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bookworm
Social climber
Falls Church, VA
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Topic Author's Original Post - Oct 8, 2007 - 08:42pm PT
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are the gunks dog friendly? i know the approaches are straightforward, but what's the general vibe at the crag and around the campground?
he's a typical golden retriever...very friendly and affectionate; rarely barks
i don't trust people who don't like dogs and find it hard to believe that dogs are not welcome EVERYWHERE, but i also want to respect the local ethic
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happiegrrrl
Trad climber
New York, NY
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...pretty dog-friendly, I'd say.....
There are dogs at the c/ground every week(mine included), and dogs along the cliffs. Of course there are some people who don't like dogs at the crag, and may make some mention; I have been "reprimanded" by some people at times, for my dog being there. But that is like one person out of one hundred who stops to say hello and give/get some Teddy love......
Of course, if your dog barks a lot, whines when you get on a route, noses into people's packs, or you leave him untethered and allow him to roam....you won't get a warm reception.
The "rule" is that dogs must be on leash at all times and not left unattended, including at the cliff base while you climb. This rule became effective in 2005, and was a hot topic for a few months, and then died away.
Be considerate, and insure your dog is safe and not in a situation where (s)he will be tempted into dog-like (mis)behavior is the key to a good dog's stay at the Gunks.
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Rock!...oopsie.
Trad climber
pitch above you
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I'd like to mention one thing that I see at the Gunks a lot, and it drives me nuts.
Lot's of people tether their dog right near the base of a route and then climb away. The gunks has rockfall (not all of it from me, despite my handle), and dogs don't understand "Rock!" Nor can they get the hell outta the way when somebody kicks some pebbles off a ledge. Some spots are easy to find a safe area for scruffy, while others may be pretty tough... maybe that's a factor to consider when picking routes?
This public service announcement brought to you by the guy that doesn't wanna see your dog get brained while I belay my buddy on the next route over. Never actually seen it happen thankfully, but I have seen some close calls.
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hagerty
Social climber
SLC
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>The "rule" is that dogs must be on leash at all times and not left unattended, including at the cliff base while you climb. This rule became effective in 2005, and was a hot topic for a few months, and then died away.<
That rule was first published and has been in effect since at least 1990.
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ng
Trad climber
southwest
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i love my dog dearly -
that's why i leave her at home when i go out to climb;
i think its totally unfair to tie a dog up at the base to be
1) potentailly hit by falling rocks / gear;
2) bit by snakes and centipedes (which gunks has plenty of)(also eating the centipedes can be very toxic - which some dogs have)
3) annoy those who don't like dogs and trying to enjoy a day climbing
as much as i love dogs - it sucks being on a route and listening to someone's mutt whine and bark for hours on end.
just cuz the guy who hangs out at the Uberfall has a pooch in his truck does not imply its 'ok' for them to hang out at the base all day
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Aya K
Trad climber
New York
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That's Teddy in the truck with the ranger. He's the cutest.
Don't turn a simple question about whether it's ok to bring your dog to the gunks into a "dogs at the crag" thread. That's just a lame waste of everyone's time. Like abortion, bolting, evolution and a discussion on what the best shoes are, it's been done to death.
I've been bringing my dog(s) to the gunks for years and never had a problem, and you'll see tons and tons and tons of other dogs there. Some are friendly and some aren't, but by and large they're all well behaved and in control. I've had more problems with jerky people than I have with dogs, and never had a problem with a non-dog lover giving me crap for having a dog at the crag. Funny how they only seem to come out online.
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ng
Trad climber
southwest
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aya k,
have you done a formal poll of Gunks climbers? you don't really know how most climbers at the gunks feel. (You are right - some of the biggest human asses i've met climbing have been at the gunks).
whether its the gunks, ORG, Hueco,...this issue is the same
 i bet the pro dog/ anti dog at the crag is split 50/50 and though i give my boxer organic kibbles, 2 big walks a day, and write checks to ASPCA almost monthly -
i still believe dogs don't belong at the crag- EVEN MORE SO AT THE GUNKS b/c its one of THE HIGHEST TRAFFIC areas in the country - hence, more likely a dog will get something dropped on it or be around someone who doesn't dig their presence.
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BadInfluence
Mountain climber
Dak side
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so dogs will be more likly to understand Rock! when not tied to a tree? I've seen climbers put their newborns on crashpad at the base of a cliff.
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jstan
climber
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Probably it makes sense to look at the issue as though taking your dog to the cliff is much like taking another climber. There will be another creature there that needs attention and space. Each person has to ask themselves, is taking my dog the best utilization of our resources.
This is the way managers of the land will probably look at the issue. They hate to impose rules for several reasons. Having to enforce the rules is not the least of those reasons. But sometimes it just has to be done. Of course when a situation evolves to the point where it becomes less desirable, the rules are likely to change.
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Aya K
Trad climber
New York
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NG, whether you think that dogs should be at the crag (presumably not even your local crag) is completely irrelevant to the OP's question. If you would like to start that debate again, you can start a new thread.
The Preserve rules say they can be there.
The op wanted to know what the general vibe was towards dogs.
My experience, and clearly Happie's experience (and both of us are there at least several weekends a month), and many other dog owners' experiences have been that they are very dog friendly so long as you have a bit of common sense about dogs, other peoples' reactions to dogs, and follow the rules. Happie gave a very good answer to the OP's question.
To restate: If you want to bring your dog, bring him. When are you coming up, bookworm? We can have a doggie party!
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mack
Trad climber
vermont
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I have been badly scared a couple of times by dogs tied at the base of a climb. Once at the Gunks and once at Poko. Had to make a wide detour beyoud the reach of the dog, while they growled and barked at me, very scary, and I love dogs. Leave em at home if possible.
Mack
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happiegrrrl
Trad climber
New York, NY
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That's my dog(Teddy, as Aya said) in the ranger truck. We'd been doing trailwork hauling rocks from the Stairmaster area back to near Bunny, and by the 3rd trip walking back and forth, Teddy gave Bob "the look" and asked for a lift..... It really did happen that way(to the best of my recollection).
It seems to me that the "dog at the crag issue" is not one that is likely to be resolved. People have various opinions, and unless they are doing more than voicing them online, that's all they are - opinions.
Frankly, I get more irritated at the gumbys who don't know enough to stow their packs to the side of a trail that a dog who's tethered nearby and has moved into the trail. At least you can ask the dog to move or let you by.....
That said - someone with a territory-protecting dog who tethers it in a traffic spot is doing the same thing, to a much worse degree. Some people really do have body-memory fear of dogs, and that is something a good companion animal steward should be aware of.
I really do my best to be a good steward with my dog in public, whether it's on a city sidewalk, in Camp Slime or at the cliff base, or anywhere else I take him. But I will also advocate for his rights which, whether you(a general "you", not someone specifically) agree or disagree, he is entitled to.
Legally, his rights apply by proxy, as he is my property. I don't expect society to evolve to a point in my lifetime where it, as a whole, accepts all sentient beings as "separate but equal"(which is my belief), and so I take my stand as I have leverage.
However, I don't have the right to force my self(and dog) unjustly onto others. Someone with an aggressive, territorial dog who tethers his at trailside is doing exactly that. They are probably the same type who yard sales their pack and it's contents in the trail. Inconsiderate.....
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travelin_light
Trad climber
california
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One dog is usually not a problem even if its being a little pest. The problem arises when EVERYONE brings thier dog.
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bookworm
Social climber
Falls Church, VA
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 9, 2007 - 11:25am PT
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Thanks to all for the responses...including the naysayers. My previous dog was a Rottie, very sweet but also aggressive when tethered. I understood that I couldn't allow him to run free, primarily because he was a Rottie, so, in the virtually impossible chance he did bite somebody, I would have to put him down...because he was a Rottie. My point...I stopped taking him to the crag after the first few experimental trips.
Cody (I know, I know, there's nothing more cliche than a golden retriever named Cody, but I adopted him and can't think of anything that sounds the same...and don't worry, I will NEVER tie a bandana around his neck), on the other hand, is almost annoyingly sweet and friendly. So far, he doesn't whine when I climb at the local crag...if he does, I'll leave him home unless I have somebody to keep him company. I'm dog crazy--the more the merrier--but I do appreciate that some dogs are troublesome...so, I asked.
We will be up there the first weekend in November (11/3 - 11/6)...any chance of having those days declared a "dogs only weekend"?
What about Roadhouse, and Roadie for short? Roadhouse would be a joke because he's definitely more of a cafe/bistro dog, and Roadie would cut down on his confusion.
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