Climate Change skeptics? [ot]


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Trad climber
Lee, NH
Sep 11, 2013 - 08:24am PT
So Norton, you're saying it is sort of like that blogger Cook and his thoroughly debunked 97.1% consensus?

Since Rick Sumner is recycling some of his old claims, I'll recycle a response from the last time he said this.

(Ed H) "debunked" you mean attacked on the blogs...

(Chiloe) Yah, Rick has swallowed those "strenuous blog attacks" I mentioned. That's his way of knowing.

In the real world, no one has come close to showing that Cook et al. are wrong -- probably because they are not. Think they are? It would not be that hard to mount your own counter-study, which none of those blog critics has yet tried.

The ultra-simple approach I mentioned, just scan contents & abstracts of any relevant journal (you choose!) will lead to a similar conclusion. Because it is true, most scientists who study the matter agree that greenhouse gas buildup is changing the atmosphere and hence thermal properties of the planet, with uncertain results that we probably won't like.

Whereas the "Oregon petition" that Rick believes in really has been debunked, the Cook et al. paper has not despite strenuous efforts on the blogs. One problem with debunking Cook seems to be that their conclusion is basically correct, supported by independent lines of evidence. For a real simple do-it-yourself example, see my suggestion above.

What kind of published scientists have their own blogs anyway?

Increasingly many. Picking just a few examples from Rick's own 2.9 percent:
Roy Spencer
Roger Pielke Jr.
Roger Pielke Sr.
Judith Curry
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Sep 11, 2013 - 09:00am PT
Cold here this am ED..Cloudy and cold.

As For Rick, hes on his way -back up North Today.. Hes leavin~~on a jet plane~~dont know when he'll be back again...

The great basin summer was a short and cool one. Only 1.5 weeks of hot weather.
The Chief

From the Land of the Mongols
Sep 11, 2013 - 09:03am PT
The dancing begins. Gotta love it BRUCKY.

Einstein was Jewish, which is why the people of Israel asked him once to become Israel's second president. Also, Einstein felt uncomfortable with the idea that the Jews are God's favored People.

"For me the Jewish religion like all others is an incarnation of the most childish superstitions. And the Jewish people to whom I gladly belong and with whose mentality I have a deep affinity have no different quality for me than all other people. As far as my experience goes, they are no better than other human groups, although they are protected from the worst cancers by a lack of power. Otherwise, I cannot see anything 'chosen' about them", said Einstein.

Although, neither Einstein nor his parents were religious people, he did in fact attend the Catholic primary school. But at the age of 12 he was already questioning the truth of the stories written in the Bible. "The consequence was a positively fanatic orgy of freethinking coupled with the impression that youth is being deceived by the state through lies; it was a crushing impression", Einstein wrote

Twist it all ya want Boys. Something you all are good at.

Now, twist this one.

"Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind."
Albert Einstein


The Chief, you couldn't follow the simplest of the physical arguments you illustrious list above contributed to science... once again, your reading some bedtime story written by one of your wacko blogs

Oh please ED, or any other of you Scientism fanatics, disprove that the above individual scientists DID believe in the fantasy of Creationism nor the existence of a GOD.

Please do that.

Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
Sep 11, 2013 - 09:11am PT
If there's nothing humans can do to roll back the calamity, you may as well be discussing how many angels can sit atop a needle.

Mountain climber
La Mancha
Sep 11, 2013 - 09:12am PT
"Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind."

This is what Albert Einstein wrote in his letter to philosopher Eric Gutkind, in response to his receiving the book "Choose Life: The Biblical Call to Revolt". The letter was written on January 3, 1954, in German, and explains Einstein's personal beliefs regarding religion and the Jewish people.

The letter states pretty clearly that Einstein was by no means a religious person - in fact, the great physicist saw religion as no more than a "childish superstition". "The word god is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, the Bible a collection of honorable, but still primitive legends which are nevertheless pretty childish. No interpretation no matter how subtle can (for me) change this", Einstein wrote.

And from wiki:

On 22 March 1954 Einstein received a letter from Joseph Dispentiere, an Italian immigrant who had worked as an experimental machinist in New Jersey. Dispentiere had declared himself an atheist and was disappointed by a news report which had cast Einstein as conventionally religious. Einstein replied on 24 March 1954:

It was, of course, a lie what you read about my religious convictions, a lie which is being systematically repeated. I do not believe in a personal God and I have never denied this but have expressed it clearly. If something is in me which can be called religious then it is the unbounded admiration for the structure of the world so far as our science can reveal it.


Trad climber
Greeley Hill
Sep 11, 2013 - 09:17am PT
Yip yip yip!
The Chief

From the Land of the Mongols
Sep 11, 2013 - 09:20am PT
Einstein's personal beliefs regarding religion and the Jewish people.

That says absolutely NOTHING regarding his belief in a GOD.

Once again, you all equate "religion" with ones belief in a God.

Twist it up boys. Twist it up.

I do not expect any of you to eeeeeeeven come close to understanding that concept.
The Chief

From the Land of the Mongols
Sep 11, 2013 - 09:22am PT
his particular beliefs in religion...


Not religion EDH.


Two completely separate entities.

we have control over...

You and I have absolutely NO control over shet. There lies another fantasy on your part.

Social climber
Albuquerque, NM
Sep 11, 2013 - 09:23am PT
Hey Ed...

What's on the front burner at the DOE regarding renewables?
The Chief

From the Land of the Mongols
Sep 11, 2013 - 09:32am PT
No EDh.

It is in response to BRUCEKY and the rest attempting to discredit DR. Spencer for his beliefs in God and Creationism.

Something you all are soooo good at repeatedly doing.

Total bias to say the least.

Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
Sep 11, 2013 - 09:46am PT
Dr Hartouni writes:

"Chaz... you forgot about the parts of the climate change that we humans are causing, that part we have control over, it's our choice to do so... and whether of not we do anything, we can estimate the consequences of our actions."

So what do we DO?

It's hard to join on with the "do something" crowd, when we don't know what doing something means.

And how do you propose getting the people who want to do nothing to do something? They get a vote, too.
The Chief

From the Land of the Mongols
Sep 11, 2013 - 09:48am PT
my criticism of Spencer is based on the science he's published

Of course ED. "His" science does not go in line with the science that aligns with your belief in how the CC science should be. Especially since he is the designer and implementer of he modeling process that you all distort to your advantage.

Both he and Dr. Christy are the fathers of the CC Models and their process.

NASA seems to think different than you EDH and the rest here. Had they not, neither would have been awarded the NASA Exceptional Scientific Achievement Medal (1991) nor would they continue to seek their expertise in the CC Science research field and continue to fund and accept/acknowledge their research as good science.


Social climber
Joshua Tree
Sep 11, 2013 - 09:52am PT
I get especially tickled at the free-marketeer libertarian/austrian clowns like the Blah one, and the "only the free market profit motive can lead us" bile as they post on...oh, the irony of it all, the internet.

Yes, the internet, a product of public sector money far and wide...DARPA, various public Universities, govt grants, etc.

Mountain climber
La Mancha
Sep 11, 2013 - 10:06am PT
Apparently reading is not something you are particulary proficient at:

"The word god is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses..."
The Chief

From the Land of the Mongols
Sep 11, 2013 - 10:27am PT

"the doctrine of a personal God interfering with natural events could never be refuted, in the real sense, by science"

"About God, I cannot accept any concept based on the authority of the Church... As long as I can remember. I have resented mass indoctrination. I cannot prove to you there is no personal God, but if I were to speak of him, I would be a liar. I do not believe in the God of theology who rewards good and punishes evil. His universe is not ruled by wishful thinking, but by immutable laws".
A. Einstein

Exactly based on the misreprentation that God and human conceived religion are one in the same.

They are not according to Einstein.

States nothing to the effect that a "personal GOD" as Einstein describes it, does not exist. Nothing.

Dingus Milktoast

Gym climber
And every fool knows, a dog needs a home, and...
Sep 11, 2013 - 10:50am PT
Quoting decades-old Einstein statements about an impersonal god (read: physics) out of context in a thread on human caused climate change = LOL.

Einstein would find the science compelling. He would LOL at those for whom proper credentials are vetted as 'believe, or disbelieve?'

I know this - Einstein is no god, on earth nor in heaven.


Trad climber
Portland, Or
Sep 11, 2013 - 10:59am PT
The Chief should start his own blog and sell ads. I have some obvious suggestions on what might appeal to his followers.

But for now, have to keep working so I can contribute to his pension. Socialism, I say!!
The Chief

From the Land of the Mongols
Sep 11, 2013 - 11:03am PT
such errors are not to be tolerated... I do no longer believe them worth of that trust.

According to who?? You and your opinion?

NASA doesn't seem to think so. They continue to stand behind them both and continue to fund their research.

Are you now EDH going to state unequivocally that all the GCC scientist that are in line with AGW, MANN, SCHNEIDER, HANSEN etal have NEVER been wrong or without scientific fault??

But for now, have to keep working so I can contribute to his pension.

Yur welcome.

Trad climber
Western America
Sep 11, 2013 - 11:30am PT
“Warmists Admit: ‘We can’t say climate change caused the civil war’ in Syria.

(but they would like to and direct attention away from the fact that
muslims over there go bat shyt crazy when they presume their religion
has given them the green light to go on a murder spree.)

next up

Terrifying flat global temperature crisis
threatens to disrupt IPCC agenda

The Chief

From the Land of the Mongols
Sep 11, 2013 - 11:36am PT
Reputation is easily lost and hard to regain... 1991 capped a good run for those fellows you so revere, they didn't do so well after that, and instead of working to regain their scientific reputations they decided that their political reputations were more important. That's their choice...

Please then explain why NASA continues to support them both and their work in Climate Science research without any lapse of funding.

Also, why the NOAA does the same.

With that said ED, your posts are clearly indicating your obvious "bias" opinion in this matter which are clearly different than the two govt agencies that are spearheading the US research in GCC.

Oh yeah, the DOE, your employer EDH btw, also supports their work with funding.

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