."
The current standoff is "a rekindling of 'Chinatown,' " said S. David Freeman, who was general manager of the DWP when it struck the deal in 1997 and believes it should remain intact.
"We are seeing a fundamental reversal of a decade of relative harmony," Freeman said. "If the mayor does not want to leave office labeled a polluter, he ought to think twice about that."
L.A. Mayor Antonio Villaraigosa, who six years ago declared a new era of collaboration with the Owens Valley, declined to comment on the dispute.
The DWP claims that the 1997 agreement contains flaws that set the stage for unforeseen problems and sent costs soaring. For example, the DWP has had to spread more water than anticipated -- yearly costs have grown to about $45 million -- over portions of the lake bed where dust pollution exceeds federal standards.
The utility also argues that geological reports and newly discovered archaeological sites indicate that the lake was smaller in 1913 -- when the aqueduct began taking water south -- than outlined in the 1997 agreement. The DWP is responsible for dust arising only from the portions of the lake bed exposed since 1913. The utility says the State Lands Commission should be responsible for rest of the area, which amounts to about 10 square miles.
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
mammoth lakes ca
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Aug 13, 2012 - 01:38pm PT
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DWP has enough money and lawyers to drag out every law suit thrown at them...Now DWP is going after the Town of Mammoth Lakes regarding water levels in Mammoth Creek...Just what Mammoth needs...More lawyer fees...Mammoth Lakes...Just for suits....
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Aug 13, 2012 - 02:06pm PT
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DWP - another sterling example of government working for the people.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 13, 2012 - 02:17pm PT
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DWP - another sterling example of government working for the people. Exactly.
Government doing the bidding of their constituents. The Water Lust of the LA citizenry trumps the environment every time.
And bitching about environmentalists every step of the way.
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Loomis
climber
Peklo Vole!
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Aug 13, 2012 - 04:57pm PT
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Nice shots Jody! :)
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Aug 13, 2012 - 06:59pm PT
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Tyranny of the majority.
Everybody loses.
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dee ee
Mountain climber
citizen of planet Earth
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Aug 18, 2012 - 11:38am PT
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Jody, what was/is that place? Everytime I drive by I wonder. It looks like someone is there. There is a newish suv parked outside most days.
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Brandon-
climber
The Granite State.
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Aug 18, 2012 - 01:40pm PT
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Ron, are you calling Cadillac Desert 'info', as if to discount it?
Have you actually read 'it', or are you just bagging on what you've heard about it?
+1 for Cadillac Desert. It should be required reading for anyone living west of the Mississippi.
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Vgavinator
Social climber
Ladera Ranch, CA
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Aug 18, 2012 - 01:57pm PT
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Correct me if I am wrong.
I think Jody's photo is of the old LP sawmill.
I never worked there but I had a buddy, Rob Remple, who did.
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Brandon-
climber
The Granite State.
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Aug 18, 2012 - 02:06pm PT
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Ron, I'm not comparing anything to anything. Simply showing support for the thoughts expressed in Cadillac Desert.
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otisdog
Big Wall climber
Sierra Madre & McGee Creek, Ca.
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Aug 18, 2012 - 02:47pm PT
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no, it's the old Pittsburg glass facility.
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Vgavinator
Social climber
Ladera Ranch, CA
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Aug 19, 2012 - 12:20pm PT
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Thanks Otisdog:
I have told so many people that that was an old Louisiana Pacific Sawmill I am sure I have started another urban legend. Oh well, Just as in the airplane thread it is amazing what can be believed as truth when there is no credibility to a story whatsoever. (is it OK to say that that in a sentence?)
Does anyone know the history of LP on the east side? I am pretty sure Rob wrote one of the last Timber Harvest Plans in the area. I am not sure where the logs went.
Thanks,
Jeff
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Spider Savage
Mountain climber
The shaggy fringe of Los Angeles
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Aug 19, 2012 - 03:34pm PT
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Send me some more water Chief. I have this big vegetable garden I need to water so I can be a part of the "local" farming community. I don't want to look like I'm out of touch by eating produce flown to LA from Chile, Argentina and New Zealand.
Also, need more for my swimming pool, nice green yard, coy pond, and this pretty fake waterfall. It's good fung shui you know.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Aug 19, 2012 - 05:54pm PT
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It'a about 95, I think I'll go hose off my driveway.
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can't say
Social climber
Pasadena CA
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Aug 19, 2012 - 06:10pm PT
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Let me just say if LA hadn't of taken the water from the Owens Valley, we wouldn't have the wide open spaces that we all enjoy today. Before LADWP stole, lied, finagled and bamboozled the water rights, the Federal Land Reclamation Service was planning on developing those same water resources.
If LA hadn't of done what it did you would have nothing but Reno writ large, or the way I think of it as Fresno east. It was either Mulholland or Fred Eaton who said by taking the water they were in reality creating a huge recreational area.
So what would you rather have, the big wide open and high and wild or Reno from the Sierra to the Whites?
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Aug 19, 2012 - 07:21pm PT
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Not a big fan of Cadillacs but I wouldn't say I feared or loathed them.
Yes I read the book (a few times) and spent a few years as a conservation student at CU before being seduced by the climbing bum lifestyle.
Look its done. It is well documented. We know what and why. The system is literally entrenched.
What will change things?
Pretty easy to say, it is just hard to say when.
COLLAPSE
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Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
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Aug 19, 2012 - 07:34pm PT
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L.A.'s going bankrupt next year. '014 at the latest.
The DWP has been LA's big Sugar Daddy for as long as anyone can remember.
Whether DWP goes down the toilet with LA - or clings to the rim - could determine the future for the East Side.
Change isn't always good, however. Change from what's not happening there now would be development. Is that what anybody here wants?
Can't Say is correct. The water situation is what's keeping the wide open spaces wide open. Maybe you'd like it better if the East Side looked like Victorville and Apple Valley. You'd get an Olive Garden and a Target in the deal.
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krahmes
Social climber
Stumptown
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Aug 19, 2012 - 10:12pm PT
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Without LADWP the Owens Valley would probably look a lot Minden-Gardnerville corridor. I think that would be really f-ing sad. Don’t get me wrong I wouldn’t mind living in Gardnerville; I’d just hate for the Owens Valley to look like that or worse yet look like my hometown which had a population of 6100 when I was born there; I think the sign said 97,000 plus the other day when I went to visit my mother on Main Street. That’s a lot people 50 years.
I read Cadillac Desert back in late 1980's and took the book as the narrative truth of the situation; and as such took a militant stance towards LADWP. Age and my narrative have made me reconsider much of what I thought I knew and I read non-fiction books with a skeptic eye nowadays.
Seven scattered years of living in southern Owens Valley set in 30 years roaming the trails of the west and seeing the incessant 1%-3%/year population growth a year, faster roads, better cars, and more people makes me grateful that LADWP takes a hard line to growth to Valley.
It has gotten better, when I showed up in Olancha in 1987 the dust from the lake was horrible. In the 2 year stint I did in LP in 2009/2010 I was continually amazed at how much better the air quality was than it the late 1980s/1990s. Though just like taking a narrative from a book, I'm wary of trusting my memory as an engraving of history. The GBUAPCD is to be applauded for the work they’ve forced to be done on the Lake.
The history of the last 30 years of Owens Valley has been one of lawsuits, arbitration and accommodation Mono Lake is in better shape, the water runs down Owens Gorge and the air is cleaner. What the future holds I don't know I guess my greater concerns are the 4 laning of 395 from Mono to Ridgecrest which essentially puts a fence between the Sierra Range front and the Owens River, and development towards the range front such as the housing development on Whitney Portal Road. I can’t imagine climate change is going to be good for the OV or the west.
My great concern is just how many new pilgrims of whatever skin tone the West can hold. I’d ask the new colonist’s, “What is your manifest destiny?” Mine at this stage of life is to save what can be saved of the land west of Rockies. A little more carrot and lot less stick might go a long way and I’m not sure what I consider worth saving, is the same as what others consider saving. With regards to this current lawsuit I don’t know. California’s broke, Los Angeles is broke, and I can’t believe the printing press of Feds is going to make things better at least not for me or the west; it will just end up in the same old dead end game of real estate and land speculation.
Finally when the viaduct ruptured coming off the Long Valley slope in 1991(?) and forced the diversion down the Owens River Gorge I always heard the story that a DWP employee was in a hurry to get home and instead of taking the prescribed half hour to close the upper gate to viaduct he slammed it shut allowing a vacuum to be created in the upper portion of the viaduct which took out the 1.6 mile (?) section of the viaduct and forced the diversion and the lawsuit. I’ve always wonder is that true?
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
mammoth lakes ca
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Aug 20, 2012 - 01:56am PT
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Dingus Milktoast...Have you ever been from Tuscon to Tucamcarri or Tehachapi to Tonopah....? Eh ?
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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Aug 20, 2012 - 02:10am PT
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I have! Both of those stretches. A mish mash of dry driving and water pork as far as the eye can drink it in...
How about this Ron A have you seen the movie Chinatown? Less detail, more nose slashing, but some of the same issues...
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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Aug 20, 2012 - 10:46am PT
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I don't know what you guys are talking about. The cities of LA and Las Vegas are both glaring examples of the same problem
The problem is that we have no mechanism to limit growth in US cities. LIke the federal deficit, the populations grows without regard to the resources required to sustain the people.
Eventually you reach a point where it just has to stop cause there's not enough water for everyone, but how do you stop it? We are there but can't admit it and nobody wants to desalinate or address the issue in a way that works 100 years down the line
So FUBAR is inevitable. How could it not be? Project all this on a 100 year curve (not a long time if you care about the grandchildren) Rain is NOT increasing. WHat to do?
Peace
Karl
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rectorsquid
climber
Lake Tahoe
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Aug 20, 2012 - 10:55am PT
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Limit growth of L.A. or Vegas? How about limiting growth of the human species. Until that happens, people will need to live somewhere and living in a city is better for the environment than a lot of the alternatives.
But for arguments sake, how would one limit the growth of those cities? Where would the people there live instead?
Dave
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10b4me
Ice climber
dingy room at the Happy boulders hotel
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Aug 20, 2012 - 10:57am PT
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The sad thing is that most city dwellers have no idea where their water comes from.
They also think water is infinite
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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Aug 20, 2012 - 12:00pm PT
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Limit growth of L.A. or Vegas? How about limiting growth of the human species. Until that happens, people will need to live somewhere and living in a city is better for the environment than a lot of the alternatives.
But for arguments sake, how would one limit the growth of those cities? Where would the people there live instead?
Not every place is as short of water as LA and Vegas. We need to get that we can't just plunk a city anywhere, allow it unlimited growth and not get screwed. There are tons of places with more water. They don't want us to come probably!
You want to live in a city that doesn't have enough water. No pool, no lawn.
Not to mention our issues with agriculture and water, it's not just cities. We have a problem that's getting to the point it can't be borrowed or ignored any longer
Yes, would be great if population didn't keep increasing. Sadly, all the approaches to dealing with that are fraught with problems
In 100 years some of LA will be under the sea. Maybe we'll have a more efficient desalinization system by then
Peace
Karl
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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Aug 20, 2012 - 12:23pm PT
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Yup Ron, the one With Jack Nicholsen; Nose slashing, Water pork, light Mullholand expose', better Faye Dunaway exposure, Incest -the Works!
When I bought my house in Portola (more rain/snowfall in year then the eastside combined) it had a sod lawn. I took it out and planted a Thyme Lawn-no watering!
Then I moved to Colorado and rented out my house.
My otherwise excellent Renter, took out the thyme, which he took for weeds and put down Sod...
It went downhill from there from a socioecconomic standpoint.
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Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
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Aug 20, 2012 - 12:26pm PT
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Every time I get a good coverage of local, drought-resistant vegetation in my yard, County Code Enforcement issues me a "weed abatement notice".
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
mammoth lakes ca
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Aug 20, 2012 - 12:28pm PT
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jaybro....Nice try but Ron is holier than you.... as for the pissing contest , that will be decided at a later date...
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
mammoth lakes ca
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Aug 20, 2012 - 12:29pm PT
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Chaz...Try getting a medicinal card...
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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Aug 20, 2012 - 12:33pm PT
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Finally when the viaduct ruptured coming off the Long Valley slope in 1991(?) and forced the diversion down the Owens River Gorge I always heard the story that a DWP employee was in a hurry to get home and instead of taking the prescribed half hour to close the upper gate to viaduct he slammed it shut allowing a vacuum to be created in the upper portion of the viaduct which took out the 1.6 mile (?) section of the viaduct and forced the diversion and the lawsuit. I’ve always wonder is that true?
Quite probable. There was a case several years ago in Puerto Rico where that happened and the line break washed a village away causing millions of dollars in damage.
A half hr closing time on a line that size to avoid surge is not unusual at all.. When you get column separation you set up shock waves that propagate at around 1100 fps thru the whole system. Sometimes the damage is miles away, all depends on where the constructive reinforcement happens from all the reflecting shock wave fronts.
This vid is from a valve mfr and you can imagine what the forces are like if you scale this up to a 72 inch pipe. Same thing happens if the power fails and a pump shuts off suddenly.
[Click to View YouTube Video]
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can't say
Social climber
Pasadena CA
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Aug 20, 2012 - 12:37pm PT
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True Confession: I'm a serial lawn water'r. Go f*#k yourself
just don't jump to conclusions.
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
mammoth lakes ca
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Aug 20, 2012 - 12:50pm PT
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Ron...It's a good read , good stories...As for sledz...Most people agree mine are greener...
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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Aug 20, 2012 - 02:31pm PT
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Sad to see so much misunderstood info regarding water.
Yerington, another "banana belt at slightly less than 4000 feet elev, was a swamp/wet zone in ancient times- so the agricultural developement there makes perfect sense to me or the indians before.
Well, in ancient times, LA was underwater, so what does that prove?
The eastern sierra is desert, and yes Ron, so is Reno. I lived there.
You seem to think that if a river runs within a mile of a place, taking the water is fine, but it the river is 100 miles away, that is a crime.
Look for your 10,000 pools on Google Earth.
A lot of bashing of the southland, but they are working to reduce water useage massively.
Los Angeles won the US Water Prize last year for it's committee to reduce waste, increase recycling, and integrate efforts. I serve on that committee.
Orange County has the largest water recycling facility in the US. It has produces 93 BILLION gallons, so far:
http://www.ocwd.com/
i have personally toured the facility, and it is IMPRESSIVE.
In LA, we dump 90 million gallons of cleaned water into the ocean A DAY. This is a non-imported, non-interuptable water source, that is cost effective.
Why doesn't LA recycle? Cost of building the infrastructure.
ALL water is recycled.
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dipper
climber
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Aug 27, 2012 - 09:43pm PT
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FYI
The Water Education Foundation’s latest issue of Western Water examines the issues associated with the State Water Resources Control Board’s proposed revision of the Bay-Delta water quality control plan. And the downloadable version is now available in an interactive, digital format.
Go to this link for more...
http://www.aquafornia.com/archives/72385/
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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Aug 27, 2012 - 10:34pm PT
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Why doesn't LA recycle? Cost of building the infrastructure.
We are,
Hyperion sends 28 mgd to west Basins E.C Little Tertiary facility which is in the midst of a major expansion.
There's a major plant expansion at Wocholtz in Yuciapa as well.
The O.C. AWT is undergoing a doubling of it's capacity.
The trend to tertiary treatment and recycling began long ago and isn't going to stop till there isn't a drop of potentially reclaimable water reaching the ocean.
These plants are incredibly expensive to build and operate, and take a long time to construct, but they are still a good deal compared to imported water where MWD holds a monopoly.
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