Climate Change skeptics? [ot]

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raymond phule

climber
Aug 1, 2013 - 01:25pm PT

Wrong! You lose.

Correct! You are a bird. (I guess you play the non sequer game)


raymond phule

climber
Aug 1, 2013 - 01:30pm PT
NO, YOU LOSE (not the capitalized letters, I scream higher so you obviously lose).

raymond phule

climber
Aug 1, 2013 - 01:32pm PT

that data you just posted does not apply to this thread. It does not substantiate the game plan

Who believes that records low is not possibly when the climate is warming? What game plan?
Chiloe

Trad climber
Lee, NH
Aug 1, 2013 - 01:55pm PT
Raymond you can't win a moronathon.

But getting back for a second to ancient atmospheres and climates, it might be a good time to mention the faint young sun paradox, that is the mystery of why Earth was warm enough for liquid water in Archean times when the sun was substantially fainter. It's known the answer must involve greenhouse gases, but not known exactly how.

Here's Wikipedia's entry,
The faint young Sun paradox or problem describes the apparent contradiction between observations of liquid water early in the Earth's history and the astrophysical expectation that the Sun's output would be only 70% as intense during that epoch as it is during the modern epoch.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faint_young_Sun_paradox

New research (July 2013) addressing this paradox, from the University of Colorado:
The simplest solution to the faint sun paradox, which duplicates Earth’s present climate, involves maintaining roughly 20,000 parts per million of the greenhouse gas CO2 and 1,000 ppm of methane in the ancient atmosphere some 2.8 billion years ago, said Wolf. While that may seem like a lot compared to today’s 400 ppm of CO2 in the atmosphere, geological studies of ancient soil samples support the idea that CO2 likely could have been that high during that time period. Methane is considered to be at least 20 times more powerful as a greenhouse gas than CO2 and could have played a significant role in warming the early Earth as well, said the CU researchers.
...
Another solution to achieving a habitable but slightly cooler climate under the faint sun conditions is for the Archean atmosphere to have contained roughly 15,000 to 20,000 ppm of CO2 and no methane, said Wolf. “Our results indicate that a weak version of the faint young sun paradox, requiring only that some portion of the planet’s surface maintain liquid water, may be resolved with moderate greenhouse gas inventories,” the authors wrote in Astrobiology.

http://www.colorado.edu/news/releases/2013/07/09/cu-study-shows-how-early-earth-kept-warm-enough-support-life

And here is that Astrobiology article itself, the whole thing:
http://online.liebertpub.com/doi/full/10.1089/ast.2012.0936
k-man

Gym climber
SCruz
Topic Author's Reply - Aug 1, 2013 - 02:09pm PT
I just can't seem to get enough of The Chief and his seemingly infinite wisdom.

Here, I repeat another pearl of his deep thinking:

You want the Govt to start fixing this AGW chaos. Yet your own DEM GOVERNOR is willing to shell out 3-5 BILLION of your tax bucks on a BULLET TRAIN. How much on CLIMATE CHANGE MITIGATION? 1/10th of that. NICE!


But wait a minute... Isn't getting cars off the road one of the planks that we need to implement in order to reform our use of fossil fuels? And, wouldn't mass transit help with reducing car travel?


Hmmmm, The Chief, please explain to me a couple of things:

1) Can a nation change it's energy platform without the aid of the government?

2) Doesn't mass transit help to reduce our dependence on fossil fuels?


I ask you because from your tone of voice, it appears you might know some things. So, I'm depending on you to provide thoughtful and useful answers.
rick sumner

Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
Aug 1, 2013 - 02:26pm PT
And your Buddy Ed posted a paper titled "No climate paradox under the faint early sun" a few days back Chiloe. Seems to have a different conclusion based on studies of sediment mineralogy. Can you guys please get your scientists straightened out, they seem to be all over the board and indeed overboard in this rat infested sinking ship of CAGW.
dirtbag

climber
Aug 1, 2013 - 02:32pm PT
Idiot^^^^^
raymond phule

climber
Aug 1, 2013 - 02:36pm PT

Can you guys please get your scientists straightened out, they seem to be all over the board and indeed overboard in this rat infested sinking ship of CAGW.

The problem is sometimes that climate science is conspiracy where everyone agrees with each other to get funding and different views cant even get published and sometimes is the problem that the scientists cant even agree with each other...
Dr. Christ

Mountain climber
State of Mine
Aug 1, 2013 - 02:48pm PT
HAMWEATHER is now not worthy. Unbelievable.

Who ever said it was not worthy?

You said:

NOAA released last weeks "Record Temperature Events"

And I corrected you... it ain't from NOAA. Try unwinding your panties a bit and learn to read.
Chiloe

Trad climber
Lee, NH
Aug 1, 2013 - 03:08pm PT
Can you guys please get your scientists straightened out, they seem to be all over the board and indeed overboard in this rat infested sinking ship of CAGW.

Rick reliably exhibits a tinfoil-hat comprehension of science. The reality-based community understands science is dynamic by its nature for non-conspiratorial reasons. Frinstance, Ed cites (and Rick tinfoil-hats) a 2010 article in Nature suggesting that low albedo could resolve the faint sun paradox. Since then other scientists have run the numbers and disagreed, as in this NASA group:

We show that, even with the strongest plausible assumptions, reducing cloud and surface albedos falls short by a factor of two of resolving the paradox,” say Goldlatt and Zahnle.

So the paradox is alive and well; and more puzzling than ever. Last year we discovered that a greenhouse effect can’t explain the paradox. Now we know that a lower albedo wouldn’t have done the trick either.

http://www.technologyreview.com/view/424154/faint-young-sun-paradox-not-solved-says-nasa/

We could go farther with this topic though I know that reality can't dent Rick's conspiracy views.
monolith

climber
SF bay area
Aug 1, 2013 - 03:37pm PT
Yep, when the arctic ice is not reachable, the polar bears will just "party" (AndersonSpeak) with the brown bears, like nothing happened.

And the reef fish whose reef degrades and even disappears, well they just "party" in place.

(leaky submarine reply from Anderson in 3....2....1....)
Elcapinyoazz

Social climber
Joshua Tree
Aug 1, 2013 - 03:47pm PT
Huff-n-Chuff, still dumber than dirt I see.

And who determines which scientist they employ?

Well numbnutz, I DO, for one. Hired one this week. Ed does for another. Along with the thousands of other GS supervisors who employ scientists in their agencies.
rick sumner

Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
Aug 1, 2013 - 07:44pm PT
What are the odds that mini Garcia would be here to make his opponents miserable- i've heard something in the neighborhood 10 to the 80th against such a proposition. Yet here you are-intelligent design at or before the big bang-no one can refute one way or another. All you have to do to assure a bright future is convince enough of your friends ,who go on to convince their friends, to ignore or fight the doom and gloom and carry on in your best possible effort. Nature decides our fate as a species not man.
rick sumner

Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
Aug 1, 2013 - 11:03pm PT
Exactly Ed Garcia, don't believe everything you think! The policies you relentlessly push, then repeatedly deny, could well destroy our now fragile world economy and render the planet uninhabitable to the present population.You as an egghead are out of your depth in economics.
monolith

climber
SF bay area
Aug 1, 2013 - 11:12pm PT
Vostok ice core and Greenland temp data are not global average temperature.

They and many other proxy sources are used in the Marcott, Mann and other reconstructions of global average temp.

It's the spike in global average temp that is unprecedented, not the fluctuations of individual points on earth.


http://www.motherjones.com/blue-marble/2013/03/new-hockey-stick-graph-...
http://www.motherjones.com/blue-marble/2013/03/new-hockey-stick-graph-scarier
Credit: monolith
rick sumner

Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
Aug 2, 2013 - 12:05am PT
Yes, if you have done well in this country it is patriotic to give back to the system that allowed it. I certainly do as well Norton. There comes a point though, when you say enough is enough after witnessing decades of the uncontrolled waste of tax dollars. At this point i would rather, and in fact do, give what i can to highly effective people i know can spend judiciously-usually schools-and gladly take the exemption. Aren't you getting a little wound up Norton, this is after all just an internet discussion. Ron's a good guy, what you had to say crossed all reasonable lines.

And Ron, you don't need to stick your neck out to cover my back. It is unnecessary and only leads to you catching flack.
abrams

Sport climber
Aug 2, 2013 - 12:24am PT
Credit: abrams

air pollution and deforestation from overgrazing combined with
world wide sources of vehicle and factory soot would be the smart
target to bring under control rather than CO2.

Don't know how many of you get the dusting duty around your homes but
consider all the worlds glaciers are getting this fallout non stop and each

particle is acting like a little toaster oven that will never stop melting
the ice until its pushed out the toe.



http://juneauempire.com/stories/042408/sta_271769319.shtml




BLUEBLOCR

Social climber
joshua tree
Aug 2, 2013 - 12:53am PT

Aug 1, 2013 - 08:42pm PT
well Ron,

unlike you, I actually review what I post and if I find I said something not intended I take it out.

Since I don't know for sure if Rick is white or not, I reconsidered and deleted that, so fuking what.

You ought to try it sometime, make sure you mean what you say instead of blurting out all your bullsh!t that others here constantly call you "rong" about.

What?

And YOU Ron Anderson who I would guess does not pay a dime in Federal income tax due to your pathetically low pigeon stuffing income have somehow a problem with the fact that I once mentioned, and you bothered to remember, that my wife and I choose to donate extra to the Treasury General Fund every year?

Ah wait, you are jealous of the fact that I have so damn much money I can just give it away to my government, boo!
Really bothers you doesn't?

I do it out of patriotism, it came from a lifetime of working with my brain so go fuk yourself.

And speaking of my patriotism, I wish you were there next to me in the jungle 40 years ago being "patriotic", you miserable low life son of a b!tch

WOW For some the climate never changes
command error

Trad climber
Colorado
Aug 2, 2013 - 01:08am PT
http://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/local/Gobi-Desert-Dust-China-Southern-California-Sierra-Nevada-Owens-Valley-200760831.html

Why are scientists so stupid ignoring pollution you can see and freaking out over invisible carbon dioxide?
Answer: $


BLUEBLOCR

Social climber
joshua tree
Aug 2, 2013 - 01:14am PT
^ U r 2 Burchey

That's even more funnier
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