Climate Change skeptics? [ot]

Search
Go

Discussion Topic

Return to Forum List
Post a Reply
Messages 6721 - 6740 of total 25078 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
guyman

Social climber
Moorpark, CA.
May 10, 2013 - 11:32am PT
Ron .... good questions.

+1111
Chiloe

Trad climber
Lee, NH
May 10, 2013 - 12:00pm PT
Anecdotal evidence its still chilly in Greenland count for anything?

Meant the world to unfortunate explorer Philip Goodeve-Docker, obviously. May he RIP.

Regarding climate on the other hand it counts for zilch. Here's a real Greenland climate update by Jason Box:

Greenland “snow drought” makes big 2013 melt more likely

Multiple melt factors combine to increase the odds of more melt water runoff from the ice sheet during the 2013 melt season:
* less ‘cold content’ of snow to melt away (ablate) for a given energy input before bare ice is exposed;
* a longer period of exposed darker bare ice, in this case weeks earlier bare ice exposure is likely unless a big snow dump before or during the coming warm season;
* Less snow leads to a smaller refreezing capacity in the lower accumulation area. Thanks Robert Fausto of GEUS for reminding me of this one.
* a possible higher concentration of light absorbing impurities per unit volume of snow, assuming that the impurities are deposited whether or not it snows.

This pattern results from a persistent atmospheric anomaly, blocking cold air transport southward along west Greenland, producing relatively warm temperatures there while northwestern Europe has had a cold winter (Figure 2).


More at http://www.meltfactor.org/blog/?p=860
wilbeer

Mountain climber
honeoye falls,ny.greeneck alleghenys
May 10, 2013 - 02:22pm PT
Hey Ron, Guyman, help me out here.
You would not believe it anyway,whatever I/We say about how carbon rose or decreased,[i do know],you will refute it or will you.There is a consensus of how that happened,please give us your theory.
I will only refute with web links,and you probably would not want to read that much.
After all there must be 2 or 3 viable theories that you fruitcakes suscribe to.
Post em up,c'mon now
wilbeer

Mountain climber
honeoye falls,ny.greeneck alleghenys
May 10, 2013 - 02:38pm PT
I mean come on man,theres got to be something on shell,exxon,bp's websites to argue this ,Ron,Guyman, even Rick.
rick sumner

Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
May 10, 2013 - 03:20pm PT
The last gasps of the discredited catastrophists. Guys, die with a little dignity would you please.

Dr. F, that is the clearest most concise summation of the CAGW crowd i've ever heard.

Wilbeer you'll never in a million years devise a strategy to deal with me.
dirtbag

climber
May 10, 2013 - 03:27pm PT
Rick, are you in drugs? Seriously.
wilbeer

Mountain climber
honeoye falls,ny.greeneck alleghenys
May 10, 2013 - 03:27pm PT
nice response,just full of science,even you could do better than that,i will give you that much
blahblah

Gym climber
Boulder
May 10, 2013 - 03:31pm PT
They won't die, they'll just move on to the next over-hyped "catastrophe"--including new ones with at least a grain of truth. (And the transition from "global warming" to "climate change" was smooth--even if you don't like those guys, you have to give some credit for rebranding their "catastrophe" and milking it for a few more years.)
Nothing really wrong with "science" per se, just got to watch how much public funds we blow on it; in case anyone hasn't noticed the US isn't exactly rolling in cash these days (well we are, problem is most of it is printed or otherwise created out of thin air, or borrowed). Studying "climate change" is probably a less ridiculous waste of taxpayer money than shooting men to the moon or Mars or wherever else.
wilbeer

Mountain climber
honeoye falls,ny.greeneck alleghenys
May 10, 2013 - 03:42pm PT
Rick you are straying from the issue,i could care less about making a strategy for/about you.Show me some science /theories/hell even opinions about your agenda,i am going to fight you ,thats the way it is.
That does not mean i hate you dude,there is plenty of your kind where i live.
This would be my third bbq.
the Fet

climber
Tu-Tok-A-Nu-La
May 10, 2013 - 03:45pm PT
if you're not part of the solution...
Dingus Milktoast

Gym climber
And every fool knows, a dog needs a home, and...
May 10, 2013 - 03:47pm PT
He's showing you the hook, wilbeer. Don't bite bro, THAT is an effective strategy. He even trolled that arrogant Eh Hartouni ;-)

DMT
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
May 10, 2013 - 04:17pm PT
To put it in my simple mans grasp. The world and Co2 level has changed many times in the past without mans intervention in such. My argument is NOT that we DO indeed have an effect, but rather the significance of that in relation to an always changing planet, and the predictability of the future- especially when considering the amount of time involved for changes to take place. I think much of global warming to be another eco-self supporting industry to be honest. Much like the "mustang" of the great basin which now enjoys all manner of support- completely opposite on common sense.

That ISNT to say reducing emissions of all types isnt a good idea. Obviously, the cleaner the air the better.
wilbeer

Mountain climber
honeoye falls,ny.greeneck alleghenys
May 10, 2013 - 04:36pm PT
monolith,that is awesome!
Paul Martzen

Trad climber
Fresno
May 10, 2013 - 04:39pm PT
A few days ago, Randisi posted this sensible observation.
I discovered long ago that in situations like this you should ask the people you are arguing with if there is anything that could possibly dissuade them from their opinion.

Seems to me that this rule should apply in both directions. Meaning that those studying and concerned about climate change should state what evidence would persuade them that they are mistaken and what types of evidence would not persuade them.

So, I would be persuaded that climate warming is not happening if:
1 New studies from several to many sources showed that a majority of the glaciers in the world were not shrinking or were increasing in volume and were balancing out the recorded decreases in glacier volume. Statements that glaciers are increasing without reference to actual evidence will not persuade me.

2 Temperature data from satellites and world wide ground stations that show average temperatures as decreasing or not increasing. Statements by those not involved in temperature collection that temperature and climate data are flawed do not persuade me.

3 Statements that most climate scientists are corrupt do not persuade me and seem laughable.

4 Lists of scientists who do not believe in global warming do not persuade me any more than lists of scientists who do believe in global warning.

5 Evidence about how the world is changing are most persuasive. Actually, kind of overwhelming and mind boggling. To try and think about what we might be facing and how we can possibly deal with it, is daunting.

Not that climate change denialists are of any importance other than that so many are in congress and running for various government positions. Demonstrates a major weakness in our form of government that we can not rationally deal with such a major issue.






Dingus Milktoast

Gym climber
And every fool knows, a dog needs a home, and...
May 10, 2013 - 04:39pm PT
Dooooooooon't do it!

Its like arguing with.....



about Marconi.

DMT
wilbeer

Mountain climber
honeoye falls,ny.greeneck alleghenys
May 10, 2013 - 04:41pm PT
so right DMT
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
May 10, 2013 - 04:59pm PT
Credit: Ron Anderson
guyman

Social climber
Moorpark, CA.
May 10, 2013 - 05:14pm PT
The earth climate is rising in temp... that is a fact, right now.

It has been much cooler and much warmer in the past... true.

The reason(s) for this - We are not sure.

If you claim to have the ANSWER - well I guess you are just smarter than the average dude.

Paul, good post
Ron, same same...
rick s good
Dr F. I went looking for the best post ever but I reckon you deleted it.
wilbeer

Mountain climber
honeoye falls,ny.greeneck alleghenys
May 10, 2013 - 05:23pm PT
I do not have any answers,i agree with the consensus.
Do you believe in democracy?
Chiloe

Trad climber
Lee, NH
May 11, 2013 - 06:47am PT
Writing about that numerical milestone, 400ppm, that we reached just this week (for the first time in several million years), Bad Astronomer Phil Plait again tells in simple terms why it matters.

It may be arbitrary, but it is still a stark reminder of many things, none of them good:
* CO2 levels are rising, and they’re rising far faster than any time in human history (and at least for the past 11,000 years).
* CO2 is for real and for sure tied to rising heat content of the Earth. For quite some time that heat has been going into the air, and we’ve seen rising temperatures around the world. At the moment, a lot of that heat is going into warming the oceans, but climatologists expect to see air temperatures increasing rapidly again soon.
* This has direct impacts, like increased temperatures in the air and water, melting ice, and more severe weather. It also has indirect impacts, like fluctuating weather patterns. This makes it difficult to tag any freak storm to climate change, but it does mean that over time, we’ll see more and more. Worse droughts and floods, more forest fires, increased ocean acidification, and more are all expected due to increased carbon dioxide in the air.
* All this is happening on a timescale hugely accelerated over natural cycles. The Earth tends to changes over millions of years; we’re doing this to it in just a century. Without time to adapt, this will have a profound impact on life around the globe.

The simple truth is this: More carbon dioxide is in the air than there has been for millions of years. The world is warming up, and it’s due to human influence. If we do nothing it’ll continue to rise, and even if we get our act together it’ll get worse before it gets better.




More at http://www.slate.com/blogs/bad_astronomy/2013/05/11/atmospheric_carbon_dioxide_levels_at_all_time_high_for_past_several_million.html
Messages 6721 - 6740 of total 25078 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
Return to Forum List
Post a Reply
 
Our Guidebooks
Check 'em out!
SuperTopo Guidebooks


Try a free sample topo!

 
SuperTopo on the Web

Review Categories
Recent Route Beta
Recent Gear Reviews