Discussion Topic |
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RDB
Trad climber
Iss WA
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Topic Author's Original Post - Jan 18, 2009 - 01:00am PT
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Didn't ya just love those Galibiers, Trappeurs, Haderers and the rest?
Stole this pictures from the other boot thread. Got any more of old leather beaters?
Looks like Trappeur dbls in the back and Trappeur Devouassoux up front with the covered laces? By '77 everything I used was covered by a supergator.
The MAN, Ricardo Cassin and real boots!
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Tarbuster
climber
right here, right now
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Jan 18, 2009 - 10:29am PT
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We were looking at a 1977 issue of Off Belay last night;
They did a section on ski mountaineering boots and bindings.
Talk about big and heavy, leather plastic or otherwise...
Steve W has the issue.
If it is still at BrassNuts/Crimpergirl's house maybe we can scan something up.
The Galiber Superguide, by contrast to most, was relatively svelte:
(Goat Rocks beneath Mount Adams, WA 1976)
The Lowa Scouts were cute, 'wish I still had a pair:
(Summit after booting up S Face of Clyde Minaret, CA 1980)
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RDB
Trad climber
Iss WA
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Topic Author's Reply - Jan 18, 2009 - 11:02pm PT
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Not leather but big!
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Ghost
climber
A long way from where I started
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Jan 18, 2009 - 11:23pm PT
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Trappeur doubles under those gaiters! I still have them (haven't worn them for a few decades, though).
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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Jan 18, 2009 - 11:43pm PT
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My first boots were a pair of Galibier Terray's. Sort of the old school equivilent to Trangos.
Had the name of the guy that made them stitched into the label.
I went thru about eight sets of soles on those boots (mostly doing the resole jobs myself)and then turned them into home made telemark ski boots till one final crash finaly destroyed them seperating the sole from the upper.
They don't make 'em like they used to.
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Tarbuster
climber
right here, right now
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Jan 19, 2009 - 12:30am PT
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Alternate title for the thread:
"Heavy Leather" ...
(any resemblance to an album by Weather Report is purely coincidental)
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RDB
Trad climber
Iss WA
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Topic Author's Reply - Jan 19, 2009 - 01:22am PT
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Ray Brooks photo
Springs of 1976, Alaska, not really what I had intended but left to right under the fancy new Supergators...Galibier Makalu, Haderer single, Handerer single, Trappeur Devouassoux.
My own leather mtn boots were like old friends. You?
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Tarbuster
climber
right here, right now
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Jan 26, 2009 - 08:26pm PT
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Should have treated them like friends...
My Lowa Scouts I wound up beating up working tree service.
My Supeguides, I sold to Steve Massioli after converting to Koflachs.
Here's Paul Sibley, in a pair of Mollitor, somewhere in Rocky Mountain national Park.
(Chiloe's foto)
He had 2 pair: tight fit pair for rock and a larger pair for extra socks and ice.
I had the extra pair on "toy loan" for some time.
Paul gets back from guiding Ellingwood Arete in the Crestones:
"Man, I wore my Mollie's and they were killing my feet"
Ha!
I felt bad, so I treated HIM like a friend and reminded him that I had the larger pair and gave them back ....
Cripes, I shuda just hung on to them!
Here's Paul later on, with a prototype LOWA ski mountaineering/ice climbing boot, I think called the QUANTUM:
(we are both sort of boot geeks)
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Sir loin of leisure...
Trad climber
X
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Jan 26, 2009 - 08:27pm PT
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I have small feet, so I don't much like this thread...
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Tarbuster
climber
right here, right now
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Jan 26, 2009 - 08:29pm PT
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Summit of Mount Adams in my Superguides, 1976:
(check the 75 cm axe)
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Reilly
Mountain climber
Monrovia, CA
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Jan 27, 2009 - 12:06am PT
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E Ridge Bug Spire BITD
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RDB
Trad climber
Iss WA
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Topic Author's Reply - Jan 27, 2009 - 12:59am PT
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Raichle "Zinal", Mt. Temple, Canadian Rockies, 1973.
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jbar
Ice climber
Russia with love.
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Jan 27, 2009 - 02:19am PT
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A little solo with my scarpas last week. They're really old but I LUV my scarpas! Just got a pair of la sportiva cirques as a gift but I'd rather wear my scarpas. Even try to wear them to the gym when somebody drags me there.
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RDB
Trad climber
Iss WA
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Topic Author's Reply - Jan 28, 2009 - 11:47pm PT
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Leather boots are so cool!
Trappeur TD Sup on the left, Haderer Tauern single in the middle and a pair of awesome Lowa's on right.
And one of the best bottles of '76 Georges Duboeuf Beaujolais Villages ever uncorked:)
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Jan 28, 2009 - 11:57pm PT
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hey there guys... say, nice post/thread, ... say, i always wondered abou the "old boots vs new shoes" stuff....
as--those old timers, sure did climb....
*say, i saw those pics of the first el cap decent... long time back... those were surely not "now-a-day" shoes/boots etc...
yet, after used to such modern day shoes, it sounds like it'd not be good to take-off climbing with "something not tried and proved" even though it worked for someone else, right?
thanks for any shares, as to this... just curious...
(kind of like a dancer and their shoes, etc... and a skater, and their skates..)
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survival
Big Wall climber
A Token of My Extreme
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Jan 29, 2009 - 11:00am PT
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Must add story......
I have a pair of Galibier Makalu that are nearly mint, with one tiny exception.
*I wore them into the Chugach Mts one day for a minor mixed ground solo. Got home and pulled the liners to dry.
*Wife put on liners to go outside and do some chore in the snow.
*Left liners on porch because they now had snow on them.
*Stray dog shows up and leaves with one liner for a chew snack.
* I now have a really bitchin' pair of classics with ONE LINER!!!!
* What are the best liners I can get as replacements, and where??
Thanks,
Bruce
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RDB
Trad climber
Iss WA
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Topic Author's Reply - Jan 29, 2009 - 12:48pm PT
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Hey Bruce,
Funny but not so funny :)
What size are your boots?
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survival
Big Wall climber
A Token of My Extreme
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Jan 29, 2009 - 04:13pm PT
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Dane,
9 or 9 1/2 I think. I'll check.
Thanks,
Bruce
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Reilly
Mountain climber
Monrovia, CA
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Feb 12, 2009 - 02:31am PT
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Dane,
Here's a rare set for ya! They don't get much older or bigger! These are custom Russkies with attached 'Slooper Gaiters'. Boy, you didn't wanna be downwind of these bad boys! This was on the Kahiltna when I was their 'chaperone' in '77.
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RDB
Social climber
way out there
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Topic Author's Reply - May 7, 2009 - 11:22pm PT
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I had missed this one. From Luca Signorelli in the Chouinard catalog thread.
(from L to R): Giancarlo Grassi, Renato Casarotto and (sitting on the wall) Gianni Comino. The date of the picture is 21 july 1978, and the place is the terrace of the Monzino hut. The glacier on the background is the Freney. They had just opened yet another route on the Brenva side.
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RDB
Social climber
way out there
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Topic Author's Reply - May 7, 2009 - 11:39pm PT
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Some fun stuff I have seen recently.
How about a almost new pair of size 11 Super Guides?
Or a pair of brand new Super guides? $400 plus shipping and insurance from France. Should be easy enough!!
Or new pair of Makalu
Hardware extra :)
Always interesting to know some weights and make soem comparisons to modern boots.
Newest Sportiva Evo Nepal is 2lb 10.4 oz per boot
Galibier Super Guide in the same 45 size 2lb 15 oz per boot
Super Guides give a lot more ankle support and flex a bit under the toe in my size. Easy to rock climb in and a small volume boot. Pull that old heavy and clunky Makalu rubber sole and add a new lwt Vibram similar to what Sportiva is doing and I suspect the Super Guide weight would easily drop below 2.5 lbs.
Nepals are fexible in the ankle in comparison and not a hint of flex in the sole. Ok to rock climb in and a much higher volume (read warmer) boot.
So much for the BIG boot "of yesterday". The current boots are pleanty BIG as well.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
Monrovia, CA
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I preferred Peutereys for rock climbing- a little lower so gave you a little more 'smearing' ability.
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RDB
Social climber
way out there
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Topic Author's Reply - May 8, 2009 - 12:53am PT
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Yep, the Galibier Peuterey, pretty much what every modern technical boot out has copied for ankle flex and sole stiffness. Some even softer now. Nepal isn't much stiffer just a good bit higher. Peuterey was the rock boot, the Super Guide the ice boot. Remember the Walker? Peutereys really with a slightly higher cuff and a sew on leather gaiter?
Richard Pontvert had mtn boots figurd out and a model for every style of climbing in the Alps.
I still like how stiff the ankle is on the Super guide. Only thing I have seen that is close these dasy is the Spantik. That kind of support makes a decent ski boot :)
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Reilly
Mountain climber
Monrovia, CA
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I think I have some pics of us climbing Washboards at Peshashtin in our Galibiers - Yee ha!
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RDB
Social climber
way out there
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Topic Author's Reply - May 8, 2009 - 02:21am PT
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Don't be teasing me Reilly. I've done Washboards in Galibier boots but they were a pair of rock shoes.
Let's see those pictures!
a slick 5.10....in 1960.
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RDB
Social climber
way out there
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Topic Author's Reply - May 8, 2009 - 10:45am PT
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Hey Reilly, I was laying in bed this morning thinking about all the early stuff I saw done in Peshastin in mtn boots. Slider Thread and Fakin It were two of them.
Timson Route on Gilvers Dome another.
I had forgotten how unspecialised climbing was back in the early '70s. Then I found Robbins boots, PAs, RD, RRs, Shoenards, EBs, Contacts.
Chricky I spent a lot of money on shoes!
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Brad Steinfeld
Ice climber
Goshen
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Jan 27, 2010 - 08:50pm PT
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Guy's you are sure bringing back the oldies but real goodies for me.
In addition to a lot of old stuff still stacked up in the basement are a pair of size 10.5 Makalu's that I would take offers on if anyone is interested in them. excellent plus condition.
I won't temp you with the other "junk" other than to say there are about 30 old hand made and early Pre Great Pacific bongs that I helped Warren Harding pull from the WF Leaning Tower and a few early apron routes we were playing with. yes my bones are that aged!
If anyone has an interest in the Galibiers drop me a line.
Thanks again for the stroll down memory crag.
Regards,
Brad
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SteveW
Trad climber
The state of confusion
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Jan 28, 2010 - 12:10am PT
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Bruce
I had a pair of those Makalu's too--kept 'em for years,
and decided it was time to give them up in 2005. I had them
sent over to Pakistan for survivors of the quake as the AAC
had put together a drive for warm boots & clothing for those
poor people there. . .
My plastiques are so much lighter!!!!
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nutstory
climber
Ajaccio, Corsica, France
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Jun 11, 2016 - 01:20am PT
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I have already posted the following stuff on another thread, but this one seems to be a little more appropriate: If you look for the Trappeur Nanda Devi on the Internet, you will not find any information or photograph about them… The French mountain guide Walter Cecchinel was the technical adviser for Trappeur in the seventies and eighties. If they are not as famous as the Galibier Desmaison Makalu-Hivernale, from the historical point of view the Trappeur Cecchinel Nanda Devi are most interesting. Used on the Nanda Devi in 1975, these boots summited the Everest with Pierre Mazeaud, Jean Afanassieff and Nicolas Jaeger during the first French ascent in 1978. Then they became the Trappeur Everest 78!
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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Jun 11, 2016 - 06:53am PT
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The boots available in the 70's, compared to today's lineup, truly, truly, sucked. The ONLY thing they had going for them was good workmanship. They were heavy, cumberson and didn't fit well. They also weren't very warm and got wet easily. I guess that in a real pinch, if you sliced them very thinly, you could eat them.
I have ZERO nostalgia for them. If I still had any I would give them away free if whoever wanted them would pay the expensive shipping costs those meaty monsters would require.
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nutstory
climber
Ajaccio, Corsica, France
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Jun 11, 2016 - 07:32am PT
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"good workmanship" is heavily enough to make me nostalgic...;-)
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Sierra Ledge Rat
Mountain climber
Old and Broken Down in Appalachia
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Jun 11, 2016 - 07:35am PT
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I have ZERO nostalgia for them Ha!
I still take great pride in having climbed long 5.8 alpine routes in Galibier Vercors.
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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Jun 11, 2016 - 07:43am PT
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I have no nostalgia for any of the gear that I used from the late 60's on. I guess I do take a perverse pride in what I was able to get up with that shite.
I'm still trying to push my personal envelope in alpine climbing and I'm using only the latest, most advanced, equipment to help do it. Going back to the Latok region in August!
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Fritz
Social climber
Choss Creek, ID
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Jun 11, 2016 - 08:55am PT
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That's ok Donini. I'll continue to be nostalgic about 70's gear.
I bought a pair of Galibier Hivernales in 1970, last wore them about 1980 & finally gave them away in 1994. I now regret not keeping them.
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Happy Cowboy
Social climber
Boz MT
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Jun 11, 2016 - 09:02am PT
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Haderer's noted in the threadhead. First sighting? These are the bomb. Made in Salzburg, Austria, early 70's.
I differ from "Sir Jim". More than just workmanship these are the nearest to "goat boots" I ever knew, and capable to this day, ah the boots not me. Look at the sole rocker, designed for miles, and miles of approach. Waterproofness? A peak inside reveals the core, 2 rows of wooden pegs holding the midsole together. The only exposed stitching at the toe, i.e. minimal needle punctures where water contact.
A stiff toe 45 yrs and counting...I have to agree on HEAVY!
But FIT??? You could order custom, and wait...I lucked into an early "production run" @ TM in Jackson. The tongue stamp says it all: size 44 1/2, #7 (forefoot)widest, #1 (heel) narrowest. #'s 1-3 were heel sizes and 4-7 forefoot width. This pair still fit perfectly. They also climbed rock very well. Made a niche feel like a ledge.
I'd climbed in Peuterey's prior, which I did like but had punched a big hole in the toe.
I've hiked and climbed a gear room of shoes. Many discarded after a trip or two from lousy fit. Not a problem for Haderer.[photoid=460239]
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Sierra Ledge Rat
Mountain climber
Old and Broken Down in Appalachia
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Jun 11, 2016 - 09:09am PT
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I still have my Galibier Makalu boots. Anyone want to buy them? They were the largest size available at the time, what ever that was.
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Happy Cowboy
Social climber
Boz MT
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Jun 11, 2016 - 09:33am PT
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Sorry, havin trouble posting multiple pics. Here's the boots sizing
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Happy Cowboy
Social climber
Boz MT
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Jun 11, 2016 - 09:35am PT
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Haderer of Salzburg, Austria
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Happy Cowboy
Social climber
Boz MT
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Jun 11, 2016 - 10:10am PT
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and another, basic 7 lb pr. Bumb to Tarbuster on Heavy Leather!Wayne Shorter plays the sax just how he feels...
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ydpl8s
Trad climber
Santa Monica, California
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Jun 11, 2016 - 10:12am PT
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I had a pair of Civettas(sp?) and a pair of Super Guides. I also had a pair of Kastinger's that I haven't been able to find any pictures of online. They had a gusset front like the Galibiers did and the top of the tongue/gusset was red plastic with the Kastinger logo on it (I think). They also had a fairly substantial snow cuff, and were from around the mid to late 70's. Do these ring a bell with anyone?
edit: I think they had a 3/4 steel shank, worked pretty well with rigid crampons (Chouinard black anodized), not as well as the Super Guides.
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McHale's Navy
Trad climber
From Panorama City, CA
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Jun 11, 2016 - 12:10pm PT
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I really liked my Lowa Alpspitz BITD.
You and me both. I went through several pairs of those and sold quite a few as a Lowa dealer. The next one up, the Lowa Civettas, where on the beefy side of things! I went through a pair of those just working in the pumice plant and mine in Lee Vining in the late 60s.
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Mark Force
Trad climber
Ashland, Oregon
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Jun 11, 2016 - 02:22pm PT
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johntp
Trad climber
socal
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Jun 11, 2016 - 05:06pm PT
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Had a pair of super guides. Worked well with the SMC rigids.
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ms55401
Trad climber
minneapolis, mn
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Jun 11, 2016 - 08:25pm PT
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Wayne Shorter plays the sax just how he feels...
Nice photo!
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crankster
Trad climber
No. Tahoe
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Jun 11, 2016 - 08:31pm PT
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What a great photo of Joe Brown, Mark.
I'm with Jim. The only thing I remember about those boots is blisters. Had a pair of Lowa's that had an add-on plastic upper cuff for skiing. Not really good for either climbing or skiing.
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Mark Force
Trad climber
Ashland, Oregon
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Jun 11, 2016 - 09:44pm PT
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Used to have a pair of Super Guides. They were cool. I don't think they ever broke in though - I think they just kept breaking me in - at least my feet.
Sportiva Nepal Evos are awesome. What a world of difference.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Jun 11, 2016 - 10:32pm PT
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You took that pic, Mark? I didn't think you were that old!
Wish I hadn't been too self-conscious to take his pic when I climbed with him at Anglesey.
OK, not exactly on the same rope, but the same wee cliff!
We did hang out afterwards - high point of my climbing career! :-)
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mastadon
Trad climber
crack addict
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Jun 12, 2016 - 07:48am PT
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Ron Burgner at Peshastin Pinnacles, 1973. Superguides, I think.
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Happy Cowboy
Social climber
Boz MT
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Jun 12, 2016 - 09:21am PT
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The Hivernale's I used in AK on Traleika ascent 71', Hunter south 73', and numerous Teton winter ascents. Made the shift to plastic and aveolite~ 81'
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Mark Force
Trad climber
Ashland, Oregon
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Jun 12, 2016 - 11:29am PT
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Reilly, How cool that you met and hung out with Joe Brown! I did meet him at his shop in 74-75. Drank pints and played darts in a pub in Llanberis with Don Whillans sitting nearby. Does any of that count? Yeah, I thought not.
No I'm not that old. That pic is probably late 50s? Amazing what he could do then with runners and pebbles for pro and boots. Damn.
Cool shot of Peshastin. Lots of fun shots here.
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Bruce Morris
Social climber
Belmont, California
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Jun 12, 2016 - 01:07pm PT
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I still have a pair in my closet today. When I pick them up, I just can't imagine how I hiked 750 miles in them one summer in 1978. Maybe that's why people have so many knee surgeries today? They weren't conditioned properly with good old heavy leather boots!
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EdBannister
Mountain climber
13,000 feet
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Jun 12, 2016 - 03:27pm PT
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of course there were two strains of footwear, boots and climbing shoes...
As hiking boots were trending away from heavy, i.e. too much boot, we wrote Lowa and suggested a boot between the Scout and the Bozen. both lighter than the Civetta and Alpspitz. The reply came back to their sole US distributor, (add dictatorial German accent)" We are the boot makers, and you are the boot sellers."
in short, the idiots did not listen and lost a huge portion of the market they once owned.
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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Jun 12, 2016 - 04:10pm PT
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I was an early convert to lightweight footwear. While guiding in the Tetons in the early 70's it struck me that hiking on dry trails with heavy boots made little sense. I started using the funky running shoes of the era and got strange looks from people toiling up to the Lower Saddle with Soperguides and Vercors.
I don't even own any hiking boots...I go directly from approach shoes to technical alpine boots. By the way...today's technical boots way less than some of the so called medium weight hiking boots.
The French boots (Superguides, Vercors) so popular in the 70's didn't fit me at all.....toe boxes were way too small.
Alpine and ice climbers today haven't the slightest notion how good they have it. Half of them would give up climbing if they were told they had to wear the crap boots that were are only option bitd.
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EdBannister
Mountain climber
13,000 feet
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Jun 12, 2016 - 04:15pm PT
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Jim is dead on.
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NutAgain!
Trad climber
South Pasadena, CA
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Jun 12, 2016 - 04:43pm PT
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Ray Jardine's philosophy for the Pacific Crest Trail turned on the light bulb for me... I still have these monsters that I only used on one trip. They basically look new still. I'd be happy to sell them.
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Mark Force
Trad climber
Ashland, Oregon
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Jun 12, 2016 - 04:59pm PT
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I'm into the light shoes mostly. Gave up on hiking boots in the 70s. Hike/backpack mostly in Tevas/Chacos and running shoes. Even backcountry Grand Canyon trips are better in sandals!
Nepals are half the weight of the old Superguides. Nice and the "hike/walk way better. Gotta try some of those newer lighter rigs in the near future.
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Happy Cowboy
Social climber
Boz MT
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Jun 12, 2016 - 08:36pm PT
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I'm into the lightest footwear, particularly with age. I also guided in the Tetons and Winds during the 70's and used Adidas for approaches/sometimes carry for descents. Certain ascents involving an "up and over the summit" did have me use only the Haderers I posted pics of previous. One climb of such I remember well was when an older friend from SLC was passing thru in route to Canadian Rockies. He suggested we do a " training route". As long a technical route the Tetons had, semi-rugged approach, a bivy, requiring gear to be carried over the summit. We choose the Grand's NW ridge. Fine by me as I appreciated any opportunity I got to climb with George. We did this a couple times, and had fun. I recall he climbed in Lowa Civettas, not certain. Those summers I remember as GDL's Alberta 72', Deltaform 73' and N Twin 74' glory.
I fully recognize the benefits of new, always evolving/improving footwear, and when interested I goggle a gear review.
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Fritz
Social climber
Choss Creek, ID
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Jun 12, 2016 - 09:58pm PT
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I bought some 2nd-hand Habeler boots from a close friend in 1974. He said he liked them, but they were a little big on him. They fit me well enough that I took them with a pair of Carmen Supergators off to Alaska's Haye's Range in May 1976. My feet stayed warm, my boots were way lighter than the double-boots my fellow climbers took, & I never got a blister.
Stiff as a board, but warmer than steel-shank boots, due to their wood-shank.
My feet grew out of them, and I gave them away. Sigh.
The Habeler boots were featured in the 1972 & 1973 editions of Chouinard's catalog.
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nutstory
climber
Ajaccio, Corsica, France
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Jun 12, 2016 - 10:52pm PT
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Mark Force: what a magnificent portrait of Joe Brown!
I was most fortunate to meet the legendary climber in November 1998. Because of his very "special" accent (and because of my so poorly spoken English...) I did not understand what he told me. I recorded our “conversation”, and I translated it later once at home in Corsica… Anyway, I was not able to look at him, and to understand him, at the same time… I was so much intimidated…
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Mark Force
Trad climber
Ashland, Oregon
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Jun 13, 2016 - 07:36am PT
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It would have been such a wonderful thing to see him climb. Seemed like a good bloke.
Here is the site where the pic came from
http://www.risk.ru/blog/195579
Fritz, great pic of you.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Jun 13, 2016 - 08:16am PT
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Some of you youngsters may not know this story about old leather boots. Just after the war,
when most Brits were poor as church mice, there was a rescue callout. Two blokes found
the deceased and promptly went to it to determine who got his boots.
"Well 'e bloody well won't be needing 'em!"
Think of that ye who disparage old 'eavy boots.
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Jan
Mountain climber
Colorado & Nepal
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Jun 13, 2016 - 11:10am PT
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I still have my steel shank boots I purchased in Chamonix when I lived in Geneva. I think they were Galibier. Warm and great for crampons. Amazingly, I used them all one summer when I taught for Outward Bound. I quit hiking in them when I went to Nepal and learned that an average Sherpa day was twice as long as an average OB day and they were way too heavy for that (or my legs were way too weak, one of the two). I hiked in tennis shoes in the Himalayas after that all the way up to the snow line. I even hiked in Nepal sometimes in rubber thongs like the locals. Hard to say if the arthritis in my feet now comes from the boots or the sandals.
I also skied in these boots and I'm thinking to use them again for alpine style cross country. I've been told that the new plastic boots result in torn ACL's instead of broken ankles like the old leather ones. Personally, I'd rather have an ankle break than a messed up knee requiring surgery and modern boots aren't going to improve my ski style that much I'm pretty sure. Any advice about a good compromise?
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Jun 13, 2016 - 11:14am PT
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^^^^ Breithorn alert!!!!!! It would be very hard to take that pic today
without at least a few other people in it. Was that before the telepherique
to the Klein Matterhorn was built?
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Jan
Mountain climber
Colorado & Nepal
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Jun 13, 2016 - 05:35pm PT
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No, we took that telepherique and started from there. It was the middle of the week however when we were up there and we didn't see any other tracks.
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nutstory
climber
Ajaccio, Corsica, France
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Jun 27, 2016 - 05:25am PT
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McHale's Navy
Trad climber
From Panorama City, CA
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Jun 27, 2016 - 10:49am PT
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I was an early convert to lightweight footwear. While guiding in the Tetons in the early 70's it struck me that hiking on dry trails with heavy boots made little sense.
In the early 70s a friend, Ken Horwitz, wrote an article for Off Belay that talked about the damage the heavy boots were doing to hiking trails like the Muir Trail - mostly through meadow areas. Maybe the article never made it since I can't seem to locate it but this piece about climate change caught my eye:
Off-Belay, 1972
Jan 1972, p. 11: Lloyd, Darryl, "Climate Changes and Northwest Glaciers"
Washington state contains three-quarters of the glacier area in the western contiguous U.S., which totals about 200 square miles. There are nearly 700 glaciers in the Cascades alone and more than 100 square miles of permanent ice north of Snoqualmie Pass. In the late 19th century, following the peak of the "little ice age," virtually all glaciers began to recede. Between 1920 and 1950 some observers considered the recession catastrophic. The period from 1913 to 1943 was relatively warm and dry in western Washington. The climate shifted around 1943, and glaciers began to respond by the late 1940s and early 1950s. In Washington, glacier expansion reached its peak around 1956-57. From that time until this writing, most of the state's glaciers have remained in apparent equilibrium. The article includes a fine aerial photo of the Klawatti Glaciers in the North Cascades by Austin Post.
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Dolomite
climber
Anchorage
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Jun 28, 2016 - 04:53pm PT
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I let these Lowa Civettas go in 2008 after about 35 years of service. Loved 'em, but too heavy these days. I had a pair of Makalus that hurt my feet so badly that I left them in Peru to insure I would never wear them again--which I probably would have done, being a cheap bastard.
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Tarbuster
climber
right here, right now
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Jun 28, 2016 - 07:45pm PT
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Interesting stuff showing up here.
First, from Fritz's post:
The Habeler boots were featured in the 1972 & 1973 editions of Chouinard's catalog.
So, Fritz, I wonder if the Klocker boots from the Chouinard catalog and the Habeler Superlight were one and the same?
Just before plastic boots came out, I really wanted to switch out my Superguides for a pair of Superlights.
Remember when those wood shanked Habeler Superlights became available with something called an aveolite liner? (I wouldn't be surprised if I previously mentioned this somewhere up thread).
Not exactly a double boot, sort of halfway there IIRC. This really seemed like the right boot to have at the time. Lightweight, with the thin silver liner (maybe closed cell foam), and, IIRC, also designed by Peter Habeler.
*Maybe the Superlight was a later incarnation of the Klocker, or maybe Habeler just designed for two different boot companies.
IIRC, the Superlight was marketed by (and probably manufactured by) Kastinger.
I'm guessing they came out around 1978 or 79.
...............................................................
Then, from McHale's Navy:
Jan 1972, p. 11: Lloyd, Darryl, "Climate Changes and Northwest Glaciers"
This brings back fond memories of Darryl Lloyd and his brother, Darvel Lloyd.
In 1976, I spent 10 or so days circumnavigating Mount Adams, under Darryl's tutelage, along with a handful of other climbers.
He and his brother Darvel owned and operated the Mount Adams Wilderness Institute.
In the second post of this thread, and in a subsequent post, I posted pictures of myself from that trip, wearing Superguides.
I just did a quick search on Darryl Lloyd and came up with this:
http://www.oregonlive.com/travel/index.ssf/2014/07/mount_adams_attracts_darryl_ll.html
The 1970s were the Lloyd twins' main era on the mountain. They founded the Mount Adams Wilderness Institute in 1970 to teach mountaineering, one of the first such formal programs in the Northwest. They ran 75 eight-day to two-week sessions, nearly all of them completely full, until 1980, when nearby Mount St. Helens erupted. The Forest Service placed Mount Adams in a red zone, an area unsafe for humans to visit, and the Lloyds wound up losing the business.
But not their love for Mount Adams.
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ddeike
Trad climber
yucaipa, ca
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Jun 28, 2016 - 08:32pm PT
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Dane, been lurking round the camp fire and happy to see your still posting. Great memories from N Idaho and Canada mi brochacho. Keep in touch.
Dave
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Tarbuster
climber
right here, right now
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Jun 28, 2016 - 09:09pm PT
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The record shows Dane last posted here February 19 of 2015.
Sadly, I think we have lost him, as we have many others to the overall decline in the quality of the forum.
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Todd Eastman
climber
Bellingham, WA
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Jun 28, 2016 - 10:24pm PT
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Tar, the Habler Superlights were different from the Klockers. I got to borrow some Superlights for ice climbing in Vermont and the owner had to threaten me with an ice axe to get them back. They were light, climbed really well, and were super comfortable.
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Scole
Trad climber
Zapopan
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Jun 30, 2016 - 03:32pm PT
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I bought my first pair of Super Guides in 1974 at Sport Chalet for $19. I bought my second (and third) at Mountaineering Outfitters in Driggs, Idaho (RIP)in 2005 for $19. They still had the original pricetag.
I climbed in lots of different leather boots like Makalus, Asolo 8000, Putereys and Superlights over the years, but I still love my Super Guides.
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Tarbuster
climber
right here, right now
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Jun 30, 2016 - 09:59pm PT
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Thanks for the reply, Todd.
Scott: fun Crystal Crag picture!
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nutstory
climber
Ajaccio, Corsica, France
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Jan 10, 2017 - 02:56am PT
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nutstory
climber
Ajaccio, Corsica, France
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Feb 20, 2017 - 02:09am PT
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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Feb 20, 2017 - 03:27am PT
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We all had Habeler Superlights with Supergaitors on Latok1 in 1978. The best combo avaltable at the time but, let's face it, vastly inferior to what is available today.
With size 12 feet I don't think I would still be alpine climbing at my age if I had to wear the clunker leather boots from bitd.
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nutstory
climber
Ajaccio, Corsica, France
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Feb 20, 2017 - 05:16am PT
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donini, I well suspected that you would react quickly after my post... ;-)
Great photo!
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jstan
climber
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Feb 20, 2017 - 12:18pm PT
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In 1987 while on a ferrata in northern Italy, a waiting line developed. A diminutive young lady in front of
us was wearing huge leather boots that seemed a good six inches across. She complained, "there is no
place here for me to put my feet."
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DM88T
climber
Dave Tully SanDimas,California
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Feb 21, 2017 - 09:00am PT
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Galibier Hivernale - downhill ski boots
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nutstory
climber
Ajaccio, Corsica, France
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May 12, 2017 - 01:53am PT
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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May 12, 2017 - 04:28am PT
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Bouldering on Mt. Conness' backside.Lowa Davos, similar to the Lowa Scout, but better for climbing.
Lowa Alpspitzen were my everyday footwear from June '71 until about 1974, when I finally made the switch to the Davos, a very much lighter boot.
The Alpspitzen were used once by one of my in-laws' kids as Frankenstein boots for Halloween.
In '74 Doug Ross convinced me to buy some Klocker boots, the ones pimped by Chouinard. I loved those on Shasta with no crampons. I don't think I ever used them on another peak and don't recall where they were last seen. They were very well-crafted and very light, but stiff as heck where they needed to be.
I recall the Seconds Sales at The North Face on Telegraph, where we would put out a pile of odd boots from Europe that were probably purchased by Doug Tompkins for sale in the original SF location. These older "clunky boots" were popular with Telegraph street guys because they were so darned cheap.
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nutstory
climber
Ajaccio, Corsica, France
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May 12, 2017 - 05:39am PT
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A message from Walter Cecchinel after that I sent him the photograph of the ED Sup:
La chaussure ED Sup (le summum de la chaussure cuir de l'époque : stop-tout cuir, double laçage et voute plantaire auto-moulante)
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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May 12, 2017 - 07:47am PT
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When I see these old photos I am reminded of the old adage....ignorance is bliss. Surely, if we had known of the advances coming in boot design we would have temporarily suspended our alpine forays and waited for their arrival. Those old boots make wonderful photographs, especially in sepia, but they were clumsy, heavy, stiff and poor fitting.
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Todd Eastman
climber
Bellingham, WA
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May 12, 2017 - 08:14am PT
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but they were clumsy, heavy, stiff and poor fitting.
Unless they were easier to climb in, flexible in the right ways, and more comfortable than any of the new offerings...
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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May 12, 2017 - 08:52am PT
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^^^^ HEAR, HEAR! I loved my Galibiers! Used to slab climb at Peshastin in my Hivernales! :-)
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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May 14, 2017 - 04:03pm PT
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Jim will never change his attitude about new gear vs. old gear.
He is "hidebound."
Cheers to ya, Jim.
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Mark Force
Trad climber
Ashland, Oregon
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May 14, 2017 - 08:22pm PT
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Jim, love my Nepal Evos, but game to hear your take on your favorite mountain boot these days...
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TwistedCrank
climber
Released into general population, Idaho
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May 15, 2017 - 07:59am PT
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I loved my Super Guides. Used to go jogging in them. The telltale crackle of the broken shank let people know I was coming. Then I got some Pivetta 8s, which were like fairy slippers - except the blown out stitching on the funky rand made them impossible to resole. Getting that news was like a sucker punch. So I bought some Nike tennie runners.
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nutstory
climber
Ajaccio, Corsica, France
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To date I have not found any name or date for these Trappeur...
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Ksolem
Trad climber
Monrovia, California
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Fabiano's. Not too big and clunky, beautifully made, and quite suitable for rock climbing. Or so it seemed at the time. Who could have imagined the shoes we get to choose from today.
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AP
Trad climber
Calgary
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Crazy to think we used to climb 5.10 in heavy leather boots.
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Ksolem
Trad climber
Monrovia, California
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That's one of the reasons 5.10 was considered to be big grade.
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Don Lauria
Trad climber
Bishop, CA
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Been in my various closets since around 1975. Still unblemished.
My German is in need of review ... does that say "super light"?
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Don Lauria
Trad climber
Bishop, CA
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I started using running shoes in the Sierra in about 1974. Never wore "mountain boots" since. Even used crampons on running shoes when crampons were needed.
Don't know whether they still fit or if they ever did.
Just stuck my bare foot in one and they still fit - but they are doomed to antiquity.
Donini, don't remember what I was wearing in the Karakoram back in '75. I'll have to look at my slides - all 75 boxes of them courtesy of National Geographic. Maybe George remembers.
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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Don....yep, those are Habeler Superlights. George, Jeff, Michael and I all used them on Latok in 78. They used laminated wood as the shank/ lasting board. That was supposed to make them warmer.
If I still had to wear those old leather boots I wouldn't still be alpine climbing. I have size 12 feet anchoring a 150 pound body. Way too old to have 7 pounds of boot/anchors.
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F10
Trad climber
Bishop
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Loved my Super Guides
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Mark Force
Trad climber
Ashland, Oregon
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Jim, What is your favorite mountaineering boot now?
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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I have the Eiger from Asolo. Very light, climbs great and really fits my foot.
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Mark Force
Trad climber
Ashland, Oregon
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Thanks for the tip. I'll check it out.
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rmuir
Social climber
From the Time Before the Rocks Cooled.
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Memories of wearing my heavy-leather Galibier Makalu double-boots (with the felt liners) around the UC Irvine campus for a few days before heading to Alaska…
Serious dorking.
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EdBannister
Mountain climber
13,000 feet
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The first English language book on ice climbing "Climbing Ice" was written by Norman Kingsley.
I suppose it Chessler material now, but if you want to feel like you have great gear, or even had improved gear in the 70's or later, have a gander at that! sorry no pics, my ex trashed my entire guidebook and lit collection. Meanwhile, Norm Kingsley had 100+ first ascents in those scary crampons and boots, not just new routes, first on top. Never understood why he did not get more recognition, but he was not a self promoter.
for the record, since someone reported doing so... using flexible footwear w rigid crampons stresses the heat treated metal.. with continued use .. they eventually explode. foot fangs excepted.
the 80's Lowa US lineup from light to heavy:
Bozen, Scout, Alpspitz, Civetta
in the larger sizes, the Civetta came in at 4 pounds, per boot.
We did eventually find a great use for size 5, which no size 5 person had a hope of ever flexing.
One of the guys bought the hardware, installed, filled 'em up with cement, Lamps.
there were several more "pairs" made
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Mark Force
Trad climber
Ashland, Oregon
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Love my Nepal Evos. They fit like custom - wish my AT boots fit that good. Was wondering if anybody's had experience with the Nepal Cubes.
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tradmanclimbs
Ice climber
Pomfert VT
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Asolo Eigers. they ran a full size large when i bought them 2 seasons ago but incredibly light and warm. had to sell the first pair after a season and bought a half size smaller for the next season. think I could have gone a full size smaller......
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Fossil climber
Trad climber
Atlin, B. C.
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Tikchik Range, Alaska, 1958. Mapping glaciers for IGY. Bought 'em at REI on the way up. Fording streams first days, always wet. Moulded to the feet. Lugging 70 - 80 lb. around AK all summer, couldn't have had anything better! Swiss - can't recall the brand.
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guido
Trad climber
Santa Cruz/New Zealand/South Pacific
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Ah yes Wayne and those classic glacier goggllllles!
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Fossil climber
Trad climber
Atlin, B. C.
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Tad -
Twenty-six. No, didn't use it on that trip. Dick Long was my partner that summer. Great summer!
And Guido - still got those goggles. And I think the boots were Raichles.
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nutstory
climber
Ajaccio, Corsica, France
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Sep 19, 2017 - 06:40am PT
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Tarbuster
climber
right here, right now
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Sep 19, 2017 - 09:02am PT
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^^^
Scored a set of the Super Pro with the PVC toe cap for your collection. Nice!
.....................................
This is what I use now, as I need high-volume, mostly for walking in cold weather, didn't want something quite as stiff as the yellow Evo, and had to get them from Europe:
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nutstory
climber
Ajaccio, Corsica, France
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Oct 12, 2017 - 09:11am PT
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If you look for information on Val d'Or on the Internet you will not find anything on this French brand of carefully made mountaineering boots. So I am pleased to share with you what I have found in La Montagne & Alpinisme.
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Spider Savage
Mountain climber
The shaggy fringe of Los Angeles
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Oct 12, 2017 - 09:43am PT
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nutstory
climber
Ajaccio, Corsica, France
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Oct 12, 2017 - 09:47am PT
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If I am not mistaken, these are early Galibier "Rando"
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nutstory
climber
Ajaccio, Corsica, France
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Oct 14, 2017 - 12:12am PT
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Happy Cowboy
Social climber
Boz MT
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Oct 14, 2017 - 04:52am PT
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" Le Fu*k's" appearance! Thank you Nutstory
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Contractor
Boulder climber
CA
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Oct 14, 2017 - 05:42am PT
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These Sportiva Karakorums we're issued to a buddy of mine in the military. He passed them on to me- I'm not sure of their best application? They fit perfectly and have never been worn.
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nutstory
climber
Ajaccio, Corsica, France
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Oct 14, 2017 - 05:49am PT
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Looks a little bit too "modern" for me ;-)
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c wilmot
climber
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Oct 14, 2017 - 07:55am PT
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Looks like a pair of la sportive lhotse boots to me contractor. It's a warmer boot than the Karakoram- Should be great for winter use.
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Contractor
Boulder climber
CA
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Oct 14, 2017 - 09:24am PT
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C- thanks! They were issued to the SEAL'S so maybe an all black military version.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Oct 14, 2017 - 09:27am PT
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SEALS? How ya supposed to swim in those?
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Contractor
Boulder climber
CA
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Oct 14, 2017 - 11:09am PT
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Haha-Yes, they could swim in those!
SEa, Air, Land...
The early SEAL's plucked from Navy UDT went to Ranger school. Now they have their own mountaineering school I believe.
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nutstory
climber
Ajaccio, Corsica, France
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Oct 23, 2017 - 08:23am PT
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Val d'Or, "suite et fin"...
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nutstory
climber
Ajaccio, Corsica, France
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Nov 14, 2017 - 07:53am PT
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Marlow
Sport climber
OSLO
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Nov 14, 2017 - 11:20am PT
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Cool...
Lately I found this 1970 shoe wonder.
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nutstory
climber
Ajaccio, Corsica, France
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Nov 14, 2017 - 11:53pm PT
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A genuine gem!
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nutstory
climber
Ajaccio, Corsica, France
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Nov 22, 2017 - 02:28am PT
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nutstory
climber
Ajaccio, Corsica, France
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Dec 28, 2017 - 05:42am PT
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nutstory
climber
Ajaccio, Corsica, France
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Dec 28, 2017 - 05:48am PT
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nutstory
climber
Ajaccio, Corsica, France
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Gnome Ofthe Diabase
climber
Out Of Bed
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There was a Boot, from 1978-79(?) that looked like "Herman Monster" boots. They Had A 3 inch high rubber rand, Vibram Sole, maybe a Vasque build for the Adirondack Climbing store,-The Mountaineer- in Keene Valley NY. I over paid Al Jolley For a pair. They were Ice Box's
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Todd Eastman
Social climber
Putney, VT
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Gnome, Jim Wagner designed them when he ran the Mountaineer.
They attempted to get away from the stitched Norwegian welt.
Good boat anchors!
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Gnome Ofthe Diabase
climber
Out Of Bed
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OMG I thought They were trying to get me killit, & i climbed with my own recruits from Paul smiths from that 1980 winter on..
Honestly have to run but Good to hear Thnx For that Todd
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Marlow
Sport climber
OSLO
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Feb 13, 2018 - 11:47am PT
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My "new" boots: Galibier Hivernale
Galibier Hivernale information
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Evel
Trad climber
Nedsterdam CO
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Feb 13, 2018 - 12:01pm PT
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Hey there Gnome. I had a pair of those Frankenstein boots also. Total crap
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nutstory
climber
Ajaccio, Corsica, France
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nutstory
Trad climber
Ajaccio, Corsica, France
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Jan 22, 2019 - 01:22am PT
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Presented by Dahu as a wonderful Christmas gift, these impressive boots were on the top of my wishing list for a long long time ;-)
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Blakey
Trad climber
Sierra Vista
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Jan 22, 2019 - 04:51am PT
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There were several boxed pairs of Super Guides on sale in Annott's mid week market. They weren't cheap!
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Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Jan 22, 2019 - 09:05am PT
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The best, temporally, never is...
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