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rick sumner

Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
Jun 7, 2013 - 10:12pm PT
Thanks for links to glaciation Ed. They seem somewhat neutral. One thing i can tell you for sure is that Alaskan Glacial mass has been increasing over the last several years. Bharata seems to be indicating that the monsoon seems to be getting back on track. So perhaps in the next several years we can count the Himalayan mass as increasing as well as the already increasing Karakoram mass. If you then throw in the observed east Antarctic increase,and the soon to be observed recovery phase of the Arctic sea ice, perhaps Obama will make good on his promise to halt or even reverse the .05 mm yr claimed sea level rise.
Norton

Social climber
the Wastelands
Jun 7, 2013 - 10:15pm PT
perhaps Obama will make good on his promise to halt or even reverse the .05 mm yr claimed sea level rise.


?

got a link to one of your sources on that "promise" of the President that he would halt or even reverse the sea level, Rick?

seriously, for some reason I don't recall that one, thanks?
The Chief

climber
Climber from the Land Mongols under the Whites
Jun 7, 2013 - 10:16pm PT
NORTON!

JM wins the Senior TT for a record 41 podiums. His 20th TT win. Great race this year. Great stuff. Bruce Anstey took third place, and set the fastest lap of the race at 131.531mph

http://www.iomtt.com/News/2013/06/07/Senior_joy_for_john.aspx
rick sumner

Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
Jun 7, 2013 - 10:20pm PT
Listen to his address in Chicago the night of his election in 2008- Norton.
Norton

Social climber
the Wastelands
Jun 7, 2013 - 10:21pm PT
ok, give me a minute here Rick

just takes a minute to google his address and a few to read it, thanks
Norton

Social climber
the Wastelands
Jun 7, 2013 - 10:24pm PT
ok, found the transcript

http://edition.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/11/04/obama.transcript/


let's see if I can find where the President said he would lower the sea level....

be back in a bit
Bruce Kay

Gym climber
BC
Jun 7, 2013 - 10:24pm PT
Forget Obama. If you want to reverse the sea level rise by law you need the Legislators of North Carolina, although I'm sure the Legislators of Wassilla at least thought about it over a couple of brewskies.


North Carolina Sea Level Rises Despite State Senators
Less than two weeks after the state's senate passed a climate science-squelching bill, research shows that sea level along the coast between N.C. and Massachusetts is rising faster than anywhere on Earth

By Leigh Phillips and Nature magazine



Could nature be mocking North Carolina's law-makers? Less than two weeks after the state's senate passed a bill banning state agencies from reporting that sea-level rise is accelerating, research has shown that the coast between North Carolina and Massachusetts is experiencing the fastest sea-level rise in the world.

Asbury Sallenger, an oceanographer at the US Geological Survey in St Petersburg, Florida, and his colleagues analysed tide-gauge records from around North America. On 24 June, they reported in Nature Climate Change that since 1980, sea-level rise between Cape Hatteras, North Carolina, and Boston, Massachusetts, has accelerated to between 2 and 3.7 millimetres per year. That is three to four times the global average, and it means the coast could see 20–29 centimetres of sea-level rise on top of the metre predicted for the world as a whole by 2100 ( A. H. Sallenger Jr et al. Nature Clim. Change http://doi.org/hz4; 2012).

“Many people mistakenly think that the rate of sea-level rise is the same everywhere as glaciers and ice caps melt,” says Marcia McNutt, director of the US Geological Survey. But variations in currents and land movements can cause large regional differences. The hotspot is consistent with the slowing measured in Atlantic Ocean circulation, which may be tied to changes in water temperature, salinity and density.

North Carolina's senators, however, have tried to stop state-funded researchers from releasing similar reports. The law approved by the senate on 12 June banned scientists in state agencies from using exponential extrapolation to predict sea-level rise, requiring instead that they stick to linear projections based on historical data.

Following international opprobrium, the state's House of Representatives rejected the bill on 19 June. However, a compromise between the house and the senate forbids state agencies from basing any laws or plans on exponential extrapolations for the next three to four years, while the state conducts a new sea-level study.

According to local media, the bill was the handiwork of industry lobbyists and coastal municipalities who feared that investors and property developers would be scared off by predictions of high sea-level rises. The lobbyists invoked a paper published in the Journal of Coastal Research last year by James Houston, retired director of the US Army Corps of Engineers' research centre in Vicksburg, Mississippi, and Robert Dean, emeritus professor of coastal engineering at the University of Florida in Gainesville. They reported that global sea-level rise has slowed since 1930 ( J. R. Houston and R. G. Dean J. Coastal Res. 27 , 409 – 417 ; 2011) — a contention that climate sceptics around the world have seized on.

Speaking to Nature, Dean accused the oceanographic community of ideological bias. “In the United States, there is an overemphasis on unrealistically high sea-level rise,” he says. “The reason is budgets. I am retired, so I have the freedom to report what I find without any bias or need to chase funding.” But Sallenger says that Houston and Dean's choice of data sets masks acceleration in the sea-level-rise hotspot.

North Carolina is not the only hotspot for efforts to legislate away the reality of sea-level rise. In 2011, the Texas Commission on Environmental Quality removed all references to rising sea levels from a scientific study of Galveston Bay on the Gulf of Mexico. And this month, the Virginia General Assembly passed a bill commissioning a study on rising sea levels — but only after references to sea-level rise and climate change had been removed.

This article is reproduced with permission from the magazine Nature. The article was first published on June 27, 2012.
Dr. Christ

Mountain climber
State of Mine
Jun 7, 2013 - 10:25pm PT
rick, is this the one?

http://www.presidentialrhetoric.com/campaign2008/obama/11.04.08.html

because I can't find it there.

Maybe one of his others?

http://www.presidentialrhetoric.com/campaign2008/
rick sumner

Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
Jun 7, 2013 - 10:36pm PT
No, thats not it. Forgive me guys. I really don't pay a lot of attention to what your man in the White House says anymore. He has said so many things. Anyway below is a link in reference.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/newsweek/2008/06/07/as-the-oceans-rise.html
Dr. Christ

Mountain climber
State of Mine
Jun 7, 2013 - 10:36pm PT
Sorry dude but let's look at the graph again.

YES, let's...

We are well below average.

The south has been drier than 1977 since April.

The north and central have been drier than 1977 since early May.



Look closely. If need be, dawn a pair of glasses.
climbski2

Mountain climber
Anchorage AK, Reno NV
Jun 7, 2013 - 10:38pm PT
Just think if the internet was around back when we discovered the world was a sphere.
climbski2

Mountain climber
Anchorage AK, Reno NV
Jun 7, 2013 - 10:39pm PT
Just think if the internet was around 50 years after we discovered the world was round.

That woulda been at least 80k posts by now.
rick sumner

Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
Jun 7, 2013 - 10:40pm PT
You gentlemen do realize that California and the southwest have suffered many specie and civilization ending mega droughts over the last twenty thousand years, don't you? A little dryspell is absolutely nothing out of the ordinary.
climbski2

Mountain climber
Anchorage AK, Reno NV
Jun 7, 2013 - 10:50pm PT
We are gunna die!.. unfortunately much faster than necessary. Civilization may or may not survive another 100 years or so but if it doesn't it could have.

The next civilization will probably learn something from all of this.
Bruce Kay

Gym climber
BC
Jun 7, 2013 - 10:55pm PT
Dr Christ, If I may, perhaps i can help you navigate the denial trifecta here. The Chief as he likes to call himself, is correct. Always. This is all due to his vastly superior intuitive sense that transcends any need for extraneous learning or anything else that he dosn't possess. So you see he isn't a denier at all because there is nothing to deny.

Follow? Great - perhaps you could explain it to me.


Rick Sumner has embarked on a journey of self instruction. He has amassed, by his own words, a twenty foot stack of pee reviewed scientific studies on climate change and siding installation that he is plowing through with the idea of granting himself a Phd before next christmas. You may have noticed that he started this project with the same intuitively gained certainty of the outcome as The Chief but for some reason he wishes to be taken seriously by Ed, thus this cute little charade.

Ron Anderson also amazingly enough seems to know exactly what is going on but he makes no real pretense of knowing what is going on, which dosn't faze him one little bit. He lives in Nevadastan.

There are others that make occasional guest appearances, like Blah or Barhata who Rick is convinced must wear a turban and lives at the headwaters of the Ganges for some reason but they tend not to be too chatty and prefer mono tone one liners and cut and pastes. Boring.

Sorry, I don't mean to spoil the fun, just save you a few thousand posts assuming fair play on their part. In fact they are really of limited value in terms of the physical sciences. But for psychology they are a gold mine!
Dr. Christ

Mountain climber
State of Mine
Jun 7, 2013 - 10:56pm PT
Rick, definitely in the southwest, but name a civilization in the Sierra Nevada that ended due to a "mega drought" in the last twenty thousand years. Seriously, I know a bit about indigenous civilizations in the southwest, but not much about those in CA.

The issue was "it is dry," in response to which the Chaff offered his childhood memories and demonstrated his inability to process simple information presented in graphical form.



Thanks for the refresher Bruce. Keep up the good work.
Norton

Social climber
the Wastelands
Jun 7, 2013 - 11:17pm PT
Hey Rick, you were right!

Although you lied because the President never PROMISED to lower the sea level

HE DID!

or, more accurately, he was right, the sea level HAS GONE DOWN AS HE SAID!

Thanks for pointing this out Rick!

Obama declared in a June 8, 2008 speech, that his presidency will be “the moment when the rise of the oceans began to slow and our planet began to heal.” Obama’s prognostication occurred during his victory speech in St. Paul for the Democratic Party nomination.

Climate Depot can now announce it is official. Earlier this month, the European Space Agency’s Envisat monitoring, global sea level revealed a “two year long decline [in sea level] was continuing, at a rate of 5mm per year.”

In August 2011, NASA announced that global sea level was dropping and was “a quarter of an inch lower than last summer.” See: NASA: ‘Global sea level this summer is a quarter of an inch lower than last summer’

The global drop in sea level followed NASA’s announcement that sea level around the U.S. was declining in February 2011.

Most surprising, despite the fact that Obama said he would only “slow” the rise of the oceans, his presidency has presided over what some scientists are terming an “historic decline” in global sea levels. Obama appears to have underestimated his own powers to alter sea level.

Even more impressive for President Obama is the fact that just six months into his presidency, sea level started its historic reversal. In July 2009, sea level was already showing a “slowdown and was “still flattening.” See: Sea Level Rise: An Update Shows a Slowdown & See: Global Sea Level Updated at UC – still flattening’

President Obama’s success in lowering sea level has not gone unnoticed. The skeptical website Real Science, made sarcastic note of Obama’s “healing of the climate” and his sea level accomplishment on June 3, 2011.
“No hurricanes have struck the US since Obama became president, temperatures and sea level have dropped, and we have had record snow,” Real Science noted. “Reservoirs are filling up – and all of the damage [President George W.] Bush did to the climate has been healed. Obama should declare ‘mission accomplished’ and take credit!” Real Science concluded.
http://www.climatedepot.com/2011/09/21/promise-kept-planet-healer-obama-calls-it-in-2008-he-declared-his-presidency-would-result-in-the-rise-of-the-oceans-beginning-to-slow-and-by-2011-sea-level-drops/[/quote]
rick sumner

Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
Jun 7, 2013 - 11:18pm PT
Christ almighty ,if you wish. Look up Spirit Cave man, lookup Folsom, lookup Clovis, and of course you know of the denizens of Chaco canyon. All cultures that had to move on or perish. But their forays into the Sierra were few and far between. The Paiute, Miwok, and others have frequented the mountains there in more recent times.

Oh come on Norton-that is what he implied

Bruce you continue to entertain. At present the stack of papers is more like 16" and the siding closer to 20'
The Chief

climber
Climber from the Land Mongols under the Whites
Jun 7, 2013 - 11:40pm PT
Speaking of Fail! Models compared to reality.
Bruce Kay

Gym climber
BC
Jun 7, 2013 - 11:41pm PT
Chuff! Stop fuking up the pages!
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