BLUEBLOCR
Social climber
joshua tree
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Nov 16, 2012 - 07:18pm PT
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Hey Dr-Florist
I have one of those! I've got the name on a card around here somewhere.
I also have a few other really cool cacti. I'd like to show you pictures but I can't figure out how to upload pictures from my iPhone?
Werner, Come On, I didn't say that!!!
"But to make claim animals have no soul and we Christians have dominion over them to indiscriminately kill them in mechanized industrialized slaughterhouses reeks of total hypocrisy."
But we do have federal laws depicting how we "slaughter"animals.
I mostly eat kosher, Hebrew national hot dogs. Mmmmmm Mmmmm
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Dr. F.
Ice climber
SoCal
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 16, 2012 - 07:24pm PT
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Sorry BB
You do not have one of those
You may have something similar
That plant is very rare, and only about 20 people in the world have one of those
Take a pic of your plant, I would like to see it
on another note
I agree with Werner
If I have a soul, other animals have one too
And we have no dominion over the earth
The earth has dominion over us, and we are it's pets
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Jan
Mountain climber
Okinawa, Japan
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Nov 16, 2012 - 07:48pm PT
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Dr. F.
You have just demonstrated that all those years of meditation weren't wasted on you.You're more spiritual than you think.
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Captain...or Skully
climber
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Nov 16, 2012 - 07:51pm PT
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"Dr Florist".....Hehehe. Nice one, bBlocker.
I, too sorta kinda agree. Either all things have souls or nothing does.
It's an equal opportunity Universe.
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Dr. F.
Ice climber
SoCal
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 16, 2012 - 07:56pm PT
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No years were wasted
maybe a day or two
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MH2
climber
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Nov 16, 2012 - 08:02pm PT
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(He's an idiot.)
I will read more attentively. Many seem to have missed this. Not much evidence up to page 45, but there's a long way to go. (And I might be an idiot, too.)
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Jan
Mountain climber
Okinawa, Japan
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Nov 16, 2012 - 08:04pm PT
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Blueblocr-
The early Christians who marched to their deaths in the Roman colosseums while singing did not read the Bible because it wasn't put together then. It is possible to be a believer based on personal experience, without reading the Bible.
As for myths, rituals, and symbols, the Old Testament is full of them and the New as well. Just try understanding the Book of Revelation without symbolism. Jesus was presented at the temple as a child and he visited the temple as an adult. It was of course the center of Jewish ritual. He never said ritual was bad, only that the hypocrisy of some of its practitioners was bad. Likewise, he never condemned Jewish dietary law, he just said don't get hung up on it.
As for ritual, to me the biggest example of that is Christians who repeat the same old phrases over and over again about what we must believe. Those phrases did not come from Jesus himself but from the Apostle Paul (substitutionary atonement) and later decisions made at councils of Catholic bishops. The whole idea of the Christian trinity was developed over many centuries at a series of Catholic councils. There is nothing about it in the Bible yet Protestants continue to believe what was a Catholic formula.
As for idolatry, one of the worst forms of it as far as I can see, is Bibliolatry, the mindless worship of scripture removed from its historical and cultural context and extrapolated instead from a particular modern perspective such as Protestantism.
And then there's the egotism of saying that a person can't wait until another person who has spent 30 years on their own spiritual practice, thinks about something just like they do. Not surprising a lot of people get alienated.
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Largo
Sport climber
The Big Wide Open Face
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Nov 16, 2012 - 08:11pm PT
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MH2 wrote: On a much smaller scale:
I am reading the Roger Penrose books on consciousness and reality. The 3 of them add up to about 1500 pages. I am on page 45 of the first book.
Fruity replied: I'm sorry. (He's an idiot.) Then again, some say an entire life spent in search of the perfect cherry blossom is not a waste of time.
The shocking and most scandalous thing is the total lack of consciousness and sober, rational thought in Fruity's replies. Lost on Fruity is the subtle and dry humor of the psychiatrist having conquered a mere 45 pages of his reading.
Notice that at no time did MH2 declare he was a Penrose bootlicker or zealot, as Fruity is of Harris (and most anyone else with dated beliefs), merely that he was reading his several tomes.
We might call Dr. Penrose many things (he's a theoretical physicist with a strong math focus), but idiot is not a natural fit IMO.
For those not dialed into Primrose's work, the reason he gets pilloried by mechanical fundamentalists like Fruitcake is that he believes the mind and consciousness are non-algorithmic - and you can easily see why he troubles those from the deterministic camp, whose fire is going out by the day.
An algorithm, of course, "is an effective method expressed as a finite list of well-defined instructions for calculating a function."
According to a mechanistic belief, if we only had a sufficient list of data, we could calculate brain function exactly. A softer approach might concede that the transition from one state to the next is not necessarily deterministic; but they do not abandon their algorithms, and simply insert randomized algorithms, which incorporate random input. But the basic mechanistic process is still held inviolate and sacred.
Primrose has shitcanned this belief, and quite naturally, moronic plebians like Fruity are crying foul even as MH2 approaches 50 pages of an idiot.
Fruity's gratuitous quip that about lost souls searching for the perfect cherry blossom betrays a Homeric ignorance of the internal arts equal if not superior to the Abrahamic theists he routinely hounds.
JL
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BLUEBLOCR
Social climber
joshua tree
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Nov 16, 2012 - 08:20pm PT
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"And we have no dominion over the earth"
WwwHhhhhhhAaaaaaaaaaaaaaTtttttttttttt HhhhhhhAaaaaaaaHhhhhhhhhAaaaaa
Sorry, I couldn't stop laughing!!!!!!!!
DuDE; what is science? What is heating and cooling of metals and other elements? What's the useing of oil? What's the making of artificial medicines? What is stem cell research? What is abortions? What about the man-made breeds of dogs and cactus?
When you remove an element or cell from its original environment, and you provide for it a new artificial environment. Aren't you indeed placing dominion over that said Earth??
Or am I way off base? Lean'in toward Home>
BB
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Dr. F.
Ice climber
SoCal
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 16, 2012 - 08:29pm PT
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The earth can open up and swallow us all,
or blow your house down, or flood your town
We have no power over the earth
we only have the power to protect our selves from the earth
and the good sense to run and take shelter from Mother earth
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Mimi
climber
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Nov 16, 2012 - 08:42pm PT
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Or cohabitate on the Earth. And knot totally f*#k it up.
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Captain...or Skully
climber
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Nov 16, 2012 - 08:48pm PT
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The Earth constantly reminds us how much "dominion" we have. We live and die at her discretion. As it should be.
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jogill
climber
Colorado
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Nov 16, 2012 - 08:56pm PT
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We face a huge problem
Houston, we are having an existential problem here . . .
;>)
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Mimi
climber
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Nov 16, 2012 - 08:59pm PT
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We must get a handle on population and that can only be done through education. Gloomy picture.
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splitter
Trad climber
da'Raven / Cali Hodad, surfing the galactic plane
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Nov 16, 2012 - 10:00pm PT
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We must get a handle on population... Nature has a way of dealing with that (be careful what you wish for)!
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Mimi
climber
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Nov 16, 2012 - 10:05pm PT
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I'm not wishing for anything except a return to sanity. Oh wait, have we ever been sane? Sorry, I was trying to be optimistic.
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splitter
Trad climber
da'Raven / Cali Hodad, surfing the galactic plane
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Nov 16, 2012 - 10:10pm PT
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No need to be sorry!
Mimi, i was being sarcastic (i have a dry sense of humor/gets me into trouble sometimes).
you have a great mind & optimism is what keeps the world (human race) turning!
keep on keepin' on, cuz yer inspirational, we need more people like you!! :)
edit: plus, i tend to lean towards pessimism. people like me need people like you to help balance us out! thnx!!
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BLUEBLOCR
Social climber
joshua tree
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Nov 16, 2012 - 10:28pm PT
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Jan
" Not surprising a lot of people get alienated."
It surprises me that people see it that way..the Bible INVITES every soul!!
Around the time when Jesus walked the earth. Man's ingenuity for writing was born.
Which got His message translated to Words. And this Word is to go out to all men.
(And it came just in time for the population explosion!!) and when every man has heard the name Jesus. This is when He'll come again! This is told about in the book of Revelation.
A book of visions shown to John by Jesus. And it is very symbolic. Because it is John from 50 A.D. looking into the future at nations and governments with rockets and sattlelights. And a lot of people! But the rest of the new testament which was written for all people since Christ. Jesus purtnear mocked all symbolism and religious rituals, He rebelled against. And with His inspiration to Paul. Paul traveled the world and wrote 13 letters to the world's churches. Which depicted and spread the Christian church. Who are adamant about NOT being attached to symbolism and ritualism.All the new testament is written as a matter of fact. Other than the parables. Only the book of Revelation written in symbolism and future telling. Is in a way mystical. In that it takes great spiritual knowledge of the whole Bible to understand.
In it John sees the future problems the early churches run into. And warns them!
John also saw a time when Jesus would draw all His followers unto Him. And for the rest of mankind;the ones that didn't deny Him. Would be given a different opportunity for salvation. I believe this may be the time for the people with good faith, who didn't know the name Jesus.
To have an opportunity to make a reflective choice.
The term trinity came from a sermon, it is a man's term and was not written in the Bible.
It tries to describe the three in one Persona of God. Just like I am Mike, a body, a spirit, and a soul. God IS: Jesus and all of creation the body, Holy spirit, and God the Soul. Thus Trinity.
I don't care for the term.
Jus Mend'in
BB
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