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big ears
Trad climber
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Topic Author's Original Post - Jun 8, 2011 - 09:42pm PT
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Holy Crap! I hit the deck while climbing for the first time ever today! took about a 3-4 footer on a red c3, it held just long enough for me to come to a complete standstill and then next thing i know i am on the ground. 12 ft fall maybe, but damn it scared the hell out of me.
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Bad Climber
climber
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Glad you're okay. Falling is dangerous. It seems a lot of the current jazz around videos of the hot stars working routes involves whippers. I'm a chicken and tend to avoid them, especially on natural gear, although falling on bolted routes involves risk, too.
Be careful out there.
BAd
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big ears
Trad climber
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Topic Author's Reply - Jun 8, 2011 - 10:00pm PT
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you know, now that you say that I bet some of the vids have influenced my more than I would have thought. I have maybe taken 5 falls on gear in about 8 yrs of climbing. And never really tried a trad route thats "at my limit". I did today. made me rethink some stuff
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Sioux Juan
Big Wall climber
Costa mesa
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I saw this weekend ! a climber drop to the ground because the belayer was talking to others not watching ( the gear held and slack was to blame ) the climber was not an important one, so it's prolly no big deal anyway.
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big ears
Trad climber
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Topic Author's Reply - Jun 8, 2011 - 10:20pm PT
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I actually had someone drop me once, and I never climbed with him again. This is scary to me bc I went against my judgement and forced a placement, with the red when it really needed a green, but it was all I had. Good lesson learned. Dont force placements, espescially on routes at, or near your limit
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Holy Crap! I hit the deck while climbing for the first time ever today! took about a 3-4 footer on a red c3, it held just long enough for me to come to a complete standstill and then next thing i know i am on the ground. 12 ft fall maybe, but damn it scared the hell out of me.
Welcome to climbing!. Shouldn't happen, but it does.
Ya know why? People and systems have inherit flaws. The goal is to minimize risks/mistakes.
Good luck trying to make climbing 'safe'!
Good news is you are o.k. Learn, adapt, deploy your acquired wisdom.
Climb on!!!!!
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GhoulweJ
Trad climber
El Dorado Hills, CA
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BigEars
Dude, you should never deck. Seriously, these decisions in what/how to climb are very serious...
Glad your okay, now just tell us you won't reproduce ;)
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big ears
Trad climber
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Topic Author's Reply - Jun 8, 2011 - 10:26pm PT
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Its funny, my friends all have mixed feelings on this. Some are like blue and have a "its gonna happen, be thankful you were low, and learn from it" attitude, others were have chastised me.
Out of curiosity, how many here have had something similar happen?
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GhoulweJ
Trad climber
El Dorado Hills, CA
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Pieces pop... Yes.
In a position resulting in a deck 25years of climbing and ZERO decks...
I think part of it is your: approach, respect, and critical thinking toward climbing.
To each their own, but please don't die where/when I'm climbing. It would wrinkle my day (sarcasm)
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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I decked out out twice due to dipshit belays. I no longer climb with these execution-cases.
Once from 30 ft fall, the other a 20 footer where I hit a tree on the way down that God had pre-placed for me. Thanks God!
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GhoulweJ
Trad climber
El Dorado Hills, CA
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Wow Blue, glad your okay.
I can certainly see the sceario... I hope I never experience it!
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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took about a 3-4 footer on a red c3, it held just long enough for me to come to a complete standstill and then next thing i know i am on the ground.
Had a similar occurrence once
The initial fall was a bit longer and it was a TCU. The physics involved is that the holding power of a cam in a purely parallel placement is determined by the friction of the cam and the amount of force applied.
The fall and attendant impact force is held just fine, The cam produces a prodigious amount of outward force. But when you come to a stop and unweight the placement a bit by getting your feet back on the rock, it slides right out.
A good reason to place gear early and often.
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apogee
climber
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A looong time ago I had a groundfall as a n00b at Suicide (Cat's Meow, I think)- placed a small stopper, moved left, sketched and fell- the piece popped, and I decked. Rolled backwards, whacked my head...the day was over for me.
Analysis: Poorly placed protection, inexperience, exceeding abilities
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big ears
Trad climber
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Topic Author's Reply - Jun 8, 2011 - 10:53pm PT
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I would say that is about the same analysis for me. I would not consider myself an "inexperienced" trad leader, just inexperienced and trad climbing at my limit. Decided it was time to push myself, and got a bit carried away. Should have bailed when I realized I didnt have the right size gear
EDIT: Inexperienced AT trad climbing at my limit
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apogee
climber
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"Should have bailed when I realized I didnt have the right size gear "
Oh. You didn't mention that in the OP. The right gear makes a difference, yessirreee!
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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There's a tendency to not pay as much detailed attention to a cam placement as a nut.
It's best to think of cams as adjustable nuts and place accordingly, only using the parallel sided placements when unavoidable.
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Sioux Juan
Big Wall climber
Costa mesa
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TGT::::very good point......cams are adjustable nutz::::learn it that way & live longer- or play longer
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drljefe
climber
El Presidio San Augustin del Tucson
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F*#kin be careful dude!
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Bad Climber
climber
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+2 for TGT's point. I really WORK to get cams just right, and even then they can sometimes walk or tip into sub-optimal places. Cams are not plug and play. Also, in close-to-the-ground scenarios, it pays to be paranoid, doubling up placements, etc., if you're at all sketchy. I got some good-humored grief a few weeks ago for having a stick clip in the Alabama Hills. A lot of routes there have tricky moves right off the ground. Why the hell should I risk a sprained or broken ankle when there is simply no need? At Cochise this winter, an unfortunate bloke decked before the first clip on a long 5.9 up the center of Isle of You--seriously messed up ankle. Had he stick clipped, he'd have got back on and sent. The next day, a group asked to borrow our stick to avoid a replay.
Cheers and decking-free climbs, one and all.
BAd
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Gary
climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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Big ears, glad you're ok.
A good reason to place gear early and often.
TGT, that's great advice.
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sethsquatch76
Trad climber
Joshua tree ca
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Definitely glad your ok!!!!!!!
12 feet off the ground, not sure how you did not have the right size piece of gear.......#2 camalot......
Being supportive, I promise. Here is a synopsis of the formula I teach clients. On a 1 to 4 scale. One being sh#t, and 4 being the cats meow.
Step 1. Do we have good rock quality, both macro and micro? If so add +1
Step 2. Do we have a parallel sided crack? Or constricted crack? If so add +1
Step 3. Is my cam 50% or more compressed? If so add +1
Step 4. Do I have good contact on all lobes (3 or 4)? If so add +1
Add steps consecutively.
With out step one, look else where. Hopefully...... Step 2, things are looking good, I will have to work hard to screw this up! Step 3, sitting pretty!!!! Step 4, bomber, Lets haul the SUV up the cliff!!!!!!!
Hope this helps,
Seth
http://www.cliffhangerguides.com
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big ears
Trad climber
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Topic Author's Reply - Jun 9, 2011 - 12:16am PT
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here is the whole story.....
Got up, took a fall on the red one, it held. Realized I needed a smaller piece for the rest of the route, and it just so happened there was a BOMBER green c3 right in front of my face, I back cleaned (stupid move I know. Hindsight is a wonderful thing). pulled the green piece out, and almost immediately the red one popped. The green would have held. I was suspect about the red on the whole time, but figured since it held the fall, I was ok. I was wrong
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Pennsylenvy
Gym climber
A dingy corner in your refrigerator
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Thank god I'm not a noob.....
"Definitely glad your ok!!!!!!!
12 feet off the ground, not sure how you did not have the right size piece of gear.......#2 camalot......
Being supportive, I promise. Here is a synopsis of the formula I teach clients. On a 1 to 4 scale. One being sh#t, and 4 being the cats meow.
Step 1. Do we have good rock quality, both macro and micro? If so add +1
Step 2. Do we have a parallel sided crack? Or constricted crack? If so add +1
Step 3. Is my cam 50% or more compressed? If so add +1
Step 4. Do I have good contact on all lobes (3 or 4)? If so add +1
Add steps consecutively.
With out step one, look else where. Hopefully...... Step 2, things are looking good, I will have to work hard to screw this up! Step 3, sitting pretty!!!! Step 4, bomber, Lets haul the SUV up the cliff!!!!!!!
Hope this helps,
Seth
http://www.cliffhangerguides.com "
doing math while climbing??????
I always try to place extra gear down, place two pieces in critical ground fall zones! I see many climbers trust one piece of gear in critical situations...not me.
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Ian Gill
Big Wall climber
Redding, CA
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Decked one time about 29 years ago, due to that great equalizer - STUPIDITY.
1st pitch of South Seas - First placement off the ground was a hook, to reach a fixed pin. Pin looked like it had been there forever - I DIDN'T EVEN TEST IT! What a dumbass move, especially with all the wall experience I had.
Pin pulled as soon as I stepped onto it, luckily sending me only about 6-8 feet or so to the apron below. I had never NOT tested a fixed pin before!
That false sense of security of being so close to the ground made me careless. Only 8 feet? Yeah, but STILL could've been hurt if I had landed on my head, as no one (or almost no one), including myself, wore helmets in those days.
Always test, always use the right piece - forced pieces force falls!
Glad you're okay!
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big ears
Trad climber
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Topic Author's Reply - Jun 9, 2011 - 01:05am PT
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ok, I was suspect about it UNTIL it held the fall. Then, as I stated, stupidly, thought it was good
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PAUL SOUZA
Trad climber
Clovis, CA
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Sounds like someone is bored......
Troll
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ß Î Ø T Ç H
Boulder climber
bouldering
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I was belaying a dude on something at ORG. He got about that far up and fell. I ignored the rope etc and just spotted him. He said "nice catch", but I'm pretty sure he was pissed or whatever.
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ontheedgeandscaredtodeath
Trad climber
San Francisco, Ca
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Once the moves stop feeling solid for me I almost always back the gear up- if'n I can't, and the fall would have consequences if the last piece were to fail, I seriously reconsider my options.
Leading at one's limit requires constant evaluation and re-evaluation of ability, gear, rock quality, and fall scenarios.
I'm glad the OP is o.k.!
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o-man
Social climber
Paia,Maui,HI
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My good friend Ed became unattached to the rock while we were climbing one day. He was out from the gear just about a foot or so shy of the distance the gear was to the ground. I was tied off to a sturdy tree and when he softly hit the ground,I was suspended in the air fully locked off on my belay plate. We finished that climb and did numerous others in the years to come. ED 185lb me 135 lb
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utahman912
Social climber
SLC, UT
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The next day, a group asked to borrow our stick to avoid a replay
Stick Clip - Don't leave home without it
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