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Gnome Ofthe Diabase
climber
Out Of Bed
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Jan 17, 2017 - 02:14pm PT
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Two things :
1)I am sure that there was young climber in the Pinacels of central Cali in the late 70s,who also
Succumbed due to a rappel gone wrong.
2) rick sumner, Trad climber, Reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
Jan 17, 2017 - 11:49am PT
I popularized it for myself after my first or second dulfer in 1969. I hate that you were proud of your choice, but politics aside
I too, was the one to popularize it & legs loops, for myself.
(If I recall correctly, Craft weighed near 230lbs, and copied me)
I used 1inch webbing for a swami, A piece of 1inch tied with two loops that I then used wrapped around and tucked it to the resulting swami.
When it came time to rap, I pulled the two loops out and stepped into them.
Then clipped either to a short sling or the 'biener brake, directly to the Gap, that was between the two loops.
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Fritz
Social climber
Choss Creek, ID
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Jan 17, 2017 - 07:09pm PT
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Thanks all for posting up your thoughts & memories. I looked at the first few posts on this thread a couple days back & just re-read those & the entire thread.
All fun & fascinating history for me.
I started technical climbing in 1969. Winter of 69-70 in snowy & cold Ketchum Idaho, my friends Chris, Gordon & I would read "Ropes, Knots and Slings for Climbers" revised edition, 1967, Walt Wheelock, while smoking pot. Then we would practice knots, while our stoned state would help to duplicate stressful conditions. Most all the knots I learned have stuck like glue to my memory all these years.
By summer 1970, I had a diaper seat & was using the 6-biner rappel, but I did buy one of those trendy brake bars that slipped onto the gate of an oval carabiner. Unfortunately, it came from REI with no instructions & none of my peers had used one.
The first time I tried it, I was with a group of (once again) stoned friends in Idaho's Pioneer Range. I clipped the two ropes in & started to back over the edge, & the brake-bar popped open & the ropes fell out. I made a second try & once again the brake-bar popped open & the ropes fell out.
After a few seconds of deep thought on the subject, I reversed the brake bar, so the rappel ropes held it in place & I completed the rappel without incident. I never felt safe with one of those brake-bars afterwards.
And I stopped using drugs while climbing soon thereafter.
And for fun, here's another Ketchum friend with harness & 6-biner brake demonstrating how Austrian ski instructors rappel, at Peshastin Pinnacles in 1974.
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Roger Breedlove
climber
Cleveland Heights, Ohio
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Jan 17, 2017 - 07:15pm PT
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After reading these posts, I wonder if climbers today engage in adhocry to get down.
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Juan Maderita
Trad climber
"OBcean" San Diego, CA
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Jan 17, 2017 - 07:38pm PT
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A "baby angle" piton seemed just as effective as my aluminum brake bar.
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rick sumner
Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
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Jan 17, 2017 - 07:53pm PT
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I just about suffocated myself rapping straight down off Sickle in January 1976 with a 1" swami, no leg loops, on four ropes tied together, and packing a 75 lb haul bag. The last 2 free hanging rope lengths just about choked me out. Fortunately I was relieved at each knot by standing in aiders attached to jumars for the passover. Not well thought out, but I graduated to a 2" swami and leg loops thereafter.
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StahlBro
Trad climber
San Diego, CA
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Jan 17, 2017 - 08:03pm PT
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Worked ok for caving as well.
160ft free hanging to the bottom room.
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Caveman
climber
Cumberland Plateau
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Jan 17, 2017 - 08:15pm PT
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"the thickness of the aluminum where it is notched to ride on the biner seemed
very thin."
My guess is that the biner gate would let go before the brake bar.
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Clint Cummins
Trad climber
SF Bay area, CA
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Jan 17, 2017 - 08:30pm PT
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Gnome recalled:
1)I am sure that there was young climber in the Pinacels of central Cali in the late 70s,who also
Succumbed due to a rappel gone wrong.
Yes. Mitchell Haydon (age 16) died in 1976 at the Pinnacles when he was rapping with a carabiner brake on a swami belt,
plus a prusik above the brake that apparently tightened and he was unable to loosen it.
The full story is here, written by Jim Langford who was head ranger at the time (with edits and additions from Jody Langford):
http://web.stanford.edu/%7Eclint/pin/acc/765tomb.htm
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Darwin
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Jan 17, 2017 - 08:59pm PT
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^ Arg. So sorry for Haydon and family back in the day. I suspect when a lot of us were starting out, we weren't far from that kind of disaster. I wasn't. I know now that we might think of how to get out of it, but would we have back then?
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rmuir
Social climber
From the Time Before the Rocks Cooled.
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Jan 17, 2017 - 09:11pm PT
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Mr. Haan and I rapped down from Sickle Ledge on Glen Denny's old (very old) fixed lines back in 1969-70. Those ropes had been up there for years! (Somehow we managed to drop our own cords while setting up the rappel…) I recall using carabiner brakes and some form of leg slings with our swami. Not too clear on the details…
But I do remember the stiff oval cross sections of rope twisting over the 'biners in fits and starts, and the perlon dust collecting and blowing away as we watched our lives dangle before our eyes!
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Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Topic Author's Reply - Jan 18, 2017 - 11:26am PT
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Does anyone have a 1960 copy of Mountaineering- The Freedom of the Hills to see if they show a carabiner brake in that early version?
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Roger Breedlove
climber
Cleveland Heights, Ohio
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Jan 18, 2017 - 01:49pm PT
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Steve, does your question about the 1960 Mountaineers:FotH mean that carabiner brakes were in the 1967 version?
I have been trying to figure out how to answer your initial question: who popularized the CBR setup. Wayne thinks Royal, but Basic Rockcraft was published in 1971, and it seems that most of us think we were using the CBR setup by then. If Kro and Pratt were using CBR in 1960, then how do you define 'popularize'? Any one have a collection of Summit magazines to look through. Is Don Lauria reading along? When do your recall climbers for CBR setups--I cannot remember when your store opened.
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Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Topic Author's Reply - Jan 18, 2017 - 03:12pm PT
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Roger- My sense about the timing has been reinforced by Pat's contribution which is to say about 1960. If the Mountaineers promoted the method at the time of their first edition of Freedom of the Hills that would nail down the mechanism by which it spread as that book was widely read as was Wheelock's offering from around the same time.
I don't recall seeing anything in the early Summit magazines about carabiner brakes.
I think it is safe to say that the rescue community was likely responsible for the broader development of carabiner brakes for single line lowering of litters prior to being applied to rappelling situations.
By narrowing the question to the mechanism of popularization within the climbing community, it does allow a reasonable answer to be found in my estimation.
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rgold
Trad climber
Poughkeepsie, NY
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Jan 18, 2017 - 03:16pm PT
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I recall seeing improvised brake bars, eg angle pitons, suggested in very early rescue texts. I was reading them in the late fifties and they were probably written in the forties.
Another question is when the cavers, who have typically been ahead of the curve when it came to rappelling, started using brake bars or those racks of brake bars they use now.
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Caveman
climber
Cumberland Plateau
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Jan 18, 2017 - 04:48pm PT
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I started using a rappel rack in 1974. I never saw carabiner brake bar usage but then a rack would be a better descending device. I'm guessing the rappel rack came about in the early or mid 60's. Cavers used rappel spools, dulfersitz, racks, munter hitches, whale tails, and probably biner brake bar rigs. I know of one that went down and back up a chain that he clipped biners through. The less efficient methods fell by the wayside.
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Jan 18, 2017 - 04:54pm PT
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And I stopped using drugs while climbing soon thereafter.
Hmmm, back in SoIll we quite intuitively all had the exact opposite response...
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StahlBro
Trad climber
San Diego, CA
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Jan 18, 2017 - 04:57pm PT
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The picture I posted of my brother was probably '71. Cave of the Winding Stair. We learned to dulfersitz in '69, but it was for emergencies only. We always used a 5-6 oval 'biner brake for climbing. My and bro and I were so light back then we only used a double brake for overhanging stuff or single strand.
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Tricouni
Mountain climber
Vancouver
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Jan 18, 2017 - 08:17pm PT
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The 1960 "Freedom of the Hills" (the 1st edition) mentions carabiner brake systems in the chapter on Rescue. For ordinary rappels, they recommed the Dulfersitz. They do discuss a single-carabiner rap system, using a diaper or figure-8, but don't really recommend them.
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Mighty Hiker
climber
Outside the Asylum
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Jan 18, 2017 - 09:29pm PT
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All very interesting!
A copy of Wastl Mariner's 1963 book "Mountain Rescue Techniques" might help shed light on this. Or some earlier rescue manual, although they may only be in German. Has anyone got a copy?
Through the great kindness of Stewart W, who sometimes posts here, I recently acquired copies of the early MSR newsletters (early 1970s), which include information on home-tied sit and chest harnesses, and lots of entertaining editorials.
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Jan 18, 2017 - 09:50pm PT
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A couple of dulfersitz's was more than enough for all of us to immediately sort out another approach to rappelling given a lot of our crag was overhanging on the lower half.
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