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bob
climber
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Bump. Maybe it could drift into something. Maybe not.
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wstmrnclmr
Trad climber
Bolinas, CA
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Coming over from the Smoke and Obscurities thread.....The climbs in Tuolumne are being replaced and preserved at a rapid pace with Roger, Greg and Clint doing the bulk of the work. So now one can go for it over protection as solid (more so) as when the FA's did the routes. Roger and Clint are replacing them as they are. No additions or subtractions unless bolts are missing per topo. And Clint gets to make more accurate topo's because some were word of mouth and are different in real time. Though debates rage on about style, content, modus etc., no-one seems to mind the replacement and the hard work that goes into it. These guys are unsung heroes as far as I can tell. And if your thinking of doing a museum piece up there, stop by at the store at 8:30am and ask if the bolts are old (there's a list). If they are, grab an old rope and drag it up with you and leave it for the re-bolters. Not much work that helps a lot.
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Greg Barnes
climber
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Speaking of museum climbs... years ago I replaced a couple Kurt Smith routes on North Whizz dome after my partners failed to show up at Handbook - Ease On It (5.10c R) and Knob Roulette (5.10d R/X). Just happened to run into Kurt that afternoon, and he said something like "Why did you bother? No one will ever climb those."
Anyway, just another take on "museum" climbs...
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wstmrnclmr
Trad climber
Bolinas, CA
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Nice Greg. Climbers seem to forget what a great trad, and slab in particular, climber Kurt Smith was/is. His sport achievments and climbing during the Bachar era seems to have shadowed somewhat the "kids" achievments. As a relative newcomer to TM, I hope to get on some of his climbs and I certainly will appreciate clipping a new bolt.
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Greg Barnes
climber
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Think more than a few of his routes are awaiting a second ascent...speaking of slabs, Roger just replaced everything at Whale's Back, yikes!
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mike m
Trad climber
black hills
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There are more than a few of these climbs in the Needles and it is good to hear that some of the youngsters are making sure they stay that way. Heard through the grape vine that a route that originally had two bolts was upgraded to 10. It has been re-adventurized by a couple of guys that might only be half as old as the climb. I am not into bolt wars but don't get why people needlessly add bolts to other's climbs. There is plenty of places around here to put up your own routes.
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ß Î Ø T Ç H
Boulder climber
extraordinaire
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If replacing bolts on GU routes, it should be done GU, not via rappel.
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Crack-N-Up
Big Wall climber
South of the Mason Dixon line
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Werner's post jumps from 2007, 2009, 2011, 2012 and now here we are in 2013.
Yes replace the original with High Tech bolts and or place high tech bolts next to the originals as souvenirs.
Old Pins: Test with a hammer, or better yet remove and install your own, so you know it won't pull out.
As I see it, there are no shortages for places to climb in this world. If a climb doesn't meet your expectations in safety, don't do it.
I would argue that each area of the country has its own ethical standards, so ask leaders in that area what is acceptable, for that area.
If none of the above works for you, go top rope it, that I would say will always be your right.
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mike m
Trad climber
black hills
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I think it is inevitable and sad that traditionalist will loose this battle as I have seen our dingus milktoast say on the taco a few times, but I think it is fun to put up a fight. Most of the people putting up these routes will not be around for too much longer or are already gone. We will see, but I see it a little like the native Americans stopping the western migration of the Europeans. Not looking too good, but every once in a while there is a little big horn.
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Crack-N-Up
Big Wall climber
South of the Mason Dixon line
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I think it is inevitable and sad that traditionalist will loose this battle Many, many ways this can play out, but just as history has made laws, some areas may become off limits to someone who thinks they know better than the majority. Some of these climbing areas are in national parks that follow laws.
Some people think they can do anything they want, not so!
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ß Î Ø T Ç H
Boulder climber
extraordinaire
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Anybody can climb up, down or sideways whatever they want to, and hopefully take care for thier own safety in the process.
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Jay Wood
Trad climber
Land of God-less fools
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Biotch says:
If replacing bolts on GU routes, it should be done GU, not via rappel.
Let us know how that goes for you.
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ß Î Ø T Ç H
Boulder climber
extraordinaire
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Congrats, you've been officially trolled.
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tradmanclimbs
Ice climber
Pomfert VT
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If Kurt really thinks no one will ever climb his routs maybe he would be inclined to give someone permission to fix them ;)
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patrick compton
Trad climber
van
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i bow down and worship the FAs of old. Their bold ascents shall be forever upheld by tradition. for now and eternity.
replacing 40 year old pins and 1/4 bolts tis sacrilege!
amen.
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