Climate Change skeptics? [ot]

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Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Jun 27, 2013 - 11:18am PT
So far ,, the WIND thing has been an ugly, wildlife killing, and not so efficient means of power. Geo thermal available only in some areas and the newer plants seem to get half built then go into bankruptcy. Solar power is an alternative yet prohibitively expensive for most of America. Advancements are needed in all the category's to become actually viable to the average joe.
rick sumner

Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
Jun 27, 2013 - 11:47am PT
Yes, what are the profiteers of doom solution for tomorrows power generation needs? Let's hear it boys! All bitching but no solutions.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Jun 27, 2013 - 11:52am PT
It has to be rough when youve so little of those to spare Bruce! AHHHZING!
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Jun 27, 2013 - 12:01pm PT
all that means is I have an EXCUSE...Whats yurs..;=-D
rick sumner

Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
Jun 27, 2013 - 12:11pm PT
The problem Bruce is that your side is systematically attempting to destroy our energy production and usage sector.From a determined effort to deconstruct dams, to multi front attack on petroleum extraction, transport, refinement, to the growing consensus on banning coal,the rejection of nuclear, to limiting personal energy usage. And what do you offer as replacement- let's see- how about solar power plants whose panels are failing long before their life expectancy to 300 foot tall bird slicers and dicers. These technologies are not ready for prime time. So what is the realistic alternative guys?
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Jun 27, 2013 - 12:22pm PT
"There are a number of possible alternatives, including greatly reduced use of fossil fuels through conservation. This is something that can be done immediately. "



Such as Ed? ^^^^^...
Splater

climber
Grey Matter
Jun 27, 2013 - 12:57pm PT
The denialists have obstructed potential solutions for 20 years now.
They are not interested in those solutions or any; otherwise they would propose their own ideas. Their purpose is mainly just to obstruct.

When most people in this country still drive gas hogs, that proves we are just hiding our heads in the tar sand.
The climate is usually but not always mild here in San Diego, but roughly 50% of homes still have single paned windows.

The environmental costs of wind and solar are small compared to nuclear and coal.
But we will need more energy storage.
One method would be to add small dams with pumps just below existing hydro plants. The new small reservoir would catch the water and pump it back to the upper reservoir using off-peak power.
It might be easiest in a small side canyon that is often dry & has little erosion or fish. Or at least design it so the eventual silt can be drained out.
crunch

Social climber
CO
Jun 27, 2013 - 01:19pm PT
Carbon dioxide is a greenhouse gas.

Humans have increased atmospheric CO2 by 30%.

Therefore we humans are warming the atmosphere.

This is an experiment we are conducting, in real time, with uncertain and possibly disastrous results.

https://www2.ucar.edu/climate/faq/how-much-carbon-dioxide-and-other-ki...
https://www2.ucar.edu/climate/faq/how-much-carbon-dioxide-and-other-kinds-greenhouse-gas-already-atmosphere
Credit: crunch

What part of this is unclear?





Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Jun 27, 2013 - 01:37pm PT
oiyyyy another "graph"..


Well since the natural CO2 is fairly much a GUESS, then so is that graph.
monolith

climber
SF bay area
Jun 27, 2013 - 02:01pm PT
Don't worry folks, Anderson isn't convinced that much of the CO2 spike is man-made.

Could be completely natural, Anderson, but you should check to see if monkeys are flying out your butt.

Credit: http://www.skepticalscience.com/graphics.php?g=10
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Jun 27, 2013 - 02:03pm PT
Perfect proof of CO2 doing things all on its own..Its gone up -its gone down. Its gone all around.
monolith

climber
SF bay area
Jun 27, 2013 - 02:05pm PT
Whoa, someone missed the red line. Yep, perfectly natural.

And you wonder why people think you are a complete fool.
raymond phule

climber
Jun 27, 2013 - 02:07pm PT

In the meantime, the worlds economy collapses and chaos erupts to control the worlds oil. Nice.

I thought that you didn't care about the future and didn't want to interact with the future in any way. The man is dommed anyway so why care about a carbon tax?
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Jun 27, 2013 - 02:11pm PT
Mono,, that "graph" is non sense. Jumps from sampler to sampler. But it LOOKS dramatic..

Just like that poor floatin P bear adrift on the tiny chunk of ice propaganda crapola lol! It LOOKED dramatic, yet, the p bear just was doing what they always do.
rick sumner

Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
Jun 27, 2013 - 02:23pm PT
Ok Splater came up with a workable micro solution-good. Ed is spouting the party line-conservation and skyrocketing economy killing energy costs increases to one day get people used to abject poverty and lack of mobility. Great, if you want carbon taxes their is nothing preventing you from doing the calculations of your usage and cutting the state and Fed a check each year. But please, make it painful. And no more venturing forth into the mountains either. It is just not "sustainable".

Ron, Chief and others- i'm sure you guys are aware that Obama wants to fund additional CC research for FY2014 to the tune of 2.7 billion dollars. That will make the CC industrial complex happy.
raymond phule

climber
Jun 27, 2013 - 02:27pm PT
Did I say all that?

A carbon tax is a good way to get the companies and people that release CO2 to pay for it and it makes alternatives better alternativs.

But it is like always ridicilous to read and answer yours and your 2-3 friends on this threads posts because you show your ignorance and lack of knowledge in most of your posts.

There are a lot of research about alternative energy sources going on all over the world and same are at the moment quite good alternatives like on shore wind energy. Other like off shore wind energy need some more years before it is a real alternative.

The main problem is though that the energy is a little more expensive than already working power plants that burn for example coal and because money is everything it is thus not built enough. A carbon tax would result in a more even market.
Gary

Social climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
Jun 27, 2013 - 02:30pm PT
These technologies are not ready for prime time. So what is the realistic alternative guys?

I know! Let's do nothing until oil runs out, then we can scramble for a solution!
raymond phule

climber
Jun 27, 2013 - 02:39pm PT

SO how does "paying" for it, reduce it?

Two ways. A higher price product (electricity, gas, etc) might result in less use of the product. For example people driving less or change to a car with a better milage.

A higher price for a "dirty" product makes the alternatives relatively cheaper.

raymond phule

climber
Jun 27, 2013 - 02:52pm PT

There is that prevailing verbiage. MIGHT!

Ok, I guess that we should do nothing unless 100% of the people is 100% certain that something is true.


Not currently happening.
Do you understand that I wrote something that are completely true?



FF Energy cost have gone up substantially the past ten years. Alternatives are even higher and have increased as well. Your logic has yet to happen the past ten years.
What are you talking about? Wind energy is for example a relatively cheaper alternativ than burning oil if the oil price increase. That is obvious.
monolith

climber
SF bay area
Jun 27, 2013 - 02:53pm PT
Chief, perhaps you missed the purple line. Look closely. The Law Dome ice core gives us CO2 data from 1006ad to 1978.

The Law Dome data dovetails nicely with Vostok and Mauna Loa.

Credit: http://www.skepticalscience.com/graphics.php?g=10

http://www.motherjones.com/blue-marble/2013/03/new-hockey-stick-graph-...
http://www.motherjones.com/blue-marble/2013/03/new-hockey-stick-graph-scarier
Credit: monolith
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