Date This Chouinard Yosemite Hammer

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Steve Grossman

Trad climber

Seattle, WA

Topic Author's Original Post - Mar 18, 2012 - 12:32am PT

Okay hammerheads how early does anyone think this Yosemite came out? 1966 was the first year they became available according to the Chouinard timeline.

Gotta love the Tom Frost overhand slipknot sling attachment design!

1966 to 1967 would be my guess by the squared off details and roughness of the head forging.

thekidcormier

Gym climber

squamish, b.c.

Mar 18, 2012 - 12:36am PT

I just bought the same one for 25 bones

Delhi Dog

climber

Good Question...

Mar 18, 2012 - 12:40am PT

Knott sure when it came out, but I have one exactly like it- got mine in or around 1980

cheers

moacman

Trad climber

Montana

Mar 18, 2012 - 12:40am PT

Had a hammer like that in the late 60's. It even had the purple sling on it...

Stevo

renzo

Trad climber

Whitefish Mt

Mar 18, 2012 - 07:24am PT

wow, that pup is in mint shape! looks like a real keeper..I have one just like it that I bought in 1975

Steve Grossman

Trad climber

Seattle, WA

Topic Author's Reply - Mar 18, 2012 - 10:56am PT

If you fall in love with a hammer, it's your Mother that ends up paying the bill. LOL

Brian in SLC

Social climber

Salt Lake City, UT

Mar 18, 2012 - 11:26am PT

I think the older ones have a standard slotted screw instead of a Phillips (sling attachment). Also, the slings seem to be white and have the old Chouinard label on them.

Know I have a photo of one somewheres...

Not sure if they ever changed the head (besides the current iteration with the hole on it). Maybe?

That hammer is minty! Post 60's I'll bet.

Edit to include a photo of what I think is the 66/67 vintage style:

I think the older/oldest Yosemite hammer models had a thinner, narrower pick and maybe straighter too. The handles were shorter a bit. The couple I have are 10 7/8" long versus the more common and later vintage that seem to be in the 11 1/2" to 11 5/8" length.

Oldest slings seem to be white. I've seen purple from maybe around 70 or so. Then blue. Guesses only.

Great hammer!

Steve Grossman

Trad climber

Seattle, WA

Topic Author's Reply - Mar 18, 2012 - 11:34am PT

Ebay ha been vedy gud to me!

Picked up the hammer and a lovely Doltster recently for less than a c note.

SteveW

Trad climber

The state of confusion

Mar 18, 2012 - 11:35am PT

Steve, I have one that looks exactly like it--but I bought mine
in 1973.

Steve Grossman

Trad climber

Seattle, WA

Topic Author's Reply - Mar 18, 2012 - 11:44am PT

I bought my first in 1970 and it had a purple sling like the one above.

Here's what my original hammer looks like these days along with a well-used A5 mallet above it.

Hardly a crisp edge left after four decades of use.

steelmnkey

climber

Vision man...ya gotta have vision...

Mar 18, 2012 - 12:53pm PT

Your OP vintage looks about the same as the one I have...

Grampa

Trad climber

OC in So Cal

Mar 18, 2012 - 01:05pm PT

Steve,
I have the exact same hammer with the pretty purple sling. I bought it around 72.
Al

guido

Trad climber

Santa Cruz/New Zealand/South Pacific

Mar 18, 2012 - 01:05pm PT

Fritz

Trad climber

Choss Creek, ID

Mar 18, 2012 - 01:23pm PT

Steve: Thanks for the gear ID thread. I am away from my vintage 73 Yosemite hammer, but it has a green sling and the phillips-head screw.

Tami: I bought a complete rack of mid-70's Chouinard Hexes, stoppers, and some Chouinard Oval biners a few years back on E-Bay.

Original sticky price-tags on every-thing, even though the bigger nuts were slung with perlon. Nothing looked like it had ever been on a rock.

I suspect there is a lot of un-used climbing gear out there.

The enthusiast wanta-be, sobered up the next day and said wtf?

Steve Grossman

Trad climber

Seattle, WA

Topic Author's Reply - Mar 18, 2012 - 01:39pm PT

One man gathers what another man shelves...

Eric Beck

Sport climber

Bishop, California

Mar 18, 2012 - 01:40pm PT

Back in the early 60s, I had a part time job in a pruning shear factory. This was G. F. Hickock in Berkeley on 4th street. They no longer exist. Anyway, the handles for the pruning shears were from Hartwell Handles in Tennessee, made of hickory.
Somehow, I mentioned this to Chouinard. It turns out that he also used Hartwell handles on his hammers and was quite tickled at the coincidence.
When I left Hickock, Dick Erb got my job.

Brian in SLC

Social climber

Salt Lake City, UT

Mar 18, 2012 - 01:53pm PT

Gather for the shelves, Steve? Bunch of frickin' hoarders...

Comparison of hammers from the under side:

Steve Grossman

Trad climber

Seattle, WA

Topic Author's Reply - Mar 18, 2012 - 04:01pm PT

Thanks for the pick comparison Brian. Lots of variation...

Very cool story Maestro Beck!

A couple more old classics while we are having fun with this.

I dinged this one up a little so that Tami would feel more comfortable.

Charlet- Moser mallet supreme!

Unique head attachment with tapered ferrule makes this a real beauty!

Early CMI hammer.

steelmnkey

climber

Vision man...ya gotta have vision...

Mar 18, 2012 - 04:53pm PT

I was wondering if perhaps some of B-SLC's pick differences were due to user mod? Seems like a few dewds back then liked to file 'em down a little to customize.

Might as well keep the train a rollin'...

Grivel

Stubai

Forrest

Charlet

Stubai (I think)

Brian in SLC

Social climber

Salt Lake City, UT

Mar 18, 2012 - 05:23pm PT

Dumber than a box of hammers...

A few strange lookin' models up there. Idears?

steelmnkey

climber

Vision man...ya gotta have vision...

Mar 18, 2012 - 05:37pm PT

Yo Bri - looks like you have that same Stubai(?) mystery hammer that I have.
I guessed Stubai because there is a faint diamond shaped indent (first pic) on the underside of it as you see in the other Stubai I have (second pic). The patina on the head is such that you can't make out anything inside the diamond in the mystery hammer (and it was probably too small to begin with).

Brian in SLC

Social climber

Salt Lake City, UT

Mar 18, 2012 - 06:04pm PT

Yeah, Greg, possibly so. Try as I might, I don't see any marks on that hammer. Was my dad's, mid 50's no doubt or thereabouts.

I have a few Stubai hammers that have a couple different head stamps on them from 1950. Sometimes just "Stubai" stamped on the head, sometimes enclosed in a box, some handles marked too. Head on the unmarked one of mine matches pretty exactly...

Here's another Stubai hammer:

It must be...hammertime!

WBraun

climber

Mar 18, 2012 - 06:16pm PT

True pinnacle of hammerdum ......

Steve Grossman

Trad climber

Seattle, WA

Topic Author's Reply - Mar 18, 2012 - 06:25pm PT

Aw c'mon Werner, post up the funkiest mallet in the SAR cache...or your tool bucket! LOL

WBraun

climber

Mar 18, 2012 - 06:57pm PT

The best wall hammer I've ever seen is Scotty Vincik's home made beast.

Too bad there's no photo.

He welded this massive block of metal to a pipe and and improvised a handle to it.

Kim Schmitz would have had an orgasm if he had see this thing back in the day .....

guido

Trad climber

Santa Cruz/New Zealand/South Pacific

Mar 18, 2012 - 07:48pm PT

Seems to be a bit of moisture around here?

Stewart

Trad climber

Courtenay, B.C.

Mar 18, 2012 - 11:11pm PT

I got my Yosemite hammer (with the blue sling) in the early '70s, but can't remember the exact year. It was identical to the one passed around at Daryl's memorial. My recollection is that Daryl grabbed his later, since he often used a roofer's hammer before that - unless I was leading something short enough to toss it down to him. I also recall him telling me about the time he used it as a cliff-hanger in a moment of desperation.

scuffy b

climber

heading slowly NNW

Mar 19, 2012 - 11:21am PT

I got mine in 1971 at the factory.
At that time they were available with orange sling and either blue or
purple, I think purple. Guck (Philippe) and I got one of each color and
then did a partial switch, so one was orange shoulder sling with purple
leash, etc.
I don't think the third color was available at that time.

SGropp

Mountain climber

Eastsound, Wa

Mar 19, 2012 - 11:24am PT

I was belaying Daryl when he used that hammer as a hook. It was on the 5.9 friction traverse on the 3rd or 4th pitch of the Salathe
He could not do the move free , so he put the pick of the hammer in a shallow depression and stood in the sling. He covered the head of the hammer with his hand ,so if it popped it would not knock his teeth out.

Steve Grossman

Trad climber

Seattle, WA

Topic Author's Reply - Mar 19, 2012 - 01:10pm PT

REAL mixed climbing...LOL

SGropp

Mountain climber

Eastsound, Wa

Mar 19, 2012 - 09:39pm PT

I think the handgeschedmiedet pictured above is a slaters hammer, also called a ''zax'', used for installing roofing slates, The sharp pick was used for punching a nail hole in the slate. the keyhole was for pulling nails and the sharpened hook was for ripping the slate to size.

I bet that sharp pick also got used for self arrest on those steep German roofs.

Looks like a great climbing combo tool, ice/mixed pick , keyhole hanger and crackin-up all in one compact unit.

Anyone know why BD went to cast stainless steel for the Yosemite Hammer ? What is the point of that ?

Steve Grossman

Trad climber

Seattle, WA

Topic Author's Reply - Mar 19, 2012 - 10:00pm PT

zax-One primo Scrabble word!!!

Banquo

climber

Amerricka

Mar 19, 2012 - 11:00pm PT

There are two Stubai hammers at my house.

Stubai was (may still be) a cooperative of blacksmiths in Stubai Austria. I thought the reason that none of the old Stubai hammers look the same is because they were made by different blacksmiths in different shops.

Brian in SLC

Social climber

Salt Lake City, UT

Mar 19, 2012 - 11:11pm PT

Makes sense, thanks! Stands for "handforged" in German. Has the initials P.F.F. on it too. Strange handle but amazing feel in the hand. Nice balance. I could totally see climbing with it, but, I'll bet it's workin' man's tool, nice.

SGropp

Mountain climber

Eastsound, Wa

Mar 20, 2012 - 01:04am PT

Stubai still makes some high quality forged tools; A roofer friend of mine has some beautiful Stubai sheet metal snips as well as a zax.

I love hammers of all kinds. I am a blacksmith by trade and have close to a hundred in the shop. They range from small tinners hammers up to several massive mechanically driven power hammers built in the era just before and after the First World War. The biggest one ,a 200# Beaudry Champion was set up to forge hammer heads and star drills in a tool forge in Grafton , Mass.

Brian in SLC

Social climber

Salt Lake City, UT

Mar 20, 2012 - 01:27am PT

Interesting history of alpine areas where forged tools were produced...

Home of CAMP...neat place to visit.

nutstory

climber

Ajaccio, Corsica, France

Mar 20, 2012 - 04:06am PT

I know, I know... Nuts Museum should mean "hammerless"... Forgive me guys.

Steve Grossman

Trad climber

Seattle, WA

Topic Author's Reply - Mar 20, 2012 - 10:13am PT

Done!

stunewberry

Trad climber

Spokane, WA

Mar 20, 2012 - 11:18am PT

This could also go on the "how to get a toothbrush out of the toilet?" thread. Use a Chouinard hammer and smash the thing. The toothbrush will be easy to remove at this point. Salewa, Charlet-Moser, and other European hammers are only suitable for removing toothbrushes from bidets.

I bought my Chouninard hammer while in high school, so would have been 1968 or 9. It has the blue webbing.

spacemonkey77

Trad climber

Keller, TX

Mar 20, 2012 - 11:54am PT

Hey guys, I found this thread and have been wondering about a hammer...err ice ax that I have as well. I got this a number of years back and actually had the opportunity to get Yvon Chouinard to sign it when he was doing a books signing for his let my people go surfing book.

I am not really sure of the date on the ax as well. Any idea what something like this is worth these days.

Thanks

spacemonkey77

Trad climber

Keller, TX

Mar 20, 2012 - 11:55am PT

Oh, and do you think the hammer holster is an original with the axe?

Brian in SLC

Social climber

Salt Lake City, UT

Mar 20, 2012 - 12:05pm PT

Looks like a 1977-ish vintage Alpine Hammer.

Gene

climber

Mar 20, 2012 - 12:11pm PT

Spacemonkey77,

Based on this thread http://www.supertopo.com/climbing/thread.php?topic_id=762638&tn=0&mr=0 it appears to me that your Alpine Hammer is the 1977 version. See post at 12/1/09 @ 6:45 p.m.

g

JEleazarian

Trad climber

Fresno CA

Mar 20, 2012 - 12:46pm PT

My first Chouinard hammer had Royal Blue webbing on it, and I got it in the late 60's. I thought the purple webbing appeared after that, but I could be wrong.

Kevin, mine was also royal blue. I bought it in 1969 for $12.00, after I broke a German piton hammer I got from REI. My dad's exact quote when he saw what I paid for the Yosemite Hammer was "Highway robbery!"

I could only imagine what he'd think about the price of climbing gear -- particularly wall gear -- now.

John

Steve Grossman

Trad climber

Seattle, WA

Topic Author's Reply - Mar 20, 2012 - 12:48pm PT

The holster definitely isn't Chouinard but I don't recognize it either.

What does the stamp say top center?

So it sounds like blue and not purple webbing is typical for pre-1970 Yosemite hammers.

steelmnkey

climber

Vision man...ya gotta have vision...

Mar 20, 2012 - 12:49pm PT

Looks like "Voigt"

Steve Grossman

Trad climber

Seattle, WA

Topic Author's Reply - Mar 20, 2012 - 12:51pm PT

Still doesn't ring a bell...

SteveW

Trad climber

The state of confusion

Mar 20, 2012 - 02:27pm PT

Tami
Regarding my hammer with little use--I got into climbing just
as the clean climbing surge hit. I was climbing on the east coast,
with the influence of John Stannard's Eastern Trade and the Chouinard
catalog, so the only pitons I ever hammered were a few test ones on
far away boulders that wouldn't be noticed. I learned how to do it
cleanly, without the hammer!

Steve Grossman

Trad climber

Seattle, WA

Topic Author's Reply - Mar 20, 2012 - 02:46pm PT

Righteous, Brother Steve!

spacemonkey77

Trad climber

Keller, TX

Mar 20, 2012 - 06:14pm PT

oh, awesome, yeah it does look like the 1977 version to me to.

The holster says Voigt maker on it. I do remember chouinard himself saying something about the holster when he looked at the hammer. I dont remember for sure, but i thought he said it was the one that shipped with the hammer...but i may be wrong on that. Its been a good number of years now since i saw him.

Here is a close up of the logo on the holster.

Thanks though for pointing me in the direction of the other thread.

Steve Grossman

Trad climber

Seattle, WA

Topic Author's Reply - Mar 20, 2012 - 10:30pm PT

Looks like Steve made it...Steve Voigt of Issaquah, that is!

http://www.manta.com/c/mm8xkcr/voigt-leather-products

Chouinard rarely sold unmarked merchandise other than military stuff. LOL

Anders- Here's your holster maker. Maple leaf toolin', no foolin'!

spacemonkey77

Trad climber

Keller, TX

Mar 20, 2012 - 11:02pm PT

wow, thanks for the info. I sure appreciate it.

Any idea of what something like this is worth? I know its all relative to what someone is willing to pay...but im just curious. I would not sell it anyways. Also, i have a friend who offered to sell his 1960s era yosemite hammer. its not in mint condition...but not totally trashed out either. I would say its in decent to fair shape. He told me to make him an offer, and I want it to be a fair offer. Roughly what are these things selling for online these days? Just a rough idea.

Steve Grossman

Trad climber

Seattle, WA

Topic Author's Reply - Mar 20, 2012 - 11:10pm PT

Your signed alpine hammer is likely worth $150 - $250.

Yosemite hammers are all over the place but $50- $100 is a good average for a used one.

Post a picture.

spacemonkey77

Trad climber

Keller, TX

Mar 20, 2012 - 11:16pm PT

ill see if i can get him to send me a shot of it.

But thank you so much for all the help.

Mountain climber

there and back again

Mar 20, 2012 - 11:38pm PT

Steve, great collection. Thanks for posting it. I guess I'll have to add mine to the fray. Not nearly as pristine though.

Steve Grossman

Trad climber

Seattle, WA

Topic Author's Reply - Mar 20, 2012 - 11:52pm PT

Closeups on them mallets, mate!

Brian in SLC

Social climber

Salt Lake City, UT

Mar 21, 2012 - 12:06am PT

Yeah, H, no fair teasin' us with a long, out of focus shot...

Keeter

Mountain climber

Durango, CO

Mar 21, 2012 - 01:39pm PT

I'd agree with the previous posts on the hammer that it was mid-70's, it matches my second one from about 74.

As far as the leather Voight holster, this was similar to the one sold by Chouinard. I have one somewhere around the shop and will look for it. Often (in those days) Chouinard or Forrest would sell an accessory item with the makers name on it and later get around to branding it if sales were significant (think Salewa Crampons).

Steve Grossman

Trad climber

Seattle, WA

Topic Author's Reply - Mar 21, 2012 - 03:29pm PT

Keeter- Do you have a catalog with that holster listed for sale?

When did you buy your first hammer and did it have a blue sling?

and partner

Trad climber

Leavenworth, WA

Mar 21, 2012 - 03:43pm PT

72 or later, due to the large, square pick end.
My first was a 1966. much smaller pick.
Used w/ Porter on a couple grade 5 and 6 climbs in 1969.
I have several, used now for cabin door handles. Mounted horizontally.
the colour of the sling has nothing to do with it. The HAMMER is the issue. Also- the wooden handle on the old models (1966-1970) were shorter. Much shorter. My old 1966 looks sort of like a stubai from that age, if you are old enough and have enough memory to tune in, there. best wishes,
Dave Dailey

PS--- army drab green sling in 1966-. NOT blue.

Steve Grossman

Trad climber

Seattle, WA

Topic Author's Reply - Mar 21, 2012 - 04:23pm PT

Thanks for the background on the hammers.

My 1970 version was more rounded and eased in finish which is what prompted my inquiry. The evolution of the head shape as the dies were regularly updated is my real interest beyond show and tell.

Got any Porter stories, pitons or other goodies from climbing with Charlie?

http://www.supertopo.com/climbing/thread.php?topic_id=231728&tn=0

Which walls did you guys do together that early?

lostinshanghai

Social climber

someplace

Mar 21, 2012 - 04:26pm PT

As for the bottom blue. The top with the purple can recall a couple years later and put it away for if lost or needed a second. Cool light used so colour of slings off a tad but top is purple.

My modification on the handle, kept the blue added sling.

Could have been used for cleaning or getting into hard to get where nuts needed to come out?

steelmnkey

climber

Vision man...ya gotta have vision...

Mar 21, 2012 - 04:31pm PT

Seems like I recall the long pick version with no teeth above was from around 1975

Steve Grossman

Trad climber

Seattle, WA

Topic Author's Reply - Mar 21, 2012 - 04:38pm PT

Interesting sidelight on webbing color is that army green and white were about it with respect to available colors until Wayne Merry started the Yosemite Mountain Shop and realized the value of a better selection.

I missed interviewing him at the Nose event to find out what the original colors were.

lostinshanghai

Social climber

someplace

Mar 21, 2012 - 05:04pm PT

No, can't recall but at the end of the handle, probably hitting the hammer on the blue web a few times or?, started to fray so cut it there redid the modifications with a locking bolt then said what the hell got rid of the blue over the shoulder sling and added black and white sling. Do not know if I got it at the mountain shop or Wall-Mart. Now that I think they did not have Wall-Mart then so could have been at the shop.

Edit: now that I look at the sling looks like I got it or redid the modifications when Chouinard was changing to Black Diamond?

Anyone?

Steve Grossman

Trad climber

Seattle, WA

Topic Author's Reply - Mar 21, 2012 - 05:33pm PT

No way around that...

Mountain climber

there and back again

Mar 21, 2012 - 07:40pm PT

I don't mean to tease you guys. Thats all I had at the moment. I am dinosaur when it comes to this technology. I'll get some better shots soon. There is one on the wall I have not seen posted yet. Give me a couple days.

Great topic Steve.

Banquo

climber

Amerricka

Mar 22, 2012 - 09:23pm PT

I've got this 5 lb hammer, I'm looking for a handle and then I'm looking for somebody tough enough to use it.

SteveW

Trad climber

The state of confusion

Mar 22, 2012 - 10:18pm PT

Well I gotta hammer, . . .

steelmnkey

climber

Vision man...ya gotta have vision...

Mar 22, 2012 - 11:01pm PT

[Click to View YouTube Video]

Jonnnyyyzzz

Trad climber

San Diego,CA

Mar 22, 2012 - 11:30pm PT

So my hammer is early 70's and sweet?

Rick A

climber

Boulder, Colorado

Mar 25, 2012 - 05:57pm PT

I was thinking how strange it is that so many here (including me) enjoy an old equipment thread like this. But it’s not the result of gear fetish for its own sake, I think. It’s that all of us have memories of long ago adventures that are triggered by this old stuff, which gives it a value well beyond its worth as a collectible.

Werner’s mention of the “pinnacle of hammerdom” had me laughing out loud. I hadn’t heard this phrase (probably coined by Largo) since the 70’s, but it was a common expression back then.

“Ho man, we have achieved the pinnacle of hammerdom!”

Thanks for that, Werner.

Thorgon

Big Wall climber

Sedro Woolley, WA

Mar 25, 2012 - 11:20pm PT

The Thread about hammers!!!

Late 70's model!! Maybe early 80's? I noticed the forging is not the same as the earlier models. Should I peel the tape off Steve?? It's been taped since day one, so it should be pristine under 30 years of tape? But I can assure you it's a Chouinard!!!

Hammers rule!!!
Thor

moacman

Trad climber

Montana

Mar 26, 2012 - 06:30pm PT

Come on people..show more of those cool tools....bump....

Stevo

Banquo

climber

Amerricka

Mar 29, 2012 - 11:27am PT

Hammers rule!!!
Thor

inside every tool is a hammer

Steve Grossman

Trad climber

Seattle, WA

Topic Author's Reply - Mar 29, 2012 - 02:23pm PT

I'd say leave the tape in place Thorgon!

No doubt as to the maker.

More mallets this weekend...

ydpl8s

Trad climber

Santa Monica, California

Mar 29, 2012 - 03:22pm PT

Steelmnky/Shanghai, I got my long pick w/no teeth and purple sling, I'm pretty sure no later than 75. I bought it for exactly the purpose of getting out difficult nuts (my partner used to hammer in his nuts and stand on his hexes, if you hammered pins, why not nuts?:-)

I even used it as an ice climbing hammer in conjunction with a Chouinard bamboo handled axe, didn't work too well.

Brian in SLC

Social climber

Salt Lake City, UT

Mar 29, 2012 - 03:56pm PT

Your crag hammer style was introduced, I think, in 1972 and in 1975, a notch was added on the underside of the striking surface (maybe to sit in a holster better?).

So, it'd probably be in that age range, 1972 to 1974 or thereabouts.

Steve Grossman

Trad climber

Seattle, WA

Topic Author's Reply - Mar 29, 2012 - 09:15pm PT

The notch was introduced to reduce weight and produce a lighter hammer once nailing duty became secondary.

Rocman

Trad climber

Reno,NV

Mar 30, 2012 - 11:00am PT

got one 72 purple sling,after 40yrs still have it,but its handle is dipped in plasty,I always like screw thru handle,sling attachment

Brian in SLC

Social climber

Salt Lake City, UT

Mar 30, 2012 - 01:01pm PT

The notch was introduced to reduce weight and produce a lighter hammer once nailing duty became secondary.

From the 1975 Chouinard catalog:

"The Crag Hammer is extra light in weight and has a lightening notch under the anvil which helps the hammer to cruise securely in the holster."

Reilly

Mountain climber

The Other Monrovia- CA

Mar 30, 2012 - 01:25pm PT

Hey, have yous guys heard that somebody invented something called

The wheel?

ps
There is treatment for OCD. ;-)

mouse from merced

Trad climber

merced, california

Mar 30, 2012 - 02:27pm PT

I will try to upload a pic of my vintage 1969 CMI. It's a beautiful old hermaphroditic weapon, when I think about it.

It has a hole in the pick for attaching a cleaning biner, plus the obvious "male" parts. The head is mushroomed, too. The rubber grip is grooved all the way to the steel where a doubled rap line burned its way thru.

Hey, Weiner and Favre, show up!

nick farley

climber

bishop

Mar 30, 2012 - 02:36pm PT

Many already beat me to the obvious question.
Why would anyone date a hammer?

How about: when your only tool is a hammer, every problem is a nail.

mouse from merced

Trad climber

merced, california

Mar 30, 2012 - 06:31pm PT

Here are some pics of the hammer I used on the Salathe Wall and Half Dome in 74, and Lurking Fear in 1990, among many other piton passages.

Thanks to Roger Wyan Photography[photoid=242838] of Merced.

mouse from merced

Trad climber

merced, california

Mar 30, 2012 - 06:35pm PT

One more photo showing parallel grooves, rappel scars.

Steve Grossman

Trad climber

Seattle, WA

Topic Author's Reply - Mar 30, 2012 - 07:14pm PT

CMI stands for Colorado Mountain Industries.

I posted an even older CMI hammer up thread.

Thanks for showing yours!

throwpie

Trad climber

Berkeley

Mar 30, 2012 - 08:58pm PT

Hey! I got one of those Mouse...I don't think mine has the hole in it.

Steve Grossman

Trad climber

Seattle, WA

Topic Author's Reply - Mar 31, 2012 - 05:43pm PT

Here's an oldie!

This is a comparatively light hammer as seems to be the norm early on.

The classic Sporthaus Schuster Munich round logo.

mouse from merced

Trad climber

merced, california

Apr 2, 2012 - 01:46pm PT

I owned a Chouinard crag hammer and "we" dropped it (it was a spare, carried in the guide pack along with water, a light meter, "his" shoes, and other goodies) on the 3D in 74. The handle got badly cracked beyond repair. It may be the only time I ever heard of one of Chouinard's hammers failing.

You know he had two, like the proverbial lucky billy goat? Likely story...

---

The amusing part of the dropped bag story (everyone's got a dropped gear tale, eh?) is that Chook Pratt was good (make that "kind") enough to gather up our dropped shite, minus one EB we found on a ledge halfway down. An expensive ballsup and an abject lesson. But now I think on't, how many can say (without pride, under the circumstances):

"Pratt touched my hammer and I liked it."???

Annie Rizzi can confirm that she and I dropped a haul sack from the U-shaped bowl in 71. It was left after Millis and I decided we did not particulary care to haul it thru said bowl, a nasty undertaking. As unlikely as it seems, Pratt was sightseeing at the base and found the gear "kind of everywhere," he said. That's two I wish I could've repaid.

Annie and I were forced to bushwhack down Cathedral Gully in the dark. I had a GF who obviously trusted me, but why push your luck, and I had to start my job in the Yosemite Village Mountain Shop that morning. Bobby Oshwarth began that day, as well as Antsy Cox. I'd have been late had Check Pratt been less of a Boy Scout.

Steve Grossman

Trad climber

Seattle, WA

Topic Author's Reply - Apr 7, 2012 - 12:06am PT

Cool hammer tale mouse!

Steve Grossman

Trad climber

Seattle, WA

Topic Author's Reply - Apr 8, 2012 - 04:14pm PT

A couple from the freezer...

Ahhhh the Terror of Glencoe is in the dactyls!

And from the dawn of the Tubular Age...

go-B

climber

Habakkuk 3:19 Sozo

Apr 8, 2012 - 04:24pm PT

Topic Author's Original Post - Mar 17, 2012 - 09:32pm PT

Brian in SLC

Social climber

Salt Lake City, UT

Apr 8, 2012 - 05:05pm PT

Couple previously posted...

Brian in SLC

Social climber

Salt Lake City, UT

Apr 8, 2012 - 06:03pm PT

The feller who signed this said, "yeah, we all climbed on Stubai..."

Put the hammer down!

Steve Grossman

Trad climber

Seattle, WA

Topic Author's Reply - Apr 9, 2012 - 11:01am PT

Messner?

I don't recognize the signature but am surprised that Stubai was the weapon maker of choice considering the options.

couchmaster

climber

pdx

Apr 28, 2012 - 08:56am PT

hah hah Ekat! Nice:-)

Is the hammer on the right made by Chouinard for the 10th Mt division? Thats what I was told, there are no markings on the handle, and the screw and leash are different too.

mouse from merced

Trad climber

merced, california

Apr 28, 2012 - 10:28am PT

"Cool hammer tale, Mouse."--S.G.

Mice are justifiably proud of their tails, too.

I'll try to keep my tales as well-told as yours, amigo. Gracias.

I am gonna get a CMI tee for myself on my 64th birthday next month, if I get some $$$ from a relative (broad hint, Lenna). But where from? Who wants my money?

SGropp:

ZAX is worth a fortune on the Scrabble board, if it is placed correctly.

Brian in SLC

Social climber

Salt Lake City, UT

Apr 28, 2012 - 12:36pm PT

Is the hammer on the right made by Chouinard for the 10th Mt division?

I don't think so.

I have the same hammer, in the box. Has a military style national stock number.

At a glance looks the same as a Chouinard/BD Yo Hammer, but, the tang attachment and head attachment is slightly different. Handle appears to be different too. Screw/sling different. The geometry of the head is close, but, there are differences.

Probably the spec for the hammer from the military was based on the design of the Yo hammer and the lowest bidder just copied as best they could. I'd be curious if anyone knows the maker.

mouse from merced

Trad climber

merced, california

Apr 28, 2012 - 01:21pm PT

Re: military rock hammers.

As usual, things pop into my head that may be irrelevant, but in the military, among the Rangers and other specialty warriors who learn climbing, it is generally assumed that silence during an operation is a given. This raises the question, at least in my mind, where's the value of a hammer? Maybe Bear G. could tell us, but I'd rather hear the answer from a qualified special ops type. The hammer is probably not used except in training exercises or away from the enemy's positions.

"Go ahead, Lucy. 'splain this one."

crunch

Social climber

Apr 28, 2012 - 02:03pm PT

Great thread. Some wild designs!

Here's my Chouinard hammers:

These are the great for desert aid climbing, cleaning out--and locating!--mud-filled seams.

The center one has the original webbing, in purple:

Brian in SLC

Social climber

Salt Lake City, UT

Apr 28, 2012 - 02:40pm PT

The center one has the original webbing, in purple:

My guess is the purple sling isn't original to that hammer. That hammer is circa pre 1972 (no notch under the stiking surface). Not sure kn was in use at that time.

Great selection of "mudders"!

crunch

Social climber

Apr 28, 2012 - 03:25pm PT

Hmmmm. You might well be right. Maybe that was added later, a replacement or something. The 17Kn refers the sling itself, not the whole setup

Scored that one off eBay, way cheap, probably because the black tape covered up the inscription on the handle. My current fave, as it's a tad heavier without that notch.

The one on the right I replaced the handle, not very well, with some framing hammer handle. The hammer just left of center I recall at some point an inch or so just vanished, broke off somehow, never even noticed when it happened.

As far as wear and tear, Harvey Carter's old hammer has to be the most worn out, ever:

Brian in SLC

Social climber

Salt Lake City, UT

Apr 28, 2012 - 05:38pm PT

Wow, that's a stubby!

My trusty Grivel Thor pales in comparison:

New one:

covelocos

Trad climber

Nor Cal

Apr 28, 2012 - 09:47pm PT

My friend bought this with a rack of pins in an Addidas gym bag at a garage sale in Santa Rosa for $25!

couchmaster

climber

pdx

Apr 28, 2012 - 10:21pm PT

SOLVED Brian.

You can search cage codes at the Defense Logistics site (my co has a cage code too) I entered it and here's the co that Mfg your "hammer, hand":

"
CAGE Code: 02154
CAGE Information
Company Name: ROYSON ENGINEERING COMPANY
Status: Active Record
Parent CAGE:
Address: 100 N PENN ST
P.O. Box:
City: HATBORO
Zip: 19040
CAO-ADP: S3915A-HQ0337
State: PA
County:
Voice Phone Number: 2156752800
Fax Phone Number: 2156753035
Date CAGE Code Established: 10/25/1974
Last Updated: 1/25/2007
Point of Contact: ED ULLMAN
Company Web Site: http://WWW.ROYSON.COM"

Found here: http://www.dlis.dla.mil/BINCS/details.aspx?CAGE=02154&DUNS=014198337&JCP=0004853

Brian in SLC

Social climber

Salt Lake City, UT

Apr 29, 2012 - 02:11am PT

^^^Fantastic. Thanks!

Steve Grossman

Trad climber

Seattle, WA

Topic Author's Reply - May 13, 2012 - 12:24pm PT

Today's mystery mallet...

No maker's mark of any sort...

Blakey

Trad climber

Newcastle UK

May 13, 2012 - 02:02pm PT

Looks a tad French to me, from the late 60s early 70s - Simond perhaps?

The shaft and it's manner of attachment look a little 'after market' ;-)

Steve

mouse from merced

Trad climber

merced, california

May 13, 2012 - 02:16pm PT

It's gold!

It's a proto of Robbins' earliest design (we all remember that story) incorporating--"for display purposes"--a handle from a large paint brush his father-in-law had given him; the bristles had been damaged from sitting in the store window. Royal scavenged the handle. I don't know about the head or the hardware. Or anything, for that matter...
lol
mfm

I vote it's Euro-trash.

Steve Grossman

Trad climber

Seattle, WA

Topic Author's Reply - May 13, 2012 - 02:57pm PT

The handle is pretty distinct down to the sling hole.

mouse from merced

Trad climber

merced, california

May 13, 2012 - 03:01pm PT

Some Steve Roper hoax? lol to RR, too.

mouse from merced

Trad climber

merced, california

May 13, 2012 - 06:45pm PT

Here's my salute to Mark the Goat for the fine lettering of "Geek" because I appreciate a good "hand." (For those n00bs who never learned penmanship, one's "hand" gave you some "class." I guess Mark had some. Old times, Old Goats.

"Heidi Hammer"

Entering "New Dimension," Captain.

Roger?

No, I'm Mouse. I'm just the bombardier."

The sound of the hammers is gone (okay, generally)

But yet their echo lives on

Something bong? (too FN obvious these clowns'd never get it)

Just a buncha old hammers

Reformed iron slammers

Sucking beer in their jammers

But minding there manners

Trying not to be bored

Or worse yet ignored

Buncha tools.

This is an amazing assembly of whackers, everybody. Thanks.

(That's what SHE said.)

nutstory

climber

Ajaccio, Corsica, France

May 3, 2014 - 04:41am PT

Brian in SLC: I got this information from a good friend of mine (and "ice axe world class specialist") this morning. He asked me to post it here. What you call a Handgeschmiedet Hammer (hand-forged hammer) is not an ice climbing tool. (There is a similar hammer sold on eBay at the moment). In fact, the roofers use this kind of hammer to cut a slate. The key hole is used to pull the nails out. Stubai, in Austria, still produces such hammers currently.
Stephane

Crag Q

Trad climber

Louisville, Colorado

May 3, 2014 - 10:48am PT

Cool thread!

throwpie

Trad climber

Berkeley

Jun 7, 2014 - 04:45pm PT

There's this....

Roger Breedlove

climber

Cleveland Heights, Ohio

Jun 7, 2014 - 07:23pm PT

I ran through the pictures on this thread and didn't see a hammer like the one I purchased in about 1972. I am guessing that someone at Chounard's shop elongated the tip--maybe the same person who elongated the Dolt pin.

Ken Yager has these now, so I cannot inspect them except by looking at this photo.

Todd Eastman

climber

Bellingham, WA

Jun 8, 2014 - 12:02am PT

That's a very-first generation Alpine Hammer before the curved pick deal took off. Euro hammers of that era looked the same.

Roger Breedlove

climber

Cleveland Heights, Ohio

Jun 8, 2014 - 06:44am PT

That might be right, Todd. Yvon and Tom were starting to produce alpine gear and this might have been an early version. But pretty soon thereafter, the alpine hammers were longer, curved, and had teeth on the underside. As I recall, I could always identify my hammer because it was the only one with its shape. We were early adopters of clean climbing and the pointy end was very useful in cleaning out cracks or dislodging poorly placed nuts.

donini

Trad climber

Ouray, Colorado

Jun 8, 2014 - 07:57am PT

That was the very hammer that was used to create those sweet fnger pockets on the first pitch of Serenity Crack. Phew.....it woukdn't have been another overcrowded 5.10 without those loving...tap, taps....ping, pings!

Roger Breedlove

climber

Cleveland Heights, Ohio

Jun 8, 2014 - 08:45am PT

Is that firsthand knowledge, Jim? I always thought that Serenity fell victim to the weekend climbers continuing to nail the route after Tom did it free. In any case, I am pretty sure it was already pinned out by 1972. Certainly no one thought it was 5.11 by then.

I just noticed that Lostinshanghai posted a picture on 21 Mar 2012 (post 66) showing a hammer that is very close to the one I used, but I don't think it is from the same blank--the shape of the head looks slightly different and the long end is slightly curved.

donini

Trad climber

Ouray, Colorado

Jun 8, 2014 - 09:03am PT

Roger....not that hammer specifically, I was speaking metaphorically, but many hammers over many years...and not just Serenity. The sixties and very early seventies will be remembered for the creation of the 5.10 rating (although done much earlier back East by John Turner) AND the creation of a number of 5.10 climbs in Yosemite.

mouse from merced

Trad climber

The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.

Jun 9, 2014 - 06:41am PT

Throwpie's hammer: That there is the dial phone of climbing tech, dude.

Jamesthomsen

Social climber

Mammoth Lakes, California

Aug 28, 2014 - 06:11am PT

Banquo

climber

Amerricka

Nov 8, 2015 - 09:08am PT

Picked up this little hammer. Appears to be a Chouinard but there is no stamp on the handle. The steel appears to be a fairly high chrome content like the newer ones. I am told this type was only made for a short while. I've never seen one quite like it. It's the one on the left. The others are for comparison.

couchmaster

climber

Nov 8, 2015 - 01:06pm PT

Most likely made for the military Dan. NSN contract. It looks like a Chouinard/BD but isn't. See Brian in SLC post just upthread, same issue. Brians was made by ROYSON ENGINEERING COMPANY, however, it's possible that another made that one.

Banquo

climber

Amerricka

Nov 8, 2015 - 02:02pm PT

I've got two of those GI hammers, one is still in the box. They aren't bad hammers but the finish is nothing like the Chouinard and BD hammers. I have reason to believe that the one I posted about was made by Chouinard.

johntp

Trad climber

socal

Nov 8, 2015 - 02:23pm PT

A little OT but does anyone have a failure on the olde Forrest whammers? I wonder how the fiberglass shafts held up.

Lorenzo

Trad climber

Portland Oregon

Nov 8, 2015 - 04:06pm PT

I've got a mjollnir that's still going strong. Used it with a rock pick.

couchmaster

climber

Nov 8, 2015 - 08:40pm PT

opps, was looking at the hammer on the other side Dan. Never mind (Church lady voice)

Banquo

climber

Amerricka

Nov 9, 2015 - 11:51am PT

Bill, I thought you might have missed something.

I still don't know much about this hammer. It is nicely made and the shape of the head is cool, look at the view of the top of the heads.

I was told that only a few of these were made by Chouinard over a short period of time. The lack of a stamp on the handle suggests it was some sort of prototype.

I'm trying to trace back ownership to learn more.

Clint Cummins

Trad climber

SF Bay area, CA

Nov 9, 2015 - 12:14pm PT

It looks like an early model Alpine or Crag Hammer, where the pick has been shortened. Possibly broke the tip and then ground it to its current roundness.
Compare to this one from post 64:

Steven Amter

climber

Washington, DC

Nov 9, 2015 - 01:40pm PT

I've got a 70's hammer in the attic - don't even remember the brand. Hasn't seen the light of day in decades; maybe I'll go take a look.

Banquo

climber

Amerricka

Nov 9, 2015 - 04:42pm PT

Clint,

It looks close but I think the forging is different. Here are lostinshanghai's hammers. I think the one on the left is the Yosemite hammer and the one on the right is the alpine hammer.

This is mine which looks more like the Yosemite than the alpine.

Clint Cummins

Trad climber

SF Bay area, CA

Nov 9, 2015 - 04:53pm PT

Right, the hammer photographed by lostinshanghai is not a match for yours. But it's close. (Much closer than any of the Yosemite wall hammers). The narrowness of the pick in your top view definitely puts it in the Alpine/Crag hammer group. The other factor for dating yours is the length of the hammer side (vs. pick side) - it's longer than the wall hammers and later alpine hammers. So this makes yours a fairly early model.

Steve Grossman

Trad climber

Seattle, WA

Topic Author's Reply - Dec 17, 2016 - 12:23pm PT

Holiday hammer time bump...

Banquo- I think your hammer was an early attempt to stretch the nose of a standard Yosemite hammer into something different which certainly makes it a prototype and as such, rare.

karabin museum

Trad climber

phoenix, az

Dec 17, 2016 - 07:21pm PT

Banquo - My guess is that it is a 1971 Yosemite hammer with the nose pounded out longer.
The end of the short handle flares out, phillips screw, lower curve of the nose, and head crease is outside of the hammer handle edge. Your Chouinard hammer is different than all of these shown below.

So to be able to date that Chouinard hammer would be a pleasure.