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yo
climber
NOT Fresno
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Oct 20, 2004 - 03:24pm PT
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Avril Lavigne, now we're talking. I much prefer the old skanky eye shadow type to the newer marketing move, but that's just me.
And I was wondering the other day if Kevin Federline wasn't a climber. Dude's definitely a dirtbag with no prospects, doesn't shave much, but he's got a new sugar mama now, don't he?
Look at all we have to talk about!
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Matt
climber
SF
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Oct 20, 2004 - 03:29pm PT
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FRATguy-
you have just proven my point. you are spineless, just exactly like the group of chickenhawks that you support.
i have no idea how someone who ever climbed in EBs could now have morphed into a supporter of the worst environmental administration EVER, but since it's not due to any of these issues you seem to think we have in common, i can only assume that you must have gotten some kinda sweet walnut creek tax breaks to help you rationalize it all...
don't worry, your grandkids don't mind paying for all of this garbage!
how do you even sleep at night?
sheesh...
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maculated
Trad climber
San Luis Obispo, CA
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Oct 20, 2004 - 03:29pm PT
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You're right, the political threads will hopefully simmer down.
That said, quit being such a nice guy and just tell the whiners to shut up. :)
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dufas
Trad climber
san francisco
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Oct 20, 2004 - 03:30pm PT
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Political discussion is just an extension of campfire, car trip and belay ledge arguments. Consider this cross-fire for climbers. Obviously most enjoy it based on the number of responses and issues raised and the verve with which people stay with it. I'd vote to leave it, it is entertaining.
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Hardman Knott
Gym climber
Marin Hot Tub Country
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Oct 20, 2004 - 03:41pm PT
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I thought it would be useful to repost something I wrote in the[url="http://www.supertopo.com/climbing/thread.html?m=44110&f=75&b=0"] Question For Matt[/url]
thread -- it's as relevant as ever...
---------------------------------------------
{Oct 1st 2004}
Finally, I never understood why people would want to carry on political dialogs
with a group of climbers, on a climbing-specific forum.
For those of you who think posting political stuff to a group of climbers
is a good idea, there's a much, much better place do do that.
It's the Community forum on Rockclimbing.com.
As of this morning, there are already dozens of posts about the debate last night,
all of them made by climbers. You will reach a vastly larger number
of climbers--on an order of magnitude. Check it out. Way more bang for the buck!
Personally, I would recommend checking out Usenet. Learning how to use
a newsreader program isn't all that difficult, and is what we had to use before
Gore invented the internet.
It is still a vastly superior medium than any Web-based forum;
you need to use it to see what I mean.
Here are some groups I found, using just the keyword Politics:
alt.politics
alt.politics.bush
alt.politics.economics
alt.politics.elections
alt.politics.gw-bush
alt.politics.immigration
alt.politics.liberalism
alt.politics.media
alt.politics.radical-left
alt.politics.republicans
alt.politics.socialism
alt.politics.socialism.democratic
alt.politics.socialism.libertarian
alt.politics.usa
alt.politics.usa.constitution
alt.politics.usa.constitution.gun-rights
alt.politics.usa.republican
soc.politics
talk.politics.guns
talk.politics.libertarian
talk.politics.mideast
talk.politics.misc
talk.politics.theory
us.politics
us.politics.elections
wash.politics
There are probably thousands more...
If this is all too complicated for those of you who think programing a VCR
is akin to rocket-science, you can always read Usenet using the Google Groups
interface. I must warn you--and Dingus will attest--that using web-based Google
instead of a newsreader is like driving a golf cart on a race-track instead of
a Lamborghini Diablo, or getting a massage in a wetsuit instead of being nude.
Try it, you'll like it!
(To Matt:)
Nobody is telling anyone what they should or shouldn't post.
I'm merely making a suggestion--as a user of this forum.
There are so many much-better, on topic venues specifically for politics,
where you truly won't be preaching to the same small group. (choir?)
You will get a much more diverse opinion form all over the world.
This is a climbing specific forum with an emphasis on Yosemite.
Can't we have 1 cool place where we can get away from politics for a while?
Broaden your horizons dude, and let us shallow-types have our little playpen!
{end Oct 1st post}
-----------------------------------------
I would like to add that those who insist on posting off-topic political stuff
are the very definition of intolerance--they are presumptuous enough to decree
that we should talk politics--and to hell what anyone thinks. Never mind that
rockclimbing.com has a Community forum with much, much more traffic and various
political issues being discussed. I will ask again: is it really too much to ask to
have one place where we can get away from the tedium of political stuff?
Is it too much to ask to talk about climbing on a climbing forum?
Hardman Knott
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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Oct 20, 2004 - 03:58pm PT
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Politics will probably settle down as soon as the election is over, well, maybe a few months afterwards...
Or maybe when we're out of Iraq...
at least until the next war.
If it bugs folks, having off-topic and on-topic sections is a better solution than censorship.
I'd like to be able to talk politics, bowel movements, girls, bolts, and whatever. Each internet "community" is it's own group and acting like a community (dealing with each other, hashing things out, and discussing anything) keeps folks coming back and making other contributions to the site. So in the end, it's all good for Chris as long as it's not an obscene, rude scene.
Peace
karl
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Hardman Knott
Gym climber
Marin Hot Tub Country
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Oct 20, 2004 - 04:18pm PT
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I agree that censorship is knott the answer -- censorship sucks.
With that said, there are a lot of us here who would rather not see
political posts on this Climbing Forum. So with this in mind, continuing to
post off topic political posts on this Climbing Forum is to disrespect the wishes
of other users -- who would prefer to read climbing posts on this Climbing Forum
On Usenet there are several groups I subscribe to. One of them is rec.autos.tech.
Maybe I should start posting questions and rants here about the advantages/disadvantages
of throttle-body injection vs multi-point, or detailed "trip reports" (with photos)
of my adventures such as replacing my fuel-pump for the first time, which included
draining and removing the fuel-tank, or replacing my front crankshaft seal...
Another group is alt.true-crime. Should I post articles here on various news-worthy stories,
along with my opinion on how the Scott Peterson case is going?
Instead of sci.geo.satellite-nav, should I post here about the ramifications of
Selective Availability being deactivated--from a national security vs Joe Public perspective?
How about posting here instead of comp.sys.mac.system about Mac OS 10.3.5?
Since almost all of you are using windows/Linux/Unix, I'm sure you would find
such discussion really compelling...
Are we starting to get the picture?
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Bilbo
Trad climber
Truckee
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Oct 20, 2004 - 04:30pm PT
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HM- Why don't you think politics has anything to do with climbing? I think it does? What about the heads of the NPS? Are they not put in place through a political process? Shouldn't we vote for pro-climber administrations as well as pro-environment admin's to keep climbing going instead of being outlawed?
Ofcourse there are other sites for political forums but do they have the same interests and concerns as climbers?
Just a thought-
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Hardman Knott
Gym climber
Marin Hot Tub Country
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Oct 20, 2004 - 04:37pm PT
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And if that's the case, and you are trying to effect change--which of course I support--
why not do it on the site that boasts 50,000 hits a day, where you will reach a vastly
larger number of climbers?
It is very important to add that everyone who wades into that Community Forum
goes in there wanting to read that sort of stuff.
You'll be much more warmly received by a titanically larger audience...
You really should check it out!
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Hardman Knott
Gym climber
Marin Hot Tub Country
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Oct 20, 2004 - 04:50pm PT
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Hey Matt, my post above came up twice. When I deleted the earlier one,
(the one you were responding to)
yours somehow got dumped as well. This has happened before--there appears
to be a bug somewhere. Please repost--I was about to respond and then I saw it was gone.
In the meantime, I'll let Chris know.
Dave
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can't say
Social climber
Pasadena CA
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Oct 20, 2004 - 04:51pm PT
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HK, while you don't seem to think off topics are appropriate on this forum, I do. I am a climber and while I do enjoy climbing threads as much as the next person, I also have had many of those same conversations time and time again. So the redundant nature leaves me non-plussed.
But since one part of who I am is a climber, and I enjoy the company and conversations with the same people, why shouldn't I be able to engage them in topics not specifically climbing related. Some of the people on here are old friends I rarely get to see in person anymore and being able chat, flame and chortle with them here makes my day that much more enjoyable.
It's like my cycling friends, when we go riding, we rarely talk about bikes or cycling etc. since, like I said before, we have had those conversations time and again.
But that's me
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Matt
climber
SF
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Oct 20, 2004 - 04:57pm PT
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well that tears it-
if dave gets to delete my posts, i am switching to usenet!
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David
Trad climber
San Rafael, CA
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Oct 20, 2004 - 04:57pm PT
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I'm with Melissa. I think that perhaps we simply need to break the forum in to at least two directories with "climbing" realted subjects positioned prominently at the top of the page. It would be an imperfect solution because people would have to be trusted to post in the appropriate area but I think most would.
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Hardman Knott
Gym climber
Marin Hot Tub Country
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Oct 20, 2004 - 05:06pm PT
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David wrote:
I'm with Melissa. I think that perhaps we simply need to break the forum in to at least two directories with "climbing" realted subjects positioned prominently at the top of the page. It would be an imperfect solution because people would have to be trusted to post in the appropriate area but I think most would.
Yeah, but then someone would have to weed-out and delete the political posts
that guys like Matt would surely make in the Climbing Section--in order to continue to annoy us.
Then there would be cries of "censorship!" and "Nazi Mods"--just like Rockclimbing.com...
As PTPP would say, there's gotta be a better way...
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David
Trad climber
San Rafael, CA
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Oct 20, 2004 - 05:09pm PT
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I'm talking about self moderation. When starting a thread you simply click a radio button to tag your thread as either "Climbing" or "Gutter". It will automatically show up in the right place. A bit of admin moderating once a month or so should clean up the rest.
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Hardman Knott
Gym climber
Marin Hot Tub Country
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Oct 20, 2004 - 05:14pm PT
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But if you have some clowns deliberately posting political stuff in the climbing
section, (which I think is highly likely) it would require constant baby-sitting,
and wouldn't be much different that what we have now...
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Hardman Knott
Gym climber
Marin Hot Tub Country
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Oct 20, 2004 - 05:19pm PT
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Matt wrote:
well that tears it-
if dave gets to delete my posts, i am switching to usenet!
I would be bummed to see you go.
After all, every forum needs its class-clown...
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David
Trad climber
San Rafael, CA
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Oct 20, 2004 - 05:24pm PT
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"But if you have some clowns deliberately posting political stuff in the climbing
section, (which I think is highly likely) "
Ya think? I figured most would play by the rules but perhaps I'm dreaming.
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