Spilled Wildshield Whiper Fluid (Methyl Alcohol) on Rope

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rgold

Trad climber

Poughkeepsie, NY

Aug 19, 2018 - 05:53pm PT

If you don't want to use the rope, give it to a chemist climber.

Someone who prefers facts to superstition.

Superstition? Neither he nor the hypothetical chemist know for certain what is in that fluid that his rope marinated in all day.

What does a person who "prefers facts" do whe reliable facts are not available? Perhaps, if in addition to facts they understand something about expected value, they will take the consequences of their options into account.

Dude, kiss that rope goodbye and buy a new one. It may be fine, but if it isn't, then you (or in a sense even worse) your partner, or the fact-preferring chemist, is dead.

NutAgain!

Trad climber

South Pasadena, CA

Aug 19, 2018 - 06:15pm PT

I gotta agree that Werner is presenting a logical approach to empirically determine whether or not there would be problems.

Ed Hartouni

Trad climber

Livermore, CA

Aug 19, 2018 - 06:59pm PT

what are the requirements for labeling windshield wiper fluid?

who knows exactly what's in that stuff?

I'm not superstitious, I am skeptical of what's on the label. If I buy windshield wiper fluid from Fisher Scientific I'm going to get a pretty good list of what it is I'm buying. Probably not so much from O'Reilly's Auto Parts.

Could be the rope is entirely OK, like I asked: who wants to risk it?

Ed Hartouni

Trad climber

Livermore, CA

Aug 19, 2018 - 07:28pm PT

phyllp was surprised by some of the things on the list...
I'm not a chemist, I don't like it when my ropes get contaminated with unknown stuff...

I climb with my ropes a lot, and a long time too, but if something happens to them outside of climbing I usually retire them.

Reilly

Mountain climber

The Other Monrovia- CA

Aug 19, 2018 - 07:41pm PT

Nice, Ed, blame it on the Irish!

rgold

Trad climber

Poughkeepsie, NY

Aug 19, 2018 - 07:46pm PT

Something for those fact-preferring chemists, from http://www.mytendon.com/adverse-effects-of-car-fluids-on-mountaineering-ropes

A considerable reduction of the number of falls can be seen with the brake fluid, the antifreezing mixture for radiators and the summer windshield washer fluid. If a used rope is contaminated with those chemicals, we recommend not to use it any longer. The reduction of the number of falls due to wear and subsequent contamination could have fatal consequences.

WBraun

climber

Aug 19, 2018 - 07:59pm PT

OMG !!!! one fall less lol.

We used to tape over our rope core shots and keep climbing on those ropes, Bridwell taught us that. lol.

Not recommended for the faint of heart or the paranoid.

Damn even jumared on the core of the rope itself, meh.

Don't fall was the motto.

Modern climbers fall all over the place now a daze

Soo st00pid.

After 100 falls and hangs "I finally did my latest project" is the new motto, lol.

Whatever ....... ha hah ha

rgold

Trad climber

Poughkeepsie, NY

Aug 19, 2018 - 08:04pm PT

OMG !!!! one fall less lol.

OMG !!! 20% reduction in the capacity of a brand new rope!

...The reduction of the number of falls DUE TO WEAR AND SUBSEQUENT CONTAMINATION could have fatal consequences.

Werner's point seems to be that if you are cool climbing with a rope with taped core shots, then soaking a rope in washer fluid isn't going to stop you. Fair enough...

skywalker1

Trad climber

Aug 19, 2018 - 08:17pm PT

I'm with Werner. Still unsure then slice it a long its length, find an obscure area. If it looks good inside then tape it up and go have fun. :-)

Honestly soak it in some water and dry it. If you still feel you can break/snap that rope, which you can't then retire it.

S...

DanaB

climber

Aug 19, 2018 - 08:25pm PT

what are the requirements for labeling windshield wiper fluid?

who knows exactly what's in that stuff?

Good points. I don't have the experience with SDS (formerly called MSDS) other people here do, but while at work I often need to use them. From what I have seen of product labeling and SDS, I personally would not rely on either one as the final determinant for deciding if a rope is safe/not safe to use after contact with something.

skywalker1

Trad climber

Aug 19, 2018 - 08:39pm PT

MSDS can be helpful or confusing. I had to order play sand and it came with an MSDS that to a lay person could seem like plutonium.

Retire the rope and climb on your partners rope a few years. In the mean time try breaking the thing and post up what you find. Fun topic not being my rope. :-)

S...

Bale

Mountain climber

Aug 19, 2018 - 10:10pm PT

rgold

Trad climber

Poughkeepsie, NY

Aug 19, 2018 - 10:18pm PT

In the CP Nylon compatibility chart, ethanol and ethylene glycol get an A=excellent rating, but methanol and methyl alcohol (10%) get a B = Good, Minor Effect, slight corrosion or discoloration rating with a somewhat unclear footnote, "Satisfactory to 72°F (22°C)" Since the car almost certainly got a lot hotter than that, we are presumably out of the satisfactory range.

I looked at a few MSD sheets for washer fluids; all the ones I found indicated methanol. There isn't even a shred of statistical validity to my sampling.

I'd say the potential for "slight corrosion" caused by the presence of methanol fits with the Tendon tests that found a 20% reduction in total rope capacity.

I made my "superstitions" known before checking any of this and see no need to repeat them. Now some facts have been added, but of course how important they are is a matter of interpretation, and either way of interpreting may be subject to bias caused by having already taken a position.

At this point, as whataboutism starts to head off course, I'd say that the OP has about as much useful information and opinions as he's going to get. Best of luck to you, Jake, and be safe...

Nick Danger

Ice climber

Arvada, CO

Aug 20, 2018 - 06:29am PT

I try to let only granite, sandstone, rainwater, aluminum biers, and pure thoughts touch my ropes.

And snow and ice. Snow and ice are OK.

Gnome Ofthe Diabase

climber

Out Of Bed

Aug 20, 2018 - 07:04am PT

When this troll started I pointed out this rope's integrity became suspect way before it was spilled on, when this (blankety blank) got it.
it became a -gym cord-, Only rope.

As danger says,
I've never let my ropes anywhere near products of any kind!
Especially, never 'foreign' liquids,
never mind anything capable of corrupting the integrity of the strength/durability of my
Life Lines.

The new 'modern' ropes, the skinny cords I've climbed on,
are silky but not sturdy they do seem soft. like planned opalescence?

I also have a 1975 150 foot red, yellow & blue Mummut 9m! & use it too.
It is Light weight, supple but continuous-weave durable stiff sheath,
i don't test it but it still has good stretch, it is my favorite lead rope.
I often tie into the middle and climb on both strands, for my short leads.

I have a work horse, that I did cut the ends off. 20 feet, 10 off each end. It is almost all black, a "Maxum" (New England Ropes?)
A 9.8 that was 'new' on sale as old stock bought from Sierra Trading Post in 1999.& this one k, for sale - I guess.

As Erudite Duck points out,
We Russians climb on duct tapped sheaths.
On core shot cord to single point belays above the apron,
We are just glad it is not 90 feet of goldline.

When Fish gets around to it, he will point out that factory coil
& that my gear will never ware out, it never gets climbed with. . .