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aliebling
climber
San Francisco, CA
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Topic Author's Original Post - Mar 21, 2011 - 10:30pm PT
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I know this has been discussed in detail before, but I'm new enough to need some hand holding. Prompted by having to abandon an older number 2 c4 in Joshua Tree last week (on Fote Hog...go and get it!) due to a broken trigger wire as well as a broken trigger wire on an older number 3 c4, I want to give my older cams some tender loving care.
Can anyone give directions a competent newbie can follow (including tools needed and some step by step pics if possible) or is anyone in the Bay Area willing to help out if I provide beer and grateful thanks?
Here are the likely suspects:
In addition, the following (old metolius 0 and 1 and and other .75 c4) all have highly warped (stretched?) wires which I'm afraid will break at the swages.
The c4s look pretty straight forward (new wire, new swage?), but the metolious look soldered in. Also, the cam heads on the metolius are completely smooth - should they just be junked or are they still fine for use?
Finally, any recommendations for sling replacements?
To assuage your fears and preempt the usual "you're gonna die", these are all from the spares rack...but it would be nice to be able to include them with confidence when I need more of a given size.
Thank in advance!
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ClimbingOn
Trad climber
NY
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Mar 21, 2011 - 10:41pm PT
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This is what you need:
http://www.ems.com/product/index.jsp?productId=3659009
That particular kit works for only sizes 1 - 4, but other size repair kits are available as well. Each kit comes with two replacement wires, and detailed instructions. I just replaced one of the wires on a .3 C4 last week - it is very simple, and takes only a few minutes. Any climbing shop will carry this repair kit.
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The Larry
climber
Moab, UT
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Mar 21, 2011 - 10:45pm PT
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Dude, Those TCU's are over 20 years old.
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aliebling
climber
San Francisco, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Mar 21, 2011 - 10:59pm PT
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Thank you ClimbingOn...I knew they existed but couldn't find them actually available. Anyone have a link for the trigger replacement kit for old camalots under 1?
Larry: they've held up well so far. If the consensus is that I should junk them, then I will, but I really hate to throw out perfectly good gear just because it's old (otherwise they'd have to throw me out, too!).
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squishy
Mountain climber
sacramento
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Mar 21, 2011 - 11:15pm PT
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yeah, you're gonna die...
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The Larry
climber
Moab, UT
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Mar 21, 2011 - 11:17pm PT
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That 3 Camelot still looks good but those other ones look pretty beat.
The Camelots are easy to fix with a swagger kit but the TCU's are a little trickier to recable.
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Mighty Hiker
climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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Mar 21, 2011 - 11:27pm PT
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You may be able to send them to the manufacturers, get them checked, lubricated, fixed up, and even reslung. Worth checking. Looks like most of them need it.
You can just send the blue camalot to donini, though.
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WBraun
climber
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Mar 21, 2011 - 11:32pm PT
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adatesman hits it.
Don't send stuff like this off to someone else.
Don't be a lazy, do it yourself and learn something practical.
Don't just become a specialized person in this world and know how to do only one thing but have a "book knowledge" of everything but can't do sh'it.
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Pennsylenvy
Gym climber
A dingy corner in your refrigerator
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Mar 21, 2011 - 11:33pm PT
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del cross I'll take em if they aren't thrashed. Send you cash for shipping.....PM me.
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Ketchup
Mountain climber
Reno, NV
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Mar 21, 2011 - 11:35pm PT
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If you're replacing cables, think about replacing the webbing too. I think the kits come with instructions and a crimping tool. My vote is fix the 3, consider the little guys after you do an easy one. Junk the .75. C4's are sweet.
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socalbolter
Sport climber
Silverado, CA
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Mar 21, 2011 - 11:47pm PT
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Go to www.thecamdoctor.com
A few years back I bought one of their generic repair kits. It comes with a few different sizes of wire, rigid wire, and various sized swages. Also a swaging tool and instructions specific to various kinds of climbing cams.
I've since repaired many cams (my own and others) and still have plenty of supplies from the kit to do many more.
It's the best deal I could find and I have no regrets whatsoever about purchasing it.
Good luck!
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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Mar 21, 2011 - 11:53pm PT
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Those things have decades of life left in them.
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OlympicMtnBoy
climber
Seattle
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Mar 21, 2011 - 11:54pm PT
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Nothing wrong with those smooth lobed TCUs, the old ones came that way. The "teeth" are somewhat cosmetic and don't really contribute much to the holding power. Good suggestions on fixing the triggers yourself, it's not rocket science, and if you do screw it up, the cam still isn't gonna fail in a fall and kill you.
If they need new slings though (which they might), both BD and Metolius are good about reslinging them fairly reasonably and I think they will repair the trigger wires too (might cost extra). Metolius especially was very cheap ($3) and did a great job of polishing up (literally) some old TCUs and making them work like new.
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Clint Cummins
Trad climber
SF Bay area, CA
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Mar 22, 2011 - 12:03am PT
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I have the swaging tools, cable and lots of swages; can lend you this stuff.
I can show you how to do one, then you borrow the stuff and do the rest.
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aliebling
climber
San Francisco, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Mar 22, 2011 - 12:19am PT
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Awesome Clint!
How doable are the slings (I'm sure they should be replaced) to do myself or should I send them off and have them done by the respective manufacturers?
Also, any thoughts on repairing the broken .5 trigger (plastic pull)?
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Jay Wood
Trad climber
Fairfax, CA
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Mar 22, 2011 - 12:57am PT
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I redid the trigger- pull on a u stem camalot with a section of plastic pipe,
but it didn't work well- those things are pretty much junk compared to all the rest that's available.
Scrap the u-stems. My .02
Liquid electrical tape is pretty good for touching up frayed, but not broken, trigger wires.
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Moof
Big Wall climber
Orygun
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Mar 22, 2011 - 12:59am PT
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Slings can be redone with a water knot, or have them done professionally (Fish, Yates, BD, etc).
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Clint Cummins
Trad climber
SF Bay area, CA
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Mar 22, 2011 - 01:07am PT
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I agree with Moof - replace slings with tied ones, if needed. You can set the knot by clipping biners to both ends of the sling and bouncing on it.
You can straighten the cables on the TCUs with your fingers.
Straighten the steel cam wires with your fingers or a couple of small crescent wrenches or channel pliers. This is pretty quick and easy.
Broken plastic trigger bar on old U-stem Camalot Jr.? Not sure; I don't have one of these to look at. Maybe fabricate one from plastic pipe as Jay did, if you have the tools and inclination.
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WBraun
climber
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Mar 22, 2011 - 01:08am PT
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Good job Clint!
You are the bomb ......
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Fish_Products
Big Wall climber
FishProducts.com
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Mar 22, 2011 - 11:04am PT
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To add to Clints excellent tutorial:
What I do to make sure the trigger bar is level and the wires are the right length is this:
Usually one cable is intact on the cam.
Snip this cable right at the base of the swage on both sides.
Straighten the cable out and then use it as a length guide for the new cable.
Match up the snipped cable with your new cable, then hold a sleeve at the end of the snipped cable, hold it in place along side the new cable, then put another sleeve end to end with this one. Cut the new cable at this length, which is old cable plus the length of two sleeves.
Cut another new cable this same length. Now your trigger bar has no option but to be level and give the correct amount of retraction on the cam.
If your control rods are broken or lost, you can use all sorts of stuff to replace them.
Large paper clip
Spring wire
and my personal fave, the nail portion of a PopRivet. This will have a ball end ready to go into most cams and not pull through the hole. Nice clean fix with none of that bent over wire jazz. Size will depend on the cam, and they come in very many diameters and lengths.
Or you could always send them to us for wires and slings.
See us on the web at:
http://www.FishProducts.com
http://fishproductsblog.blogspot.com/
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pvalchev
Social climber
Mountain View, CA / Calgary, AB
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Mar 22, 2011 - 12:12pm PT
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And a "quick fix" (for camalots) a friend and I used in Squamish on the recommendation of someone there - buy a tennis racket from a consignment store: $3.
Take the string off, cut off a piece and loop it through the trigger and poke the ends through the cam lobes the same way as the metal triggers. Now that's where you'd have to "cap" the metal to prevent it from pulling out. Instead, cut off the excess leaving about 1/4" sticking out, take a lighter and burn the end to form a "ball" of molten plastic. Wait for it to dry, and enjoy your new cams.
My buddy's have lasted years like this and it seems to be plenty strong.
The string we used was almost the perfect diameter, nearly maximum for the hole on the cam lobe, but I doubt it matters a whole lot.
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aliebling
climber
San Francisco, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Mar 22, 2011 - 05:59pm PT
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Del cross: I sent you a private message vis supertopo. If you didn't get that, you can also reach me at myusername @gmail.com. I promise the cams will get so
E loving attention and thence used!
Clint: likewise a pm sent. I really appreciate your kind offer. Let me know what works best for you to meet up. We're headed back to jtree in 3 weeks and would lov to have them fixed up for that.
All: To replace the slings myself, is there a recommended sling width/material? I read something on the BD site warning against too narrow/dyneema/etc...
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Impaler
Gym climber
Vancouver
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Mar 22, 2011 - 06:27pm PT
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Another option is to take the cams to Seth at Marmot mountain work in Berkeley for trigger wire replacement. $5 for a cam or something like that. Of course, if you have a lot of them that need replacement - DIY is the way to go.
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aliebling
climber
San Francisco, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Mar 27, 2011 - 01:03pm PT
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Clint: pinging you about repairing trigger wires again. We're off to JTree again in two weeks and I've love to have at least the number 3 fixed up before we go.
If that doesn't work out, can anyone give me an idea of the turnaround time for marmot in Berkeley in case I need to have them do just the one?
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Cuckawalla
Trad climber
Grand Junction, CO
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Mar 27, 2011 - 01:19pm PT
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Also Weed-Wacker cable works super good. You just push the cable through and burn it to mushroom as a stop. Cheap, tough, light.
-Jesse
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slobmonster
Trad climber
OAK (nee NH)
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Mar 27, 2011 - 02:06pm PT
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Hi all. I can do most cam trigger repairs in relatively quick turnaround. During the week I'm @ Marmot, in Berkeley, and do cam repairs during off hours: $7.50 for one trigger wire, $14 for both; it's not through any business so please bring me cash. Feel free to PM me, too.
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Clint Cummins
Trad climber
SF Bay area, CA
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Mar 27, 2011 - 05:34pm PT
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aliebling:
I have sent email directed to your gmail address and via the supertopo email, but I haven't received any replies.
So I suspect one or both of our spam filters are blocking emails.
My home phone number is on my web page, and in the phone book.
Too bad, yesterday would have been good. I have to go into work now.
Next weekend, I plan to be in the Valley....
Maybe the distance from my house to yours is too far to make meeting convenient enough.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 30, 2011 - 01:21pm PT
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BUMP for timeliness
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kev
climber
A pile of dirt.
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Aug 30, 2011 - 02:10pm PT
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Aliebling,
I highly recommend hanging with Clint and learning how to do this.
I had a lot of fun!
On a side note after Clint's Cam School, I have replaced more on my own successfully, with the exception of small alien trigger wires - too small for my fumbling fingers...
kev
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franzr
Trad climber
Lancaster, CA
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Aug 30, 2011 - 03:14pm PT
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For the last several years I prefer to use weed wacker cord. Extremely durable, cheap, and easy to install. Very similar to the tennis racket cordage tip mentioned above--not sure which one is better.
--Ryan
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MTucker
Ice climber
Arizona
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Aug 30, 2011 - 05:07pm PT
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Mucci
You have to match up parts and tools correctly.
Nicopress 17-3 = 1/32"
Match wire, sleeve, and tool
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mucci
Trad climber
The pitch of Bagalaar above you
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Aug 30, 2011 - 06:32pm PT
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I was just trying to make a point Tucker but thanks for clarifying for the thread.
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slobmonster
Trad climber
OAK (nee NH)
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Aug 30, 2011 - 08:09pm PT
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Yeah, I get it. It's not pocket change. But if you want to do the repairs for yourself, all the info you need is outlined above.
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Jay Wood
Trad climber
Land of God-less fools
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Aug 31, 2011 - 12:41pm PT
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No, it is pocket change.
You probably spend most of an hour on a cam including communication & shipping, right?
Robbery- sheesh.
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Bill Mc Kirgan
Trad climber
Cedar Rapids, Iowa
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Aug 31, 2011 - 01:24pm PT
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saltw#ter
LOL
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Jay Wood
Trad climber
Land of God-less fools
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I ordered a kit several days ago, & the payment seemed to go through.
Temporary website glich?
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slobmonster
Trad climber
OAK (nee NH)
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Well, for those among you in the Bay Area without the inclination or tools, I'll fix those pesky trigger wires for you. Let's say $10 per cam (i.e. both wires if needed) for Supertopo people...
I can do these in my spare time, and you can drop them off @ Marmot Mtn Works in Berkeley. Ask for Seth.
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Acer
Big Wall climber
AZ
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There are plenty of options and people that will fix your cams.
Check out Wired Bliss to get any brand of your cams refurbished. $5 for each sling or repair. Trigger wire repair includes headed pins, sleeves, and wire for all cam lobes on most cams.
http://www.wiredblissusa.com/Repairs.html
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tolman_paul
Trad climber
Anchorage, AK
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Thanks for the thread, I was going through my rack and found one of the wires on my #4 camalot was nearly cut in two. Kinda weird the piece on my rack that has been used the least, was abused the most.
I used 1/16" aircraft cable and swaged it in place, and also realize I cut the cable a bit too short. I also found the only good thing about the first gen U cable camelots is the trigger will rotate if one cable is shorter than the other, and the cams will still open evenly.
BD definately went with wimpy cable on their cam triggers.
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moinerus
Trad climber
Edinburgh, Scotland
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Sep 11, 2011 - 12:35pm PT
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If your are in the UK or Europe order from http://www.thecamdoctor.co.uk for fast delivery. Same kit as from america but will arrive in a few days.
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Jay Wood
Trad climber
Land of God-less fools
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Dec 13, 2011 - 03:03pm PT
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I got a crimp/swage tool at the fishing supply place.
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thebravecowboy
climber
The Good Places
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anybody aware of a similar multi-brand cam repair service as to what Wired Bliss was offering prior to their hiatus early this year?
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| Messages 1 - 45 of total 45 in this topic |
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