Climate Change skeptics? [ot]

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Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Aug 5, 2013 - 01:43am PT
No i make no pretense,Bruce, but i CAN read the "other sides" as well as the CC sides. I gleam what i can.
I did that concerning crud like the spotted owls, penguins , reef fish, polar bears, and fires. WUN HUNERT purcint beuuulllchips.





The Chief

climber
From the Land of the Mongols
Aug 5, 2013 - 01:53am PT
BRUCE:

Have you ever contemplated that some of us actually come from a location where the streets have no names and wish to keep it that way.

Shet Happens Bruce, ED, Chiloe etal. It has since the beginning of time and even before then. Get used to it. Cus it's gonna keep happening. Regardless what your science says.
rick sumner

Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
Aug 5, 2013 - 01:54am PT
Thanks Blublocker. I checked my email but haven't received anything from you yet. I still have 6 books left out of my 10 book commitment so anyone else that wants to read an excellent presentation from somebody that's been on the other side feel free to pm me.

Look Ed, I wrote that post from memory in 15 minutes before I went to an open house-very good day I might add as it looks like at least we have 2 houses sold. I literally have a 2 foot pile of papers, most peer reviewed and some not, that I've downloaded and read at night. I'm not going to spend my night looking for the paper on a new treatment for the physical qualities of CO2. My wife is already complaining that I read these stupid papers until I fall asleep and don't pay enough attention to her. I think it was by a mathematician by the name of Johnson.

Anyway guys, people like Ed are very intelligent and see the world in depth at minute levels but they can't see the forest for the trees. They just lack smarts in other departments and incorrectly assume since they are surrounded by like minded people that they know all, see all, and the rest of the populace are blind idiots. Well, they're not and the range of intelligence of normal human beings is smaller than imagined. Different peoples intelligence are just manifested in different ways. Ed and Chiloe are undoubtedly good guys and mean well but they just don't get that the game is up and they are beating a dead horse for miles it can never again give. Anyway that's my take.
Bruce Kay

Gym climber
BC
Aug 5, 2013 - 02:21am PT
BRUCE:

Have you ever contemplated that some of us actually come from a location where the streets have no names and wish to keep it that way.

Contemplated? Hell I have concluded that about you ages ago.

Furthermore, I think that explains exactly your position on this subject.

However what it has absolutely no bearing on is the ability to understand Climate science, which is what this thread is about.

Which you could care less about as you have indicated all along.........


































You are one fuked up individual
BLUEBLOCR

Social climber
joshua tree
Aug 5, 2013 - 03:39am PT
Bruce
All right you caught me with my pants down, I jus wanted a free book.
But I did think that he pointed to some holes in the ozone hole conspiracy. lOL

But realiisticly I believe there can be more contributors to global warming than jus the burning of fuels. Like, the average air temperature going into an engine is 75 deg. and the exit temp. is
over 110. And the engine runs at around 160 deg. So without having any scientific credentials
I would still say these two functions are heating up the atmosphere, thus the waters of the oceans. And all the "things" that man has created that sit on top of the earths surface that act like radiant heaters. IE cars, trains, buildings, etc. these all store heat from the suns rays and radiat it back through the earth. Then there's water. The world has a finite amount of fresh water. What has man done with that? For one, since 1800 mans population went from 1bill to 7bill. Man is 3/4 water. That's a lot of water that is no longer in the earths system acting as a coolant. Instead it's in a mans body at 98deg. Another heater. Then there's all the other billions and billions of gallons were keeping separated from the ground in our toilets, and pipes, and swimming pools, etc. all warming! We're doing a lot of things that warm the planet. That's all I'm Say'in
BLUEBLOCR

Social climber
joshua tree
Aug 5, 2013 - 03:59am PT

The jet stream is wobbling because of the decrease in the temperature gradient between the North Pole and the equator.

This is another one. This could be caused by the recent huge sun flare activity we've been having. And the fact that we've (the earth) has been closer to the sun for the last 7 yrs than in a long tIme. Now we're moving away.

The climate is VERY sensitive and will continue to change. Everyday!

Let's continue to understand it and try to make provisions to keep it stable!

Cheers!!
Dingus Milktoast

Gym climber
And every fool knows, a dog needs a home, and...
Aug 5, 2013 - 09:04am PT
het Happens Bruce, ED, Chiloe etal. It has since the beginning of time and even before then. Get used to it. Cus it's gonna keep happening. Regardless what your science says.

Good news!!!1111 Their science says shits gonna happen, too!

group hug!!!

DMT
The Chief

climber
From the Land of the Mongols
Aug 5, 2013 - 09:23am PT
Their science says shits gonna happen..

Their sh#t is not of any validity as it is not real. Only of human concepts and perceptions. Nope. Not gonna really happen. Only in their minds of fatalistic conceptualization as you believe it to happen. Reality Dingus. Reality. Oh it might get warm. But it is not due to your Sportsmobile and the powerplant that powered the electricity in your suburbia domicile. Nope. It is getting warm as it has millions of times before your human brothers and sisters ever showed up and demanded electricity in order to type bullshet propaganda on their keyboards.

RILEY, you are on the same sinking dingy as DRF etal. One bigass AGW bitch about everything utopian socialist that would embrace communism and the gov't wiping yours and the entire societies ass daily, in a heartbeat. Thank god there are fundamental Rednecks still around that will not tolerate nor allow that to ever occur within our borders.

Life on planet earth is as it all should be. Get used to it. Cus you all are gonna die. That is not a model. It is reality.
wilbeer

Mountain climber
honeoye falls,ny.greeneck alleghenys
Aug 5, 2013 - 09:23am PT
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/02/opinion/a-republican-case-for-climate-action.html?_r=1&

As demonstrated on this thread ,you, all about myself,Faux Libertarians are going to have a hard time with the word "Consensus".
Let alone winning a future election.

You should be CC deniers,for you are evolving yourselves to extinction.


3%.
The Chief

climber
From the Land of the Mongols
Aug 5, 2013 - 09:27am PT
"Consensus".

What fking consensus. Oh yeah, the 67% of the 37% submitted peer rev'd AGW papers that had an opinion about GCC. Got it.

The ONLY "consensus" you all have is within your fatalistic Utopian minds. Move deeper into them Vermont woods WILBEER. Cus the drones are a coming to get you.

You should be CC deniers,for you are evolving yourselves to extinction.

Yup. That is why the KEYSTONE PIPELINE is a GO. Got it WILLBEER. A BIGASS GO! That reality is gonna make me some big bucks. Yeah!

Let alone winning a future election.

As far as elections go, that too is a flat out joke. Congress is a joke of all jokes. 10% approval. Nice. And Obama is seriously turning into a sell out for sure. BTW, Obama approves of the KEYSTONE PIPELINE. Ha!
wilbeer

Mountain climber
honeoye falls,ny.greeneck alleghenys
Aug 5, 2013 - 09:36am PT
yeah chef,misinformation,i did not get it.


"Fundamental Redneck",that will get you somewhere.I think we are going to have a season up here for those.

Caught some nice truly native brookies lately?
The Chief

climber
From the Land of the Mongols
Aug 5, 2013 - 09:38am PT
Get me somewhere? WILLBEER. It is and has been already here. Wake the fk up. Come outta them woods and taste reality dude.


Caught some nice truly native brookies lately?

Funny you ask.... I've caught a buttload of NATIVE Piaute Cut's AND Golden's. Thank you very much.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Aug 5, 2013 - 09:49am PT
The IPCC 2007 Climate Forecast for this Century:
CO2 (the most important gas) has risen from 280 ppm to 379 since pre-industrial times and its growth seems to be accelerating. Whether it does or not is the basis for 7 assumptions about future temperatures.
Temperature increase. For the next 2 decades, 0.2 deg. C (0.4 F) temperature rise per decade, slightly higher later in most models. The models are all different and respond differently to different assumptions. For the end of this century, IPCC provides 7 best estimates (for 7 assumptions) ranging from 0.6 - 4.0 C (1.1-7.2 F). Warming is likely to lie in the range 2-4.5 deg. C (3.6-8.1 F), with a most likely value of about 3 deg. C (5.4 F). Since the 1800s the temperature has risen 0.76 deg.C (1.4 F). The warming is to be greater on land, in high northern latitudes.
Sea level rise. For 6 sets of assumptions, the mid-points are about 0.3 meters ( 1 ft.) Since 1850 sea level has risen about 200 mm (9 in.), a little less than 2 mm/yr. More recently the rate appears to be 3.1 mm/yr, now measured by altimetry satellites. (However, we learned on 22 June 2007 that the data were manipulated to achieve this!!). In a 2009-published study, the authors used GPS measurement to correct for local vertical movement of the Earth at key tide gages, finding a "global rate of geocentric sea level rise of 1.61 0.19mm/yr over the past century" with no acceleration.
Other attributes. Ocean acidity should rise with reduced ph units of 0.14 to 0.35; hurricanes become more intense, perhaps less numerous; heat waves and heavy precipitation more frequent; less sea ice and snow cover; higher westerly winds in mid-latitudes; more precipitation in high latitudes, less in sub-tropics inland areas.



read more at: http://www.climatecooling.org/
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Aug 5, 2013 - 10:06am PT
The IPCC Projections do not Comport with Reality
CO2 has usually been associated with temperature rise throughout the history of the Earth. It is indeed a greenhouse gas but it operates on a logarithmic function. The Earth's natural processes also contribute, and remove, copious amounts of CO2. Since plants first appeared on the Earth, they have converted nearly all available CO2 to oxygen, fossil fuels, and other longterm removals from the atmosphere. Today less than 4/100 of 1% (379 ppm) of our atmosphere is CO2. This pales in comparison with other periods in Earth's history. Common IPCC scenarios rely on an increasing supply of fossil fuels, yet we know that this is not possible and that production will soon peak (if not already) while prices will continue to rise. It is absolutely unrealistic to think CO2 emissions will rise for the duration of this century.
The projected temperature rise is unrealistic, given that the USA and global temperatures have risen by only 1 deg F (.5 C) in 100 years (revised, NOAA, 1 May 2007 ), (or 150 years using the full instrumented data set) during the height of industrial expansion. Even if all this rise is correct, and is attributable to human causes, it is a trivial amount in the natural variation of the Earth, and to suggest the rise would accelerate 5 fold (IPCC best estimate) in this century is incredible. Even after the release of the new data set and procedures by NOAA on May 1, which addressed some of the urban heat island issues and dropped the warming 44% (below IPCC 2007), significant other urban heat island issues still remain. There are also issues of calibration as measurement protocols have changed, issues about the design and placement of the temperature stations, and even the strongly held view by many skeptics that this is a natural rise as the Earth recovers from the Little Ice Age (circa 1500-1900).
Sea level rise may have increased recently, but other studies have consistently shown no increase. Even if there is an increase, it is in the order of 1 mm per year on top of the 1-2 mm per year that has been happening for the last century, this additional amount is 4 inches (10 cm) over the century. This is not trivial if you are in a low-lying region wrestling with land subsidence, but it is barely more than what would be coming anyway.
The other forecasts, such as for hurricanes, rainfall, and snow cover, are not significantly different than under natural variability, and will advance more slowly than the decadal oscillations. In particular, if ocean acidity were a problem for shell formation, it would have shown up already in areas where there are naturally high levels of CO2. It has not. Further, the lead hurricane expert for IPCC, Chris Landsea, resigned over the misrepresentation of data by IPCC
Dr. Christ

Mountain climber
State of Mine
Aug 5, 2013 - 11:12am PT
I built a fence, a deck, a climbing wall, and some other things around the house. I know for a fact someone who builds for a living could have done a better job and in less time. But I enjoyed the process and learned some things along the way. I also ask the honest opinion of every builder who sees my work so I can make potential improvements on my next project. It must suck to live in a world where your weak little ego can't handle being set straight by experts.
The Chief

climber
From the Land of the Mongols
Aug 5, 2013 - 11:52am PT
I also ask the honest opinion of every builder who sees my work so I can make potential improvements on my next project. It must suck to live in a world where your weak little ego can't handle being set straight by experts.

Must REALLY suck to have to seek the APPROVAL of others in all ones daily affairs. Now we know the truth about ya DRCHRISTYOUNGn.

BTW, EXPERTS are not infallible. There is always someone bigger & badder around the block to topple the 'EXPERT'.
Bruce Kay

Gym climber
BC
Aug 5, 2013 - 12:08pm PT
Blue blocker - Compare if you will the recent arguments of Ed and Rick. Eds one above concisely, rationally and with detail deconstructs Ricks notions and his ability or lack there of and he rebuts in much the same manner. It is an argument which invites the same from Rick. It practically begs for a challenge by presenting clear and concise observation and explanation which is a requirement of any civil debate.

Rick could chose to equally rationalize his position and the flaws in Ed's as well but he dosn't, which leaves us to speculate - quite reasonably I might add- that he can't.

Instead he pontificates, speculates, opines all with some fairly over the top hyperbole and as we all know a very poor personal grasp on the technicalities of the subject. It emphasizes grandiose rhetoric and assertion with no invitation to challenge. It avoids the vulnerability of challenge and is by definition intellectually cowardly. This is fact. No one can dispute this despite all the spectacular flourishing of technical language that Rick engages in. He is a charletan and an impostor whenever he claims his ability to parse the science. There is no logical reason at this point for anyone to waste time on his personal assertions of science.

His default - which is the only rational default of 99.9% of us - is to rely on expert opinion. We only ask him to defend his choice of expert opinion which requires an examination of his processes of judgement and reasoning which as I have pointed out before he literally refuses to do.

So once again, What exactly did you find outstanding about Ricks long winded same old especially when compared to that of Ed's?



Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Aug 5, 2013 - 12:09pm PT
Ed i dont think anyone questions your abilities, just the allegiance.
dirtbag

climber
Aug 5, 2013 - 12:14pm PT
^^^^only tin foil hat idiots do, rong^^^^^
dirtbag

climber
Aug 5, 2013 - 12:17pm PT
Your idea of a credible source is a John birch society opinion piece.


Hahahahahahaha.


I'm laughing at you.
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