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Fossil climber

Trad climber
Atlin, B. C.
Jul 24, 2016 - 07:53pm PT
The Washington Post article lays it out almost perfectly. Those who are persuaded by fear of the future and xenophobia, both of which Donald is Trumpeting, will not even read it carefully and will deny what they read. There is nothing more dangerous than a true believer - and a true believer is one who has been encouraged to express his - usually suppressed - darkest instincts. That's what DT is doing.

Read up on Germany in the 30s - there's a lot of similarities. Economic depression, angry public, a scapegoat race or religion, charismatic personality claiming to fix everything.

Hillary is no paragon, but she is known to be able to work with others. DT is an arrogant reactionary. HIs way or the highway. I shudder to think of him and Kim Jong Un - peas in a pod - reacting to each other. Or Putin.

Remember the concentration camps for Japanese-Americans during WW2? With DT in there I suspect it won't be long before Muslims are treated equally. And not just the suspect ones.

As usual, it's a choice of two questionable candidates. But remember Germany in the 30s.
BLUEBLOCR

Social climber
joshua tree
Jul 24, 2016 - 08:00pm PT
^^^ well we got till november.

There is nothing more dangerous than a true believer - and a true believer is one who has been encouraged to express his - usually suppressed - darkest instincts. That's what DT is doing.

DT is shinning his darkest instincts. true believers reliquinsh it.

BLUEBLOCR

Social climber
joshua tree
Jul 24, 2016 - 08:07pm PT

Pople in the USA have no clue how easy their life is.

maybe your thought is that we have no experience in this matter? but we have been exceeding clued in!
zBrown

Ice climber
Jul 24, 2016 - 08:15pm PT
Pictured, Sammy Davis Jr. and Nancy Sinatra had it so ez in life. Got their fair share all right.

zBrown

Ice climber
Jul 24, 2016 - 08:26pm PT


[Click to View YouTube Video]
10b4me

Mountain climber
Retired
Jul 24, 2016 - 09:36pm PT

^^^ where do you think evolution gained it's start? from "conservatism" or "chaos"?

You seriously can't try to equate an ideology to a biological event
rottingjohnny

Sport climber
Shetville , North of Los Angeles
Jul 24, 2016 - 09:44pm PT
Zbrown...You sure that's Nancy and Sammy...?
Ken M

Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
Jul 24, 2016 - 09:54pm PT
Pople in the USA have no clue how easy their life is. But, we tend to envy other people, than to be happy with what we have. In the article cited by Ksolem, they complain that a lot of poor people use illegal drugs. As somebody who knows what "poor" means, I almost started laughing. How those poor people can afford buying drugs in the first place??? You call them poor?

I think this is a critical point. Extreme poverty is rare in this country. When it exists, there is often an associated problem, such as chronic mental illness. Those people cannot "pull themselves up by their own bootstraps"

I think we humanely owe these people food, shelter, and guidance.
rottingjohnny

Sport climber
Shetville , North of Los Angeles
Jul 24, 2016 - 09:55pm PT
Props to Hillary...
BLUEBLOCR

Social climber
joshua tree
Jul 24, 2016 - 10:01pm PT

You seriously can't try to equate an ideology to a biological event

i don't know?? ask Fruity if there is anything besides biological!!
BLUEBLOCR

Social climber
joshua tree
Jul 24, 2016 - 10:14pm PT

I think we humanely owe these people food, shelter, and guidance.

interestingly, i have never heard a blue whale, porpoise, lion, or chimp say anything like that
Ken M

Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
Jul 24, 2016 - 10:28pm PT
interestingly, i have never heard a blue whale, porpoise, lion, or chimp say anything like that

I also don't think I've heard a Republican say that. Nice dodge, though.

Perhaps, if you disagree, you can point me to that plank in the Repub Platform. I can't find it.
rottingjohnny

Sport climber
Shetville , North of Los Angeles
Jul 24, 2016 - 10:34pm PT
Cosmic...Here's a 3 stooges eye poke for you...
BLUEBLOCR

Social climber
joshua tree
Jul 24, 2016 - 10:36pm PT
i'm not disagreeing with you. i'm also disagreeing with Nature/Evolution, which you also seemed to be doing?
overwatch

climber
Arizona
Jul 24, 2016 - 10:54pm PT
Remember the concentration camps for Japanese-Americans during WW2? With DT in there I suspect it won't be long before Muslims are treated equally. And not just the suspect ones.

As usual, it's a choice of two questionable candidates. But remember Germany in the 30s


so we should expect another Reichsmordwoche?

. In the article cited by Ksolem, they complain that a lot of poor people use illegal drugs. As somebody who knows what "poor" means, I almost started laughing. How those poor people can afford buying drugs in the first place??? You call them poor?

who says they're buying them?
nah000

climber
no/w/here
Jul 25, 2016 - 01:37am PT
Ken M: you're right i got a little too emo with regards to the dnc and the wikileaks drop. i shouldn't have said it proves the dnc was in bed with hillary but rather that it proves that some individuals within the core dnc team let their biases influence their actions and combined with the evidence of the dnc drastically reducing the number of debates and placing them at inopportune times to name one example, strongly suggests to me that collusion with hillary's camp was likely [albeit to this point this is still admittedly unproven]. i also went too far with regards to the press, because what you suggest is true. there are aspects that do look fishy, but there is nothing that i have seen with regards to this that prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that anything more than garden variety fact checking was necessarily going on. with that said, i'd still be outraged if i was bernie or one of his supporters as there is no way, shape or form that the dnc acted as an unbiased entity as it is mandated to do.



HFCS: ok i read the wapo article. i agree with everything they say. and this sums up their key point from my perspective: "The U.S. democratic system is strong and has proved resilient when it has been tested before. We have faith in it. But to elect Mr. Trump would be to knowingly subject it to threat."

i agree and have no illusion that a trump presidency wouldn't be a likely and by choice test of the u.s's system of checks and balances. and whenever one tests something there is a possibility that it will fail...

that said, i think subjecting the system and the voting public to four or eight more years of empire based economic/political/militaristic policy will only lead to a stress test far greater than trump...



the point: trump is a symptom.

ignoring him and voting in the same problem will inevitably result in a new harder to treat symptom four or eight years down the road...



finally as i've spent a bunch of time ranting, i think it's only fair that i lay out what i believe the actual problem is at the most fundamental level. then i promise i'll shut up for a bit.

when taken as a whole, the u.s. in terms of actual base level election process is, at this point, nothing more than a simulation of democracy.

until the following fundamental issues are addressed, all of the other economic, foreign policy, etc. reform that needs to happen, won't. and so here are the, to start, fundamental nuts and bolts that [imesho] would have to be addressed if the u.s. is interested in once again becoming a beacon of fair and representative human organization:

1. rational and neutral redistricting. the gerrymandering that has happened in the u.s. is a joke. there are lots of options that are mathematically or scientifically based that solve this problem. how in the fUck this kind of obvious and overt manipulation can happen in this day and age is just this side of unbelievable.
2. reform first past the post. there are many systems that are far more democratic and keep power from being so entrenched in two parties that the majority of people by definition must end up hating both equally. reform of first past the post, in also resolving the two party problem, will help to address much of the reason behind the voter apathy that currently occurs.
3. get some proper transparent vote counting machines. there are solutions to this problem other than hanging chads and easily hacked diebold machines. that it is even a question that these might have been hacked [and i'll bet dollars to donuts that in my lifetime there will be proof that some of the elections in the early 2000's were hacked: there is too much smoke at this point for me to bet against there having been at least some fire] is again just this side of unbelievable. regardless of whether they were hacked/hackable or not, that this simple problem continues to exist, when there are known solutions that could easily be solved by a number of tech companies in about a month, should be nothing short of an outrage.
4. put some serious teeth behind stopping the usual garden variety but consistently widespread vote manipulation that always happens: not enough voting booths, people redirected to the wrong voting place, people being robo called that votes have been canceled, arcane voter id and registration laws intended to disenfranchise specific demographics and etc. i've always wondered why the carter center feels the need to traipse around the world observing elections when almost every third world vote suppression shenanigan that happens elsewhere is at least rumoured to have happened during every major election somewhere on u.s. soil.
5. place stronger limits [and get rid of the loopholes] on the money that any entity [corporations, unions, individuals and the press] can spend on candidates. what's the point of one person, one vote, if the information flow is heavily skewed to those with money?
6. press reform. right now foxnews is an unabashed wing of the republican party and while the left leaning press may not be quite so unsubtle it's not far behind. anybody with the bandwidth that the mass media is given by the public, has a responsibility to the public. while the fairness doctrine may not have been perfect, eliminating it altogether is in part to blame for the delusional mess of polarized politics that has been left in its wake.

that's off the top of my head... i'm sure i've missed some things, but it'd be a start.



i get that most of the above isn't on the mainstream table at this point.

but if the u.s. is to survive as a democracy it will have to happen at some point. the above don't begin to solve even half of the problems, but without a fair and solid representational foundation all of the other discussions are just shuffling the deck chairs around and attempting to have the tail wag the dog...

the question, from my perspective, is given the choice between tweedle dee [clinton] or tweedle dumb [trump] what's the better method to bide time until the next generation gets so pissed off with this overtly manipulated system that they make shIt happen?



in all honesty i don't claim to know the answer for sure...

at this point [and i must admit that the unreserved darkness of the rnc convention has certainly made me at least pause] i continue to stand behind the argument i've been making, to one degree or another, for the last six months or so:

little [hopefully] meteor 2016!
Escopeta

Trad climber
Idaho
Jul 25, 2016 - 04:45am PT
The OP fears that Trump will the lead to country down the path to a Totalitarian regime and then recommends that we vote for.....Hillary Clinton.

Hilarious.
Reilly

Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
Jul 25, 2016 - 07:01am PT
The key to responsibility is to be:


... at least in Maine.
10b4me

Mountain climber
Retired
Jul 25, 2016 - 07:19am PT
Which is it, nationalism, or authoritarianism, that drives trump supporters? If it's the latter, the trumpsters will get more than they thought.
Bushman

climber
The state of quantum flux
Jul 25, 2016 - 07:33am PT
Blind allegiance to spunk daddy
Messages 201 - 220 of total 510 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
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