The Albatrosse, Leave the pins at home!

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Messages 1 - 28 of total 28 in this topic
Bulldog

Trad climber
Yosemite, CA
Topic Author's Original Post - Nov 14, 2009 - 10:30pm PT
On my recent solo ascent, I brought the heavy iron of the suggested amount, and luckily brought a extra 12/22 total beaks. Never did place a single pin, but did clip 4 or 5 fixed pins enroute. Moral of the story, lighten up, and leave the pins at home. P.S. chop the bolts on, Walk the plank pitch, theirs a bomber head placement,and bomber cam placement a foot away. Oh yeah,P.S.S. bring a #2 cam for getting on top of the canoe, or free climb it.
'Pass the Pitons' Pete

Big Wall climber
like Ontario, Canada, eh?
Nov 14, 2009 - 10:49pm PT
Hey Kevin,

Nice having beers with you and Gretchen in the "Seedy". Congrats on your solo of the Albatross - I gotta go do that route someday.

Your post above is unclear to me - are you saying you used a bunch of big peckers?

Now - tell us about your ascent of Mediterraneo! Let's hear the beta and see the pix, buddy. Hey Tom, where are you these days? We should go do that one!

Oh yeah, and Bad To The Bone! Might be on that one come spring.
Steve Grossman

Trad climber
Seattle, WA
Nov 14, 2009 - 10:53pm PT
You are talking about The Flight of the Albatross, right? First solo ascent? Congratulations! How many hammered placements more or less and how was the climbing? I never understood how those hardware lists get so freakin' bloated.
Bulldog

Trad climber
Yosemite, CA
Topic Author's Reply - Nov 14, 2009 - 11:20pm PT
Yeah Pete, good swilling with you and those volumptuous women at the seedie! Pecker report goes like this, 3 extra large, 4 large, 12 medium, 3 small, some of those medium sized ones are ground down to sharpen them up, from prior use. As the Mediterraneo topo goes, we didn't make a topo, we got topo off a El Cap poster, which was basiclly a staight line, good luck on that one, bring many peckers, All belays are bomber. Bad to the Bone, many peckers, and bugaboos, you might have to add rivet to the 6th pitch, a refigerator size flake ripped on my partner, he wore it like a cheap dress while flipping upside, WOW! Hope that helps. Later
Bulldog

Trad climber
Yosemite, CA
Topic Author's Reply - Nov 14, 2009 - 11:42pm PT
Yes, SENSEI/Mr. Grossman that is The Flight of the Albatross but I didn't huck my carcass off the top, so it's only The Albatross. The climbing was great, those two pitches coming off of Cast away maties pinnacle are very splitter and Mr. CaldwelLs chalk all over it. The aid pitches were amazing as well. Oh yeah, 14 peckers were placed on the first A3 pitch and I placed 18 on the other A3 pitch, and all peckers were set with a chisel on the back of the head, "Watch out for ramp on that pitch." Good to hear from you, SENSEI!
T H

climber
. . . not !
Nov 15, 2009 - 01:14am PT
"we got topo off a El Cap poster, which was basiclly a staight line"
haha .
bringmedeath

climber
la la land
Nov 15, 2009 - 01:27am PT
peckers are not pins????
Steve Grossman

Trad climber
Seattle, WA
Nov 15, 2009 - 01:47am PT
That is the most beautiful part of the Captain and that route has always interested me since few routes move through it. Again, proud effort and thanks for the details.

Pondering the mistreatment and disrespect that Zenyatta has suffered has been getting me down recently and has had me wondering if anyone really even hears my voice these days. These routes are too fragile for continual mindless pounding and drilling.

The Captain serenely takes all that we dish out and in doing so provides a mirror for our collective dreams and motivation should you choose to see yourself in the midst of the adventure.
mucci

Trad climber
The pitch of Bagalaar above you
Nov 15, 2009 - 02:10am PT
Good job keeping the hammering to a minimum on such a proud route!

Beautiful line, what was the canoe like? That thing looks knarly!

Bad to the bone too? Damn....

Mucci
Mighty Hiker

climber
Vancouver, B.C. Small wall climber.
Nov 15, 2009 - 02:29am PT
Another report on this climb: http://supertopo.com/climbers-forum/238594/TR_My_visit_to_the_Canoe
Pierre

Big Wall climber
Sweden
Nov 15, 2009 - 05:10am PT
I concur about the beta - I believe I placed 15 Beaks (did not use a chisel to set them though) on the "walk the plank pitch" when me and Ian did it in late june of 2009. I would suggest bringing as a minimum; 11 normal sized, 4 medium and 1 large. I also think the rating is a bit off, it is a hard pitch with a possible ledge bruiser... RFP! (really fun pitch)

I was also wondering about the bolt on that pitch - a few feet higer is a Bomber green (?) alien placement.

Placed some heads (5?) on that pitch aswell - and we left them in place - hope you liked them Bulldog!

I think the chalk on the pitches above "cast away" belongs to Honnold and Anker, they were freeclimbing on "EL Corazon" when we were hanging out on the Albatross...

peace

jack herer

climber
veneta, or
Nov 15, 2009 - 08:38pm PT
what is an extra large beak? is it a vermin thing or a spectre?
Pierre

Big Wall climber
Sweden
Nov 16, 2009 - 11:47am PT
Black Diamond make three different sizes of the Pecker, #1, #2 and #3.

I call the #1 for the normal/standard size, then #2 goes as a medium and #3 is pretty big and I call it large.

No need for an extra large beak if it is bigger than BD #3...
Lambone

Ice climber
Ashland, Or
Nov 16, 2009 - 12:45pm PT
peckers are not pins? that's news to me...
Steve Grossman

Trad climber
Seattle, WA
Nov 16, 2009 - 10:07pm PT
I think that his point is updating the hardware list.
John Mac

Trad climber
Littleton, CO
Nov 16, 2009 - 10:18pm PT
Steve,

Don't worry you are being heard by a lot of climbers out there, especially in the more fragile areas.

Yosemite seems to be way behind and eventually will be loved to death. I suspect many routes already have been. It's way past time for people to stop making excuses and start leaving the hammer behind and try to climb as clean as possible. There still seems to be a mindset in Yosemite that hammering the hell out of everything is a given right, whereas getting the hammer out of the haul bag should be a last resort.

Cheers

john


PS: Bulldog, congrats on your solo.
Karl Baba

Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
Nov 16, 2009 - 10:38pm PT
Congrats on the light-handed ascent. Much respect.

Certainly there is a difference between the damage of pounding a pin with a hammer and setting a pecker with a tap. Enough difference to recognize. You probably clean them with a yank eh? No harm done!

Peace

Karl
Lambone

Ice climber
Ashland, Or
Nov 16, 2009 - 11:30pm PT
"all peckers were set with a chisel on the back of the head"

can you explain this? Never heard of this technique...using a chisel to place a beak.

And sorry...but I don't get the "I placed 34 beaks, but I didn't place any pins" logic.

Not sh#t talkin, just curious and confused. Are beaks the new clean aid?

Congrats on your ascent!

And John, "yosemite seems way behind". Way behind what? Wasn'tclean aiding invented in Yosemite? Have harder clean ascents been done elsewhere? Doubt it.
Steve Grossman

Trad climber
Seattle, WA
Nov 16, 2009 - 11:36pm PT
The issue for me is sustainability and challenge. A mini-drytooling exercise is better than a bunch of fixed heads. Most people don't even seem to be aware that they should be cleaning pitons from the midpoint upwards rather than lazily all the way up and down which just leaves a flare that becomes very hard to clean climb and clears off any irregularities. Soft rock freaks learn that lesson quickly.

Lambone- Listen to the crap advice that Pete can't help spewing and you will get the point.

The blunt chisel comes into play when you don't have a clear swing at the anvil of the beak. Lots of folks will just blast away and scar the area just as people like to place heads with the pick of their hammer and cause rock damage with the slightest misplaced blow.

Nobody is taking the position that beaks aren't being hammered or regarded as a piton but they are placed differently and result in a different sort of impact.

Lambone

Ice climber
Ashland, Or
Nov 17, 2009 - 12:15am PT
^^^uh, well I am pretty sure I read it right when the OP said "I didn't place any pins." And the title of the thread is "leave your pins at home." I dunno maybe I am just confused on the language... But why would you make that claim after nailing 30+ beaks?

RE chisel...I didn't think about beaks in corners, yeah that makes sense to use the chisel. Good technique to keep from marring up the rock.

I agree that beaks are less damaging then other pins, like uhhhh duh. Not a ground breaking revelation there. But a beak is a pin and nailing is nailing.

"Lambone- Listen to the crap advice that Pete can't help spewing and you will get the point."
WTF does that mean?^^^ why you gotta go trash talking Pete outa nowhere? Yeah I have been reading Pete's advice for over 10 years, what's it to you? Doesn't mean I agree with all of itbut that doesn't mean it's crap.

I think the only people you are talking about who don't know how to clean pins properly are noobs on zod, trip, shield... But even most of those guys have read it in the supertopo book they just don't have practice yet. Too bad for those routes.
Bulldog

Trad climber
Yosemite, CA
Topic Author's Reply - Nov 18, 2009 - 01:02pm PT
My title caption simply states, you don't have to bring the suggested amount of pitons, of 27 total, not including the 10 beaks. I, on lead brought a starter selection of pitons, that I was willing to place, but after leading the first A3+ pitch, without placing a angle, lost arrow, or kniefblade, I thought that perhaps I might be able to climb the route with only beaks/peckers....less intrusive pitons. Point being, if you want to lighten up, Leave the HEAVY pitons at home. As for the chisel use, like Mr. Grossman said, it let's you pinpoint your hammer blow, either in a hard to strike corner position, or even straight in. Using the chisel, on beaks simply makes the placement more secure. Using it to clean the beak, makes it very useful as well. Hope this clarifies the intent of my post. Peace out!
Mungeclimber

Trad climber
sorry, just posting out loud.
Nov 18, 2009 - 01:30pm PT
"refigerator size flake"


YIKES!

mucci

Trad climber
The pitch of Bagalaar above you
Nov 18, 2009 - 02:01pm PT
The chisel is a great idea, especially for cleaning.

LA's have always been the ticket to get those pesky beaks out.

Good stuff here
Mucci
seamus mcshane

climber
Nov 18, 2009 - 03:07pm PT
Yo KA !
Badass dude!!!
What's that, 20 routes?
Remember nearly drowning in the Owen's River? Gotta be 10 years ago.
What a hoot!!!
Peace from St. George. McShane.
Mike.

climber
Nov 18, 2009 - 04:29pm PT
I think it could be said of every nailing route that beak-type pins replace many/most other pins. Definitely reduces the need to tie off short. I carry almost no KBs and way fewer LAs. The hooking action and ability to go where no pin has gone make Peckers and Tomahawks shine. Tomahawks' right/left design reduce the need for using a chisel, making them easier to place (and clean) in corners.

What we need are more canted (camming) designs like the Pika Toucan. And we need fatter-blade versions to better work in LA slots similar to Crack-N-Ups.

That style piton is the cat's ass. Some of mine so mysteriously disappeared last year...there's a testimony.

Nice job on the route, Bd. Cool pic of the Canoe above your name.
Bulldog

Trad climber
Yosemite, CA
Topic Author's Reply - Nov 20, 2009 - 05:37pm PT
Excuse me, Mr. Middendorf. I didn't mean to sound cocky. The bolts on "Walk the plank" pitch, are not in the supertopo book. So I thought someone else had placed them. Their is however a big fat new one next to the first bolt, the original bolt look totally fine to me, however I didn't use either one. The rivet above that was used and wipped on! wow-hoo
So, thanks for putting up the route! It was a blast! CHEERS!
Melissa

Gym climber
berkeley, ca
Nov 20, 2009 - 06:00pm PT
Pardon the interuption...I'll delete shortly. Mike. I sent you an e-mail via tacomail a while back. Did it go through?
Mike.

climber
Nov 20, 2009 - 07:12pm PT
Melissa, No I did not. The ST-gram dealie doesn't reach me for whatever reason. ouscre at hotmail daught cahm does work. Cheers to ya both.
Messages 1 - 28 of total 28 in this topic
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