not a big fan of Trump, but...

Definitely the largest discriminatory policy in history

Prius have supplanted BMW as the biggest dicks on the road.

UC has gone through many iterations of Affirmative Action since then and one could say it's someone based on merit system now. Asians comprise about 14% of Ca population and about 40% of UC enrollment. Whites are about 49% of the population and comprise about 38% of enrollment. UC is mandated to take the top 6% of h.s. seniors. So based on merit alone a lot of white kids aren't cutting it. It's posited that if UC went strictly on academic measures only, Asians would comprise about 90% of enrollment. But, then there is football and basketball and swim teams that must be populated.

Reilly, he finally kicked the Prius's out of the diamond lanes.

To continually say we must make amends for past actions is simply not logical.

Such a burden, being born white in America.

Such a burden, being born white in America.

"I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin but by the content of their character."

I find it odd how white people of privladge assume every other white family enjoyed similar upbringings

The really funny irony here is that the Democrats on this site that believe in "white privilege" are hearkening back to the era when Democrats were the racists! LOL

It's just white guilt stemming from their racist roots. But that era is long-past, and it's time to talk about present reality rather than four and five decades ago. "White privilege" went the way of Democratic racism; deny Democratic racism today, and you have to deny the white privilege that went along with it

the hand must now provide free tissues for traumatized white people like Mad Bolter and c wilmot

don't remember our history?

Prius have supplanted BMW as the biggest dicks on the road.

The silly assumption white people are born with some secret privladge is a racist assumption in itself.

I seriously doubt anyone who grew up poor would promote discriminating against white people and asians because of the color of skin they were born into

If that really is your background- then you should understand that poverty- not race- is what holds people back

And your accusations that anyone who wants to end such race based policies is a "whiner" - is nothing more than a childish insult. An accusation worthy of a bully

What I find strange is that the perpetually aggrieved...

You're kind of dodging the question, professor. Why did you need to go into deep debt when the UC system had exceptionally low tuition costs and you were on a teaching assistantship? Your story seems less than convincing.

Today "white privilege" is a myth, and it has been for a long time.

when my black girlfriend was handed her Ph.D. on an economic silver platter.

Yeah, that for sure is what a lot of white folks tell themselves.

Maybe she was just smarter than you and eligible for more scholarships???

Of course, mine is just one example. But, you know, it's a catch-22. Anybody like me that talks about "other cases," is "just babbling second-hand, probably false crap that he's heard." On the other hand, if I cite what I know first-hand, well, then that's "just babbling about one case as if it can be generalized."

You expect others to bow down to your expertise and first-hand experience but never accept nor defer to the expertise an first-hand experience of others if it does not fit your world view.

You do the exact same thing all the time in here when it comes to views or facts with which you disagree, from healthcare to climate change by way of the 2016 elections. You expect others to bow down to your expertise and first-hand experience but never accept nor defer to the expertise an first-hand experience of others if it does not fit your world view.

This whole debate boils down to those who blame people for things they never did and were never part of based on the color of skin they were born into.

So selling out the Cali colleges to Chinese students is affirmative action, right?

To continually say we must make amends for past actions is simply not logical.

Larry "TOM" Elder...

Crankaloon, I'm still waiting to hear what your graphic MEANS

His behavior, however, indicates that he has very serious mental problems and one should always have some compassion for the severely disabled.

...granted by an activist conservative majority...

Dude is a SELL OUT!!!

Well I don't mean to speak for Crank but a lot of it resonated with me.

Some examples.

*Most Ivy League schools did not admit women until the late 60s to early 70s.
Penn (my alma) admitted women way back in history so it was about my only option since I didn't want a female only school.

*my brother received full ride athletic scholarship in 1964. Such did not exist for me in any meaningful way several years later. Heck I wasn't even allowed to play b-ball on a full court until Title XI

* ROTC scholarships: Were avail to males only

Key Club scholarships: (HS boys equivalent of Kiwanis). Boys only, scholarship offers.
Demolay: boys scholarship. Rainbow Girls: no scholarship

HS did not permit girls in shop, metal shop, or heaven forbid: drafting!!! Advanced bio and calculus open to girls only after eligible boys were enrolled.

Going for a history PhD at Penn ... a girl really? Constantly reminded that there isn't a college that will hire a woman instructor in history. They were almost right. How liberal and wonderful could UCSanta Cruz be? Oh my dreams could come true. Also for a female friend who was a new bio PhD.
Within two years it was clear that a woman would never be advanced to tenure track. However, you only have my word that it was "under the table" sexism, and not because I was unqualified. As for my bio friend, she never stood a chance in the male dominated science department. Very troubling treatment by "colleagues". And all this in ultra liberal UCSC in the 70s.

So don't take this as whinging. My academic prep and professional life have been very rewarding. I don't play the victim card. However there were frustrations and "greater powers at work" which did make roadbllocks and I had to take detours. So be it. But to suggest there weren't roadblocks that have derailed some women's dreams is sophomoric. I've tried to live by the adage "you can't control the wind, so adjust your sails".

Oh an BTW when involved in anti war activities, specifhcally SDS, women were primarily used for running the ditto machine, making coffee etc. So even radical groups BITD adhered to traditional sex roles!

I could give ton more examples, but heck I have a life. I truly believe many women of my generation had to run faster, jump higher and be willing to be called a "bitch" or coded "well isn't she ambitious" to make some of the strides we have. In retrospect I can't say I liked it or felt it was fair, but it was character building. So over the years while not radical or self righteous regarding civil rights I do remain vigilant. A lot of sh#t still happens in the "old white men" circles.

and mb1 wishes it still was like that

so hard to define what will make the playing field equal, or what constitutes a "hand up, not a hand out"

Are you trying to say blacks should not be helped because asians are so successful?

Susan clearly understood my post and gave some meandering thoughts, but she didn't answer my question.

Let me try to another tact:

1. Colleges discriminate against Asians in admissions.
2. Why is that OK?

If you disagree with (1), you're free to do so, but that is essentially a fact. Disagreeing would be similar to disagreeing with the statement that black families have a lower average net worth than white families.

As to (2), I have no idea what a reasonable answer would be, and that is what I'm looking for.

If you think white males don't have an advantage in our society, and you really believe this with your age and experience, I'm certainly not going to convince you otherwise.

Look at any of the numerous studies, polls, graphs, etc..they're easy to find.

The group less inclined to believe there's any degree of white privilege? Conservative white men. Enter Wilmot and Wall of Text Maker.

Are you a lawyer, by chance?

just many decades old.

Harvard where some instructors gave all A's to keep students out of the draft

That's the sort of utter BS, poking-with-sticks CRAP that makes these "discussions" not even worth honest people's time. Seriously, you should be ashamed of yourself that you find it acceptable to impugn people's motives in that way.

That sort of comment is unacceptable, and honest people on this site should decry it. Only that way can we elevate the discussion to include all and only demonstrable facts and principles.

Mueller' special team: Out of 12 attorneys, 2 women.

privately funded ones are exempt

privately funded ones are exempt

WHY are libs not screaming and threatening to burn down

released has been in place for quite a while in Canada.

It is not at all true that Howard only admits blacks.
Can you identify the following, who I believe is one of the more famous (or infamous) Howard alumna of recent years?
(She did end up suing Howard for discrimination, but still)

WTFover you ignorant trash

Trump, but...

I don't need a guy wielding a shovel for 15 bucks an hour to speak English...

But I wouldn't expect anyone living a life of White Privilege to grasp that...

You feel a patient has the right to request the race of their doctor?

How about sex? I've always gone to a female obgyn for my own comfort level. Am I sexist?

I don't know. Is a man who feels a male doctor is more qualified to treat them based on their comfort level sexist?

kingtut:
If you had been subjected to racism all your life you might understand why a Black American didn't feel the same way and would be more trusting seeing a Black Doctor.

kingtut:
Currently, Hispanics represent something like 30-35% of the population of California, but the number of new Doctors being trained at all of the Med Schools in the state (that those Hispanics are paying for) are something like 3% of admissions.

This is why a goal of only accepting the most "qualified" based on test scores and GPAs is not suitable for medical schools and other professional schools.
...
It is very real that patients often don't trust their doctors and that is a barrier to healing. Never being able to see a doctor of your ethnicity is a barrier to access.

I'm still trying to come to grips with "Hillbilly Elergy".

As for your "non-politician" POTUS, how's that working out? How's the winning going?

I read a study some time ago that pointed out that--at most--these schools add 5% to a graduate's earnings.

Personally I view people who see race as a factor in who they choose as a doctor to be affected by racist thinking.

I just want the best medical care possible

kingtut:
Unless you were a physician practicing in Kazackhstan and have first hand experience, like I have with black patients, then you may have some credibility.

kingtut:
And you can spare us any more cute anecdotes from the former Soviet Union that play to Putin's Nationalism, which is based on racism.

As for your "non-politician" POTUS, how's that working out?

that race should not be a factor when seeking medical care

that race should not be a factor when seeking medical care

Monolith, was she fortunate enough to have an un-diagnosed MRSA infection?

The number one predictor of success was a willingness to work hard
..
the poor levels of preparation for .. my students was the killer .. for them.

I have also read two or three other "saved-by-education" biographies, including "A Hope in the Unseen." They all seem to be the same: it is possible but very hard to escape being poor and ill prepared. It is hard not to look back in wonder, and, apparently, want to write a book. My conclusion is that trying to apply lessons from individual experiences to national politics is a fools errand.

My conclusion is that trying to apply lessons from individual experiences to national politics is a fools errand.

first I have to say that it is ironic that many voices here decry what they see as "biased admissions" with evidence they claim shows that one applicant had more merit than another but was denied admission based on some arbitrary "intrinsic" attribute (race, gender, "having the right stuff"); the irony being that many of these same voices decry the idea that someone who has achieved meritorious accomplishment should have any more weight in public policy discussion than "the regular Joe/Josephine on the street."

It's pretty lame to try and have a debate with people who want to argue with facts

Facts are stupid things.

your skin color is an arbitrary factor that should have no bearing on admissions

Ed- many people who are white or Asian have been passed over in favor of an applicant of less academic merit with "minority" status.

While yes- there is many factors to admissions- the color of you skin should not be one of them

Healyje- you are fine with it because it doesn't affect YOU.

Blah-blah the disingenuous laywer:

Your "Japan" example is patently ridiculous, but of a piece with your typical engagements here. I made a clear point, that diversity can improve the educational experience for all the students. This experience is not an easy thing to measure and involves elements that go beyond test scores or lifetime earnings.

If that's not clear, I can rephrase so that even a lawyer can understand: Make better than it would have been without that diversity.

Japan having "good outcomes" (whatever "outcome" means is not stated) without diversity is a ridiculous attempt at making a "point" when the assertion had nothing to do with "good outcomes". The assertion was "better than it otherwise would have been". "Better" applies regardless whether the starting point is "good" or "bad".

I hope you're not arguing this poorly on behalf of clients. Even a mediocre trial lawyer would hand you your ass in a courtroom.

They have a lack of doctors, for one thing, and the reduced tax base is holding down the salaries of the doctors that are there, so they emigrate.

John Trudell (1946-2015) was a leader for the Indian of All Tribes Occupation of
Alcatraz in 1969, and went on to serve as Chairman of the American Indian Movement
(AIM) from 1973-1979. On February 11, 1979, he burned an American flag on the steps
of the F.B.I J. Edgar Hoover building in Washington D.C., as he'd been taught in the
military to burn the flag once it had been desecrated; and the US government’s treatment
of Native Americans and its classism and racism had desecrated the flag.

Some 12 hours
after the flag incident, a fire “of suspicious origin” burned down Trudell’s home on the
Shoshone-Paiute reservation in Nevada, **killing Trudell’s pregnant wife, Tina, their three
children and Tina’s mother**. The F.B.I. declined to investigate, and the blaze was
officially ruled an “accident.” After the fire, Trudell turned his tears into writing poetry
and later, spoken word music and acting. A lifelong activist and human rights advocate,
he was quoted as saying “I’m just a human being trying to make it in a world that is
rapidly losing its understanding of being human.”

c wilmot: Healyje- you are fine with it because it doesn't affect YOU.

[–]gloogun270 79 points 2 days ago
I have a confession. I was part of a group in high school called KBD (Keep Blacks Down).
What people don't realize is that black people score VERY high in test scores, even beating out whites and some asians.
But the members of KBD would do all in our power to log in to the adminstrator computers and change scores,
steal papers and circle the wrong answers, even create conflicts against other blacks so they would get in fights and always be at in-school detention.
This wasn't just our high school. This was schools across the nation, working around the clock to make it seem like black people are cavemen dumb dumb apes
who can't even read words that are more than seven letters long. If it weren't for us, black people would be top of every class in the country.
Any former KBD members here?

That's like saying the child of a murderer has to make amends for the sins of his father.

But that's what happened in the US. Our white ancestors enslaved blacks, and stole their wealth, in the form of their entire lives' productivity.

There was no "privilege" for being white, there was no empathy from society because they were white. In fact my father was shamed and osteicized so badly for being poor ( and part of a "bad"family)he joined the military as a means of getting away.

The modest upbringing I enjoyed was s result of my parents own hard work- no one helped them