(I'm allergic to almost all chemicals)

if you are bi polar, then likely neither pole is good for you. If you have a modest income then there are second world countries with decent health care programs and rural living that one can find. Panama is one example. Super powers, even ex super powers, seem to have lots of big problems. Though smaller countries can too.

Both Russia and the US are huge landmasses with very diverse experiences from region to region. To try and make generalizations is a popular sport but falls short of reality on the ground. You make many sweeping generalizations above based on limited regional experience.

Every empire is on a trajectory that ends in collapse, every one of them. The top .01% of sociopaths will attempt to milk or murder you where ever you go on the globe. The key is to not play and live as debt-free and under your means as possible.

So move where ever you like best and try it out. If you're not tied down to family/kids then you'd be foolish not to.

If you do move, report back from time to time.

(southern countries don't work for me because I can't tolerate heat: my idea of super-warm is 70F, and comfortable indoor temp is 52F...)

I can relate to that! When renting, I used to leave my windows open in winter prior to having a family and find ice crystals in the sink in AM.

Try exploring Northern WY/Maine/MT... there are still 'wilder' regions with less local regulation out in the sticks.

Every empire is on a trajectory that ends in collapse, every one of them. The top .01% of sociopaths will attempt to milk or murder you where ever you go on the globe. The key is to not play and live as debt-free and under your means as possible.

So move where ever you like best and try it out. If you're not tied down to family/kids then you'd be foolish not to.

Life is an adventure. When deliberating choice A vs B?
Choose C!
Go somewhere new! Mexican Riviera! Costa Rica! Argentina? Chile!

It sounds like you want to move back to a rural area in Russia then... Why not try it out?

Sometimes learning a completely new trade can offer some perspectives and opportunities too. I come from an IT background as well which can be soul-killing although profitable. In my own case learning new skills constantly keeps me sane.

My conclusion is nowhere in the US I can escape these issues.

Damn dude you should limit it to just a few hours per night.

I never thought that I would live in the desert, but I do. I also used to sleep with my windows open in the winter. I slept 10 months out of the year on my porch. But this was Yosemite where winters are not that harsh. Once I left Yosemite, my choices that I could afford in the US were places with 10 months of summer, with 4 months being pretty harsh, or 10 months of winter. I chose summer. I still love the United States, but there are days when I wish that I would afford to move to someplace like Panama.

Canada seems like a possibility for you, but I do understand that choosing a new country requires a certain level of energy. When ones health is difficult, that can make new choices tough. I also deal with health issues. America is not friendly towards people with health issues and insufficient funds.

I hope that things work out for you. Perhaps look for a Russian community within Canada.

Did you see my above edit about acupuncture? just curious about your experience.

Ok, I'm out of this thread. You've decided already, you just lack the commitment. Otherwise, you would have already put money down on property in Russia. I predict you'll use the cover of your rejection of corporate culture to override the practicalities of moving elsewhere, since you seem focused on that, and that will get you the commitment you need.

Best of luck,
M

My problems with the US:
the country appears to be a forced labor camp run by the rich and heading into some mad direction of world aggression, destruction of own land, spiraling state debt and division between rich and poor, at this point.
I say "forced labor camp", because healthcare issue is the hook used to install the forced element here (below). I absolutely don't enjoy corporate rat race, which already made me physically ill, from stress and dissatisfaction from meaningless work (software engineer), and unable to work, basically, driven to a total breakdown and diagnosis of biploar disorder, along with some other issues resulting from prior accident.

He is saying that it sounds like you have already made up your mind and just want people to push you in the direction of going to Russia.

Edit: that is if there is no place that you can comfortably live in the US.

Your long term socialist slave training coupled with an uncritical acceptance of the western Left's propaganda and deranged value system is coming home to roost in your overwrought psyche.

The psychological problems you have wrongly attributed in some way to the U.S. would occur anywhere -- given most of your lifestyle choices. They will not go away by moving to a high latitude authoritarian state where the average amount of dopamine provided by sun exposure would not keep a Pygmy shrew happy.

You perhaps need to move to a very sunny climate with low population, get outside a lot more, radically limit your screen time ( computers, TV, smartphones) and quit listening to fake news as#@&%es.

I wouldn't say America is beyond hope, but all the negatives you mention are real and unlikely to change for the better (my perspective).

You've done the research, or I'd suggest rural Maine, Vermont or such.

Did my research on the states like MT, ID and by and large they are still expensive, although some reasonable properties (by US standards) can be had.

As others have written, Canada? Don't know much about it other than BC.

Alaska? Easy to live off the grid there and most soil is fertile. Relatively a "live and let live" mentality from my understanding.

As others have written, this is starting to look like troll looking for validation to go to Russia as you reject all input.

...I want on MY OWN land....

I hear you. I could live on Lk Baikal or Kamchatka. Going to sail from Sweden thru St Petersburg thru White Sea Canal around Kola to Norway in a year. Maybe we’ll go to Новая Земля тоже but I don’t want to glow in the dark.

...I want on MY OWN land....

I truly understand this desire but have learned there's no such thing anywhere on the planet. Lines have been drawn all across the globe and anywhere you are subordinate to someone with more rifles than you. If you have something of realized value, someone will try to take it.

Gov't is really just a larger well run criminal enterprise with better indoctrination for the youth. And as you've noted in areas without much reach or interest of the squid, lesser criminals with fewer rifles than you will still try to take stuff.

Living as a hermit far away in some frozen land perhaps might seem attractive. Perhaps what you seek in happiness might better be defined in your own head first before seeking an address? Family, friends, and lovers are far more important than what particular arbitrary lines on the globe you dwell within.

Doesn't seem like a troll. Seems like someone who has looked hard at this, doesn't really want to move back to Russia, but is running out of options in America. Having health problems while living in America is very difficult, unless you have plenty of money. But long term chronic health problems that limit ones ability to either take a corporate job, or make loads of money, make it very very difficult here.

have you considered that there is lyme disease in Russia? Does Russia go after it aggressively like they do in America? Could that be why it seems more prevalent in America? Just thoughts.

yep.. I miss the conifers. But the desert has its beauty too. Seems like you have looked at Canada already. Out of curiosity, what about Belarus? what are its pluses and minuses? Or have you already ruled out third options? If so.. I would go back to Russia for a visit/stay in a rural town. When is the last time that you were back?

My impression is that Russia, excluding urban tourist traps, is at least a bit cheaper on average than Mexico.

Personally I find many aspects of Russian culture to be appealing, but an American's impression of these things is almost entirely irrelevant to the native-born.

As potential tourist, it's astonishing that a ticket for a 7,000-mile train ride to the Pacific is (in theory, unless I'm mistaken) available for less than $200. Tourist agencies don't recommend this, for various reasons they don't come right out and say.

Air travel is also quite cheap. Mountain areas are of course very remote from most of country.

I gather that one's rights/relationship to "authorities" as a tourist vs. dual citizen vs. regular ole citizen would differ.

Despite whatever downsides to USA there may be, obviously one wouldn't want to mess in any negative ways with the Russian bureaucracy.

As for Lyme disease, this is grossly overblown concern -- purely as a matter of medical science.

Interesting that in Russia, occult healers and such are much more widely consulted than in USA. Not my cup of tea.

Not my cup of tea.

formerclimber, I'm not here to get in a beef with you. I really did offer some constructive recommendations. Did you look at the link on Alaska property I posted earlier?

I found that in two minutes by googling "alaska land cheap". A more thorough search would find even better prices for land suitable for homesteading off grid.

If you are going to categorically reject all input other than agreement to go back to Russia, what are you asking the question for?

I require on-grid electricity and need some wired internet, Satellite internet won't support my work

I would wager finding reliable hardline/cable internet access is still going to be very difficult in rural areas of Russia. I know for a fact that it's hard or impossible to get in the US in many rural areas I've looked for homes. I need very similar high-speed reliable lines to do my work and that severely curtailed where I could live here.

And you can find those in Russia AND what you are asking for??

I have friends that use satellite internet for transmitting/receiving detailed geological and environmental data transfer in remote locations. Why do you need wired internet?

You said you could live off grid. Which is it?

I recently saw a couple of GREAT movies about Russia as gangsterland 1990s (I know that's ancient history now), by a deceased director Aleksei Balabanov. The films were "Brother" and "Cargo." Perhaps compared with some of Quentin Tarantino's work.

MOUNTAINEERING ANGLE: Sergei Bodrov Jr. played lead in" Brother" and apparently became like Tom Cruise of Russia.

While making a film was killed at age 30 by a massive ice and mud flow in the Caucasus. The slide covered nearly 10 miles and killed 125 people.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kolka_Glacier

To me that implies off grid living.

I'm done here. Go to Russia; it's what you want to be told.

From St. Petersburg it's a 30-hour drive or a $300 (RT) flight to Sochi -- which I assume is nearest extensive area of alpine (caucusus) within Russia. Probably the Alps or Norway is same distance or closer....

. The US State Dept. currently doesn't recommend going to Mt. Elbrus-- (my recollection of some of this specific information is weak).

I bet there's some rock climbing in Crimea -- but it might be a little bit complicated there these days, especially for non-natives.

There are definitely things in Urals -- alpine & cragging.

There's crazy-ass stuff waaay out east --- the geography becomes vastly complex.

Hmmm, it appears you're screwed.

Sorry.

Ciao
DMT

One astonishing thing about Russia is the river network. One thinks of the historical "Canadian voyagers"..... and various obsessive, crazy paddling adventurers of today.....

It would be entirely possible to put together canoe trips in Russia that would last for YEARS......given a 100-mile portage here and there (or possibly canals).

MuriKKKa is becomig a fascist paranoid hillbilly $hitshow that it is becoming harder to dirtbag in. It is a an unkind brutal system, becoming the Purge. Europe and China are already making side deals, the market will crash soon enough and they will gladly pick up the pieces of this patriotic sham.

Putin is an authoritarian that controls media, but at least he is honest about it. He is smart, probably the richest man in the world, and he always has a wry smile like the has the Ace up his sleeve. #Putin2020

how is the climbing in Russia?

Okay, I'll take the bait.

You sir, want everything for nothing. Doesn't work that way in the US.

Go home.

Seeing the title of the thread, I knew I could offer no answer, but I clicked in anyway. Maybe I was curious what made you question whether “America gone bad beyond hope.” Reading your posts, I could sense that the struggles were real. Somehow I found many of them relatable (not that moving to Russian is ever an option for me.) While it’s easy for people to dismiss you or question your sincerity in seeking advice once they feel that the wisdom they offered were not taken with the seriousness it deserves (how dare you!), I understand that being as analytical as you are, you’ve gotten no stones unturned and yet still have no clear vision into the landscape.

I believe you’ve covered all, or almost all, possible avenues of getting yourself out of the bind, but there is one area I do not see questioned. One reason that you feel very limited in your searches is your health. In my mind, a healthy adult should be able to adapt to any climate and environment he’s exposed to. Among other things, if you have any joint issue as an aftermath of your prior climbing accident, I wonder what cold climate would do to it esp. when you age. If you are so willing to make drastic changes to your life, have you looked into taking drastic measures to fix your health? Depending on the underlying causes of your health issues, you might find some serious detoxing, fasting, or diet change (elimination) helpful if they hit the right spot. These are not pseudoscience, but are oftentimes dismissed too quickly. Maybe it deserves a duration of dedication to look into your health before you start uprooting.

I’m sure you didn’t expect anyone on the forum to be able to offer you an answer, but for the time you take to articulate your hundreds of threads of considerations, I hope you at least find the discussion a helpful sounding board, rather than a total waste of time. Best wishes to solving your inner debate.

If you pin your hopes on 'elected' puppets anywhere on the planet you will be sorely dissapointed.

Sounds like you need to go on a vacation to Russia and take a hard look before deciding...

You've clearly decided that everything here sucks, so definitely move. Post back with some pics of your Dacha, or whatever they're called. Russia is a fascinating place. Just recently read a great biography of Peter the Great. Or you could go to Stolby and die soloing like the crazy people there. Wow. That was sarcasm, btw. I hope you find what works. Stolby IS crazy, however.

You will find, however, that no matter where you go, there you are.

You’re the expert on you.

My best advice is to stay on your meds.

Best wishes, wherever you take your life!

There's still some remains of socialism present

there's still free healthcare.

there're plenty of cheap houses

even free to take houses, in rural areas.

A lot of land one can lease for dimes, for doing agriculture.

the big problem, however, is property theft in most places.

A lot of other crime and safety concerns, basically a 3rd world country situation.

And wonderfully cold climate, cold summers while very small number of ticks in many areas.

As well as there is nothing special about any other country.

Pell , do you think formerclimber is posing (sic) from Olgino?{ Ольгино) every post 100 rubles . 40 posts in 5 hours

they turn all Love It Or Leave It

you sure can sell a lot of hot dogs to the upper middle class when you sing that tune...

LOL. for what purpose? How does this thread serve Russia?

Winemaker
Sport climber

Yakima, WA

Aug 3, 2018 - 10:08pm PT

LOL. for what purpose? How does this thread serve Russia?

To sow dissension. Laugh all you want, but sh#t is going on from the Russians and it isn't helpful. When I first read this thread I thought 'okay, WTF' but as I read it and looked at the times between responses doubt crept in. This is just bullshit to aggravate the masses. Vote in November; the count may be altered, but vote.

LOL. for what purpose? How does this thread serve Russia?

I'm actually not on any meds....but you stay on yours

My suggestion would be Australia or New Zealand.

Wino, Суперпопо, indeed!

20 liters of vodka annually

why life expectancy plummeted after the Russians gave up the soviet?

Humor is the best antidote.

Kinda like

There is no paradise on the Earth

You haven’t been to Norway apparently.

Donald Trump’s environmental policies may have caused controversy in the US but the president’s stance has managed to get him a literal stamp of approval from a Russian mining company.

Uralasbest, one of the world’s largest producers and sellers of asbestos, has taken to adorning pallets of its product with a seal of Trump’s face, along with the words “Approved by Donald Trump, 45th president of the United States”.

The move follows the US Environmental Protection Agency’s recent decision not to ban new asbestos products outright. The EPA said it would evaluate new uses of asbestos but environmental groups have criticized the agency for not going further by barring them on public health grounds.

Reilly,
Mountain climber, The Other Monrovia- CA


. . . . . will be more welcoming than the Kanadians’ my last three trips there, but knott nearly as welcoming as that HAWT Swedish Immigration officer in June! OMG!

Male life expectancy in Russia is 64 years, according to the Guardian newspaper. A quarter of males die before reaching age 55

You need to read Tom Wolfe’s You Can't Go Home Again.

Russia seems much more corrupt than the us though. The govt system is ripe for abuse. And it seems the culture is more corrupt. I’ve had Russian friends who say they’d never go back because the police and politicians are corrupt and you can’t do anything about it. And as you mention theft is a problem. 

Gotta disagree on building codes. Yes there’s too much red tape and fees but for the most part it’s about building safe structures and not having a cess pool pollute your neighbors well. 

Zoning and building regs are vastly different from state to state and town to town in the US...

I bet with a little research you could find a rural place in this country to suit your needs.

Build a tiny structure to code with whatever materials you'd like.

Detroit has some really, really cheap "clean" lots... :)

I think you mentioned you were bipolar... if that's true then that's not going to change with your address. Something to think about.

The view that all of us can go somewhere and live anyway we like no longer applies. There are limited resources, water, land. We need to respect our neighbors as they need to respect us and not just f*#k things up to suit ourselves.

So, love it or change it for the better. For 99% of Americans it's really impossible to leave. I'm fortunate as I have US and NZ passports, as does my daughter. It ain't that easy for most.

Uh, you can stay in most civilized countries if you gots the coin. With most you only have to get yer passport stamped elsewhere every 6 months. NBD

I think you mentioned you were bipolar... if that's true then that's not going to change with your address. Something to think about.

...And places like Detroit are not safe....

Sounds like you want rural/frontier living but with modern conveniences like grid electricity, high speed Internet access and 'safety'... for cheap.

 a rural house with 2 acres of land
 I'd like to live simple life, do small farming, few goats and birds, big vegetable gardens, things to make me food-independent.
 wild tall growing grasses, no manicured lawns, wildflowers growing tall everywhere, beautiful nature mess,

Ecuador is an increasingly popular choice for American ex-pats. You sure you want to tackle the cold winters in Russia? Especially if you are bi-polar, winter cabin fever will make it worse. As you get older, the cold is harder to take.

Try northern California:
...

40 acres by Mt Shasta:
..

Former Climber - try Canada. But not in the cities.

I would wager the "empty villages" and abandoned areas of Russia are likely not 'safe' either.

Sounds like you want rural/frontier living but with modern conveniences like grid electricity, high speed Internet access and 'safety'... for cheap.

If you find it, please let me know where. Promise I won't tell!

I didn't mean the bipolar thing as a jab... not at all... I just meant that if you have a serious mental condition, uprooting yourself to a foreign place with no social ties probably isn't the best idea.

What about saving up for an extended off-the-grid 'vacation'? True isolation... tent, boots, pack. A month or two of hiking might do some good. There are plenty of places you can still get lost for that amount of time.

It's troubling that you can't figure out what the above means.

It means you can move as much as you want, as far as you want; you will still have the same brain with all the same problems, you will still be bipolar, with all the problems that carries. You can't outrun it. It doesn't get filtered out by a visa or a border. A different culture exposure doesn't fix it.

Interesting. formerclimber, I scanned your replies quickly and was most shocked to find out that you are a "she" not "he". I definitely have a certain gender stereotype in my mind and would have never guessed that you are a woman. Without getting into details (and risking being politically incorrect), let me just say you have my respect for your vision.

Talk about your vision...

a rural house with 2 acres of land
I'd like to live simple life, do small farming, few goats and birds, big vegetable gardens, things to make me food-independent.
wild tall growing grasses, no manicured lawns, wildflowers growing tall everywhere, beautiful nature mess,
I don't mean to cherrypick, but those are a few things that stood out in my mind. Sorry if you've mentioned this already that I missed, but have you ever lived your vision anywhere?

In my observation, usually being food-independent takes a village, or at the minimum, a family. There is a reason why rural developing regions prefer having boys because living a food-independent life (for many, not by choice) demands strong and ample labor.

Wild tall growing grasses need attention as well because they can quickly become fire hazard in a dry season.

The upkeeping of a house, esp. a rural house, and acreage where labor help is scarce, can sometimes be overwhelming, esp. for a lone woman. (Yeah, I'm no feminist.)

One last thing, you mentioned you were bipolar. Could there be any chance that you also had/have depression? (No need to answer me/here.) One's mental state can also affect his/her outlook on life too, something I try to self-examine frequently.

Oh, maybe just one more thing. All studies have pointed out that social isolation is not healthy for an aging mind (think dementia and Alzheimer, etc). Loners beware, maybe?

My old college roommate teaches at a small university in the midwestern corn belt located in a smallish town of 15,000 people surrounded by endless agriculture. You can buy a decent house there for $25k, a nice place for $70k, and a really, really nice place for $150k. Most of the homes on the market there are under $130k, I'd guess the median home price is $70k. An old four-square style two-story farm house on a few acres five miles out of the city would be very cheap there.

It's a college town, so there is culture and amenities, of course good internet due to the Univ, it's a reasonable 1hr drive to larger cities with almost anything you would ever need and you can be in really big cities within 3hrs if you need an international airport or something of that nature. Obviously the climate and conditions are prime for agriculture, growing food would be easy enough. It gets hot in the summer for a month or so, like almost everywhere else in the US, but has cold winters, plenty of water, and nobody is going to care if you have some animals and a garden - unless your house was "in town" you would stick out more if you didn't have animals and grow crops.

There are many similar towns in this area of the country, all across Iowa, Illinois, Nebraska, Kansas, Missouri. They are not exciting places if you are seeking "mountain sports", but there are ample outdoor recreation opportunities, the towns are "lively" with good food, music, pubs and that sort of thing, and it's very cheap and easy living with low crime.

There are rural parts of Washington with very reasonable real estate and in Eastern Washington the sun actually shines! Our very own Wayno lives there. It is waaaay better than the Midwest.

A friend just sold her 5 acres with a nice big house 5 miles from Tonasket for $200K,
pretty damn cheap if you ask me. $20K per acre is pretty standard anywhere decent.

The only downside of having a small farm is being dead-tied to the place.

Oh, I'm a feminist, not sure why not be one.

In Russia, I do know women who do this alone. In fact, some people in Russia (pension age) do this because this is the only way to have something to eat! And those who are not alone mostly got fist-fighting drunks for a husband in rural areas, hahaha, not much use, expect in terms of knowing to find where vodka i

Worst thing is lack of motion and lack of mental stimulation.

Of course I do have depression, and it doesn't respond to any medications, neither I can tolerate side effects from them. I have it all my life.

I'll definitely give this move a heavy thought...

That’s a bummer for all of us, but probably mostly for her.