US national policy issues looming after healthcare?

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guyman

Social climber

Moorpark, CA.

Jul 12, 2017 - 12:19pm PT

Guyman
what will you do when you hit 65 and are able to get the evil socialized Medicare???

and the cash Gov. freebie handouts called SS, for you jobless freeloaders

will your mind change then?, or will you just remain a hypocrite

FRY.... don't play the IDIOT, please. Unlike some here you are at least sincere.

Of course I will apply for Medicare... It is the Law you know.

And SS? A freebee??? I have paid into that scam since I was 14...paid a lot.

I don't think Im a hypocrite at all, I just wish for the dumb ass political theater going on in DC to STOP. I voted for President Trump just because he is the wrench in the machine and he might just make it come un-glued .... something I am looking forward to.

Both political parties have let all of US down... from the Republican tough talk for the last 8.5 years to the Democrats "we know what is best for you" actions over the same period.

Both suck and all they care about is the repub vs dem score. The way I see it the score is 0 to 0.

So Democrats .... next time we vote... coming up pretty soon... run some of your people who spout this philosophy of: The RIGHT to health care (paid for by somebody else) Ever increasing TAXES, no gun rights, lead the fight to stop CC, stop fossil fuel.... you know lay it on the line in clear language.

repubs.... do the same, put the things you want out in the open...

Let the voters decide.

PS... I'm not going on vacation--- the Congress is.

madbolter1

Big Wall climber

Denver, CO

Jul 12, 2017 - 12:30pm PT

In the context of this thread about policy issues, I will close with this: integrity and privacy should matter; protecting our nation and shared values (if we have any left?) should matter more than winning an election. These are the messages I would like our legal apparatus to help enforce, regardless of which parties or individuals are broken upon than law.

We are on EXACTLY the same page. And IF a genuine investigation (not just hype from NYT, LAT, and CNN) reveals breach of law, I want them in PRISON. I'm not partisan, and I really do want the swamp drained (not that Trump is likely to contribute much or anything to that process).

What I can't just let slide is the radical double-standard of "evidence" on these threads. That was my point.

And to my mind, anything coming out of CNN at this point counts as anti-evidence, with the NYT a close second.

dirtbag

climber

Jul 12, 2017 - 12:38pm PT

[quote]with the NYT a close second.[\quote]

With statements like it's impossible to take anything you say seriously.

WBraun

climber

Jul 12, 2017 - 12:46pm PT

Dirtbag is as bad as Trump who swallows every bullshIt story he's spoonfed by his beloved stoopid main loon media outlets ......

WBraun

climber

Jul 12, 2017 - 12:59pm PT

You stoopid brainwashed American idiots are useless .....

Cragar

climber

MSLA - MT

Jul 12, 2017 - 01:04pm PT

^^ a lot are but what makes you so useful?

Gnome Ofthe Diabase

climber

Out Of Bed

Jul 12, 2017 - 01:15pm PT

I was just looking to post a Rock on Tuesday . . .

The real thing here is - that what a smoking duck says - gets any play at all?
he is Nanering nincompoop
with a golden line to karmic redemption but his leanings in all ways have be anti-freedom loving , and anti Isreal/USA which is where he is ded on right
If you follow the money , the oil has a stranglehold over this administration,
it's a Russia led take over ,
the government is un-staffed , no state department,
no attorney general.
total division of the proletariat
and the seeds sown for the coming overthrow
A Reichstag moment ?? In slow motion.

Gary

Social climber

Desolation Basin, Calif.

Jul 12, 2017 - 02:07pm PT

"don't think Im a hypocrite at all, I just wish for the dumb ass political theater going on in DC to STOP."...

So you voted for Trump? The logic there escapes me.

Both sides suck, you do have that right.

jstan

climber

Jul 12, 2017 - 02:33pm PT

And SS? A freebee??? I have paid into that scam since I was 14...paid a lot.

At the time I was retiring I did a financial analysis which weighed the net present value of all the payments I had made to SS versus my projected benefits up to my expected date of death, I'd have to find the actual spread sheet to give accurate numbers but my sheet told me

the SS system is not a scam at all. I was going to get back what I had put in,

Now,,,,,,

my calculation did not include the taxes paid by my employer. I think that flow of money goes to cover the SSA's rather minimal overhead charge of 3%. (In the defense industry overhead charges of 400% are not unusual.) The employer charge must also go to cover the SSDI program; a system of benefits for the disabled that Congress put in place with no provision for additional funding.

That said, a story:

When I went to sign up at age 65 I saw a fellow perhaps 30 who was traveling on a skateboard who was picking up his monthly benefit. Since he could travel by skateboard, something I would not attempt, I knew he was not physically disabled. And the fact he was drawing benefits at thirty while I at 65 had yet to see a dime, I knew he was not mentally disabled--- relative to me at least.

I would ask to see the calculation done by the author of the text in the above quote box justifying his statement.

dirtbag

climber

Jul 12, 2017 - 02:49pm PT

Dirtbag is as bad as Trump who swallows every bullshIt story he's spoonfed by his beloved stoopid main loon media outlets ......

Please tell us again how the moon landings were faked, with links to your unimpeachable sources.

Norton

Social climber

Jul 12, 2017 - 03:45pm PT

When I went to sign up at age 65 I saw a fellow perhaps 30 who was traveling on a skateboard who was picking up his monthly benefit. Since he could travel by skateboard, something I would not attempt, I knew he was not physically disabled. And the fact he was drawing benefits at thirty while I at 65 had yet to see a dime, I knew he was not mentally disabled--- relative to me at least.

Jstan, how do you know the 30 year old skateboard fellow was actually "picking up his montly SS benefit"? SS benefits are paid by mailed check or electronically deposited, they are not held at SS offices in the form of either cash or checks. I was told this just two months ago when I accompanied my nephew to the local SS office and overheard the SS interviewer give that answer to him when he asked how he could receive his monthly benefit. So either the SS person was lying to my nephew or he had not been informed that he could show up and pick up his check at the SS office as you say you personally observed the 30 year old. Regardless, I trust your personal interview and in depth conversation with him enabled you to judge him not qualified, and certainly not compared to you.

So why did the seemingly healthy enough to skateboard 30 get SS you may ask. Well, a part of the SS Administration deals with Disability and that means those awards go to people who have been judged to be unable to make a living in America permanently due to either physical or mental disabilities. Your example 30 year old could be able to skateboard but be retarded or mentally impaired. It is very difficult to get on Disability, virtually all initial claims are routinely rejected, it can take literally years of evaluations and hearings before Administrative Law Judges to be awarded Disability pay.

Norton

Social climber

Jul 12, 2017 - 03:48pm PT

Both employee and employer each pay 6.2% of the employee's gross pay into the SS pool.

That money is not differentiated as going specifically to pay either benefits or administrative costs.

madbolter1

Big Wall climber

Denver, CO

Jul 12, 2017 - 04:36pm PT

It is very difficult to get on Disability, virtually all initial claims are routinely rejected, it can take literally years of evaluations and hearings before Administrative Law Judges to be awarded Disability pay.

That's what the NYT would have us believe, but I call BS.

Who should we believe? NYT or CBS? They are about equally liberal. So.... What to do? What to do?

Well, CBS says:

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/disability-usa/

In an interview with one disability attorney:

Steve Kroft: Out of the hundreds of people that you represented, how many of these cases involved strong cases for disability?

Jenna Fliszar: Strong cases I would say maybe 30 percent to 40 percent. And then I would say half of my cases were not deserving of disability.

And the DailySignal, another left-rag has more to say:
http://dailysignal.com/2012/10/12/able-bodied-people-defrauding-social-security-disability-program/

An 18-month investigation by a Senate subcommittee reports that in more than 25 percent of cases reviewed, evidence confirming disabilities was “insufficient, contradictory, or incomplete.” The staff reviewed 300 decisions in which individuals were awarded disability benefits by administrative law judges. A 2011 internal Social Security Administration report echoed the findings, showing a national error rate of 22 percent.

I could go on but don't have time. SS-Disability fraud is a multi-billion dollar per year industry. And it's not "hard" to engage in it! Now over 80% of disability cases are filed by the very attorneys that you see advertising on TV. They make their money when they GET a person on SSD and are paid their fees by the feds. It's quite a racket.

guyman

Social climber

Moorpark, CA.

Jul 12, 2017 - 04:38pm PT

I would ask to see the calculation done by the author of the text in the above quote box justifying his statement.

Jstan ...... its a scam only if the whole program gets canceled on me. I haven't put anything into a Excel just to check, but I can tell you that after i stopped being a bum around climber and became a solid full time worker... I maxed out every year for 25 years.

So you voted for Trump? The logic there escapes me.

Both sides suck, you do have that right.

Gary.... totally logical, who would you have had me vote for?

HRC???? Get real.

10b4me

Mountain climber

Retired

Jul 12, 2017 - 05:50pm PT

For the record, I despise Trump. He's an outrage on too many levels to even list!

Nice attempt at throwing a bone to people who think.

10b4me

Mountain climber

Retired

Jul 12, 2017 - 05:57pm PT

Disengenuous

I'm not partisan

Sure

madbolter1

Big Wall climber

Denver, CO

Jul 12, 2017 - 06:04pm PT

Sure

Whatever. You don't know me.

Splater

climber

Grey Matter

Jul 12, 2017 - 06:40pm PT

Soc Sec used to have a good payout ratio. In fact in the early years the payout was almost as good as California public employee pensions still are.

But gradually the payout ratio was decreased until todays situation where it is a poor forced "investment" for anyone making above lower income.

The tax rate was increased, going to 12.4% total in 1990.
So people who worked much of their career before 1990 paid an average much lower tax rate. https://www.ssa.gov/OACT/ProgData/taxRates.html

Also, starting in 1983 some Soc Sec benefits became taxable income.
https://www.bogleheads.org/wiki/Taxation_of_Social_Security_benefits

And it is correct that the percent of Disability fraudulent claims has increased tremendously. The SSA has been using up the temporary SS surplus at a much faster than predicted rate because the disability fund is already bankrupt and is now taking money from the pension fund.
Because the trust funds are disappearing, by 2035 there be about a 25% shortfall compared to payroll tax revenues. Whether this is fixed with a revenue increase or a benefit cut will be up to the whim of whatever "geniuses" are running the government. So it is quite an assumption whether the present payout formula will be maintained.
And that's not even including larger future shortfalls in Medicare.

https://www.ssa.gov/OACT/TRSUM/index.html

The number of disabled beneficiaries has risen from 1,812,786 in 1970 to 10,237,204 in 2015, driven predominately by an increase in the number of disabled workers.
https://www.ssa.gov/policy/docs/statcomps/di_asr/2015/sect01.html

http://retirementblog.ncpa.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/01/disability-chart5.jpg

https://www.ssa.gov/policy/docs/chartbooks/disability_trends/sect01.html

Gary

Social climber

Desolation Basin, Calif.

Jul 12, 2017 - 07:48pm PT

Gary.... totally logical, who would you have had me vote for?

HRC???? Get real.

Guy, there were more than two people running for office. There's always been a choice beyond Republicrat or Demopublican as long as I've been voting.

BTW, I'll bet you $1000 you get to collect SS and as for as long as you live.