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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Jun 27, 2016 - 09:40pm PT
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It's a pity Americans are incapable of handling roundabouts although it
seems Easterners are able to. I guess all the retards are in California.
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Todd Eastman
climber
Bellingham, WA
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Jun 27, 2016 - 09:40pm PT
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Fats, why all the entitlement?
You were inconvienced, BFD!
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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Jun 27, 2016 - 09:43pm PT
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sorry you feel that way, Fats.
But I dont see you offering any alternative, and you simply won't respect other's posts about Emergency Services, or that it was just as bad with two lanes---but no access to Emergency Services.
You just want to gripe, instead of problem solve, enjoy your life. I'm sure your family does.
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John M
climber
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Jun 27, 2016 - 09:52pm PT
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It was pretty shocking to me the first time I had to deal with the lane closures, and that was quite a few years ago. I don't remember when they first tried it. I'm not surprised that someone who hasn't been in the valley in 10 years is shocked at the changes. The park is in a no win situation. For Every change they make , or try to make, they are sued. I supported some of those lawsuits because I thoroughly disagreed with some of the changes, but I can also see how difficult it makes doing anything in the park. So then you end up with less then the best possible outcomes.
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the Fet
climber
Tu-Tok-A-Nu-La
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Jun 28, 2016 - 12:25pm PT
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As I posted in the thread on SUPs, my biggest gripe is they are not ticketing any aholes who were driving in the bus lane (at least that I saw), just waving them back into the left lane periodically. It's bad enough to be stuck in one lane, but to have the rule breakers get off scot free and cause even more congestion, and block the lane for buses is really lame.
They don't have to ticket everyone, just one car at a time, enough to show there is a possible downside for being a selfish prick.
They need to ticket more.
They need to extend the shuttle bus to the full valley loop. Maybe only half the busses make the full loop.
They need to have more stops (e.g. the only one between El Cap and the village turn off is 4 mile trail) where they stop if someone is waiting or someone on the bus rings a bell.
For myself if I have to come at a time where I can't avoid the traffic I'll always bring bikes now. I'd much rather have the one lane restriction than a quota and being turned away at the gate.
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JEleazarian
Trad climber
Fresno CA
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Jun 28, 2016 - 12:55pm PT
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I understand the desire to maintain access for emergency vehicles, but as others have pointed out, the parking lot at the ends of the mess would prevent access in any case. I've long resented those who get away with a trip in the shuttle bus lane after Stoneman Bridge on the way to the Village. Now they have a second opportunity to be jerks.
Still, I'm with Werner on this one. When the crowds are this big, the limited ability of the Valley to accommodate them will lead to the congestion we experience all too often.
I leave it to others to determine whether we can do better. I have my own belief that we can, but this is really the political process at work. Everyone says they want a less crowded Valley, but few tell how much less they're willing to visit to bring it about.
John
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overwatch
climber
Arizona
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Jun 28, 2016 - 12:59pm PT
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if they don't enforce then f u c k it
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nathanael
climber
CA
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Jun 28, 2016 - 01:11pm PT
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I've seen someone get ticketed for it. Not sure how common it is though.
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Fat Dad
Trad climber
Los Angeles, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Jun 28, 2016 - 01:19pm PT
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Ken, sorry to fly off the handle. It seemed like you were deliberating misreading my earlier posts. My bad. I'll make an effort to be more civil in the future.
The primary thing that I've tried to communicate that I think the NPS could explore other options, or build some flexibility into the current system. I understand the need for emergency services, but it's not like the prior system prevented their access, so that's not an end all be all argument. That doesn't support why they're letting buses use the second lane either. Finally, like (Fet?) pointed out, they're not enforcing it anyways, so how important is it really?
Sorry Todd, I don't have an entitlement attitude. The current system just sucks. Knowing they don't enforce it, the next time I could just blow through and not care, but I'd rather try to communicate with someone about discussing ways to fix it. They may totally blow me off (I half expect it), but I'm willing to make the effort, not just kibitz from behind a computer screen.
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dikhed
climber
State of fugue and disbelief
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Jun 28, 2016 - 01:23pm PT
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he started in with the grow up bullsh#t, that always furthers the conversation
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JLP
Social climber
The internet
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Jun 28, 2016 - 03:49pm PT
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After Trump deports all the Mexicans, the place should clear up nicely.
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John M
climber
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Jun 28, 2016 - 04:23pm PT
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but it's not like the prior system prevented their access, so that's not an end all be all argument.
it slowed the response down considerably... so yes it did prevent it to some extent. I"m not sure why you don't seem to understand this. Did anyone die because of slowed response? I don't know. But it was only a matter of time. Its one thing for large distances to be the reason for a slow response. Its another for gridlock to be the reason.
I'm not sure you understand just how bad the situation was. At the south gate, where I worked the entrance for the concessions, the line was sometimes out past fish camp. 4 miles from the entrance. That was with both lanes open in the valley. That didn't slow people down from coming. What slowed them down was the possibility of the park closing. But there was such a huge negative response to it closing that the park had to figure some other way out to allow emergency response. This was what they decided on.
If you have a better solution, then how about saying what it is. The park doesn't close the second lane all of the time. Only when visitor numbers are expected to reach a certain point. They no more like doing it then you like experiencing it. I can guarantee that.
http://www.sierrastar.com/2016/05/18/78911/yosemite-responds-to-traffic-congestion.html?fb_comment_id=1003015263081517_1003688223014221#f2d8e662e4
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WBraun
climber
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Jun 28, 2016 - 08:51pm PT
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I remember a cardiac call years ago on the mist trail where we got shut down by the traffic gridlock
and had to go on foot to get cars to move aside while we crawled ahead in the Rescue vehicle at less then 1 mph.
The response would have been normally a 1 minute drive and took about a half hour instead.
Majid_S who posts here can confirm this as he was one of the two people on foot getting people to move aside.
Lucky it was a false call when we arrived.
All this while some guy from LA who's never even been on code calls nor even driven code calls in bad traffic
says there's really no problem with emergency response due to traffic in Yose.
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JEleazarian
Trad climber
Fresno CA
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Jun 29, 2016 - 10:31am PT
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One thought does come to mind. In the mid-1970's, Adrianna Gianturco, Jerry Brown's Caltrans administrator made the number one lanes of the Santa Monica Freeway into diamond lanes, thereby reducing the number of lanes available for normal commuting traffic. It created gridlock in both directions, often where none existed before. It also created some particularly delicious ironies, because the talented liberal cartoonist for the LA Times, Paul Conrad, had to commute downtown and was a victim of the Caltrans-caused delays. This produced a series of anti-diamond-lane cartoons that would have done an anti-environmentalist's heart good.
The opponents of the conversion to the diamond lane couldn't persuade the Brown administration to remove it, so they resorted to an old environmentalists' trick. They sued to enjoin the diamond lane because Caltrans failed to file an environmental impact report. Judge Matt Byrne ruled that the plaintiffs were correct, and enjoined the use of the number one lanes as diamond lanes.
Which raises the question, has the NPS filed an environmental impact report for the one-lane road rework? If so, where do I find it? If not, anyone interested in a "private attorney general" suit to enjoin the conversion because they failed to produce an EIR?
;>)
John
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John M
climber
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Jun 29, 2016 - 11:06am PT
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LOL.. good idea John, except the closures are temporary each time, just cones used, so no impact required.
Okay.. time to think outside the box... motorcycle ambulances and fire trucks.. no lane closure required.
I also think that we need to get Werner his own helicopter.
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brianszero
Trad climber
gunks
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Jul 12, 2016 - 12:25pm PT
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When I took my wife and kids to the valley a couple of years ago it was not what I expected. Sure it is beautiful, the walls come right out of the earth and the falls make you want to climb to the top and jump off.
Standing there in the valley with all the cars, buses, noise and the first mile or so of each hike with their now paved paths just showed how this park is being loved to death. We spent a few days hiking around trying to avoid the "beautiful valley" as much as possible.
I would say the best way to preserve the true Yosemite experience is to actually limit vehicles altogether. Tourists, travelers, climbers, ect would need to hike into the valley to experience the park.
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WBraun
climber
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Jul 12, 2016 - 12:42pm PT
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They don't work at night and go to sleep at night just like normal people ....
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WBraun
climber
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Jul 12, 2016 - 12:52pm PT
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This is NOT a major city.
This is a National Park.
I spent an hour in the gridlock last Saturday.
So I suffered the same as you.
Sorry .....
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WBraun
climber
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Jul 12, 2016 - 01:00pm PT
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99.9999% of the time I never get get stuck in it.
This is the first time for me in years .....
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kev
climber
A pile of dirt.
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Jul 12, 2016 - 01:19pm PT
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I really don't get why everyone is upset.
1) WHY would you want to be in the valley in the summer? It's a zoo and it's hot as f*ck. Sure there are places to hide from the shade but not the tourons.
2) If Werner nees a lane in an emergency then he should have one.
3) See #1 - I really don't understand heading to the valley to climb right now.
Go mid fall to mid spring and avoid all this horsesh#t.
kev
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