Climate Change skeptics? [ot]

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Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
May 20, 2013 - 02:28pm PT
what info? There has been only 2 sales that ever breached the canyon proper. At least as far as USFS ..One was the Acorn Helo-Salvage sale , a First for the region, and the Horse Thief Canyon Commercial sale. Horse Thief was the contested sale/units.
Knotts

Mountain climber
State of Reality
May 20, 2013 - 02:30pm PT
I'm not a scientist so I leave the science to those with the prerequisite background.

Great advice for all them climate scientist and industry operators to heed. The decision & policy making aspect of it all that is.
El Cono

Boulder climber
Tierra Del Coņo
May 20, 2013 - 02:30pm PT
Hey Ron... have you ever stuffed a penguin?
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
May 20, 2013 - 02:31pm PT
ElCono,,why yes,, yes i have. Many countries hunt them every year- normal game birds.
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
May 20, 2013 - 02:33pm PT
Ron, Can you explain why that particular section of old growth forest within the accepted range "had never and would never" be home to a spotted owl? You say "dramatic differences in over all habitat." Please be specific.
Malemute

Ice climber
the ghost
May 20, 2013 - 02:39pm PT
Ah yes, penguins in the Arctic
and polar bears in the antarctic. When you're an IDEA man like Ron, these are just petty details.
Knotts

Mountain climber
State of Reality
May 20, 2013 - 02:40pm PT
Mr Schmidt said no such thing. You are either lying or stupid.

Here's a transcript of what he actually said at the point you mentioned:

"We have built a society, agricultural systems and cities and everything that we do, based on assumptions that basically the climate is not going to change.

The fact that we have so much infrastructure right near the shore is because we didn't expect the sea level to rise. The damage that we had from Hurricane Sandy was increased because sea level has increased by, you know, 10- to 12 inches in....."



Mr Crunch,

Here is my post. He said precisely what I stated.

Kind of like building ones house directly next to a small river never contemplating the fact that a once in a hundred year flood can ruin your day in hours. Or building your home on the shoreline in a hurricane prone beach front. It'll never happen to me thinking. Now we blame piss poor planning of urban expansion on Climate Change. That of course is according to NASA's Mr. Gavin Schmidt. Listen to what he states at mark 3:20. "We did not expect the earth to change."

I most highly recommend you revisit your Optometrist as soon as possible.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
May 20, 2013 - 02:40pm PT
Ok Wes,, for ONE, spotted owls prefer multi layer canopies, ie regen and un even aged stands- typical in old growth in wetter climates where SOs can be found in abundance. The top of Woodfords was basically the opposite. Even aged for the most. Stagnation and canopy competition from huge old JP and P pine had prevented any such multi layering for 200 years or more. Nor was their even close to sufficient water sites for it to be capable of heavier growths in what is mostly a somewhat alluvial granite soil. The duff layers held any seed beds so brush species had also diminished. And wild fire had been halted at small size events.

Compare that to actual preferred habitat of Spots and you find they trend to clear cut regen for both hunting and nesting, mostly in western exposed climates MUCH more moist than woodfords canyon and surrounds with enitrely different species make up of the flora. They are found in conjunction with the grey owl which turns out to BE the cause of fluctuating numbers of spots.


thats in a nutshell but covers the basics.




edit: FYI i have about 20 diff bird books that indicate the coverage of any given specie quite differently. The spotted owl "range" charts certainly arent the exception.
Knotts

Mountain climber
State of Reality
May 20, 2013 - 02:50pm PT
Mr. Crunch,

Gavin was off in his analogy. It was the storm surge due to the high tide that did the destruction from Sandy. Not the rising sea levels due to climate change. Exaggeration at it's best.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
May 20, 2013 - 02:51pm PT

Malemute

Ice climber
the ghost

May 20, 2013 - 02:39pm PT
Ah yes, penguins in the Arctic
and polar bears in the antarctic. When you're an IDEA man like Ron, these are just petty details.






huh?^^^^^^^^^Thats the third mention of such .. I certainly never said polar bears were in the ANTartic.. so wth?
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
May 20, 2013 - 03:04pm PT
Thanks Ron. I've actually had my eye on Horse Thief for a potential groundwater study site. I'll have to get off my ass and head up there soon.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
May 20, 2013 - 03:06pm PT
The canyon itself has water. The units contested were over the top to the east of the horsethief drainage- over looking woodfords canyon proper. There were several stages and units of that sale. It took around four years to complete them all. Most of the lower horsethief canyon proper units were commercial thins with some pre comm here and there.


edit: Side funny note, on one of those Sales, a major theft of decked logs was done, and the investigation led me to one of the hariest LE contacts i ever had to make- in the Woodfords Tribe Colony, along with Alpine Co and CHP with full auto weaponry.. LMAO!
Malemute

Ice climber
the ghost
May 20, 2013 - 03:25pm PT
huh?^^^^^^^^^Thats the third mention of such .. I certainly never said polar bears were in the ANTartic.. so wth?

mixing up penguins & polar bears is a common error among those who prefer gloss over substance ie palin
k-man

Gym climber
SCruz
Topic Author's Reply - May 20, 2013 - 03:26pm PT
The disinformation campaign can only survive for so long. We saw, as in the case of tobacco, there was a similar disinformation campaign decades ago to obscure the science and the scientific link between the use of tobacco products and lung cancer. But eventually the truth of what the science had to say became accepted. There are some positive signs that we are moving in that direction; the rest of the world is moving increasingly towards renewable energy .... We are lagging behind but we are slowly making progress ourselves.

 Michael Mann, director of Penn State University's Earth System Science Center
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
May 20, 2013 - 03:31pm PT
i didnt mix up anything. I was talking about penguins and polar bears.. So i still fail to see the point..

signed ,, cornfuzed in kneevader.
Malemute

Ice climber
the ghost
May 20, 2013 - 04:39pm PT
I certainly never said polar bears were in the ANTartic[sic].. so wth
anyone dumb or ignorant enough to say there are penguins in the arctic is also dumb or ignorant enough to think there are polar bears in antarctica


it's ok for those under 8 years
Knotts

Mountain climber
State of Reality
May 20, 2013 - 04:48pm PT
This is for Mr. Mountainlion concerning his tornado claim. Comes from a very strong proponent of Climate Change periodical.

No one knows whether tornadoes have increased in number or intensity, since the aforementioned changes in reporting practices "make the intensity question harder to answer,'' Brooks said, adding, "If you take the dataset of reports at face value, it appears intensity has decreased over the years, but there are a number of things that have led to lower ratings for the strongest tornadoes.''
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/05/18/climate-change-tornado-intensity_n_3300098.html?ref=topbar



The disinformation campaign can only survive for so long. We saw, as in the case of tobacco, there was a similar disinformation campaign decades ago to obscure the science and the scientific link between the use of tobacco products and lung cancer. But eventually the truth of what the science had to say became accepted. There are some positive signs that we are moving in that direction; the rest of the world is moving increasingly towards renewable energy .... We are lagging behind but we are slowly making progress ourselves.

Michael Mann, director of Penn State University's Earth System Science Center

I thought Mann was a scientist and not a policy decision maker/politician.
wilbeer

Mountain climber
honeoye falls,ny.greeneck alleghenys
May 20, 2013 - 04:57pm PT
Knotts or Rick said,"I am a human on this planet that sees a dire need to consider the plight of the people on this planet today. Not in a hundred or two hundred years. Hundreds if not thousands of Children are dying daily throughout the world of starvation and disease from poor sanitary and food conditions. Many have no homes nor education to speak of. None of this is caused by the climate. It is caused by poverty and lack of concern by the societies of the well off (Amerikans) that are too busy squabbling over the politics of whether or not the planet is warming and how fossil fuels are or are not the cause."


Just to be clearhttp://fec-individuals.findthedata.org/l/4563274/Sumner-Richard

So how many of us alarmists/climbers have done this?
McHale's Navy

Trad climber
Panorama City, California & living in Seattle
May 20, 2013 - 05:05pm PT
I'd feel strange giving somebody money who is already worth 1/4 billion (250 million) dollars and also has money in offshore bank accounts.
Knotts

Mountain climber
State of Reality
May 20, 2013 - 05:09pm PT
Mr. Wilbeer.

Let's clear the latest C02 infested air. I posted that. Not Mr. Sumner. I contributed no moneys to either a political or science organization for their causes or promotions. Politicians and Scientists are one in the same. Take that for what it is worth.

Edit for Mr. Navy.

"I am a human on this planet that sees a dire need to consider the plight of the people on this planet today. Not in a hundred or two hundred years. Hundreds if not thousands of Children are dying daily throughout the world of starvation and disease from poor sanitary and food conditions. Many have no homes nor education to speak of. None of this is caused by the climate. It is caused by poverty and lack of concern by the societies of the well off (Amerikans) that are too busy squabbling over the politics of whether or not the planet is warming and how fossil fuels are or are not the cause."
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