Petzel Mini Traxion for TR soloing

Search
Go

Discussion Topic

Return to Forum List
Post a Reply
Messages 1 - 44 of total 44 in this topic
locker

Trad climber
Joshua Tree Ca
Topic Author's Original Post - Nov 3, 2006 - 11:00pm PT
Well, I have been using it since I saw it posted on here some time back and now I'm curious if it was just a "TROLL" and I am a bigger idiot than suspected...

(Yes I know it has TEETH and all...

But do any of you out there use it for this purpose also???...

(I am suiting up with my Armour awaiting the barrage(sp)...)

Hummerchine

Trad climber
East Wenatchee, WA
Nov 3, 2006 - 11:12pm PT
I use it all the time. I do not trust one, though. I attach one to my belay loop (yow!) with a DMM Belay Master carabiner, and another to a half runner girth hitched (yow again) to my harness. Weight the rope a bit, bomber. I also modified my upper Mini, use a Dremel (or in my case a dental lab drill) to remove the lockout tab on the outer aluminum plate so there is no way to accidentally lock out the cam. No worries about the teeth, I have taken numerous falls with no consequence. I have alse tested a Mini on a very old 8mm, dropping a 25lb weight many times over factor 2, since I threw the weight down. No sheath damage at all. Read all of Petzl's info that comes with the device. I often also use a Yates Screamer on the anchor, in case I fall near the anchor it will absorb any shock load due to minimal rope in the system. I have experimented with many setups and this is the best I can come up with. Good luck, be careful!
Hardly Visible

climber
Port Angeles
Nov 3, 2006 - 11:14pm PT
Locker,
I use the mini traxion for this all the time, put a little weight on the bottom of the rope and its the best little top rope belay around. I tend to use it on stuff that I have pretty wired doing laps and such.
Curt

Boulder climber
Gilbert, AZ
Nov 4, 2006 - 12:19am PT
Yes. I do use my mini-traxion for that--and it works great.

Curt
Kevster

Trad climber
Evergreen, CO
Nov 4, 2006 - 01:18pm PT
If you don't use 2 mini's, I would recomend running the rope through a locker below the Mini attached to your doughnut. So if you fall and the mini for some reason does not engage the biner will stop you on the backup knot you hopefully tied 20 feet from the ground. I hold the Mini up with a piece of shockcord around my neck so it engages pretty much instantly when I am off. I like the dremel idea on the locking tab, haven't done that one yet.

Oh yea, if you want a backup just tie knots in the rope and let them dangle vs clipping them to your harness. That will keep the device sliding smoothly.

When climbing on fixed or static lines I always use 2 devices as backup knots are not really an option.

Gunkie

climber
East Coast US
Nov 4, 2006 - 01:20pm PT
I use a Gibbs and a Petzl Basic. Works for me.
Kevin

Social climber
Oak-town
Nov 4, 2006 - 02:14pm PT
Better yet, use a gri gri

no teeth, better rope feed, and just rap when finished
WBraun

climber
Nov 4, 2006 - 02:26pm PT
Grigri don't work unless you want to spend all your time fumbling with the stupid thing in the middle of a crux.

Guys here in Yosemite use the mini-traxion Kauk, surfer bob, myself, Dean Potter, etc. etc.
'Pass the Pitons' Pete

Big Wall climber
like Oakville, Ontario, Canada, eh?
Nov 4, 2006 - 03:00pm PT
Never trust your life to a single solo belay device or you will END UP DEAD!

Mini-trax should be OK, provided the end of the rope is weighted and there is not any slack. You cannot fall onto a slack rope with a toothed cam or you will end up dead! But you need more than one ascender, either that, or you need to stop every now and then and tie a backup knot.

Two Gibbs ascenders are definitely better since they have no teeth. I would use the new-style ones that have the spring holding the cam shut against the rope.
Curt

Boulder climber
Gilbert, AZ
Nov 4, 2006 - 03:29pm PT
I guess it's fair to assume you don't do much of this, Pete. Also, the "new-style" Gibbs (with the spring) have been around at least 25 years.

Curt
'Pass the Pitons' Pete

Big Wall climber
like Oakville, Ontario, Canada, eh?
Nov 4, 2006 - 03:34pm PT
Bwah-ha-ha-ha-ha!!! Touchee....

It's probably been more than twenty-five years since I made up my last Gibbs ropewalker system. Been froggin' ever since.
Anastasia

Trad climber
Mammoth Lakes, CA
Nov 4, 2006 - 08:05pm PT
I use my mini for soloing. I also solo climbs beneath my grade so I don't have to fall.

If I do, I would rather have the teeth damage my rope then have the device not catch.

AF
KenD

Trad climber
Palo Alto, CA
Nov 4, 2006 - 08:36pm PT
A Trango Cinch is really good for roped soloing. No teeth to damage the rope. Feeds smoothly.
locker

Trad climber
Joshua Tree Ca
Topic Author's Reply - Nov 4, 2006 - 09:50pm PT
Nice to see that it was not a "Troll" and that I am not as much of an idiot as I was begining to believe (Jurys still out on that one actually!!!)...

I use it allot and will continue to...

Quite a few out this way insist that it will easily cut the rope and I am totally nuts for using it to TR on...

So be it!!!

"If I do, I would rather have the teeth damage my rope then have the device not catch"...


You get a big DITTO on that one young lady...
T Moses

Trad climber
Paso Robles
Nov 4, 2006 - 10:24pm PT
I use an Ushba Basic Ascender in Titanium. I tie back up knots periodically. Ultra smooth action. Only locks if you fall. You can move doe slowly (down climb). It eliminates the accidental hangdoging of the standard lockup ascender.
Bazo

Boulder climber
Ky
Nov 5, 2006 - 08:26am PT
What are the advantages of the mini traxion over the petzel shunt? ( I've been using the shunt for a while ).
Gunkie

climber
East Coast US
Nov 5, 2006 - 10:41am PT
What are the advantages of the mini traxion over the petzel shunt? ( I've been using the shunt for a while ).

JMO, but the Petzl Shunt seems to put a lot of force on a very small area of rope. Good for backing up rappels or for stopping mid-rappel, but maybe not so good in the event of a dynamic fall.

Again, just my opinion.
Landgolier

climber
the flatness
Nov 5, 2006 - 11:31am PT
Have any of you grigri/cinch users ever set things up so that the rope goes from your harness up to the anchor and then back down to the device? I saw a guy doing this once and he claimed it was somehow better, but I can't for the life of me remember why. Seems like it would be the worst of all worlds -- crappy feeding and twice as much of it to do, more risk of not locking up, etc... I guess I'm wondering if there's something I missed, or if the dude was just a Darwin Award aspirant.
reddirt

climber
Nov 5, 2006 - 04:54pm PT
I've tried many other configuation/setups (but not the mini traxion) & am a big fan of the petzl microcender (for TR). Just got a sweet deal on the silent partner & have health insurance so I'm ready to do some damage on solo lead. YIKES!
s. o.

Trad climber
academia
Nov 5, 2006 - 11:51pm PT
I've tried a gri-gri and a shunt. My vote is on the shunt because it sucks pulling the rope through the gri-gri. Also, if you have no slack in the system, then your fall is not dynamic. Annother plug for the shunt, there are no teeth and the manufacturer has instructions on how to use the device in a top-rope solo mode.
check out the instructions at en.petzl.com/ProduitsServices/PS_116_1.pdf
note that petzl advocates the basic or ascention for self belay
atchafalaya

Trad climber
California
Nov 6, 2006 - 12:06am PT
I have always used the soloist, thinking of going to the mini-traxion though.
locker

Trad climber
Joshua Tree Ca
Topic Author's Reply - Nov 6, 2006 - 12:46am PT
"I have always used the soloist, thinking of going to the mini-traxion though"...

I used mine right up until it was suggested on this forum to use the Mini Traxion...Bought it, tried it, loved it...

works like a charm...

and it has cool, sharp teeth to boot!!!...

steelmnkey

climber
Vision man...ya gotta have vision...
Nov 6, 2006 - 08:46am PT
I sometimes use a Microscender...from back when it was made by Rock Exotica, now made by Petzl.



It has a machined cam interface and it's probably easier on the rope over the long haul. Always runs smooth. But the mini seems to work well also.
pyro

Social climber
I'm not telling,
Nov 6, 2006 - 04:38pm PT
Grigri works. teeth will snip the rope
bobmarley

Trad climber
auburn, california
Nov 10, 2006 - 09:06pm PT
what about a traxion with a tibloc backup (tibloc extended with a sling running below your harness)? i've seen some tahoe climbers using that technique and it seems pretty bomber.

also, what about a static over a dynamic? seems like the static would handle the teeth a little better than the dynamic.
Hummerchine

Trad climber
East Wenatchee, WA
Nov 10, 2006 - 09:45pm PT
bobmarley:

A Tibloc as a backup would be better than nothing, but definitely nowhere near as bomber as another Mini-Traxion as a backup. The Tibloc is not designed to hold without manually placing it on the rope and tensioning it. It could slip as a backup, especially with the upper Mini-Traxion that may have failed sliding down the rope onto it. I personally feel that a static rope would be a particularly bad idea. Any shock loads possible, including potential damage to a rope from cam teeth would be wildly accelerated with a non-dynamic rope. I also think that static ropes increase danger in climbing, period. I use a Yates Screamer (or equivalent) on my rope just in case I fall near the anchor, because there is so little dynamic rope out to absorb the force of any fall. A static rope would just be a disaster. I have also found that the older a rope gets, the more static it gets. Don't let them get old! Hope this information helps!
bobmarley

Trad climber
auburn, california
Nov 14, 2006 - 11:13am PT
tried out the traxion w/ tibloc backup this weekend. felt like i was fumbling around with the tibloc on backup. kept thinking about both devices slipping and couldn't commit to falling on hard moves. perhaps 2 traxions is best. also noticed in the latest climbing (#235 pg 79) they suggest a setup of one traxion while clipping occasional backup loops on the other side of the rope. i guess the downside would be having to clip the loops while climbing.
WBraun

climber
Nov 14, 2006 - 12:26pm PT
" ...seems like the static would handle the teeth a little better than the dynamic."

Yes ....

Fall onto the damn thing, don't be timid.
Sewellymon

climber
.....in a single wide......
Nov 14, 2006 - 01:18pm PT
i would guess the guys in yosemite using the mini trax are NOT using the climbing ragazine approved "one rope w/ traxion while clipping occasional backup loops on the other side of the rope"?

i use a soloist. tie backup knots on the rope to catch my upsidedown fall (has not happened yet), but don't use a 2nd rope w/ backup knots because it seems like a pain. but i am 100% dependant on the 9mm that attached soloist to harness. should be fine for TR'ing, but no redundancy in the system...
locker

Trad climber
Joshua Tree Ca
Topic Author's Reply - Nov 14, 2006 - 04:31pm PT
I fall using the Mini Traxion and don't worry about it cutting the rope or failing... and it doesn't... I do however... and I can "fail" trusting my "mini traxion" on routes well above my grade...


"also noticed in the latest climbing (#235 pg 79)"...

interesting...so it is "catching" on... (Pun intended on the "Catching"...)...
Dingus Milktoast

climber
NorCal
Nov 14, 2006 - 04:50pm PT
"The Tibloc is not designed to hold without manually placing it on the rope and tensioning it. It could slip as a backup, especially with the upper Mini-Traxion that may have failed sliding down the rope onto it."

Why would you put the tibloc BELOW the trax? Reckon I don't get that. Put it on the rope above the trax with a sling to your harness. That way the trax pushes the trinket up the rope as you climb but if the trax fails to engage, the sling tightens and viola, the tibloc shreds your rope! *just kidding*

Seriously, I'd put the tibloc above the trax (unless I'm overlooking something obvious). I've only used mine a few times but I'm inclined to continue locker's approach, no backup, restrict to routes I won't be constantly whipping from (5.5 or so)

Cheers
DMT
Cuckawalla

Trad climber
Grand Junction, CO
Nov 21, 2006 - 12:10am PT
How many people use the mini TRaxion and actually use back up nots? if you are working a one pitch route over and over seems a pain, though of course its your life at stake. Just wondering how many people trust it enough to forget the back ups.
WBraun

climber
Nov 21, 2006 - 12:12am PT
I just use one mini-traxion and no back up knots, nothing man.

You trying trying to scare me or something?
Hummerchine

Trad climber
East Wenatchee, WA
Nov 21, 2006 - 12:18am PT
I use TWO Mini-Traxions, one on my belay loop with a DMM Belay-Master carabiner, one on a half-runner girth-hitched to my harness. I agree, using a separate rope with backup loops would be a massive pain. Sure, two Minis are more hassle than one, but just barely...and there is simply no way that two of these fine units are going to simultaneously fail. But hey, I do bow down to Werner; makes me feel REALLY safe knowing that he uses only one!
Cuckawalla

Trad climber
Grand Junction, CO
Nov 21, 2006 - 12:46am PT
no not trying to scare you, trying to validate it in my own head. Going out tomorrow and all I have is a solo-aid. Might buy a trax so I can work the route after I establish it. on harder routes you cant fiddle with back ups. If I heard it on supertaco must be legit!!
WBraun

climber
Nov 21, 2006 - 12:49am PT
Oh don't listen to me, I'm nuts. Kauk and Potter both use two mini-traxions, and it makes sense to be safe.
Mimi

climber
Nov 21, 2006 - 01:42am PT
Werner, you are a wild and crazy guy! Never known to flail.
k-man

Gym climber
SCruz
Nov 21, 2006 - 11:52am PT
I asked an avid soloer why they don't use a ProTraxion instead of the Mini. The Pro has a nice berring which lets the rope glide better and I think the Pro has a higher load rating, although both seem to have the same cam mechanism.

The answer I got was that the Pro is too bulky, for when you want your hips close to the rock, etc. But since this is what I have, I'll be using the Pro...

Another buddy of mine attaches the Mini to his doughnut and then supports it up by his stomach by attaching a sling to it which he hangs around his neck. This looked really good, less slack to take up before the gizmo engages in a fall.
locker

Trad climber
Joshua Tree Ca
Topic Author's Reply - Nov 21, 2006 - 02:29pm PT
I use a Single Mini Traxion NO back up knots or any other form of backup...

I TR solo often above my limit and do not fear falling knowing that little sucker will catch me...

as I have written before...

I use a DEDICATED rope for TR soloing exclusively...

and to make sure it is a good and safe one...

I ALWAYS use one of my RETIRED ropes...

wouldn't want to tear up a new one now would ya???...
Elcapinyoazz

Social climber
Joshua Tree
Oct 18, 2007 - 03:48pm PT
I've recently switched to doing my solo TR stuff on a mini-trax rig and thought I'd add my $0.02

My prior set-ups were Silent Partner (major PITA for this application, works well for other things though), Gri-gri, modified grigri, soloist.

My set up goes like this: A mini-trax on a small locker clipped to the donut. A 4" sewn sling girthed to the donut and connected to a pro-trax below the mini as a backup device. Then I take a loop of elastic shock-cord, girth it through the clip-in hole in the mini and wear it around my neck and over one arm bandolier style with a slight tension on the shock cord (enough to keep it upright even when I'm hunched over.

Feeds super smooth, and the shock cord keeps the device upright/higher up so it engages more quickly, feeds smoother, and doesn't bang into the backup pro-trax.

The modified gri-gri runs a close second and would be my choice for solo leading, but doesn't feed smooth enough for my liking.

I've ripped onto this rig repeatedly and the teeth aspect of the traxions seem like a non-issue. My ropes are getting more shralped from rubbing the rock near the anchors..the traxions don't seem affect them at all.

If I had the pro deal or was wealthy I'd run two minis, as the pro is a little bulky for this application, but I already owned a protrax, and don't notice it when I'm climbing.

I don't run backup knots or a second rope or any of that business, the backup traxion is plenty enough backup for me.
Polar Sun

Trad climber
Joshua Tree
Oct 18, 2007 - 05:03pm PT
The British equivalent of OSHA commissioned an engineering firm to do a massive evaluation of everything that gets used in "work at height". What climbers consider self-belay devices, are referred to as "rope grabs" in the factory realm.

The test included a 3 kn drop to determine if the device had an appropriate level of slippage to add some dynamic safety. They also did a catastrophic 10 kn static drop. They tested no toothed devices, as they considered them inappropriate for this application.

The three hands-down winners were the Petzl Microscender, Petzl Rescuecender, and the Troll Rocker. At the failing end of the test were the Shunt and the Ushba (At 5 kn the Ushba folded in half and cut the rope). The two Petzl units showed no sign of any damage in the 10 kn drop.

Iíve used the Microscender for over 15 years when top rope soloing. I place it at chest level with a chest harness which links to my doughnut. In hundreds of top rope falls it has never failed to grab instantly (And yes, Pete, I do use a backup, usually a toothed ascender or GriGri).
Anastasia

Trad climber
California
Oct 18, 2007 - 05:22pm PT
I use the mini traxion with back up knots. I can't imagine soloing without having a back up. The first thing I learned about climbing beside not stepping on the rope was to "always" backup my protection. Even when I jumar, I use either a grigri, make knots or I use the traxion for back up.
I think my life is worth a little extra work. Plus, I once had a jumar fail while I was moving up with the other jumar. Without the grigri catching me I would have had an interesting ride.
AF



rockermike

Mountain climber
Berkeley
Oct 18, 2007 - 05:30pm PT
I don't want to buy more gear. Why hasn't anyone mentioned just using an ascender with neck loop? I have both the regular Petzl Ascension (typical handled bigwall ascender) and as a back up a petzl "basic" ascender. Any reason these wouldn't work? What's the purpose of the pulley feature in the mini? I don't get it.
CFetterolf

climber
Oct 18, 2007 - 05:32pm PT
In the past I've tried ascenders and modified Gri-Gris and have now settled on the Mini Traxion as well. I found that I wasn't 100% comfortable without a backup though, so my solution is to let the Mini Trax push a prussic along on top. This cord gets clipped in to my harness with it's own carabiner. Tying backup knots just isn't practical unless you're climbing routes with ledges or other hands free stances.
Messages 1 - 44 of total 44 in this topic
Return to Forum List
Post a Reply
 
Our Guidebooks
Check 'em out!
SuperTopo Guidebooks


Try a free sample topo!

 
SuperTopo on the Web

Review Categories
Recent Trip Report and Articles
Recent Route Beta
Recent Gear Reviews